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Old 23-02-2021, 08:21 PM
Gordy
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Going OSC or mono - Any regrets?

I am going through that ------ stage of trying to decide whether to go for a OSC or mono camera. I have read about the pros and cons of each which are clear cut.



When you bought your current camera, did you do so thinking it was an informed choice at the time but now regretted that decision.



Be honest now!
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Old 23-02-2021, 10:24 PM
Startrek (Martin)
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My original thought transition process was always DSLR > OSC cooled > Mono cooled
Went from a Canon 600D DSLR ( 3 years use ) to a new ZWOASI2600MC cooled OSC ( since September last year )
This camera is so good, I wonít be going Mono for the immediate future
Chalk and cheese literally
I still use the old DSLR for dabbling in a bit of planetary and lunar imaging but the 2600MC is my Lamborghini
Cooled OSC from both QHY and ZWO are improving in performance at a fast rate particularly over the last 18 months
Hope others offer their experiences
My 2 cents .....
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  #3  
Old 24-02-2021, 11:40 AM
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The_bluester (Paul)
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I started with a cooled OSC (ASI294MC Pro) and moved on to a better one (ASI2600MC Pro) recently. If the mono version was more than a rumor at the time I would have waited for the ASI2600MM.

I still plan to move that way (Mono) and will probably do the musical chairs routine when I do. 2600MM goes on my SVX80 which has the 2600MC on it now (Which I am quite happy with) The 2600MC goes on my SCT (Where it will be more than a little oversampled, but I can software bin after capture to help that so long as I accept the bigger file sizes while capturing) and for the ASI294 I might whack a short, fast camera lens on it as I am hunting for dim, dark, obscure stuff to image and a lesser quality quite undersampled image to see what is there does not matter, so long as dim stuff shows up. Treat it as a survey.

That or just sell the ASI294 when I wrangle the mono camera.
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Old 24-02-2021, 11:42 AM
AdamJL
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OSC for me. I just don't have the time for mono.
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Old 24-02-2021, 01:22 PM
Spidy (Phil)
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Quote:
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osc for me. I just don't have the time for mono.

+1
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  #6  
Old 24-02-2021, 01:43 PM
jahnpahwa (JP)
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I'd advise to go straight to mono.

I went to Mono about 3 months into my astro life, no hassle at all. I'm not a photographer, so dont have a background in this stuff... its just a week or two of playing with things and then its just the way it is, which I find is the same with most gear/software changes with this game. Maybe 10 years ago before pxinsight it was tough to integrate a mono image, but not anymore.

I don't think it takes any more time than OSC in acquisition, and maybe a few more minutes in processing in some situations. In fact, the methods that OSC users seem to use to approximate a mono set up (synthetic luminance layer, separate narrowband data from colour image, etc) probably make the OSC a longer overall process on anything but a very simple RGB image.

The flexibility increase is real, and the number of nights you can image, and types of targets to image on those nights, is increased. You can differentially focus each filter, which is MASSIVE when imaging with refractors, even Apo refractors.

The cost difference, well, if you start looking at tri-band and quad-band filters for OSC, there is barely any price difference at all. Lots and lots of people are stoked on their narrowband-esque images with these filters, and yeah, they do look good. The biggest thing to keep in mind here is that the bayer matrix is still there, which means that you are getting only 1 in 4 pixels picking up your Ha wavelengths... ONE IN FOUR! Your 20mp camera is now a 5mp Ha sensor. I suppose you can drizzle or whatever, but then you're really starting to lose the "easier to use" aspect of OSC.

If you're thinking that mono is going to add a heap of weight, it needn't. Yes, my zwo 1600 has a smaller sensor than the current 2600, but it, with filter wheel and filters only about the same. My newt and refractors, each with standard focuser, has no problems lifting/locking the camera at all. If going a 2600mm, the 5 pos filter wheel is 500g... not the end of the world at all.

Finally, astro has taught me the value in buying once (at least for a while), and like people are saying, the progression might be DSLR - OSC - Mono, but to me thats a $2000-3000 step for little reason, and since I'm on a budget, I don't think I'd have gotten past the OSC.
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Old 24-02-2021, 06:10 PM
Alchemy (Clive)
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All fair points below. Had both, both have their advantages and disadvantages, you want to pop out an image instantly where the weather can be dodgy and you might get interrupted go the OSC it’s good for comets too. Want to get more detail, prepared to put in the time etc, yes mono..... but buy what YOU want don’t buy to impress others or try to compete, just enjoy the experience.


