In considering a new EP, have been reading and looking at opinions comparing Televue and Explore Scientific. Currently I have a 4mm (celestron no-name brand and yes, that's right, I never use it!), a 6mm Orion Edge-On Planetary (which I use all the time because it is way superior to all of my others!), a 9mm Plossl, a 15mm Plossl, 24mm 2" plossl and a 32mm Plossl (which is a great EP!)
I am considering somewhere around 10mm (will probably give my 9mm away to a friend); just wondering if anyone has used both brands and could compare simply which one is better. I realise that the ES is going to be alot more affordable!
I'm using an 8" Dob: is it worth spending money on these superior EP's with this sort of scope? If I was to look at Jupiter (for argument's sake) on a good night, how much better would a ES or TV be than my Orion EP? What would the difference actually "look" like? More detail, colour?
Hi Mate, no worries about the "hyjack!" Yes, those TV EP's are a touch expensive! If you get yourself an Orion Edge-On EP, I think you'll be pretty happy with it...they range from around $119 to $135...my 6mm is so much better than my plossls, especially when seeing is good! I basically only use that and my 32mm plossl on 99% of viewings!
This is always an emotive debate. But when it comes to TeleVue eyepieces I like the adage, buy once, cry once.
Something that is rarely acknowledged is the contribution that aperture plays in eyepiece performance. In my travels talking to guys with big Dobs the performance of Ethos and Delos sits above almost everything in the wide field market. But at the smaller end of the scale, you probably wouldn't see much difference between a TV and an ES.
So your decision might depend on whether you plan to stick at the hobby and maybe end up with something bigger one day. Good eyepieces can be kept and used forever, no matter what future telescopes you end up with.
Specifically, because you are asking about a 10mm, I have to say the Delos is near the perfect eyepiece. The colour tone, transmission, and contrast is better than anything I have ever looked through in a widefield, including Ethos. I have looked through the Orion Planetary, and the Delos is a nice step up in performance by comparison.
Like you Shaun I'm in the market for some new eye pieces to use in my 8" dob. I've got a 9mm, 15mm and 25mm Plossls and hate the 9 and 15 due to the not every good ER (eye relief). What I've been doing is going through the old post in the eyepieces forum. Some bloody good info and links in there. Still haven't made a final decision yet but it has helped me onto the right path. If you haven't looked yet do it. I'll keep a eye on this thread to see what people say to your questions.
Rather than picking a specific focal length, I'd suggest you think about what you'd like to achieve with it and then pick something suitable. For example, if you want a decent planetary eyepiece, for average nights, then go for something 160-200x...this will also help you bust open globs too
So the best buy - regardless of brand - all depends on how you use your scope and what your interests are IMO
There is a lot more to this than ES v TV. IMO the only way to find out what you like is to beg borrow or buy and try…all sorts. I have been through quite a few and have ended up with what I am happy with…ES 68 and 82º mix.
Good news is XW's Delos etc hold their value pretty well. Questions to ask yourself….
Do you observe with glasses?
What AFOV do you like i.e.60º 68º 82º 100º
What scope and f ratio
How are your sky conditions and how often do you get out
The only thing I would say to buy is a coma corrector….I bought the ES I mostly use my f12 refractor which gives pinpoint stars all the way and have to have the same in my f4.8 reflector….the only way is a coma corrector.
Then you can get to ES v TV and don't forget Pentax, Denkmeier and all the others.
Matt
Thanks for the info Matt! I imagine there is a fair bit of trial and error involved with EP's.
To answer your questions (for arguments sake!):
1. No, I don't observe with glasses
2. AFOV in my Orion Edge-On is 55' which I find very comfortable
3. I use an 8" Dob (F6-ish)
4. Sky conditions are usually fairly good (only just dark enough to pick up the Sombraro Galaxy for example)
5. I'd observe most weeks where there is good weather
Shaun you lucky so and so. Sounds like great conditions unlike all of use suffering in Melbourne. I get 2-3 really good nights a year in Melbourne, a few hours drive out in the country is a different story, but I work lots of nights and don't/can't get out that much. I sort of did the following in my choices....
I wanted one set of eyepieces to do 2 scopes, 6" f12 Refractor and f4.8 10" reflector. I have young kids so I had a budget, which meant a set of TV Panoptics and Naglers was not on the table. A while back when the US dollar was worth less than 90cents I bought 4 XW's and 3 ES 100º eyepieces .....for 6 months they were nice...BUT....I also binoview and found that cheap eyepieces binoviewed gave me a better view than looking through the XW's. The ES 100's were nice depending on which scope they were in. My other scope is a 100ED f9, the 100's were not good for me in the reflector or 6" refractor. So what to do? In the past I had a few ES 68º eyepieces and really liked them. Many times on Cloudy Nights I had read that they were really close to Panoptics, in fact more than a few prefered them to TV, so I bought a couple and tried them at f4.8 and f12. The result.... beautiful...at 1/3rd the price Looking at the kids it was clear what to use. Out went the XW's and ES 100's after they sat in the eyepiece draw for 6 months unused. Selling them more than paid for the 68º eyepieces and 4 82's, bought on sale and a couple of bino pairs, 25 and 18 orthos (thanks Flash)
Along the way in the last few years I also had a couple of the Orions. Nice but a bit dark compared to others.
