BackyardEOS ~ A new software for Canon DSLR

[guyroch]

Originally Posted by Omaroo

Well, that's me gone anyway. I totally forgot that a typical netbook display is 1024x600, meaning that I can't see the important buttons at the bottom of the screen - i.e. "Snap Image".

This might be a reasonable blocker for you Guylain, as there are many, many people who use cheap netbooks in the field rather than a laptop. My Acer Aspire can't scroll the screen either, it seems. @#!*% .

I'd like to look at them as challenges to overcome, not as blockers.

Well. going from 1024x768 to 1024x600 may not be (is not) difficult to do at all. I can easily squeeze a few things in and it will work just the same on a 1024x600 resolution. I'll see what I can do.

I'd like to take this opportunity to indicate that I'm very open to suggestions and I'm even ready to adapt BackyardEOS to meet your needs; this is one good example.

Guylain

[guyroch]

Originally Posted by Omaroo

I note that you've now reworded your purchase conditions Guylain. Reading it through prior to that there was no indication of an annual renewal.

Ummm... I have not changed the wording on the website, It's been like since I posted it yesterday.

Hey guys, I did not mean to create a fuss about this, I have worked hard on this software and I hope it will make your life easier if you decide to purchase it. It is up to you to decide based if the terms and conditions if they are satisfactory to you. Are they casted in stone? Of course not. Can the pricing structure change? Of course it can. But I had to come up with a fair price for a fair product and this is what I have come up with.

Generally speaking I'm very sorry the added value of BackyardEOS is in the shadow here; it's not even highlighted by anyone.

The pricing structure is not something I came up with on the spur of the moment, I have put some careful thought into it and even polled some potential users as indicated in the thread below in an attempt to prevent this kind of conversation. But this is an important conversation just the same and I do hear everyone out there.

I know of another similar tool out there that offers similar capabilities and the pricing structure is similar.

Thank you,

Guylain

[Omaroo (Chris Malikoff)]

Sorry Guylain, I've modified my previous post. Obviously you can set the screen to a virtual scroll mode, but that's inconvenient for just about everything else. I've just done that and it works, albeit slowly. Image files coming off the 5D2 are pretty large, and a netbook is but a netbook. That's not your problem though.

A version that can squeeze into 1024x600 would be nice. The buttons are pretty huge, top and bottom, so they may be slimmed down a little to fit I'd say. You'd obviously want to maintain the image window aspect ratio.

[guyroch]

Originally Posted by Omaroo

Sorry Guylain, I've modified my previous post. Obviously you can set the screen to a virtual scroll mode, but that's inconvenient for just about everything else. I've just done that and it works, albeit slowly. Image files coming off the 5D2 are pretty large, and a netbook is but a netbook. That's not your problem though.

A version that can squeeze into 1024x600 would be nice. The buttons are pretty huge, top and bottom, so they may be slimmed down a little to fit I'd say. You'd obviously want to maintain the image window aspect ratio.

Image aspect ratio is always maintained. Yeah scrolling is a pain. I honestly think I can make everything fit in 1024x600; though I may make it a user setting to keep it flexible for other users and use as much screen real estate as I can.

Are you willing to test it if give it good go at supporting 1024x600?

As for the image size I agree, we are working with very big files. Oddly enough though downloading the file take way less time than working the Exif data post download.

Thanks

[Omaroo (Chris Malikoff)]

Absolutely I'd be happy to try a 1024x600 version for you Guylain. I've been trying it this morning and it's a very nice piece of software. You've done a splendid job - and I'm a software development manager, so interface design is very near and dear to me.

[guyroch]

Originally Posted by Omaroo

Absolutely I'd be happy to try a 1024x600 version for you Guylain. I've been trying it this morning and it's a very nice piece of software. You've done a splendid job - and I'm a software development manager, so interface design is very near and dear to me.

Okay, I'll give 1024x600 a good stab then. I'll keep you posted on the progress.

Thanks

Guylain

[Omaroo (Chris Malikoff)]

Houghy - you and anyone else with a Tak Teegul SPII , P2Z or similar small EQ mount that doesn't have a guide port will love this software. Whack on your camera plus lens of choice, and you can drift align via the DSLR without doing it with a scope first which must be dismounted - in the vain hope of maintaining the same alignment after the camera finally goes on.

I think another SkyPatrol II or III is in order one day.... hmmm....

