#21  
Old 01-06-2021, 10:01 AM
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multiweb (Marc)
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Originally Posted by gregbradley View Post
I hope that is on the sensor cover slip. It seems squashed between something.
Yeah I was thinking the same thing. I hope it's not between the sensor and the glass cover.
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  #22  
Old 01-06-2021, 10:34 AM
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The_bluester (Paul)
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Originally Posted by Craig_ View Post
Yeah, I have no idea if it was coolant, this is just what I saw being claimed as the issue on a facebook post where the photo looked very similar to this camera here. That person was of the view it was a warranty repair.
Well, if it was heat sink compound of some sort it would be, but if it is a case of they clean it with isopropyl alcohol and send it back, it will be gone for a long time to get it's nose wiped with the current state of the world. If it is actually between the senor and sensor cover slip (No idea if that is even possible) then that would be a different story.
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  #23  
Old 01-06-2021, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Startrek View Post
Paul,
Yeh Iíve had my 2600MC for 9 months with no issues but last night I forgot to turn the cooler on straight away waiting for cloud to pass , 2 hours later I cooled the camera to -15C , could this be the reason ???
Photo attached of the sensor
Martin
Really sorry to hear about this both for you and me given I have one on order.
It is most curious that the problem took so long to manifest.
Anyways dont let it set you back Martin....it is just one of those things sent to build your character...but certainly points to a need to get a back up camera
Alex
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Old 01-06-2021, 12:07 PM
Startrek (Martin)
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Thanks all for your comments and support
I sent a photo of my camera sensor on the ZWO forum yesterday and received a reply within 4 hours
They say itís silicon grease from the thermal pad and can be successfully cleaned with no further issues. They sent me a long winded procedure of how to clean it with steps and photos etc..
I assumed from their quick reply , evaluation and step by step procedure with photos etc.. that ZWO previously know of this problem with my model camera and have sent out similar replies to folk around the world
As my camera is still under warranty, I called Jess from Bintel and she jumped into action straight away.A pre paid return post form is being emailed out now , camera back to Bintel , and she reassured me if a quick turn around repair with no further issues 👍 to Bintel ( Don obviously behind the scenes here )
Canít ask for more than that !!
This camera has been simply unbelievable, so a minor issue like this whilst a bit disappointing is part of AP and hopefully back imaging with it again soon

NB : I should mention that I image with my cameras dew heater ďonĒ all the time Summer and Winter ( Jess did ask that question whether I had just turned on the dew heater recently, and I said no , itís on all the time ) Donít know if this has any relevance to the thermal pad oozing silicon grease ?????

Thanks again for all your comments and support

Martin
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  #25  
Old 01-06-2021, 12:31 PM
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The_bluester (Paul)
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OK, the silicon grease must be being used in place of traditional heat sink compound. That will probably be quick and easy to clean. Maybe they have been a little over enthusiastic with applying it. Hopefully mine stays clean as it is.

The only reason I could think of for a question on the dew heater would be if the camera was powered on and not cooled for some time the heat build up between the electronics and the heater might lower the viscosity of the grease and make it more inclined to run somewhere it should not be.
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  #26  
Old 01-06-2021, 01:04 PM
Startrek (Martin)
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Originally Posted by The_bluester View Post
OK, the silicon grease must be being used in place of traditional heat sink compound. That will probably be quick and easy to clean. Maybe they have been a little over enthusiastic with applying it. Hopefully mine stays clean as it is.

The only reason I could think of for a question on the dew heater would be if the camera was powered on and not cooled for some time the heat build up between the electronics and the heater might lower the viscosity of the grease and make it more inclined to run somewhere it should not be.
Paul,
Thatís what exactly happened, every session since Iíve had the camera , Iíve had the dew heater on by default and cooled the camera immediately before even framing or focusing.For some reason I forgot to cool it , clouds came over for nearly 2 hours then cleared , then I cooled the camera and after focusing and framing a target , the first sub exposed the problem
Still it shouldnít happen if you inadvertently forget to cool the camera. Looks like a operational design deficiency or like you said a little to heavy handed with grease
Anyway hopefully rectified soon
Martin
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  #27  
Old 01-06-2021, 01:32 PM
Startrek (Martin)
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Originally Posted by xelasnave View Post
Really sorry to hear about this both for you and me given I have one on order.
It is most curious that the problem took so long to manifest.
Anyways dont let it set you back Martin....it is just one of those things sent to build your character...but certainly points to a need to get a back up camera
Alex
Alex
Thanks
My back up camera is my old Canon 600D which I cut my teeth on. I still use this old camera for planetary imaging would you believe .I was out last night imaging Omega Centauri in Sydney just for bit of fun , itís not to bad for an old DSLR but chalk and cheese compared to the 2600MC ( Holden Commodore compared to an E class Merc )
At least with the DSLR you wonít get silicon grease oozing over your sensor ......
Martin
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  #28  
Old 01-06-2021, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Startrek View Post
Alex