If I was you I'd buy, or borrow and give whatever you want a good try. Quite a few times I have thought an eyepiece that was fab on first try, only to change my mind on subsequent viewings. If the skies the limit...easy spend big, if not ES are the best value IMO.
A bit of a rave Buy and try, get rid of what you don't like and find what you do like...easy
If I ever move to better sky conditions I'll revisit my choices. Of course the best way to get better views is get a better/ bigger scope!
Matt
Shaun , such a great query and the replies have all been great , thanks guys for these .
I was in your boat about 5 years ago when ES were starting to make in-roads into The TV 'Niche' market but sadly I had just grabbed a TV 22mm Panoptic here in the classifieds ( best eyepiece I own ) and sorry to say that was the beginning of the end for me as I have sold off all my other eyepieces over the years , just like MattT did , and apart from 2 that I still have , these being a Celestron LX Axiom 31mm and 40mm AT Titan all my eyepieces are now TV's starting with a full Radian set of 3mm-18mm , Pans 19mm-27mm and Naglers 9mm-20mm all awsome eyepieces and the lot grabbed here from IIS's classifieds over 5+ years of being "Johnny on the spot" and at great prices , but you have to be quick getting some as they are very popular .
On this I have just PM'd Castony and hopefully a 6.7mm ES will be on its way to me and rest assured it will be tested plenty against probably the Radians of close FL and my 9mm Nagler in all my scopes , I look forward to testing this eyepiece and I will post the results .
I know ES are the best value on the market today , but IMHO for a little ( lot ) more TV;s especially 2nd hand these take a lot to beat .
Here is my collection of that 'Green Stripe' in its early days , probably after 2 years or so , but good things do take time , especially those sweet 19 , 22 and 24mm Panoptics or my 12 or 18mm Radian's ? Telvue's do it or me sorry to say .
My 5c.
Brian.
Last edited by brian nordstrom; 11-07-2014 at 11:53 PM.
I have only used Televue for many years. The quality is worth the money.
I do have a TMB 6mm Planetary eyepiece, but have not tried it yet and will probably sell it now my solar scope has been sold.
I didn't feel I could comment while I had ES for sale but now that they have sold I'll say that ES are very close to TV and the equal of TV in some focal lengths, with differences mainly seen at the edge of field.
The 40mm 68 degree isn't quite as well corrected in the outer field as the 41 Pan and the 14mm 82 degree has mild field curvature seen in the outer field (not nearly as intrusive as curvature in an XW14) but many others I've tried leave nothing to be desired for their respective designs.
I've moved to Delos and XW in the short and medium focal lengths mainly for their long eye relief though they are a small step up from ES. I also have a Leica ASPH zoom which seems equal to Delos/XW so even they may get thinned a little in future.
I've got 3 long focal length ES's that I'll be keeping since they have long eye relief and are equal to TV on axis. I've directly compared the ES30/Nagler 31 and ES40/Pan 41 and there was zero difference on axis.
I've owned, used and sold a few Tele Vue and Explore Scientific eyepieces over the last few of years. I didn't own both ES and TV in the same focal length at the same time so haven't done the ES v TV comparison, but it might be of interest to tell you my basic collection. My main scope is an 8" f/5 Newtonian.
6.7mm & 4.7mm ES 82D
4mm William Optics UWAN
3.5mm Vixen LVW.
The Delos and XW (and possibly the LVW) are definitely better than the others, but I am happy with the performance of the ES and WO eyepieces. Note that I'm not a dedicated planetary observer, so I'm not concerned about getting the last ounce of performance from more specialised planetary eyepieces that are out there.
My opinion is that the ES eyepieces will be a good step up from what you currently own and are worth buying. They come up used on this forum quite regularly so are very reasonably priced. If you feel the need to upgrade at a later date, the Tele Vue and Pentax eyepieces will be waiting!
Edit: Nearly all of the above eyepieces were bought used or when they were on sale. They have also been acquired over a period of time to spread the cost.
I mostly use my f12 refractor which gives pinpoint stars all the way and have to have the same in my f4.8 reflector….the only way is a coma corrector.
or my 12 or 18mm Radian's ? Telvue's do it or me sorry to say .
