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Old 11-05-2021, 09:51 PM
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Eyepiece recommendations for a 6 inch Saxon Dob

Hi Guys,

Total newbie here. I have a 6 inch (153 mm) f/7.8 Saxon Dobsonian which I've been using for over 4 months now.
Focal length: 1200mm

The telescope came with two 1.25" Plossl eyepieces - 10 mm & 25 mm, a 1.25" moon & skyglow filter and a 2" adapter.

I am interested in expanding my eyepiece/filter set to enhance my viewing experience.

Does anyone have any thoughts or recommendations to share about what will offer the most bang for the buck - e.g. a 2X barlow, UHC filter etc.?

I'd also like to hear if people with similar telescopes have had any experience with a wide view (Superview?) eyepiece, 1.25 or 2 inch?


Below are some more details in case they make a difference.
  • I stay in the western subrubs of Sydney, so have typical suburban skies for most of my viewing.
  • I don't wear eye glasses.
  • I am willing to spend upto $150.


Your feedback would be much appreciated.
Thanks.

Last edited by thegreat1; 13-05-2021 at 06:39 PM. Reason: Added the focal length now
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Old 12-05-2021, 10:52 AM
N1 (Mirko)
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Good morning and welcome to IIS!

That's a nice optic you have there, I use one occasionally and it always pleases. Sharp, forgiving and portable. However, eyepieces being the interface with the observer are the second-most subjective thing after the observer themselves. Expect to find lots of info, and not all of it consistent. I'm lucky in that I have access to a range of good eyepieces, and the best ones for the 6" f/8 for me have been:

The 32mm Televue Plossl
The 24mm Explore Scientific 68°
The 16mm Explore Scientific 68°
The 9mm Astro Hutech Abbe Ortho
The 6mm Fujiyama Abbe Ortho

Astro Hutech and Fujiyama brands are interchangeable for all intents and purposes.

But, in response to your question, a Superview should also work well given the relaxed focal ratio. Use above focal lengths as a guide when selecting. Perhaps start with the 16mm and 6mm brackets a mm here or there won't matter all that much.

Filter wise, a UHC is nice but OIII I find slightly more useful when there's a need for filtering.

Adapting the scope I use to 2" is a pain, so I haven't actually used any 2" eyepieces with this telescope.

Last edited by N1; 12-05-2021 at 11:11 AM.
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  #3  
Old 12-05-2021, 11:43 AM
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Have a look at the Cielo range from Optics Central.

https://www.opticscentral.com.au/sax...eyepieces.html

I have the Celestron eyepieces that are the same but more expensive new....bought mine used from the classifieds here. I have tried far too many eyepieces in my time and should have got these a long time ago. For widest views the 42mm Superview is pretty good too.
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Old 12-05-2021, 03:31 PM
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A good starting point is to find out how wide a field of view you like.

I have lots of high quality eyepieces. Incredible performance. But when I got a 100 degree eyepiece it instantly became my favourite. More the width of the field of view.

Televue Naglers are around 82-84 degrees.

Panoptics are around 62 degrees.

Orthos are typically only 40 degrees, so sharp but strawlike view.

There are cheaper alternatives than the name brands. Celestron, Orion, Saxon, GSO, William Optics etc.

I think that is a good place to start.

Personally I would prefer to only have 2 or 3 eyepieces but high quality rather than several lower quality.

Dual ED eyepieces are good value and fairly wide. They are sold on Ebay at about $89 each.

TMB Planetary 11 are hard to beat at around $50 on ebay. They are 52 degree or so views. Much more pleasant than an Ortho and a good one is very high performance.

Baader Hyperions are close to that price (a bit more). I have only had great experiences with Baader products.

I would rate eyepiece manufacturers (my opinion and I have tried everyone of course):

1. Televue are the recognised leaders and most of their products seem to be the standard others try to match. Sometimes they are matched and exceeded but you are unlikely to get a bum eyepiece with a TV label.

