English linguistic question

[Omaroo (Chris Malikoff)]

So essentially, people are generally a little annoyed that Americans outnumber us fifteen to one, and we'd like to expect that rub-offs are less unidirectional. Mmm... probably not going to happen. Not sure what the problem is. As a species we're evolving, and that is at the moment largely through our own inventiveness. Communications and travel are going to tend to flatten and mix unique societal traits over our lifetime. Why is this such a bugbear for most?

[renormalised (Carl)]

Well, Chris, if future evolution of human culture is represented by a predominantly American cultural set, then God help us all...the last lot of people I would want to act as our emissaries to an alien world would land there and say "Hey bro, how's it hangin'" or "wassup dude" and then do all those ridiculous hand gestures they do these days (that they've picked up from rap "culture"). How inane and tribal can you get.

[PN PM]

I have an aunt who is borderline anosmic (she is losing her sense of smell). One day she overheard her daughter telling a stranger, "My mother doesn't smell good."

This is why we need poor grammar--it's hilarious.

[Omaroo (Chris Malikoff)]

I guess that the dissemination of cultural traits will still follow the law of averages Carl, and flow from the larger countries and cultures to the small. I'm not in favour of many of those that you've touched on either, but I don't think that our disapproval will stem the tide. Some of our own local language is also pretty rough when heard on the world stage.

[renormalised (Carl)]

Originally Posted by Omaroo

I guess that the flow of cultural traits will follow the law of averages Carl and flow from the many to the few. I'm not in favour of many of those that you've touched on either, but I don't think that our disapproval will stem the tide. Some of our own local language is pretty rough when heard on the world stage too.

You're right about that....the larger cultures do tend to overwhelm the smaller ones, and you're right about our own vernacular. It can be pretty rough, but what we're mostly complaining about is this ghetto, tribal, knuckle dragging language and attitude that's come out of the US. I can imagine many over there cringe at it as well and would rather it dry up and blow away, but unfortunately it's become too ingrained into their society to rid themselves of it. At least not for several generations.

[adman (Adam)]

Originally Posted by CraigS

Language is about connectedness.

If someone choses to commence a conversation with words like: "How they hangin' ", they are attempting to connect at a level of informality. If the receiver is not prepared to connect in that manner, there are options which may be exercised, to let the transmitter know that further communication will not be possible on that basis.

Language changes. Learn the changes. Don't get stuck by not adapting to the change.

Use all of it, I say (in the appropriate situation).

The more language one is aware of, the more related, useful and able to influence others, that person will become.

My 2 cents worth.

Cheers

I agree. We get taught when we are young the 'proper' way to speak, but its only 'proper' for that moment in time. Languages are fluid, and change happens rapidly, often with several major shifts within a single lifetime. There have been many instances of groups trying to stop these shifts in language, and all have been unsuccessful. Dictionarys stopped trying to be proscriptive (telling you how it should be used) and became descriptive (telling you how it is used) a while back.

There are also many rules of grammar that make no sense. Why is it inherently bad to split an infinitive ("to boldy go") but OK to split a nominative ("the red car"). there is no reason apart from 'just because thats the way its done'

[CraigS]

I .. I .. can't quite make out his name ... .. I think he's a master of the pure Aussie language (and culture) we're trying to preserve here ...(and he has some views which may resonate) ...

(Time for a bit of humour)..


Cheers

[SkyViking (Rolf)]

Something I find very odd/amusing is when people use the word of instead of have. As in "I would of done it" instead of "I would have done it". It just doesn't make sense to me at all and I can't imagine where it originated from, but I see it written very often. Does anyone know where it comes from?

[Barrykgerdes]

Originally Posted by SkyViking

Something I find very odd/amusing is when people use the word of instead of have. As in "I would of done it" instead of "I would have done it". It just doesn't make sense to me at all and I can't imagine where it originated from, but I see it written very often. Does anyone know where it comes from?

It is most likely a corruption would have - would've to would of

Barry

[multiweb (Marc)]

Originally Posted by renormalised

if future evolution of human culture is represented by a predominantly American cultural set, then God help us all...the last lot of people I would want to act as our emissaries to an alien world would land there and say "Hey bro, how's it hangin'" or "wassup dude" and then do all those ridiculous hand gestures they do these days (that they've picked up from rap "culture"). How inane and tribal can you get.

I can think of much worse people representing the rest of us... some dudes wearing green uniforms and caps and holding guns. "Hey bro, you've been shot" All languages evolve. From an outsider point of view I find it interesting to see all the diversity of spelling and grammar although I have trouble understanding sometime. We need some more of those cool emoticons with hand gestures.