NOW
Let’s talk money.
Here’s what you need to know, OSC you’re up and running straight away so say you want a 26 mp camera, ball park $3300 I’m going to assume you already have a flattener as either way you need one

Ok so maybe you go with the mono, similar price, but now you are going to need a filter wheel ( $add) maybe the set of RGB filters aren’t quite up to scratch ($add) same goes for the luminance ( $add) of course now you are going to want a Ha filter ($add) oh wow this narrowband thing is awesome you’re going to need new S2 and O3 filters ($add) and darn that 5 filter wheel is not enough so you lash out and buy a 7 filter wheel ($add) oops all of a sudden that’s more weight than you expected and that focuser just can’t hold it any more, better get a new one ($add) of course down the track a little bit you discover that you just can’t suck up the detail with a 6nm filter you’re going to have to replace them all with expensive 3nm ones ($add ) around this time you’re thinking why did I take the red pill I should have taken the blue one... yes there are times I regret but it’s too late for me .....

Last edited by Alchemy; 24-02-2021 at 06:12 PM. Reason: More info
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  #8  
Old 24-02-2021, 08:32 PM
kosborn (Kevin)
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I started with mono (ASI1600mm) after spending a bit of start up time with a Canon DSLR. I am now on my second round of narrowband filters (Astronomik is much better than ZWO). But then last year I took another leap and bought an ASI 2600mc which is an amazing camera and saves me heaps of time on broadband targets. Unfortunately I took the red pill AND the blue pill and I am now much further down the rabbit hole than I intended! I have to say, both mono and OSC make a great combination.
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  #9  
Old 25-02-2021, 09:57 AM
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The_bluester (Paul)
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If I could dive as deep into the rabbit hole as I would like to I would keep my 2600MC on the scope it is on now and add another identical scope ($$) plus another focus motor ($$) plus a 2600MM, filter wheel, good quality NB and Lum filters ($$$$$ and you might as well get a full LRGB-HA-OIII-SII set) mounting hardware to side by side mount them ($$) and the array version of Voyager to run both at once ($$ but not big money) to allow collection of lum and NB data alongside concurrently captured RGB data on the same target. I do know of someone having done something very much like that and there would have to be some serious appeal if you could afford it.

Realism says no as it would add at least another $5K to my costs on top of going mono now (For the second scope and focus motor)
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  #10  
Old 25-02-2021, 10:13 AM
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multiweb (Marc)
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Got both. OSC is handy to do color. Quick and easy. Mono is better for NB imaging so they both have their purpose. Depends on your sky conditions and what you do most. But in the end it's good to have one of each. My cameras are respectively 13 and 11 year old. They last if you keep them dry and look after them.
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Old 25-02-2021, 12:43 PM
RugbyRene (Rene)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by multiweb View Post
Got both. OSC is handy to do color. Quick and easy. Mono is better for NB imaging so they both have their purpose. Depends on your sky conditions and what you do most. But in the end it's good to have one of each. My cameras are respectively 13 and 11 year old. They last if you keep them dry and look after them.
+1. I have both. I use mono for an Ha layer which I blend with my OSC data. The OSC gives me the colour, while the Ha gives me the detail. Dylan O'Donnell has a video on his YouTube channel.

Rene
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  #12  
Old 26-02-2021, 07:36 PM
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ChrisV (Chris)
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I started with a small 1/3 analog camera doing live imaging/stacking, then a small 2224mc, then to a DSLR doing same, then an osc cooled asi071. Finally swapped to AP. No regrets !!

I keep meaning to go to mono when an aps size came out. It has come out but I'm still enjoying my 071 especially with the nice dual band filters. I'll go mono some day, but I'm in no hurry.
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Old 27-02-2021, 04:26 PM
weathermon (Mike)
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I've got the ASI1600MM Pro and have just bought (on backorder) the ASI2600MM Pro to replace my ASI1600MM Pro. It was a tough choice between the OSC and Mono but in the end I chose Mono as I already had the filter wheel and filters.