At least with the DSLR you wonít get silicon grease oozing over your sensor ......
Martin
Wouldn't be too sure of that! Your Canon may be fine but Nikon DSLRs (some models) had big issues with oil spraying over the sensor from the shutter mechanism.
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  #29  
Old 01-06-2021, 03:46 PM
Startrek (Martin)
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Originally Posted by Craig_ View Post
Wouldn't be too sure of that! Your Canon may be fine but Nikon DSLRs (some models) had big issues with oil spraying over the sensor from the shutter mechanism.
Thatís why Canonís are the preferred Astro DSLR
I pinched my wifeís 600D to do Astro years ago, it just keeps going , never even cleaned the sensor and never get dust bunnies
I certainly would be tempted to buy the Canon Ra at some stage in the future when I can longer do the deep stuff with heavy mounts and newts
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  #30  
Old 01-06-2021, 08:16 PM
Startrek (Martin)
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Due to the grease smear on the sensor of my 2600MC , I decided to check the Cloudy Nights forum and found quite a few posts ( dating back to November 2020 ) regarding this issue with the 2600MC. Most of them experienced the oil smear after 6 months of use , mine was 9 months of use.
One post had an excerpt from the ZWO forum earlier this year saying ď We already have improved our production.We will clean the oil on the thermal pad before use it so it wonít happen againĒ
So the bottom line is this has been a problem with this camera since mid 2020 onwards and the fault doesnít occur until 6 to 9 months down the track in most cases.
I am confident though that due to the nature of this problem and ZWOís acknowledgment and commitment to improve , any new purchases from March 2021 onwards hopefully will be ok
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  #31  
Old 01-06-2021, 08:40 PM
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yep, common issue. I'm waiting for it to happen to me!

That said, on the subject of dew (which this isn't), don't forget to use your camera's in-built dew heater.
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  #32  
Old 01-06-2021, 09:17 PM
Startrek (Martin)
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Originally Posted by AdamJL View Post
yep, common issue. I'm waiting for it to happen to me!

That said, on the subject of dew (which this isn't), don't forget to use your camera's in-built dew heater.
Adam,
If you joggle back through the post , I mentioned that I use the dew heater as default ďonĒ all the time , and wondered if having the dew heater on and not cooling the camera down immediately ( like Iíve been doing for 9 months except for the night that I had the oil smear ) caused the silicon grease under the thermal pad to increase viscosity due to heat and dribble across the sensor ???
Possibly ?
Maybe ?
So if you have a 2600MC Iíd advise you to cool the camera down immediately after connecting irrespective of whether you use the dew heater or not ( it may or may not be the cause but itís doesnít hurt doing it anyway )

Martin
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  #33  
Old 01-06-2021, 10:03 PM
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Ha, cheers Martin. I've got a blinding headache tonight so I'm probably skipping posts and not noticing

But yes, as soon as I connect the camera, I start cooling. Force of habit now, as I go about getting everything else setup.

Good luck getting this sorted. Looks like a few hours of fun!
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  #34  
Old 02-06-2021, 07:18 AM
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I have had mine maybe ten months, hopefully the fact I have seen no sign of it means mine will stay clean, but if it is going to happen I must be about due.


Got a link to the CN thread? With most of them happening around the 6 month mark they may not have been cleaned by the owners but if someone has done it would be interesting to know what they used for a solvent. I bet you a dollar mine hangs on until the warranty is over, if it does it at all.
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  #35  
Old 02-06-2021, 08:09 AM
Startrek (Martin)
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Originally Posted by The_bluester View Post
I have had mine maybe ten months, hopefully the fact I have seen no sign of it means mine will stay clean, but if it is going to happen I must be about due.


