Observatory Rebuild

[loc46south]

Recently I undertook a rebuild of my observatory with eventual probability of remoting it, I say "eventual" because technology is changing now at such a pace that I should be able to reach my target within the next few years. The site has no mains electricity, or internet access.

http://www.pbase.com/loc46south/observatory

The obervatory is exposed (very) - winds exceeding 120kph are common and it has been built to withstand these conditions. The primary power source has been moved to Solar Energy from a 6.5 kva petrol generator, for no other reason than it will allow me to experiment with unattended operation.

Comments and Questions welcomed

Cheers
Geof Wingham

[alistairsam]

Hi Geoffrey,

That's an impressive build. That farmer has a kind heart!!
Are the solar panels operational? Do you use wireless internet for remote access?
are there any traces of light pollution at this site?
Look forward to more pics.
Cheers

[loc46south]

Hi Alistair - Yes I have a very helpful and understanding farmer, I live in a small rural community and being the local luney help heaps. The solar collector system is working and power is trickling in as I speak - I have a total reserve of 600 amp hours at 24 volts - which is not as much as it sounds.

I'm miles away from anyone and there is no usable wireless internet, the only option at present is satellite internet and that is too expensive. But I do have excellent 3G Smartphone reception and I am looking at options to use that to control the operation remotely - time will tell.

There is no light pollution and fantastic skies (when the weather is right)

Realise now that info on the rebuild and methods was a bit light - supplied a bit more to aid those interested

http://www.pbase.com/loc46south/building_a_roll_on_roll_off__observ atory

Any questions or comments welcomed

Cheers
Geof Wingham

[BPO]

Geoff, the cellular solution works well while it's working. The problem I encounter with my system is that the link is dropped periodically and when it does the remote client software cannot be made to automatically reconnect. That means another long drive up the mountain just to click 'connect'.

Without a cabled link, the only really reliable option is satellite, and even that is not reliably reliable, if you know what I mean. And, yes, very expensive, plus with ridiculously tiny monthly data caps into the 'bargain'.

Bite the bullet and plough in that fibre optic cable!

:D

[naskies]

Fascinating! Thanks for sharing the story. I look forward to reading about your future progress!

[alistairsam]

Hi
You could use 3G router with keepalives or run a script that sends a small amount of data periodically to keep the link up
You could also program the pc's to wake up at evenings automatically
Other option is to send a magic packet (WOL) over the Internet to wake the pc up
But I'd suggest testing these methods thoroughly before implementing them
Where exactly is the current observatory at?

I'm no expert at remote imaging but there are a number of things you could do
Open the roof automatically when it's clear, download a script for your target run, use plate solving for auto centering, auto focus using focus max and so on
But it removes the fun and sense of achievement with sitting in your obs and running it manually

[loc46south]

Hi All - I have all the goodies to remote the observatory, cloudwatcher, software,auto focusers, etc,etc - this observatory and it's predecessor are being used as testbeds - to sort out the systems for a practical workable remote observatory as far as possible up some remote hillside. Objective one has to be complete before I can move on with the dream. The present observatory is remote in the fact that it is isolated but it is onlt 45 minutes away from home so that makes it practical to use and serve as a test bed for ideas. The communications problem will solve itself in time, 2 years ago my cellphone coverage was almost non existant, now it is 5 bars inside the observatory - commercial pressures in the smartphone market make it an obvious choice for communication.

The biggest problem is Power and for a number of reasons Solar is the only real option, but it is inefficient and very expensive. Computers are needed to run the cameras,mounts, focusers,etc and for data storage, plus they are needed to work the machinery to open and close the roof.

Computers are the biggest user of electricity - your normal netbook/laptop is rated 120 to 200 watts. If you run that 24/7 then a 600amp hour @ 24volt system and 4 x 200 watt panels will just about support it, but there is no power over to run the rest of the systems. Plus all the newer computers are USB2.0 and USB3.0 - a lot of the astronomical gear still runs Serial/Comm connections. Real problems that need to be solved if progress is to be made. Hence the rebuild, I expect to be spending quite a few hours there over the next couple of years as things are sorted out so comfort is one prime consideration and storage another.

My current project is sorting out the computer problem, most commercial boards are useless as they are directed at the mainstream market, but there are a number of industrial boards available and I have one arriving from USA in the next few days, it uses 12 VoltDC, has 6 USB2.0 Ports and 6 Serial/Comm ports - 1.8 GZ 2800 chip and 4 GB ram - it draws 20 watts

If we can get that working than power problems start to go away.

Cheers
Geof Wingham

[BPO]

Geof, I added an inexpensive external antenna and went from 1-2 bars on a good day to a solid 5 at all times. They work.

You'll discover the problem is that over longer periods (days, weeks) the cellular links randomly drop out on the provider side, and there is no provision within the remote client application to automatically reconnect. This is for obvious reasons, but extremely inconvenient for those few of us who actually need the option.

Intel Atom mini-ITX systems have been the backbone of my remote observatory computer systems for a few years. Right now I run the Intel D525MW. (1.8 GHz, 4 GB, and everything else you'll likely ever need in the way of ports and options.) They draw 10W or less when idle, and peak at below 30W when flat out. It's the way to go. Did you ever look into those American custom builders I told you about? They will make any mini-ITX setup you like. Want 12 com ports? Not a problem. 4,000 USB ports? Easy. (So, okay, I'm exaggerating about the USB ports...)


Ah, okay, you did. I should have kept reading... :D


You should have no problems. They work well.

[alistairsam]

Hi
How difficult and expensive would it be to add a vertical wind turbine since you mentioned your area is quite windy?

You could also have a hybrid system with wind and solar
http://www.urbangreenenergy.com/solutions/green-energy-for-home

I'm seeing quite a few of these pop up on top of buildings in melbourne, mostly universities.

