Setting The Standards

[leon]

Hi Guys, often I have read in reply to posts, probably more so in the Deep Sky section, about standards, and that members are expected to meet the professional and experience of some.

Buy this i mean, someone may post an image of an object and it is just awesome in its capture, processing and the like.

Consequentially it is suggested that the bar has been raised, and we must aspire to reach these heights.

There are some among us that just cant reach this goal, may it be because of lack of experience, equipment, whatever, or just don't want to, and are quite happy enjoying this hobby at the rate of interest by them.

Competition is healthy, don't get me wrong, but i feel that some may be put off in posting there work because they have not reached that standard.

Shoot me down in flames if you like, but i reckon many among us, especially the new members will no post an image because of it.

Leon

[skwinty (Steve)]

As a newbie to astrophotography, the level of expertise and quality that constantly appears on this forum hasnt put me off posting my amateurish pix. Albeit ,I have only posted a few but it is not the raising of the bar that has discouraged me from posting. I think that the lack of guiding and accurate polar alignment is the reason I dont post anymore.

however, this is about to change. I will receive my QHY autoguider next week, thanks Theo, My reticule eyepiece, thanks Steve and yesterday I received my skywatcher 80mm/1000mm Mak Cass, thanks Paul. It is very light at 1.3 kg. As soon as this all comes together, then brace yourselves IIS'ers

[matt]

Hey Leon

I understand where you are coming from, but also think sometimes people use the phrase 'raising the bar' as a turn of phrase or a euphemism for 'well done' or 'nice' etc etc

What I mean is...it's not always meant to be taken literally.

I, for one, appreciate the efforts of many in the images they post...whether world beaters or enthusiastic beginners.

I would hope no-one feels put off or intimidated by the well-intentioned comments of encouragement/praise for others. We're all running our own race, eh?

[Alchemy (Clive)]

Originally Posted by leon

Hi Guys, often I have read in reply to posts, probably more so in the Deep Sky section, about standards, and that members are expected to meet the professional and experience of some.

Buy this i mean, someone may post an image of an object and it is just awesome in its capture, processing and the like.

Consequentially it is suggested that the bar has been raised, and we must aspire to reach these heights.

There are some among us that just cant reach this goal, may it be because of lack of experience, equipment, whatever, or just don't want to, and are quite happy enjoying this hobby at the rate of interest by them.

Competition is healthy, don't get me wrong, but i feel that some may be put off in posting there work because they have not reached that standard.

Shoot me down in flames if you like, but i reckon many among us, especially the new members will no post an image because of it.

Leon

im sad you feel that is the case leon , i have given up mostly critiquing on images at the (not professional end) as people can take offence (case in point perhaps), and that is not the intent i can assure you. Mind you i dont have a problem being honest with someone who has 100,000 dollars of gear as it should produce the very best results

You can improve your imaging by taking advice from your peers, you might suggest critique is done privately perhaps.

Your equipment may limit the tracking or depth but should not stop you improving your processing technique. If you dont post thats your call but ifeel you would be missing out on an oppotunity.

there is NONE here who could not improve their images, i have copped plenty of comments in the whats wrong with them..... too green, lacking focus, tracking off, overprocessed i could go on...... Some IIS members have a good ability and are able too pass that on to other members (jase is just such a one) and i have benefitted from his advice

I Sort of overanswered your post a bit but please tell us what you would like in regard to your posts( i say this sincerely) perhaps we can improve our attitude.

Cheers to a fellow imager

Clive.

[leon]

Clive, thanks for your response, firstly this post is not about me, as I would post any image that I feel looks OK, trust me I have had plenty of advice on my images and I'd encourage that if it helps me get the experience I so often lack.

I would never take offence to any good advice.

Also your attitude and that of others is honest, and fine with me, I suppose I was just saying that newcomers and /or the less experienced, may feel put off because they may feel that their images are not, and never will be of the standard of some of the best on this forum.

