Polar Alignment PMX and TPoint

[roughy (Mark)]

After having to dismantle and reassemble my gear in the observatory, I seem to be having some considerable difficulty re establishing polar alignment. The necessary basic settings are correct - level, gps coords, time (thanks to assistance to another thread on this forum) etc.

However the TPoint polar alignment report is sending me all over the place with some very large suggestions (turn the right knob 9 full turns etc). I'm fairly confident that my physical/mechanical alignment is reasonable.

A user on the SB forum suggested that the instructions for which knob to turn are reversed for the southern hemisphere, i.e. the left knob is left facing north or the right knob facing south behind the mount. If this is in any literature I have missed it entirely.

Is someone able to clarify this point?

Cheers

Mark

[Mighty_oz (Marcus)]

I think in there wisdom SB changed it to suit N hemi people, u have to reverse what it says for S hemi, but i'm using a early version of the skyx. Also how many t-points are u doing ? The smaller the number the greater the pendulum effect i've found. I now do 50 points to get close to PA, other wise its a 150+ one to get it close to spot on.

[pvelez (Pete)]

Mark

I had the same question a few months back. The other issue I found with the SB manual is that it doesn't indicated which side of the mount you need to be facing ie on the counterweight side or the control panel side.

I would do a 25 point run and shift it half the direction indicated. If it increased the error then I'd switch it the other way.

Trial and error is time consuming but I found it the best way. Remember also to apply the Supermodel before checking the PA - I found the recommendations for shifting the mount differed depending on whether or not I applied the Supermodel

Pete

[roughy (Mark)]

Thanks Pete and Marcus.

It seems to begin to make sense, to "swap hands". TPoint has been advising to make larger corrections each time, suggesting I was heading in the wrong direction.

Makes me wonder why I thought I had good alignment when I first set the PMX up late last year.

Cheers

Mark

[PRejto (Peter)]

Originally Posted by roughy

Thanks Pete and Marcus.

It seems to begin to make sense, to "swap hands". TPoint has been advising to make larger corrections each time, suggesting I was heading in the wrong direction.

Makes me wonder why I thought I had good alignment when I first set the PMX up late last year.

Cheers

Mark

Mark,
You probably did have good alignment last year because the T-Point instructions were simple to follow and couldn't be misunderstood. Now they are confusing! Take my word for it, face North and make your corrections. I just did this exercise recently and that is what worked for me!
Peter

[Logieberra (Logan)]

Peter, saw your SB post on this. They gotta update the code for us Southies. Would be a shame to destroy darn good PA when trying to reach PA perfection, by following Tpoint and spinning the wrong knob.

Thanks. I'll face Nth for now

[gregbradley]

Originally Posted by roughy

After having to dismantle and reassemble my gear in the observatory, I seem to be having some considerable difficulty re establishing polar alignment. The necessary basic settings are correct - level, gps coords, time (thanks to assistance to another thread on this forum) etc.

However the TPoint polar alignment report is sending me all over the place with some very large suggestions (turn the right knob 9 full turns etc). I'm fairly confident that my physical/mechanical alignment is reasonable.

A user on the SB forum suggested that the instructions for which knob to turn are reversed for the southern hemisphere, i.e. the left knob is left facing north or the right knob facing south behind the mount. If this is in any literature I have missed it entirely.

Is someone able to clarify this point?

Cheers

Mark

You do need to click on southern hemisphere in the TCS area of the Sky X.
Then follow the instructions.

I don't see how the directions can be misunderstood, they give you compass directions ie turn the mount 3 ticks to the west or
similar. That does not require facing it one way or the other as long as you know your compass directions.

Greg.

[PRejto (Peter)]

Originally Posted by gregbradley

You do need to click on southern hemisphere in the TCS area of the Sky X.
Then follow the instructions.

I don't see how the directions can be misunderstood, they give you compass directions ie turn the mount 3 ticks to the west or
similar. That does not require facing it one way or the other as long as you know your compass directions.

Greg.

Greg,

Don't know if you have done this recently but the latest builds of TSX do not give directions like that anymore. There are no East or West directions, just directions such as loosen the right knob and tighten the left. That means you have two choices....either facing South (incorrect) or facing North (correct).

Peter

[Logieberra (Logan)]

Greg, what build are you running?

[gregbradley]

Don't know if you have done this recently but the latest builds of TSX do not give directions like that anymore. There are no East or West directions, just directions such as loosen the right knob and tighten the left. That means you have two choices....either facing South (incorrect) or facing North (correct).

Peter[/QUOTE]

Oh OK, sorry, my error.
I thought they gave directions in compass directions.
In which case its vital the southern hemisphere is checked in the TCS part of The Sky X. Unless its become bugged with later editions.

The Southern Hemisphere user is sometimes overlooked!

Greg.

