Help! Goto is now GoWHERE!

EddieDog (Eddie) · #1 20-03-2011, 10:48 PM

Hi all, hasn't taken me long to ask for help. Upgraded handcontrol today and went out to test this evening and after successfully aligning, when I select an object, it goes nowhere near. I'm sure my time and location is correct. Any ideas. Will test again tomorrow as no time tonight.
Eddie

MikeyB (Michael) · #2 20-03-2011, 11:39 PM

Some questions first, to narrow down the possibilities:

What version of the hand control software does the handset say it's running?

What alignment method are you using?

How much prior experience do you have with aligning this scope?

Are you running the scope on penlight batteries?

EddieDog (Eddie) · #3 20-03-2011, 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeyB

Some questions first, to narrow down the possibilities:

What version of the hand control software does the handset say it's running?

What alignment method are you using?

How much prior experience do you have with aligning this scope?

Are you running the scope on penlight batteries?

Hi Michael, upgraded to latest version hand control, it was verified during update process. I used two methods. Twice used 3-star alignment successful both times but goto bad.
Then did a solar alignment using moon. Just for interest I selected the moon as a goto and off it went somewhere else.
Previoulsy it has been a little off at times but more often than not it would either hit the target or miss by only a little.
Lasty, previoulsy I used a/c power, but his time on batteries so I do suspect it could be them, But if so, why when I was ON the moon, did it go walkies when I asked it to GOTO the moon?

Eddie

ballaratdragons (Ken) · #4 20-03-2011, 11:53 PM

I don't know the accuracy of your hand controller but the ones for the Skywatcher EQ6 mounts are atrocious on the Moon and Planets.
Everything else is exact.
After your 3 star alignment try it on a Deep Sky object, not a Solar System object.

Also, have you set it right for Daylight Savings time. Different manufacturers set a different date in their controllers. EQ6 mounts are about 2 weeks out.
If you set it with Daylight savings on, try setting it off. Or Visa-Versa.
I've made the Daylight Savings mistake heaps of times.

Barrykgerdes · #5 21-03-2011, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EddieDog

Hi Michael, upgraded to latest version hand control, it was verified during update process. I used two methods. Twice used 3-star alignment successful both times but goto bad.
Then did a solar alignment using moon. Just for interest I selected the moon as a goto and off it went somewhere else.
Previoulsy it has been a little off at times but more often than not it would either hit the target or miss by only a little.
Lasty, previoulsy I used a/c power, but his time on batteries so I do suspect it could be them, But if so, why when I was ON the moon, did it go walkies when I asked it to GOTO the moon?

Eddie

Hi Eddie

I have read through your post and it seems you have a Celeston Nexstar 6se and have just updated the software (successfully). I am no expert on the 6se but I do have the works (mount assembly) of one. It has a faulty Altitude motor (intermttent).

I have found that batteries are a waste of time. They work for an hour or so and then start to miss gotos. No bother when connected to a A/C supply.

Forget Gotos to the moon and planets for alignment. The calculations for these are only primative and done at initiallisation so they can be a long way off and depend on date, time and location.

You say that you have success with a three star alignment. When it is complete can you slew back to your alignment stars accurately. If you can I would expect your alignmnent on stars to be correct. If not There are three possibilities. Power, wrong stars or encoder ratios. I would suspect wrong stars or Power. Make sure you have correctly identified your alignment stars.

If your alignment has proved correct and you then try to slew to solar system objects and they are nowhere near the correct place the problem will be in your date/time or location. You say you have recently updated the firmware. Did you remember to reset your location. The new firmware probably has defaulted to somewhere in the USA.

Barry

EddieDog (Eddie) · #6 21-03-2011, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrykgerdes

Hi Eddie

I have read through your post and it seems you have a Celeston Nexstar 6se and have just updated the software (successfully). I am no expert on the 6se but I do have the works (mount assembly) of one. It has a faulty Altitude motor (intermttent).

I have found that batteries are a waste of time. They work for an hour or so and then start to miss gotos. No bother when connected to a A/C supply.

Forget Gotos to the moon and planets for alignment. The calculations for these are only primative and done at initiallisation so they can be a long way off and depend on date, time and location.

You say that you have success with a three star alignment. When it is complete can you slew back to your alignment stars accurately. If you can I would expect your alignmnent on stars to be correct. If not There are three possibilities. Power, wrong stars or encoder ratios. I would suspect wrong stars or Power. Make sure you have correctly identified your alignment stars.

If your alignment has proved correct and you then try to slew to solar system objects and they are nowhere near the correct place the problem will be in your date/time or location. You say you have recently updated the firmware. Did you remember to reset your location. The new firmware probably has defaulted to somewhere in the USA.

Barry

Thanks Barry, I have considered most of your points, and agree, either battery or Alt motor/servo. Will test again tonight and post results. I'm certain I had correct time and place but don't fully trust the settings. Fingers crossed.

Eddie

MikeyB (Michael) · #7 21-03-2011, 09:58 AM

When you say "3-star alignment", do you mean Celestron's 'Sky Align', Eddie? If so, identification of the stars used becomes irrelevant, but getting the Date, Time and Location correct is critical.

Date and Time will need adjustment every night you use the scope and Time also needs adjustment after every time it's switched off during that night.

Check that you have the settings correct for Daylight Savings and Time Zone (8) too.
Also check the date setting carefully - if I remember rightly, it's Month (two digits) before Day (two digits), US-style.