Got a link to the CN thread? With most of them happening around the 6 month mark they may not have been cleaned by the owners but if someone has done it would be interesting to know what they used for a solvent. I bet you a dollar mine hangs on until the warranty is over, if it does it at all.
Paul,
From all the information Iíve read, ZWO have eliminated the problem from March , so if you bought yours around that period you should be ok and any current orders will be ok
They responded yesterday to a person in my ZWO forum post who asked ď Oh no I hope mines ok , they said ď of course the problem is fixed now ď
Also ZWO in all their instructions to clean sensors use ethanol or pure alcohol not isopropyl alcohol which has additives and naturants
They advise to use a fine quality grade microfibre cloth or wipe
Martin
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  #36  
Old 02-06-2021, 08:25 AM
Startrek (Martin)
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Paul,
From all the information Iíve read, ZWO have eliminated the problem from March , so if you bought yours around that period you should be ok and any current orders will be ok
They responded yesterday to a person in my ZWO forum post who asked ď Oh no I hope mines ok , they said ď of course the problem is fixed now ď
Also ZWO in all their instructions to clean sensors use ethanol or pure alcohol not isopropyl alcohol which has additives and naturants
They advise to use a fine quality grade microfibre cloth or wipe
Martin
I just noticed youíve had your camera 10 months
Fingers crossed but if itís going to happen itís better off sooner than later obviously for warranty
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  #37  
Old 02-06-2021, 08:36 AM
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To be honest, this close to the end of the warranty period, if it happened tomorrow I would get some of the right solvent and a box of kimwipes and fix it myself. I have a technical background so I am not afraid of opening stuff up myself.

Incidentally, the way we generally dealt with the denaturing stuff in isoprop was literally washing with water afterwards if it was something that critical for cleanliness (Not much of an issue in my particular corner of the RAAF but the aircraft guys might have had to on some equipment as isopropyl alcohol was used to clean solder flux and so on off circuit boards after repairs. There are probably better solvents now which don't in turn leave residues as water might, depending on what is in it. It is interesting that you can see a lot of OEM's don't bother with much cleaning after soldering with flux when you can see boards with conformal coatings applied over the top of blobs of fried flux.

At least I can be fairly sure that when my 2600MM arrives it should not be a candidate for this issue.
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  #38  
Old 02-06-2021, 11:35 AM
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ZWO have acknowledged the problem and say that it's easily cleaned off the sensor etc by following their cleaning instructions on the website, it's a long time to wait for a warranty return when the problem can be fixed yourself, all they will do is clean the sensor like you can do yourself, unless you are a ham fisted chimpanzee which I doubt.
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  #39  
Old 02-06-2021, 12:22 PM
Startrek (Martin)
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Originally Posted by Nikolas View Post
ZWO have acknowledged the problem and say that it's easily cleaned off the sensor etc by following their cleaning instructions on the website, it's a long time to wait for a warranty return when the problem can be fixed yourself, all they will do is clean the sensor like you can do yourself, unless you are a ham fisted chimpanzee which I doubt.
The ZWO sensor cleaning procedure on their website is not what they sent me to rectify the leaking grease problem under the thermal pad
Iíll attach part 1 which refers to above
Part 2 was the sensor cleaning PDF on their website
Also part 1 was sent as a ďrarĒ file so had to be opened and unzipped with 2 different apps ( I think they donít want to make it too public about the issue with this camera
I donít mind a few weeks without the camera , itís under warranty and the responsibility lies with ZWO , they can fix once and for all
On the Cloudy Nights forum , folk have opted to do it themselves to clean the thermal pad then clean the sensor and within weeks the grease has come back on the sensor again but not as severe

Cheers
Martin
Attached Files
File Type: pdf ZWO How To Clean the excess grease on the thermal pad.pdf (286.6 KB, 21 views)
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  #40  
Old 02-06-2021, 12:35 PM
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I would say from that doc that if people have had the issue return they have possibly only opened up the camera and cleaned the sensor itself, leaving excess grease to keep on wicking around the board.

I don't think finding a .rar file indicates any great secrecy, WinRAR is more or less just a competitor to Winzip, I run into .rar files now and again, just they are not as common as .zip files.
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