2016 census. One step closer to the police state

[julianh72 (Julian)]

Originally Posted by AndrewJ

It almost worked for the last election

In my opinion, you can't hold up the results of the last federal election as an example of "people power" prevailing over "big bad government" - they are almost the worst possible outcome, as far as good stable, responsible government is concerned. (Not as bad as the possibility of Donald Trump becoming POTUS, but a close second!)

[FlashDrive (Poppy)]

Originally Posted by Kunama

What concerns me more is these endless cloudy nights and the future lack of skiable snow in Australia...

Complacency and Apostasy in its highest form .....

Poppy ....

[AndrewJ]

Gday Julian

In my opinion, you can't hold up the results of the last federal election as an example of "people power" prevailing over "big bad government" - they are almost the worst possible outcome, as far as good stable, responsible government is concerned.

I disagree.
The latest attempt by the incumbent govt to change the way voting works for the senate, so they could go for a trumped up double dissolution in the hope of a power grab, effectively gave the people a way to stick it to the pollies, AND they did.
Good stable Govt is a nice ideal, but when the choice had degenerated to a fight between dumb or dumber, the people chose a third option.
Even now, neither side can agree to get on with themselves, let alone do any governing. They dont learn.
Also, re dodgy use of private data, just look at things like Parakeelia, where they use your own taxes to set up databases to allow them to ignore you if you annoy them.
The whole lot stinks, and we havent seen the tip of it yet.

Andrew

[casstony]

Originally Posted by julianh72

In my opinion, you can't hold up the results of the last federal election as an example of "people power" prevailing over "big bad government" - they are almost the worst possible outcome, as far as good stable, responsible government is concerned. (Not as bad as the possibility of Donald Trump becoming POTUS, but a close second!)

It is people power in the sense that the voters are forcing a particular outcome, even if that results in jumping from the frying pan into the fire.

As governments become more corrupt and less representative, the people flail about looking for something better. If things get bad enough extremists get elected to power because voters don't know what else they can do - they just know they want to get rid of what they've got.

[el_draco (Rom)]

Originally Posted by Kunama

Our children live on their mobiles, iPads, laptops 24/7..... That train has left the station long ago.....

Not for my kids. When someone chooses to dump their guts online, that's their own stupidity but when governments remove your right to privacy by hook or crook, that's another matter entirely.

Complete abuse of your right to privacy under the guise of "anti-terrorism" is just a smoke screen. They want control of everything you say, do, think or believe and that's a Police state by any name you want to call it. I'm more worried about that than some disaffected nut job losing the plot.

[Kev11 (Kevin)]

The census of England and Wales has retained names since the first modern census in 1831. Despite Brexit, I don't believe the sky has fallen in over there. Do any Australians in 2016 worry about having a convict ancestor traced? That was the thinking behind the policy of destroying census records here.

[julianh72 (Julian)]

Originally Posted by AndrewJ

but when the choice had degenerated to a fight between dumb or dumber, the people chose a third option.

3rd option = Dumberer?

[AndrewJ]

Gday Julian

3rd option = Dumberer?

Sometimes you need to cut to heal.
Unless they get a real shock, they wont change, so better to cut early and hope something better comes along, than surely go under slowly.
IIRC, the constitution actually doesnt talk about "parties" in parliament, just representatives of the people.
( and people are an odd mix of miscreants )
What we now have is a professional class of Pollies, who have nearly all come through the same cloning machine. Nothing like the constitution expected.

Andrew

[el_draco (Rom)]

The basic premise of democracy was that intelligent people would vote for their representatives. Well... what can you say except the "dumberer" are easier to lead...

[xelasnave]

There is a not unreasonable expectation that fairness should prevail.
Nice thought but that will never happen.
So we will have needy and greedy folk.
I can not imagine a society where everyone is equal and each given a fair share of the Earths resources.
And so human rights will continually erode.
Who of the very first humans would have thought one human could own land and have others pay to occupy it...now we accept that, we accept the notion others can own more and have a greater access to a good life, education, security, health.
The human system is nothing to be proud of given the wars the suffering and the presumed right of a select few to control everything. And they do.
Wealth is power and it trumps any democracy hands down.
Just think of it this way, if you have a farm you need a list of your milkers and a list of fat cattle...we are not much more than cattle, some there to be milked some needed where they must forfeit their lives.
So what do we replace it with?
I think humans have to find an answer but I can not imagine they can.
War, peace, feast or famine.
Alex

[el_draco (Rom)]

