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Old 15-08-2011, 09:26 AM
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Shiraz (Ray)
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: ardrossan south australia
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Thanks guys. Sounds like we are all agreed that scale is important and that you really cannot find a consistent link between entropy and order when you consider order at large scales - that was where my original thinking was so fundamentally wrong. Since we are ultimately considering heat, I guess that we need to use the microstates idea (thanks Steven) to describe order at molecular levels (where it can be properly defined) and then, in any isolated system (or system where energy transfers in/out are accounted for), the entropy will never decrease. This applies to the ultimate system, the universe, as well. Happy with this and now understand why this explanation works.

But... is entropy a driver - ie does the universe run because it is trying to get to a state of maximum entropy, or is increasing entropy just an ultimately meaningless construct (which is what Craig was getting at) that does nothing more than tidy up the thermodynamics maths and formalise the idea that change is ultimately irreversible.... or is this even a sensible question? Regards Ray

Last edited by Shiraz; 15-08-2011 at 10:07 AM.
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