2. APM it seems they most use high end Chinese eyepieces but perform really well for the price. Most of my favourite eyepieces are APM.

3. Baader - Morpheus. Outside your stated budget but a well chosen Morpheus and a good barlow gives 2 eyepieces really that are top performers bar none.

4. Pentax - expensive, field of view is less at 62 degrees like a Panoptic or TV Delite but optically pretty perfect. 5, 7 and 10mm are the ones. The 30 and 40mm are also regarded highly. The 14 and 20 not so much.

5. Masuyama At F8 the Masuyama most likely will shine. Superior light throughput due to a lot fewer lenses in the eyepiece. 85 degree views.
The 10mm is amazing. (I only have the 10mm).

6. I have Fujiyama, University Optics etc Orthos. Hmmm, an acquired squinty taste! Reserved really for planets and lunar. Even so I would prefer to use Morpheus or Nagler.

7. Edmunds Optics RKEs. I have the 8, 12, 15 and 28mm. The 28 often hits peoples all time favourite eyepieces as it has that floating in space effect from the design where the eyepiece housing disappears in the view. About $165 from Edmuncs Optics Singapore (buy online). There is also a 21mm someone said was the best but haven't tried that. The 8, 12 and 15 are pretty good but again the narrowish field of view for me is not ideal. The 28mm doesn't suffer from that because its already quite a wide view.

8. Zooms often make top 10 favourites. Top of those is the Nagler.
The latest Baader 7-24 is another popular choice.

Greg.
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Old 12-05-2021, 07:21 PM
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AG Hybrid (Adrian)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregbradley View Post
4. Pentax - expensive, field of view is less at 62 degrees like a Panoptic or TV Delite but optically pretty perfect. 5, 7 and 10mm are the ones. The 30 and 40mm are also regarded highly. The 14 and 20 not so much.

8. Zooms often make top 10 favourites. Top of those is the Nagler.
The latest Baader 7-24 is another popular choice.
Pentax XW - which I assume your talking about, is 70 degrees sensibly identical to the delos. The Nagler zoom is 3-6mm and really far from a top choice with its 50 degree field of view and its enormous 10mm of eye relief all for the low low price of $650. Its going to get its max use with a short focal length refractor like a TV85 or TV60. But a 150mm F8. Its zoom range will be mostly unusable.



To the original poster.


You live just up the road from me in Blacktown so I know the light pollution is a problem. So unless you plan on going to a dark sky regularly. Don't get a 42mm as mentioned earlier your sky background will be completely washed out. What you really want is something that will help with contrast - making the sky background darker while increasing the image scale of your targets. Its surprising how many globular clusters you'll be able to see this time of year if your clever, as an example deep sky object from western Sydney. This can be helped with eyepiece exit pupil management. The best way to do that is with eyepiece focal length. The other option of course is using a different telescope with a longer focal length, but its still reliant on eyepiece choice.

Now what kind of exit pupil is useful? Its been noted,reported or documented by the most experience observers that 2mm is about the sweet spot between image surface brightness, resolution and contrast - in particular for deep sky observing. But, in the case of light pollution - less is more. I try to get around to 1mm when observing most things from home. More magnification, darker sky background. Its actually quite complex and clarity in the matter only really comes with experience and what you want to observe. But I am keeping it simple.

If I was to start my visual observation journey back to like 12 years ago. I wish I could have started out with a Baader Hyperion Zoom. My first scope was also 150mm Newtonian. In the case of yours however. The zoom will give you a magnification range 50x(24mm) to 150x(8mm). That gives you an exit pupil range from 3.1mm to 1mm. Ideal really. It's even a 1.25" barrel so no problems with a focuser upgrade.

The downside is of course its they are a bit over double your budget. I mean you do get 17 different focal lengths though.

If the Baader is too rich consider Orion E-Series 7-21mm Zoom Eyepiece. Its within your budget and I read not bad.