[loc46south]

Hi Alistair - About 9million dollars each I think the figure was (Picture of the adjacent ridge) - they work OK up to about 90kph wind speed then they turn side on into the wind - cheaper models like you are suggesting don't - the first decent wind and they either blow themselves to pieces or burn out. Those real flash models cost a fortune - they are not economical.

[Screwdriverone]

There is a new Telstra approved "smart antenna" which repeats the 3G phone and data signal simply by installing the antenna to a window, fully approved in Australia and works for phone calls and 3G internet service.

From memory they are about $500-$600 and would work well for you there.

The supplier I know of (no interest in them) is www.powertec.com.au.

Or check out www.cel-fi.com.au or http://www.telstra.com.au/business-enterprise/business-products/mobiles/telstra-mobile-smart-antenna/

Cheers

Chris

[alistairsam]

wow, how about that a 9million dollar wind turbine on a $5k observatory.
I was thinking about small scale vertical turbines anchored solidly on top and bottom. but I'm guessing you've already explored these options.

[loc46south]

Hi Gary - Mindful of the problems you have experienced I am basing my design on a stand alone system. Plan to use 3 computers, one for each of the mounts and 1 master controller with the cloudwatcher. Did some testing over the winter using 2/190 watt panels and 300 AH/24 Volt batteries - this ran the Gen 1 Atom with Cloudwatcher for all but the middle 5 weeks when there wasn't enough daylight to bring the batteries to float. The batteries were also manual switched to power the mount/camera/etc when required.

After winter I built and tested a system based on the D525 chip and the results were encouraging - encouraging enough to go ahead with the expansion of the observatory. The 2 new 24 volt/235 watt panels are cheaper and more low light efficient than the 24 volt/180 watt panels plus I have managed to locate another 300 AH/24 volt batteries and replaced the PWM Controller with a MPPT controller :eyepop:

I am now starting to test a N2800 board that is even more energy efficient and better suited to astronomy use -

Immediate plans are to now get all the systems bedding in and working reliably before the winter.

Cheers
Geof

[loc46south]

Hi Alistair - Yup

[loc46south]

Hi Chris - I'm in NZ not Aust - don't have any problems with 3G as soon as they built the wind turbines on the other side of the valley the telco's rented space and plonked repeaters on them.

[BPO]

Hi Geof.

Yep, comms is the big issue. PV has become so inexpensive now compared to the bad old days (and getting cheaper still all the time) that having adequate power on site is a relatively minor issue.

With cellular providers randomly bumping their links and not providing any way to automatically reconnect, it will usually mean a long drive is required to restore service to most "remote" sites.

It's not just a matter of a controlled power cycle, because there will always be at least one application - and usually multiple applications - that will require intervention that cannot realistically be scripted.

Maybe a satellite Internet service with sane charges and allowances will appear one day...

[h0ughy]

man o man i am impressed!!! what an excellent project and design initiatives being employed to engineer the desired result - imaging!! fantastic

[bert]

Maybe a solution to your 3g issue.

I bought a netgear ethernet and wireless router that was designed to run off a usb 3g dongle via an inbuilt usb port. When it got disconnected from the carrier it automatically reconnected, and was usually back up and running within 30 seconds. Worth a try.

Brett

[BPO]

Hi Bert.

Is that device designed to work with proprietary client applications (in this case from Sierra Wireless, and Telecom NZ's rebadged version)?

There's no provision at all within the client for an automatic reconnection when the link is dropped; A user must manually click the "connect" button, or the app just sits there uselessly.

You can set the client to automatically reconnect after the application has been stopped and restarted, so if the device is able to do that then it could work.

Cheers, and Merry Christmas and all that.

[bert]

As far as I know the router is carrier independent, you just have to have a compatible 3G modem. This is not the one I had but it gives you an indication of what they can do.

http://www.netgear.com.au/3G

[BPO]

Hi Bert.

Thanks very much, I'll look into that, although I'm not hopeful. The drivers and client are installed and configured by/from the Telecom NZ-supplied USB broadband modem, and I suspect anything purchased from anyone other than Telecom NZ will be shut out of their network. (You can't beat the 'phone company.)

[naskies]

According to Wiki and Telecom NZ's website, they run an open 3G network. You can connect your own device to their network - such as iPhones, iPads, USB dongles, or a router/modem as Brett pointed out. You just need one of their SIM cards, a data plan, and a 3G device that can communicate at 850 MHz or 2100 MHz:

http://www.telecom.co.nz/mobile/mobile/ournetwork/phonecompatibility/

Telco supplied USB dongles tend to be locked down to the telco with proprietary software to (1) reduce the amount of configuration needed by the user, and (2) prevent the (often subsidised) device from being used on a competitor's network.

Once you have the 3G router/modem appropriately configured, it should automatically attempt to reconnect to the 3G network - same as for ADSL. If you're especially worried about loss of connectivity, you could set up a multi-homed network in your obs with two separate 3G data connections through different service providers.

On the software side, you'd ideally want "layered" access to the obs network - e.g. a VPN for direct TCP/IP connections to the router/computers, access to a console simulator if you have a server-grade machine (it simulates a mouse/keyboard so you can remote control booting of the machine - even enter into the BIOS settings), VNC or Remote Desktop of some sort, and perhaps also remote automation software.

[loc46south]

At this point in time I intend to keep as much of the operation as simple as possible, my next objective being to install and test the running systems, software, etc until I can run them with the reasonable confidence that they will perform.

I expect this to take 18 months to 2 years and in that time I am counting on the progress and developments in the smartphone market to further open up my communication options - it will also give me time to come to grips with a technology I know very little about and I need to be careful as too much thinking makes my head hurt.

Geof Wingham