Originally Posted by xelasnave

There is a not unreasonable expectation that fairness should prevail.
Nice thought but that will never happen.
So we will have needy and greedy folk.
I can not imagine a society where everyone is equal and each given a fair share of the Earths resources.
And so human rights will continually erode.
Who of the very first humans would have thought one human could own land and have others pay to occupy it...now we accept that, we accept the notion others can own more and have a greater access to a good life, education, security, health.
The human system is nothing to be proud of given the wars the suffering and the presumed right of a select few to control everything. And they do.
Wealth is power and it trumps any democracy hands down.
Just think of it this way, if you have a farm you need a list of your milkers and a list of fat cattle...we are not much more than cattle, some there to be milked some needed where they must forfeit their lives.
So what do we replace it with?
I think humans have to find an answer but I can not imagine they can.
War, peace, feast or famine.
Alex

Prophetic words Alex, but I would hope that intelligence prevails. If not then I suspect we are little more than oxygen wasters.

[Allan_L (Allan)]

Guys
it is just a poll.
so they can plan, budget for and implement appropriate infrastructure where it is needed:
schools, playgrounds, hospitals, churchs, day care, aged care, jobs, centrelink, police, public transport, government services.
It is not a conspiracy theory movie plot. (IMHO)

[FlashDrive (Poppy)]

I just saw a ' Black Limo ' cruise past my place with no lights on ....

[el_draco (Rom)]

Originally Posted by Allan_L

Guys
it is just a poll.
so they can plan, budget for and implement appropriate infrastructure where it is needed:
schools, playgrounds, hospitals, churchs, day care, aged care, jobs, centrelink, police, public transport, government services.
It is not a conspiracy theory movie plot. (IMHO)

The major problem is that they are demanding you provide information that is not relevant to statistical analysis, ie, your name and address. In the fine print they say that information will be used to more accurately integrate other data from other agencies. Take your pick how many "agencies" that means. The net result is the government will have a complete profile on YOU!

We defeated the Australia card and this is just the same thing by stealth. There is evidence that the census is illegal and at best, an unprecedented invasion of whats left of your personal privacy. It stinks on so many levels I am amazed there aren't protests in the streets but as previously stated, you can cook a frog easily if you heat the water slowly.

[el_draco (Rom)]

Originally Posted by Kunama

I have counted 37 "keywords" in this thread so far that will have alarms going off in " their " offices....... Soon there will be a fleet of unmarked vehicles in your neighbourhoods which will drive off quickly if you approach them....

I'll get my tire spikes ready, along with the axe handle specially made for dealing with drones.

[Tandum (Robin)]

I think the real issue here is everyone in the country logging into a government computer system at the same time.
Personally I can't see it handling the load but if it does they're throwing way too much of my money at IT

[AndrewJ]

Gday Allan

it is just a poll.
so they can plan, budget for and implement appropriate infrastructure where it is needed: schools, playgrounds, hospitals, churchs, day care, aged care, jobs, centrelink, police, public transport, government services.

Then all they need to "store" is my postcode, and they dont NEED to swap the low level info with other departments.
Also, a lot of the above listed "infrastructure" is now being cut back or sold off to private industry ( even tho the local need is growing ), so no extra Govt planning data is required, as its not being used?????
I already mentioned that they sold off the schools down here and now cant rebuild. Yesterday, people living in the new Darklands ( Docklands ) developments of Melb were complaining they still dont have ANY schools.
Some new "Mega" Police stations were built but arent fully staffed whilst local stations have been closed or arent staffed at all most days.
Day care and aged care are being set to privatise, and will build where they want, not where required.
Govt planning from this data will be controlled by how much money they have and who screams the most, not a logical plan from some census result.

Andrew

[Shiraz (Ray)]

Originally Posted by Tandum

I think the real issue here is everyone in the country logging into a government computer system at the same time.
Personally I can't see it handling the load but if it does they're throwing way too much of my money at IT

agree. the phone system has already broken down under the load. My wife has so far tried 6 times to get a paper form mailed out - she has not yet got past the "we are experiencing...please call back at a later time"

Gawd knows what is going to happen when what is in effect a self-made DOS attack on the census website starts on the night of the 9th. The whole process looks like it was devised by Peter Pan.

[cfranks (Charles)]

Originally Posted by FlashDrive

I just saw a ' Black Limo ' cruise past my place with no lights on ....

The driver was obviously taking care, just in case you were imaging!

[AndrewJ]

The driver was obviously taking care, just in case you were imaging!

If it was in certain spots in Melb, they are just looking for luxury cars to steal :-)

Andrew