Word of advice though. Eyepieces are addictive.

Last edited by AG Hybrid; 12-05-2021 at 07:35 PM.
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  #6  
Old 12-05-2021, 10:45 PM
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Smile

Thank you Mirko, Matt, Greg and Adrian for taking the time to share your valuable insights.

This will take me a while to digest. I will definitely read up some more regarding the suggestions on this thread and reach out if I have further questions.


Thanks again.
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  #7  
Old 13-05-2021, 01:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thegreat1 View Post
Hi Guys,

Total newbie here. I have a 6 inch (153 mm) f/7.8 Saxon Dobsonian which I've been using for over 4 months now.

The telescope came with two 1.25" Plossl eyepieces - 10 mm & 25 mm, a 1.25" moon & skyglow filter and a 2" adapter.

I am interested in expanding my eyepiece/filter set to enhance my viewing experience.

Does anyone have any thoughts or recommendations to share about what will offer the most bang for the buck - e.g. a 2X barlow, UHC filter etc.?

I'd also like to hear if people with similar telescopes have had any experience with a wide view (Superview?) eyepiece, 1.25 or 2 inch?


Below are some more details in case they make a difference.
  • I stay in the western subrubs of Sydney, so have typical suburban skies for most of my viewing.
  • I don't wear eye glasses.
  • I am willing to spend up to $150.


Your feedback would be much appreciated.
Thanks.
I calculate a 1200mm focal length?

Then, judging from the nature of the scope, it won't be a telescope for ultra-wide true fields, but it will be an excellent scope for all objects.
Usable focal lengths will be from 4mm to 42mm more or less, but I don't think you'll need an eyepiece for every possible magnification.
In fact, I think steps of 50x from 50x to 250x will pretty much cover the bases, from large star clusters down to the size of planets.

That would be eyepieces of 24mm, 12mm, 8mm, 6mm, 4.8mm.
Plus or minus, of course. The 24mm could be a 25mm or a 23mm depending on the eyepiece of preference.

Certainly, the most cost-effective set would be of the inexpensive high quality 60° eyepieces out there. If eyepieces like that came stock with telescopes, I'm not sure a lot of people would ever upgrade.

That would be eyepieces like the Saxon Cielo HD, though it is of note that these eyepieces are identical to the Celestron X-Cel LX, so you might find them for less if you shop a sale.
Or the BST Starguider ED or Astrotech Paradigm eyepieces. You could get these from a US company and even with shipping pay less than typical AU prices.

I'd skip acquiring more Plössl eyepieces because the eye reliefs get uncomfortable at focal lengths under 14-15mm focal length and because I think you'd find the wider fields more engaging.
Like the SkyWatcher Wide Angle 66° eyepieces (6, 9, 15, 20mm), also sold under the Orion and Sirius brand names in Oz.
or the Skywatcher 58° Long eye relief eyepieces (these are not Plössls, by the way)

The Superview eyepieces are just OK at f/8. I find they are not that well corrected even at f/10 and shorter f/ratios only make that worse. As a lowest power, though, having one might be a fun eyepiece to use.

You might also consider looking for eyepieces on AliExpress, the Chinese eBay, where most of these eyepieces are available for a lot less.
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Old 13-05-2021, 05:11 AM
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mura_gadi (Steve)
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Ep's

Hello,

As people have stated at F8, you have a fairly forgiving telescope on eyepieces. Unless you have a desire for extra wide view ep's you will have plenty of good choices. What's been suggested here are good ep's that should last you a while.

Keep in mind that you are unlikely to find one line that suits all your viewing needs. You can have some real pearls and clangers in the same line up.

I base my eps' on what I tend to look at most;
- one where I want the maximum mag on a full moon .6 degrees,
- one at max field 2 degrees in my case at 30mm and 80 degree fov,
- one high mag with good light scatter control, this is for the bright planets/star splitter,
- a zoom used to look at fuzzy's from the 30mm.