[higginsdj]

I used software that introduced this licensing model - the company is now virtually out of business with software updates coming from users with programming skills. At the "last minute" (when things were obviously going bad) they offered a full paid version (one that never expires) and this, I beleive is the only reason they have been able to keep their doors open (just 1 staff member left to look after their web presence). The original user population, based on the software forum size dropped from 80,000+ to under 500 in 2 years.

Personally I have no issue with the annual subscriptions but after trialing it for a year I opted for the paid version (at 5 times the subscription price).

Other questions. Is the software locked to a single machine or can I install it on any number of machines? If locked, what mechanism are you using to lock it/identify the host machine. Changing OS versions, new Hard Drive etc play havoc with locked software.

I should point out I have no intention of buying this software (I don't have a DSLR) - just offering up some experience for what it is worth. From a user perspective it is a mindset - nothing to do with the $ amount.

Cheers

[adman (Adam)]

a suggestion for your licensing structure:

1. A single upfront charge for the software that includes a non-expiring user licence, and your first years support and upgrades.
2. An optional annual "Maintenance Charge" which entitles you to 12 months of upgrades and support.

This avoids the problems that will occur if you ever decide to move onwards and upwards and stop supporting the product. Also some people don't like to upgrade very frequently - the "if it aint broke don't fix it" types. But it lets them "opt in" for upgrades if they are tempted by new functionality.

Adam

[Omaroo (Chris Malikoff)]

Originally Posted by higginsdj

Is the software locked to a single machine or can I install it on any number of machines? If locked, what mechanism are you using to lock it/identify the host machine.

From Guylain's website: http://backyardeos.binaryrivers.com/purchase

1. We grant you one single user license to install and use the software on one computer at a time. If you do not agree to the following terms of this license, please uninstall and remove all copies.

2. You may install and use the software on another computer, but the software should not be in use on more than one computer at a time unless you purchase additional licenses. You may make back-up copies of the software for archival purposes. You may not transfer your license to use the software to another party.

I think that this is fair, and have no problem with it, having only one imaging rig in use at any one time. I imagine that all that is required is that you install the software on your second computer (maybe your desktop for indoor testing) and place a copy of your license file into the programs root directory.

[guyroch]

Originally Posted by Omaroo

From Guylain's website: http://backyardeos.binaryrivers.com/purchase



I think that this is fair, and have no problem with it, having only one imaging rig in use at any one time. I imagine that all that is required is that you install the software on your second computer (maybe your desktop for indoor testing) and place a copy of your license file into the programs root directory.

This is correct, you may install the the software on 25 computers if you wish, as long as only one copy is running at a time with the same license file. There is no built in protection against that and you can physically run it on 2 computer at once and I'll never know... and if you do every now and then that this is fine too; I understand that you may need to run it 2 computers at once every now then, no arm done and feel free to do it.

The application is not tied to any hardware and I do not make any gymnastics with registry entries, you can easily copy the entire installation directory on a USB key and run it from there. As long as the .net 3.5 framework is installed it will run.

Guylain

[guyroch]

Originally Posted by higginsdj

I used software that introduced this licensing model - the company is now virtually out of business with software updates coming from users with programming skills. At the "last minute" (when things were obviously going bad) they offered a full paid version (one that never expires) and this, I beleive is the only reason they have been able to keep their doors open (just 1 staff member left to look after their web presence). The original user population, based on the software forum size dropped from 80,000+ to under 500 in 2 years.

Personally I have no issue with the annual subscriptions but after trialing it for a year I opted for the paid version (at 5 times the subscription price).

Other questions. Is the software locked to a single machine or can I install it on any number of machines? If locked, what mechanism are you using to lock it/identify the host machine. Changing OS versions, new Hard Drive etc play havoc with locked software.

I should point out I have no intention of buying this software (I don't have a DSLR) - just offering up some experience for what it is worth. From a user perspective it is a mindset - nothing to do with the $ amount.

Cheers

This is a very compelling story and very hard to argue. Thank you sharing even if you don't do DSLR imaging. I'll recollect my thoughts and see what I can do. The last thing I want is to have a barrier which prevents potential users from benefiting from using the software for the value it brings.

Thanks for sharing.

Guylain

[wasyoungonce (Brendan)]

Personally...I would rather pay a higher initial cost with 1 years free upgrades then an annual payment for software upgrades.

Not an annual fee to keep using the software.

Unfortunately this has turned me right off. Pity. The product looks great..the packaging not so great.

[guyroch]

There have been quite a number of conversations going on today regarding the pricing structure of BackyardEOS. The conversations have taken places on several astronomy forums around the world where I introduced BackyardEOS and in my Yahoo support group as well.

