Equipment thoughts for new 10in scope

[kruscica]

Hi,
I have been considering getting a scope for about a year now. I come close to a decision and then sit back and think about the price, the usage, where, when. Anyhow, I was looking at the Orion XT10 Intelliscope and then Ron from Sirius Optics let me know that for the same money or less I could get a no-name Dob with Argo Navis (I'm a newbie and I want to learn and know what I'm looking at at the same time). That got me thinking about the GS Dobs that have got high marks in the forums. And so, I'm looking at the 10in Premium model with 2in Crayford Focuser. At $880 odd, I'm not unhappy, except that adding AN puts it at about $2K, and a decent GOTO EQ, 8in though, is "only" a grand more.

Anyhoo, I decided to add up everything I'd like, within reason. It came to $9000. A litle of this, a little of that. Wow.

And so, I am wondering what exactly will be useful, what wont work with the scope, etc.

My thoughts, for a 10in F/5 GS Dob with 2in Crayford Focuser and 9X50 Finderscope:

Televue Barlow 2x Powermate 2in (I've been wondering whether it's better to have a 2x or 2.5x. Also, I understand it's better than an ordinary Barlow. Do I need a separate Barlow thought, and also, how does it go with Paracorr or am I cancelling each other out.

Laser Collimater Deluxe
or

Orion Collimating Eyepiece (I think it has a Cheshire, whatever exactly that is)

Hurricane Blower Bulb

Televue Paracorr Tunable Top (for EPs that are ordinarily too big)

Televue Paracorr 2in - 1.25in reducing adapter (so I can use both sizes of EP)

Televue Paracorr Coma Corrector visual model (to reduce coma in an F/5)

Televue 2in eyepiece barrel extender (likewise to focus and fit eyepieces)

Televue Everbright star diagonal 2in

Orion Eyepiece and Accessory case (Medium or Large - the Large is $16 cheaper?? Anyone have either and know why?)

Orion 9 x 50 Finder RACI (would this be better than the one that comes with the scope)

Telrad (can you use this with a Finderscope, or does it replace it?)

Telrad Dew Shield+ (do we need these in Melbourne?)

Astronomik H-Beta 1.25in filter (I can use this, right?)

Astronomik 0-III 2in filter

JMB Solar Type A- 10in Newtonian

Meade Moon Filter - ND96 1.25in

Bintel GSO #25 Red 1.25in filter (for Mars and Jupiter)

Nortons Star Atlas

Star Testing Astronomical Telescopes

Uranometria 2000 Southern Hemisphere

Uranometria Deep Sky Guide

Sky Atlas 2000 Deluxe 2nd ed

Hartungs Astronomical Objects for Southern Scopes

Cambridge Star Atlas (sounds cheap and small - $49)

Orion Ronchi Tester (I use this to check collimation and the mirrors, right. And how?)

Televue Radian 6mm 1.25in

Televue Radian 4mm 1.25in

I want the small Radians because I was shocked at the size of Mars and Saturn as seen through the simulated 10in scope at www.scopesim.com. Only thing is, I get the impression the atmosphere will rarely allow me to use such high mag. In any case, because my eyesight is so bad I need to wear glasses at the scope and ER is key, so a range of Radians is likely.

I was thinking the 12mm Nagler T4, which has good reviews, but the ER is only 17, which is a little small. Maybe the 12 or 10mm Radian (except they're so expensive)

Then something like a 35mm Panoptic.

Meade Filter Set #1,2, and 3 (1.25in colored filters

Meade #905 Variable Polarizing 1.25in (I think it helps with Light Pollution or the Moon)

And finally, $1100 for Argo Navis. Is it easy to install?

Sorry, I know it's a long message. There's a lot of little things in the after sale. I was thinking of buying a little at a time. What do people think as priorities. Is there anything I left out. I'm already trying to work out how to move it around, where to use it, base mods, etc.

Thanks for your patience. I look forward to and appreciate the collective advice of the forum. And Happy Easter to one and all.

Phil

[iceman (Mike)]

Hi Phil!

Welcome to the forum and that's one great first post!

You've got a very long list there, unfortunately I don't have time for an indepth reply right now but i'm sure some other dob owners will have time to write some more.

What I will say though, is that you have made a good choice in the 10" dob, it's exactly the same as I have. The premium model with the crayford focuser is a good upgrade from the standard rack'n'pinion. I replaced mine with a moonlite focuser, as the "premium" dob wasn't available when I bought mine.