GoTo scopes are great IMHO, but lots of minor details can cause major frustrations until you learn them.

jjjnettie (Jeanette) · #8 21-03-2011, 11:04 AM

When everything else fails.....Set your controller to "default factory settings" and start all over.
Sometimes a clean boot is all it needs.

Ken was right too, the old "Daylight Saving" option has been the cause of much frustration. LOL Been there , done that.

ZeroID (Brent) · #9 21-03-2011, 11:36 AM

Just a wild idea, it hasn't gone to Northern Hemisphere default maybe ... ??

EddieDog (Eddie) · #10 21-03-2011, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EddieDog

Hi all, hasn't taken me long to ask for help. Upgraded handcontrol today and went out to test this evening and after successfully aligning, when I select an object, it goes nowhere near. I'm sure my time and location is correct. Any ideas. Will test again tomorrow as no time tonight.
Eddie

Hi, thanks to all who answered. Will further test the machine tonight. After getting home today, I re-downloaded the alt and Dec files for the motor drive. Maybe I didn't complete it the other day. I know the hand control was good because both verified. So downloaded the Alt and Dec files and verified same as source. So tonight will go out and reset the thing. Yes, If things go out of sync I gernally go for factory reset. Will do this today, will check time, date, and location - input true settings not Perth as there is a marked differnce, then see (or otherwise) what is what. Will keep you posted.
Thanks again
Eddie

jjjnettie (Jeanette) · #11 21-03-2011, 07:48 PM

Good luck Eddie.
I'm sure it will come good for you.

EddieDog (Eddie) · #12 21-03-2011, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjjnettie

Good luck Eddie.
I'm sure it will come good for you.

Thanks, Nettie, but wow, what luck...ugh. Looked out this evening and the clouds are rolling in thick and fast. No hope at all. Though retired, am working the next 3 nights, which of course, with my luck, as always, will be fabulously clear. Next night I can hope to test things is Friday...

Eddie

MikeyB (Michael) · #13 21-03-2011, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EddieDog

will... check time, date, and location - input true settings not Perth as there is a marked differnce...

I'm not sure what you mean by "true settings" and "marked difference", Eddie. Are you suggesting that Celestron has the wrong Perth latitude/longitude coordinates in their firmware?

EddieDog (Eddie) · #14 22-03-2011, 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeyB

I'm not sure what you mean by "true settings" and "marked difference", Eddie. Are you suggesting that Celestron has the wrong Perth latitude/longitude coordinates in their firmware?

Hi Michael et al. First SUCCESS! After re-downloading the firmware for both alt and dec motors, factory reset finally got back to where I was. What I mean by true settings is the lat and long of Heathridge, which differs from the City of Perth by a few minutes. But the clouds kept coming and going though not going for long enough so finished my checks and came in. The clouds seemed to be gathering over the hills where one could see many lighting flashes...hope it does not hit anything as it is so dry...
Eddie

MikeyB (Michael) · #15 22-03-2011, 01:15 AM

If you're entering your own lat/long coords, make sure they're in exactly the same format as the factory default settings, which are usually US/northern hemisphere orientated.

troypiggo (Troy) · #16 22-03-2011, 06:52 AM

Another trap I fell for is getting the dates in the wrong order. We in aus typically enter dates day/month/year but the skywatcher synscan controller requires m/d/y

Barrykgerdes · #17 22-03-2011, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by troypiggo

Another trap I fell for is getting the dates in the wrong order. We in aus typically enter dates day/month/year but the skywatcher synscan controller requires m/d/y

Yes this is a trap for the unknowing. Most of them show an error if you put a number greater than 12 in the first spot but will accept incorrect order otherwise.

Barry

EddieDog (Eddie) · #18 22-03-2011, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeyB

If you're entering your own lat/long coords, make sure they're in exactly the same format as the factory default settings, which are usually US/northern hemisphere orientated.

Lat and Long settings no prob. as sys gives option for N or S and E or W. I did mistakenly put W for Long but realised my mistake, once corrected it was fine. The date is horrid as its in US mode and one can easily miss the daylight saving opiton

EddieDog (Eddie) · #19 22-03-2011, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrykgerdes

Yes this is a trap for the unknowing. Most of them show an error if you put a number greater than 12 in the first spot but will accept incorrect order otherwise.

Barry

Yes, Barry, typical US ethnocentric

midnight (Darrin) · #20 22-03-2011, 08:04 PM

G'Day Eddie,

I had similar problems a few years back when I acquired a Meade with a goto system (autostar 497) and found it very frustrating to start with. I can not speak for your model but I learnt the following leasons for my model and maybe this may or may not help you but have a look and see anyway

:

1. Alignment. When I tried to do an alignment (1, 2 or 3 star) and it failed miserably, I would undo the clutches and manually rotate the OTA back to South without powering down, lock the clutches and start again. Big mistake! When turned on, the mount was always aware of where it was from the encoders so undoing the clutches and moving back to south meant I introduced a massive error. I solved this by turning off the controller and back on when set to south if I had to repeat an alignment.

2. Time. The Meade model to my understanding can not interpolate your exact time based on a time zone and longitude. So if you enter your longitude (eg around Perth etc) and then enter the time say from your mobile phone, this time is not the true time at this longitude. For Perth, we know we are 8hr ahead of GMT but the true GMT +8hr puts this position well east of Perth. This can also result in an apparent poor targetting. One only needs to look at the local sunset times for say Newcastle and Perth which are at similar latitudes. Perth's local sunsets are always longer by upwards of nearly 20-30 minutes.

Anyway, good luck and enjoy your nights before our "wet" season arrives soon.

Cheers,
Darrin...