I have a long way to go my self, but I'm proud of my work, even if it dose not look that good to others, or meet and standards, however some may not feel this way about their work.


Leon

[dannat (Daniel)]

I agree with Clive - hopefully in the next cuple of weeks I will shoot & post my first pics - I except they will be s*#@ , something will have gone wrong if they are not - posting I think shows the p rogress one makes - and if anyone is worried about posting it's their loss - not others or the forum's

Anyway I'm off outside to check for scp again, bloody thing - why can't someone just put a small floating flag there for everyone to hone in on

By the way, leon your pics are fantastic, hopefully in 20 years I can shoot something lie you
daniel

[leon]

Daniel, I thank you for your engouraging comments, however I still have lots to learn, but as i progress, I too will post my images.

I hope I have not given the wrong impression with my initial post.

leon

[sjastro]

Originally Posted by Alchemy

im sad you feel that is the case leon , i have given up mostly critiquing on images at the (not professional end) as people can take offence (case in point perhaps), and that is not the intent i can assure you. Mind you i dont have a problem being honest with someone who has 100,000 dollars of gear as it should produce the very best results.

That's waving a red flag in front of a bull.
I had an $18000 "high end" telescope which was a total piece of crap. My venerable C11 had power optics compared to it.

Steven
http://users.westconnect.com.au/~sjastro/small

[Kokatha man]

I think the intentions behind Leon's initial post was entirely reasonable and defensible: I'm sure that there was no specific personal target to his comments (sorry leon, you just don't seem to have it in you bro....!) but the jist of his remarks are something we could all do well to remember, whatever the subject matter.

I'd like to make a few personal points here; I'm thinking of getting into a bit of imaging myself soon, very slowly, dipping one knuckle of each toe in at a time so to speak, so I have my own personal perspectives and agendas on this particular topic.....

Now, things like navigating/recognizing the night sky, polar and drift aligning, collimation, mechanical fabrication, certain areas of problem solving and electronics etc are bread and butter to me (not absolute in all aspects, but the preceding is a pretty fair and honest comment.) But with imageing, there does seem to be an invisible barrier one needs to find a way over, that is rarely acknowledged or accomodated in the forum.

Having just read the excellent articles by Mike and another gentleman, whose name escapes me for the moment; what does strike a complete novice like myself are the assumptions of pc understanding/awareness below a certain point that, without which, still make these tutorials inaccessible. This isn't a criticism of Mike or anyone else for that matter: rather a bringing to people's attention issues that would, I'm sure, assist more people than just myself to get their teeth into these areas.

For someone like myself who mainly uses the pc for documents etc there are big hurdles: and I'd suggest that for quite a section of people from the late 30's onwards this could be the case - registax, avi's, various software tools for capture and processing etc are like "la-la lingo" - particularly if the person (eg me!) really wants to really get his head around it, but is so intimidated.

Just for the record, I have 2 sons still living at home whose professional occupations utilize high-end pc knowledge/skills - but I'd sooner bumble along than try their patience and mine with Dad's utter inadequacy, in their estimations, with IT matters!!!



As I've said in other posts, sometimes I'm disappointed when either a newcomer (or just someone with a problem) posts and receives sparse response: not allways, but even taking consideration of all the factors influencing people's ability to respond at any one moment, I am sometimes disappointed. Not necessarily with people's response per se, more with the sometimes lack of realization that we all start new things with none/very little knowledge.

I am also quite sure that most people, if they were approached to elaborate on specific questions etc, would freely and willingly give their time and knowledge: in fact, as some of you would know, I have often pm'd people to get more specific information and have allways been very favourably responded too!

I think that there's a tendency in pursuits like AA to bury ourselves in our own specific passionate objectives: manifested, I've noticed, in sometimes ascribing the most convoluted reasons to simple problems because they are the areas we would like to be immersed in, rather than them being the most likely causes!