Are you getting the standard 4 plossls with your dob? Where are you getting it from? Andrews? Bintel? Sirius Optics?

There is a lot of things in your list there that in my opinion are mostly unnecessary, and you won't need straight away, if ever. You'll definitely need to prioritise and the "nice to have's" can just stay on teh wish list until you've had more experience.

Having said that, I don't know what experience you have.. Have you owned a telescope before? Have you looked through any telescopes before? Your experience and prior experiences will help us determine what might be best for you right now.

Forget all that paracorr stuff, it's simply not important right now.

3 collimation tools/devices? You only need 1, plus practise.

A telrad can work with a finderscope, but most people use 1 or the other. You don't need a RACI finder either. The one that comes with the scope is perfectly fine. You'll only need to think about an RACI finder if you feel the straight-through finder is uncomfortable to use.

If you get an ArgoNavis you'll use your finderscope/telrad less and less, but again the ArgoNavis is a luxury and certainly not a necessity straight off the bat. I rate DSC's very highly (you can read my review here, but it's not something i'd recommend to someone buying a telescope for the first time until they'd had some time to use it and learn how to use it first.

All the books and atlases sound fine, but it also looks like a bit of overkill. Start with a good planisphere and star atlas and some software for your computer (starry nights or CDC). If you want to learn more about astronomy then there are some good beginners guides to start with too.. Also Astronomy2005 is the best overall month to month sky guide that's around.

H-beta and O-III filters - forget them. Especially the H-beta. The h-beta is useful for 1, maybe 2 objects in the whole sky. And it doesn't help that much. The OIII filter is good, but again it's not something i'd recommend to someone new. When you've had your scope for 3-6 months, and have some experience under your belt and you can recognise the difference in what you're looking at, that's when I'd recommend it.

If you get a 2x or 2.5x powermate, you don't need a normal barlow. Powermates are better than a barlow, but they are also a lot more expensive. It's unlikely you'd notice the difference until you had more experience, but if you can afford it, start with the powermate and you'll never need another.

You don't need a star diagonal, they're for SCT's and you simply won't use it with your dob.

Accessory case, for sure. You'll need one of these. Though you don't necessarily have to buy the name brand. You could probably make or buy a cheaper one elsewhere.

Forget the coloured filters for now. I bought a set and have used 1 of them, once.

The polarising filter is good for the moon. It reduces the glare so it doesn't completely ruin your night vision!

Anyway I wrote for longer than I expected. I'm sure guys like Starkler, ausastronomer, mhodson and other dob owners will be able to add to or correct what i've written.

Good luck!

[iceman (Mike)]

Oh and 1 more thing, if you live in Melbourne, try and hook up with some other melbourne guys from the forums (starkler, dave47tuc etc) and have a look through their scopes. They'll be more than willing to show you the ropes and give you some more knowledge about exactly what you're buying.

[Striker (Tony)]

I know someone who has a virtualy brand new LX200 10" for sale....!!!!!!!

[jackenau]

Firstly welcome to the forum Phil

You have obviously done your homework on what to expect you want to view and what is needed to achieve your outcome.

I agree with Iceman on his comments, and can recommend you only take one step at a time.

There are so many threads on various forums whereby so many budding astronomers purchase equipment that they rarely use or find for one reason or another to be impractical to use or not suit their expectations.

My advice is to start with something that is expandable, but basic, get a feeling for what you want to see, or expect to see and then add equipment as required to fulfill those expectations.



Ken M

[janoskiss (Steve H)]

Phil!

You forgot to mention what you want to do with the scope.
- Brighten the sky and bring it a bit closer? (i.e., look at deep sky)
- bring the sky a lot closer? (look at planets)
- take astrophotos?
- spy on neighbours?
...?

If you are happy to start out just by looking up and seeing more than by eye or binos, then it's hard to go past the GSO Dobs. Even if you do have thousands to spend, an inexpensive Dob is a great no-risk way to see if you like what the night sky has to offer.

[wavelandscott (Scott)]

Sounds as if you are prepared to "make a commitment" to the hobby and that is good but at least partly unneeded at this time...

The gear you've identified is first rate and over time might be of use to you but...

As has been previously mentioned lets start with basics...

What is your interest?

What do you want to do with the scope...visual, photography, planets, DSO etc.?

What is you experience level?

Is this a first scope?

And lastly, "try before you buy"...get to know some people on the forum and or a local club and go see things with them on their gear...