Cheers, Mike
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  #14  
Old 27-02-2021, 05:34 PM
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The_bluester (Paul)
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I just ordered one of the new (Bolted down attachment) 7 X 36mm filter wheels. That is on back order too, but that is no matter, I am going to have to miss the intro price on the new cam as I just can't swing another three grand right now. I will have to just go accumulating parts. I am choosing filters now (Trying to pick between Baaders and Astronomics, once I confirm that the FW can accept the 3.5mm deep "Cell" on the Astronomics) and for now given everything is hard to get, I will probably just start with a HA and a clear or lum. I have already proven the 2600MC I have now performs suprisingly well with a HA filter in front of it so it gets me going on the cheap and with the filter wheel, at least I can flip over to lum/clear for quick plate solving, and of they are parfocal enough, focusing. Plate solving is a bit of a pain through a fixed in place HA.
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Old 28-02-2021, 11:26 AM
Startrek (Martin)
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I know I keep raving on about 2600MC but when you progress from a DSLR ( Canon 600D ) after 3 or so years and use the 2600MC itís absolutely unbelievable
Canon 600D QE 38%
2600MC QE +80%

I donít need to take darks although I take them anyway ( I processed with and without and canít see any noticeable difference)
The noise floor is super low so at the end of my processing I only have to use a very low noise reduction to finish off the image

The detail especially on nebula at my image scale is tremendous whether Iím imaging under Bortle 8 in Sydney using a Duoband filter , Bortle 3 South Coast during a full moon with a Duoband filter or without during the dark
OSC Duoband imaging under Bortle 8 Sydney skies with moon or without is a game changer , I could never image nebula with my old DSLR under the same conditions, I tried but the images had very little detail and full of noise so I gave up and just imaged cluster when the moon was up

Also Iíve yet to image with this camera through the winter so looking forward to cooling this thing down to -20C or -25C and capturing the winter targets, nebula, clusters and some dim galaxies

This camera will never compete with Mono and filters but for a cooled OSC its the next best thing as far as my personal experience so far with this camera after 6 months use
Itís opposition the QHY268C cooled OSC is suppose to have similar performance with a few added features

Cheers
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Old 28-02-2021, 08:17 PM
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Nikolas (Nik)
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I live in the city, I work, the weather is so fickle in Melbourne I can't justify going mono until I am retired nd have the time to invest in long periods of image acquisition. As it is I struggle with a 4-5 hour window of imaging in the winter and 3 hours in the summer due to work, and that's when the weather permits!
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Old 01-03-2021, 01:25 PM
SB (Chris)
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Hi Nik,
I keep an open mind on this.
I have seen lots of articles comparing OSC with Mono and I think its important to really critically review each of these posts. For instance if the article is comparing the RGGB Bayer pattern to Mono think about what cameras are being compared their specifications and what camera you use. I use the ASI 183MCP which contains 20.18MPx of small pixels with Esprit 100. For me this gives plenty of scope for good images currently. However when I buy filters I get the 2" size as eventually sensor sizes will increase. I feel that his gives me the scope to go Mono in the future if I choose with outmaking equipment redundant (except the camera).

Chris
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Old 01-03-2021, 05:17 PM
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Nikolas (Nik)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SB View Post
Hi Nik,
I keep an open mind on this.
I have seen lots of articles comparing OSC with Mono and I think its important to really critically review each of these posts. For instance if the article is comparing the RGGB Bayer pattern to Mono think about what cameras are being compared their specifications and what camera you use. I use the ASI 183MCP which contains 20.18MPx of small pixels with Esprit 100. For me this gives plenty of scope for good images currently. However when I buy filters I get the 2" size as eventually sensor sizes will increase. I feel that his gives me the scope to go Mono in the future if I choose with outmaking equipment redundant (except the camera).

Chris
You missed my point I think
I personally use an osc camera because of my limited time for image acquisition and the crap weather Melbourne serves up. No time to acquire 4 times the time to acquire an image with different filters, what takes me hours would take me weeks with a mono camera.
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Old 01-03-2021, 06:25 PM
SB (Chris)
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Hi Nik,
Sorry, the reply was meant for Gordy.

Chris.
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  #20  
Old 01-03-2021, 09:15 PM
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Peter Ward
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If you are seeking excellence, mono is the ONLY way to go.
The laws of physics make them the obvious and only choice.

Suffice to say, JPL/NASA/ESO/JAXA donít fly colour cameras.

If you are time poor/just want some fun/technically challenged, then the new colour cameras can give great Öin fact occasionallyÖaward winning results.

But for sheer depth and breadth of intrinsic dataÖ. mono wins every time.
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