I am no different to others in all these respects, but I think that we could all do well to take the substance from Leon's post and use it to be that much more responsive/empathetic to "learners" in any particular area we can each contribute in: in this way surely subscribing to one of the ideals behind this forum and each our own's passionate interest. This, if you'll pardon me, is a much better response and perspective to take from Leon's timely posting than anything else!

[Kokatha man]

A fantastic example of a responsive, well written, comprehensive description, as an excellent example of my spiel below; is 1ponders post to steve447's thread on drift aligning using K3CCD software in the "tips etc" section on 15/4/08.

Cheers, Darryl.

[dugnsuz (Doug)]

Let them suffer in their Jocks leon!!!!
You're being to politically correct!!
Squirm you dogs, squirm!!!

...just trying to raise the bar for inflammatory responses

I try to post the best I've done so that I'm continually improving at a standard I have set for myself. I wouldn't have reached that perceived standard if I hadn't posted my earliest efforts and acted on the feedback given.
And, I was inspired by the level the bar was at to try and reach it.
So to all would be imagers I say, post and post again - the advice you get will be invaluable.

Oh and squirm you dogs, squirm!!!

Doug

[dannat (Daniel)]

well said Doug, when you call us dogs we should atleast be called astro dogs named 'Tyco'
PS. there were no dog emoticons but I just love those little guys

[Kokatha man]

Originally Posted by dugnsuz

Let them suffer in their Jocks leon!!!!
You're being to politically correct!!
Squirm you dogs, squirm!!!

...just trying to raise the bar for inflammatory responses

I try to post the best I've done so that I'm continually improving at a standard I have set for myself. I wouldn't have reached that perceived standard if I hadn't posted my earliest efforts and acted on the feedback given.
And, I was inspired by the level the bar was at to try and reach it.
So to all would be imagers I say, post and post again - the advice you get will be invaluable.

Oh and squirm you dogs, squirm!!!

Doug

Great contribution Doug.....or maybe that's all....err, on second thoughts, maybe you're talking about different sorts of bars, and aspirations....?

Regards, Darryl.

[dugnsuz (Doug)]

Originally Posted by dannat

PS. there were no dog emoticons but I just love those little guys

That could be described as a "squirm" Daniel!!
Doug

[avandonk]

I have said this before many times. It is not a competition folks. If you want competition, enter one.

I see my efforts at astrophotography a bit like playing golf. I am constantly trying to get better than the last time. There are too many variables to compare my self to anyone else.

What I think is more important is the exchange of ideas a techniques rather than saying that mine is bigger or better than yours!

The fun is in the learning not in getting to be the 'best'.

I have always given a full explanation of how I do things hoping that someone else might get some benefit.

Bert

[dugnsuz (Doug)]

Originally Posted by avandonk

I have always given a full explanation of how I do things hoping that someone else might get some benefit.

Bert

...and I certainly do Bert - Thanks.
Doug

[dugnsuz (Doug)]

Originally Posted by Kokatha man

Great contribution Doug.....or maybe that's all....err, on second thoughts, maybe you're talking about different sorts of bars, and aspirations....?

Regards, Darryl.

How dare you...I'm tee total!!

[jjjnettie (Jeanette)]

I agree Doug.
If you've put in the hard yards to achieve what is for you is a very good image, post it for everyone to see.

[dugnsuz (Doug)]

Originally Posted by jjjnettie

I agree Doug.
If you've put in the hard yards to achieve what is for you is a very good image, post it for everyone to see.

Thanks jjj,
BTW I spent a good half an hour google-ing LT Ulrich yesterday trying to find out his/her identity! That quote would appeal to my wife Suz - I reckon it's her mantra and she doesn't know it!!!!!
Is LT Ulrich a scholar on women's studies? That's as close as I got

Sorry - Off Topic

[jjjnettie (Jeanette)]

I just copied the quote off a fridge magnet.
Thought it suited me down to the ground.