I would never suggest that you (or any other newbie) jump right in a spend $9000...don't get me wrong, it would be very easy to do but is unnecessary...you should be able to be well and truly fitted out for well under $1,000 and that investment could last a lifetime...

Anyway, tell us a bit more about what you want to see and do and what your exprience level is and I think that you will get/have more advice than you can shake a stick at...

[kruscica]

Yes, I according to the email from Bintel I would get 32mm FMC 2in, 15mm and 9mm Plossls. It costs more than Andrews (but less than Sirius Optics - they're even further away though) but they check it, centre spot and collimate it.

I already have Astronomy 2005, subscription to a few Astromags, and a Planisphere from the Phillips Stargazer pack.

This will be my first telescope. I can identify some constellations. I haven't looked through a telescope since I was a kid, so about 15 years or more.

My interest was pretty much both DSOs and Planets. More so DSOs but then I thought, a good-sized Reflector can give similar views to an albeit smaller refractor. I don't have an interest in terrestrial viewing (no good-looking nubile neighbours within level of my window). Astrophotography sounds nice to do, but that's for the future.

Lastly, yes, I agree that a relatively inexpensive Dob will get the job done. It was when I added up all the extras that I suprised myself - I wasn't going for sets of anything.

Out of curiosity, what are the normal seeing limits on magnification (notwithstanding that we have people from all over Australia and the world). After all, there's the calculation of what a given focal length or aperture should support, but can the atmosphere allow that depth?

Finally, I don't drive, so I will be scouting locations either nearby my house or down on the Mornington Peninsula (where the holiday house is), or on trips (like when my mate rented a place at Inverloch last year - I first planned to get a scope to take down there 4in, then 6in. In any case, one night we went onto the road in front of the house - it was pitch black. The sight of the Milky Way, wow! Lucky he's talking about going back next summer!
It, along with working evenings, limits my involvement with the ASV or meeting up with people and finding the good spots.

Thanks.
(geez I once I get started .... )

[ballaratdragons (Ken)]

Hi Kruscica,

I have been in this hobby for 20 years now (over 40 years interested) and I am more than happy with my 12" dob and 5 half-decent EP's.

That is all I need at the moment. (getting a camera soon)

Just the dob and a few EP's and I'm happy as a pig in mud!

Apart from the supplied standard EP's that I got from Andrews I also bought a GS 2" SuperView 30mm. Very worthwhile. Enough to keep me going for years.

[wavelandscott (Scott)]

Kruscica,

My 2 cents worth...

Continue to learn the sky and consider binoculars...

Why binoculars?...They are easy to use and easy to carry...and used well, you can see heaps!

Don't get me wrong, I adore my 8 inch DOB I have a handcart (from Bunnings) that I wheel it in and out of the house with...it suits my needs well...a 10 inch DOB while portable will still take up a bit of space...so unless your friend has ample car room it might be a tight fit to travel with...either way a DOB (any scope) will take some logistical planning to go farther than the backyard in one trip...if you haven't seen one up close find someone near you and visit them before you buy anything...

Still not convinced on the binoculars...and wanting a "light bucket"...get a DOB...(my bias there are several reflctors that could work too)

The standard eyepieces will be sufficient for awhile...

I'll be a heretic...you only need 3 and a good barlow (or powermate)...low to medium power - medium power- and high power...roughly speaking in the 10 inch scope you mentioned...32 mm - 15 mm and 9 mm...couple that with a good barlow (I have a Powermate but I hear good things about the Orion Shorty plus) and you should be covered for a while...

I would also encourage you (if you choose a reflector) to get a chesire collimating eyepiece...there are several tools that people will try and sell you but simple is better...

Anyway, my opinion and $5 will get you a cup of coffee...

Good Luck!

[gary]

Hi Phil,

Gary Kopff here from Wildcard Innovations, manufacturers of the Argo Navis DTC.

You wrote -
> And finally, $1100 for Argo Navis. Is it easy to install?

The answer to this is 'yes!'

If you buy a generic Dob such as the ones out of Sirius Optics (they are all made either by Synta or Guang Sheng), then installing the encoders is probably a 30 minute exercise and no special skills or tools are required.

Email me if you would like more details.

Best Regards

Gary Kopff
Managing Director
Wildcard Innovations Pty. Ltd.
20 Kilmory Place, Mount Kuring-Gai
NSW. 2080. Australia
Phone +61-2-9457-9049
Fax +61-2-9457-9593
sales@wildcard-innovations.com.au
http://www.wildcard-innovations.com.au