Factor in exit pupil on your selections, at f8 - 12mm/18/24mm will give you 1.5mm/2+/3mm exit pupils, somewhere between 2-4mm is said to be optimal for comfort.

Eye relief, you have the two plossl's, there is a mile of difference in the eye relief they provide. If you find the 10mm a little harder to use, you may want to think about ep with good eye relief - (15mm-20mm). (A $19 plossl will tell you a lot about what eye relief you are looking for.)


Steve
Ps. Link below is handy, shows up some nice eyepieces that are within your price range here in Oz. But as they say YMMV.

Pps. I'd aim for 60-70degree ep's generally if your on a push dob.

https://translate.google.com/transla...00190,15700201

Last edited by mura_gadi; 13-05-2021 at 05:39 AM.
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Old 13-05-2021, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mura_gadi View Post
Hello,

Keep in mind that you are unlikely to find one line that suits all your viewing needs. You can have some real pearls and clangers in the same line up.

Factor in exit pupil on your selections, at f8 - 12mm/18/24mm will give you 1.5mm/2+/3mm exit pupils, somewhere between 2-4mm is said to be optimal for comfort.

Eye relief, you have the two plossl's, there is a mile of difference in the eye relief they provide. If you find the 10mm a little harder to use, you may want to think about ep with good eye relief - (15mm-20mm). (A $19 plossl will tell you a lot about what eye relief you are looking for.)
Hi Steve,

Thanks for sharing your knowledge and the link. Much appreciated.

I've read a bit about exit pupils and it's fascinating to understand it's practical application from a light gathering point of view.

From your experience, is there any merit in looking for a 2 inch eye piece for wide views - a low powered one maybe - instead of a 1.25inch wide view ep?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Pensack View Post
I calculate a 1200mm focal length?

That would be eyepieces like the Saxon Cielo HD, though it is of note that these eyepieces are identical to the Celestron X-Cel LX, so you might find them for less if you shop a sale.
Or the BST Starguider ED or Astrotech Paradigm eyepieces. You could get these from a US company and even with shipping pay less than typical AU prices.

I'd skip acquiring more Plössl eyepieces because the eye reliefs get uncomfortable at focal lengths under 14-15mm focal length and because I think you'd find the wider fields more engaging.
Like the SkyWatcher Wide Angle 66° eyepieces (6, 9, 15, 20mm), also sold under the Orion and Sirius brand names in Oz.
or the Skywatcher 58° Long eye relief eyepieces (these are not Plössls, by the way)
.
Hi Don,

Thanks for sharing your insight.

You are correct. The focal length on my scope is 1200mm. Sorry, a newbie mistake for not quoting it. Will fix it.

A wide 60 degree and above field of view on the 1.25" focuser does sound exciting. I will look up the Saxon ones along with the Skywatcher ones you've mentioned.

Another question, would getting a 2 inch ep with a wide field of view offer significantly better viewing experience?

I agree to your point regarding the lack of comfort on a high powered Plössl such as my stock 10mm. Between my 25mm and 10mm, the 25mm is used more.

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Old 13-05-2021, 11:12 PM
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Your lowest power could be a 2" eyepiece if the goal is to achieve a wider true field (low power 2" eyepieces have larger field sizes than 1.25"), but bear in mind that the eyepiece will be large, heavy, and expensive compared to 1.25".
And if the 2" eyepiece is not more expensive, it may be more poorly-corrected. Your scope has such a long f/ratio that it will not induce aberrations in eyepieces, but there are some eyepieces that are just inherently poorly-corrected, like the GSO Superviews.
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Old 14-05-2021, 07:42 AM
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wide view at $150

Hello,

Getting a wide view 2" eyepiece in your budget would be a good ask. And an often asked one, so, I'll give my 2cents worth and throw the cat amongst the pigeons.