[graham.hobart (Graham stevens)]

Just to clarify for my peace of mind, make sure the southern hemisphere option is chosen in Bisque TCS, then with mount and me facing South (or in what ever park position) so my left hand is on left side of mount and right hand is west.??

OK Im confused- I am fairly confident I got better PA when I adjusted following the turn the knob three tics etc, but I was facing south - me looking over the mount from the control panel side towards the SCP. Am I in error?
I have Southern Hemisphere set up on Bisque definetely.
ARrrgh!!!
The PA report states on it - For the Southern Hemisphere turn right knob 3.5 clicks etc"
Are you all saying face North (i.e with OTA in a normal SCP facing position (I know it doesn't apply as PMX starts from home in the NE) so if this was a normal EQ mount I would be facing North with the CW directly in front of me and the control panel on the other side?
so you would theoretically reach around the CW's to adjust azimuth etc. So even when you adjust for Southern hemisphere it assumes you are looking North and making adjustments with your right hand Eastwards and your left hand westwards?
Help!!!!!
Graz

[PRejto (Peter)]

Check out tghis post from Rat156:

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...=102979&page=2

He states that you face North....

Peter

[rat156]

Originally Posted by PRejto

Check out tghis post from Rat156:

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/s...=102979&page=2

He states that you face North....

Peter

Or reverse the directions...

This was a complete mistake by the SB guys, West is West, doesn't matter which hemisphere you're in. We should petition them to change this back ASAP. I don't want left or right knobs, even if they reverse them for SH users, because that way they would have to remember to check this every time the play with the code.

If you don't know what direction (roughly) West is, you're going to struggle with a mount like the PMX.

Cheers
Stuart

[graham.hobart (Graham stevens)]

I'm sorry but this has not cleared this up for me.
And I do know which is West and East.
Either you face towards the North and follow the directions or you face towards the South (from behind the control box) and reverse the left and right directions?
Even if the report (in the latest build) is saying "PA report for Southern Hemisphere?"

[rat156]

Originally Posted by graham.hobart

towards the South (from behind the control box) and reverse the left and right directions?

Yes, that's correct.

If I face North, I'm facing away from the mount, so that makes it impossible to make the adjustments. It depends on where you are situated WRT the mount, I sit on the North side, if you sit on the South side of the mount, then you just reach around the mount to make the adjustments as suggested by the software.

Cheers
Stuart

[graham.hobart (Graham stevens)]

Cool!
So I also sit on the South Side but have been adjusting from the North side as is easier to use knobs- so I sit behind mount control panel and face South but reverse the report left and right directions?
Sorry for being a bit slow on this but this is a new mount to me and a steep learning curve.
Graz

[roughy (Mark)]

Originally Posted by rat156

Or reverse the directions...

This was a complete mistake by the SB guys, West is West, doesn't matter which hemisphere you're in. We should petition them to change this back ASAP. I don't want left or right knobs, even if they reverse them for SH users, because that way they would have to remember to check this every time the play with the code.

If you don't know what direction (roughly) West is, you're going to struggle with a mount like the PMX.

Cheers
Stuart

Can assure you Stuart IO know west from east. However when an instruction says turn the left knob, i assume it means left not right.

[rat156]

Originally Posted by roughy

Can assure you Stuart IO know west from east. However when an instruction says turn the left knob, i assume it means left not right.

Hi Mark,

Didn't mean to insinuate that you don't know East from West, the you in my post was generic.

But left and right are reversed if the mount is pointing north vs south. If you consider how the mount would be setup in the northern hemisphere, pointing at the NCP the mount is rotated 180 degrees from that position in the SH. When you do this the left hand knob becomes the right hand knob and vice-versa. Even though the west and east knobs are also reversed in the above situation, the azimuth rotation in the report give a deviation from true south in degrees east or west, so you have to adjust the other way, it's all in the way the software is written. IMHO the change to left and right has attempted to make the adjustment simpler, but has, in fact, made the adjustment more difficult because it is dependant on the position of the person making the adjustment. Whereas once east and west are established they are observer independent.

Cheers
Stuart

[roughy (Mark)]

Hi Stuart
Just realised you wrote roughly, not roughy. Apologies.
Yep understand the issue now. In hindsight one thinks you should be able to figure it out for oneself if the corrections are getting larger and larger in the same direction. But a couple of decades of self and mount orientation facing the SCP is a strong habit to push a bit of lateral thinking through.
Cheers
Mark

[PRejto (Peter)]

Now to thoroughly confuse everyone, including me, Daniel Bisque has just put up a post saying right/left is the same regardless of hemisphere.

I have responded that several of us in the SH beg to differ; it may be SB's intent that it be the same, but experience is proving otherwise. I know absolutely that I had to reverse the left right thing to get an result.

May I suggest that others also report this to Daniel on this thread:

http://www.bisque.com/sc/forums/t/18908.aspx

Thanks!
Peter