Let me reassure everyone by saying “I hear you!”

Your feedback, positive or negative, is important to me. It will make me stronger and BackyardEOS a better product that everyone can enjoy without worrying about price.

I’m serious about making BackyardEOS a household name in the DSLR imaging space and if $8 a year stands in the way of it becoming just that I will gladly remove this barrier. The money is not that important to me, your satisfaction is!

I’m also not keen in raising the price much higher. I think that $24 is a fair introductory price and anything higher will have potential buyers think twice before purchasing and this would go against the “making BackyardEOS a household name” concept.


With this said… BackyardEOS is re-born!

1) The mandatory $8 annual fee is removed
2) The purchase price stays at $24
3) I will send a new license file with no expiry date to everyone that has already purchased the software. I want to be fair to everyone.
4) I will update the web site accordingly.

For this price you will get one single user license for BackyardEOS, one year support, and one year free service software updates with bug fixes and minor software enhancements as they become available.

Discounts will be offered for renewing your support agreement should you wish to continue with this service level. You are free to continue using your current licensed copy of BackyardEOS should you decide not to renew your support agreement; you will simply no longer be entitled to free service software updates with bug fixes and minor software enhancements as they become available.

Discounts will also be offered to newer major release upgrades with major software enhancement to all license holders regardless if you have renewed your service level or not.

This is still licensed software and the End User License Agreement is in effect at all times whether you renew your support agreement or not.

Finally, I would like to take this opportunity to thank everyone that has provided feedback on this very important matter, instant feedback at times . Life is a learning experience and today was no exception for me.

Clear skies,

Guylain Rochon

[Omaroo (Chris Malikoff)]

Guylain - it's a pleasure to deal with someone serious. You've looked at the situation and have reacted accordingly by coming up with a much better scheme. I'll be upgrading my trial to a licensed copy tonight.

As we say here in Oz - "Good on'ya mate!"

----

EDIT: Paid Only problem is that I paid via PayPal, and the email address I use for that is different to the one I gave you before to register my trial copy. Please use that same one again. Thanks!

[adman (Adam)]

Originally Posted by Omaroo

I totally forgot that a typical netbook display is 1024x600, meaning that I generally can't see the important buttons at the bottom of the screen - i.e. "Snap Image". I've gone into the advanced tab in monitor settings and I have temporarily set it to 1024 x 768 with scrolling. Annoying to say the least, but usable for a photographic session.

This might be a reasonable blocker for you Guylain, as there are many, many people who use cheap netbooks in the field rather than a laptop. Damn.

I would like to second Chris' comment about screen resolution. Tried it today on my netbook - would love to see 1024x600 supported. I can change the screen resolution - but it is an ugly "fix".

Adam

[guyroch]

Originally Posted by Omaroo

Guylain - it's a pleasure to deal with someone serious. You've looked at the situation and have reacted accordingly by coming up with a much better scheme. I'll be upgrading my trial to a licensed copy tonight.

As we say here is Oz - "Good on'ya mate!"

----

EDIT: Paid Only problem is that I paid via PayPal, and the email address I use for that is different to the one I gave you before to register my trial copy. Please use that same one again. Thanks!

Don't worry about emails, I keep track of everything. I don't think I have deleted a single email in 10 years, but is another story

Thank you Chris, I have received your payment. I'm currently making a minor change in the application to ensure it accepts licenses without expiry dates. I will send you a license file then (probably tomorrow) once I have posted and tested a new build, otherwise the new license file will not work with the current build.

Thanks you very much for your patience.

Take care,

Guylain

[guyroch]

Originally Posted by adman

I would like to second Chris' comment about screen resolution. Tried it today on my netbook - would love to see 1024x600 supported. I can change the screen resolution - but it is an ugly "fix".

Adam

Yeah, I hate ugly fix too . I will be working on a 1024x600 version.

Thanks

Guylain

[hotspur (Chris)]

looks pretty reasonable,Such a huge amount of your time making it work.

The price is very small for the amount of hours spent making it.

I'll buy one,when its ready for sale.

Good luck,Chris

[guyroch]

Originally Posted by hotspur

looks pretty reasonable,Such a huge amount of your time making it work.

The price is very small for the amount of hours spent making it.

I'll buy one,when its ready for sale.

Good luck,Chris

Thanks hotspur for the comments. It is current available for sale and has been since Saturday, November 27th 2010

Guylain