If you can find one, a 2nd hand APM UW 20mm 80degree. Main reason for the 20mm is it came with a 1.5 2" barlow lens you can remove to have a 30mm. Two ep's for a fair price I'd guess.

This is based solely on the fact you have a F8 scope and not what I would suggest if you were to ever migrate to a faster scope.

But, APM UW 30mm is $99 euro new to your door just about less VAT + postage etc. That's damn close to $150 for a new wide field ep.

It would be nice to see what else comes in around that price range for a 2degree FOV ep new.



Steve
Ps. Bang for buck for ep's at $150 each maybe -

1) $50 TBM II something between .8-1.2mm exit pupil, so 6-10mm read the reviews to see whats best
2) $80 BST StarGuider etc 15mm - nice useable eye relief and exit pupil
3) $160 APM UW 30mm 80degree - Not a keeper but something useable till you save and decide to spend $$$.

That's two good ep's and a useable third for $300 or so.

The Baader Zoom 8-24mm is 68-48degree, that wide field is at high mag where you need it if your chasing fast moving planets. $375 new, wait for 2nd hand imho its worth two $150 ep's. The ability to zoom in to frame is really nice, I have a vixen zoom, great ep but plossl FOV.

Last edited by mura_gadi; 14-05-2021 at 05:04 PM.
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Old 14-05-2021, 07:53 AM
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[QUOTE=AG Hybrid;1519343]Pentax XW - which I assume your talking about, is 70 degrees sensibly identical to the delos. The Nagler zoom is 3-6mm and really far from a top choice with its 50 degree field of view and its enormous 10mm of eye relief all for the low low price of $650. Its going to get its max use with a short focal length refractor like a TV85 or TV60. But a 150mm F8. Its zoom range will be mostly unusable.


Yes I was referring to the Pentax XW range. I was writing the field of view form memory and yes its 70 degrees which is for my view, about the narrowest I would like to go.

I mentioned the Nagler 3-6 zoom as it regularly comes up in peoples' listing of their top 10 favourite eyepeices. I had one once. It was good but agree its limited.

I got a SvBony 7-24 zoom that is quite good and quite cheap. So that is a possible cheaper alternative to a Hyperion.

Greg.
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Old 14-05-2021, 09:56 AM
Tropo-Bob (Bob)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thegreat1 View Post
Hi Guys,

Total newbie here. I have a 6 inch (153 mm) f/7.8 Saxon Dobsonian which I've been using for over 4 months now.
Focal length: 1200mm

The telescope came with two 1.25" Plossl eyepieces - 10 mm & 25 mm, a 1.25" moon & skyglow filter and a 2" adapter.

I am interested in expanding my eyepiece/filter set to enhance my viewing experience.

Does anyone have any thoughts or recommendations to share about what will offer the most bang for the buck - e.g. a 2X barlow, UHC filter etc.?

I'd also like to hear if people with similar telescopes have had any experience with a wide view (Superview?) eyepiece, 1.25 or 2 inch?

[*]... I am willing to spend upto $150...[/LIST]

I think an $89.00 Orion 1.25” Accessory Kit from ProAstoz represents outstanding value. Included in the attractive case are 20mm & 7.5mm Sirius Plossls, a 2x Barlow and 4 filters. View the ProAstroz website for details.

I have purchased a set of 6 Dual ED EPs hassle free from ProAstroz. The 15mm from that series is my favourite. It has a 60 degree apparent field and can be purchased separately for $75. It will also be a good EP with the 6" scope.

There will probably be extra postage charges in addition to the prices that I have mentioned.

Good luck and I hope U like whatever U decide.
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Old 14-05-2021, 11:18 AM
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AG Hybrid (Adrian)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregbradley View Post
I got a SvBony 7-24 zoom that is quite good and quite cheap. So that is a possible cheaper alternative to a Hyperion.
Greg.
I've read good things about it. Another option within OP's budget.
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