[M54 (Molly)]

Originally Posted by AndrewJ

Lets face it.
All the previous examples are irrelevant to life in general.
Lets get down to items that really matter,
like sport.
Deeeeefense, Ohhhhhhhfense
and worst of all quarterbacks in the AFL
( yes some commentators used that term )
and touchdowns in the rugby ( polite or no-neck versions )
are a travesty that just cannot be allowed

Andrew

Yes, that's one of my pet annoyances too.
Also, little kids these days say x, y, ZEE, instead of ZED!
Because of Sesame Street.

[ballaratdragons (Ken)]

This is what we risk losing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97YnGQE1q6M

[M54 (Molly)]

[bartman (Bart)]

Originally Posted by AstralTraveller

I assume this was to impress the oversees guests an give the place a distinct Aussie character??

Yeah mate!

Originally Posted by GeoffW1

Hey Bart dude,

See what you done now?

Cheers

MMMMM interesting!!!!!

Originally Posted by Omaroo

So essentially, people are generally a little annoyed that Americans outnumber us fifteen to one, and we'd like to expect that rub-offs are less unidirectional. Mmm... probably not going to happen. Not sure what the problem is. As a species we're evolving, and that is at the moment largely through our own inventiveness. Communications and travel are going to tend to flatten and mix unique societal traits over our lifetime. Why is this such a bugbear for most?

I'm not saying that I don't want change, and I love the fact that we are all evolving in all kinds of manner, it's just that I think we - as Aussies - might be losing some of our slang. I dont mind slang and use it all the time at the right time. It's when bad language gets used at the wrong time.

Originally Posted by PN PM

I have an aunt who is borderline anosmic (she is losing her sense of smell). One day she overheard her daughter telling a stranger, "My mother doesn't smell good."

This is why we need poor grammar--it's hilarious.

Originally Posted by ballaratdragons

This is what we risk losing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97YnGQE1q6M

That's great Ken!

I understand that language is evolving.
Just keep in mind that without proper grammar or words/text in the right context can lead to confusion (see 'my mother doesn't smell good').
I guess that's what I am trying to convey. If kids are not taught to speak properly at first, then how will they be able to communicate properly in the future?
Cheers cobbers!
Bartman

ps here is another one:
"I've got nothing........."

[astroron (Ron)]

Originally Posted by bartman

Yeah mate!



MMMMM interesting!!!!!



I'm not saying that I don't want change, and I love the fact that we are all evolving in all kinds of manner, it's just that I think we - as Aussies - might be losing some of our slang. I dont mind slang and use it all the time at the right time. It's when bad language gets used at the wrong time.






That's great Ken!

I understand that language is evolving.
Just keep in mind that without proper grammar or words/text in the right context can lead to confusion (see 'my mother doesn't smell good').
I guess that's what I am trying to convey. If kids are not taught to speak properly at first, then how will they be able to communicate properly in the future?
Cheers cobbers!
Bartman

ps here is another one:
"I've got nothing........."

That should read
"Iv'e got nothink........" (QUOTE)

[bartman (Bart)]

You are right Ron
Soz...
Jeez I hate that sms abbreviation for sorry.....
Bartman

[ballaratdragons (Ken)]

Originally Posted by bartman

You are right Ron
Soz...
Jeez I hate that sms abbreviation for sorry.....
Bartman

Now there's a 'language' that will ruin any country's use of English.
SMS talk!

I have seen it used in the occasional forum and I think it is disgusting.
About the only one I can bare is the use of 'LOL'.

I am a member in the Mitsubishi Magna Forums and all forms of SMS abbreviations are banned.

[bartman (Bart)]

There is a forum for Mitsubishi Magnas??????crazyhe hehe
I'm not against shortened/ abbreviated words such as ATM, BRB, CSKLU and LOL. They all are ( cant think of the word) the first letter of each word combined to make an acronym ( ha found the word).
Soz is not such a word/acronym!
I use acronyms when I'm lazy....but see no harm in that when it is in the right context and forum/discussion.
I'm sure that this ( shortening of words by acronyms) will evolve into a whole new language or an addition to our current language.
It's an addition to our vocabulary, not a replacement.

Bartman
Ps:
One of the worst shortening of words/ names is when I found out that our Marketing MANAGER signs off on her emails as 'V' . I will not reveal her name, but just imagine if her name was Veronica ( not her name). How unprofessional is that???????

[Barrykgerdes]

I too am against the use of acronyms in forums. Principally because prior to the escalation of SMS messaging there were a number of acronyms in general use that generally obvious meanings. However the proliferation of these abrieviations rather than true acronyms has created many duplicates that have totally different meanings than the original acronym and can cause confusion.

Barry

[Kevnool (Kev)]

Hey everybody-----Welcome to the future.