Juicing up a 10 or 12" dob

[simmo]

Hello Icers,

I'm new to this website and I can say that I'm most impressed with the level of help and care that you all have.

I had my first account of viewing tonight. My 5yr old son and myself went down to BTOW's tonight to get some idea of what is like to look to the heavens and what a sight. You long termers might sigh but because of the light at the location the only thing we could see was the moon but wow what a view. We looked through a 10" dob and that was cool because after reading the posts on here that is what most people have been recommending to start with so I wanted to try one out.

Now what I'm after is some recommendations for things that make a dob all the much better for. I'm a person who likes a challenge so after some time getting used to the sky I'll want to chase things that are a little harder to come by. I suppose what i'm trying to say is that I want some advice on what equipment I could use now that will stay with me through to becoming more advanced. I have read a few posts that the accessories usually stay while the telescopes will change.

As I wish to stay with a dob for the timebeing can you please advise on some things that you done to upgrade your dob for a more advanced instrument. You could also add anything that has been a benifit as you have changed to different telescopes.

Some things that need clarifying - I would prefer to stay manual, I live in Perth so light is an issue but I live where there is no street lighting and I'm not interested in astrophotos (yet!). On top of the telescope I have maybe $1000 to spend ( and probably much more in the long run by the sounds of it)

When I was young I lived in a remote farm and I was always in awe of the space that surrounds us. I was reminded of this again the other night while fishing on beach in a remote location where I again could see meteors ( one that broke up into three that burned dark red) the milky way and thousands of stars that you never see living in suburbia. It brang back happy memories. I think I saw in my son tonight the same awe of our wonderful life. I think it is something I won't forget and something very special.

Please feel free to advise all will be taken on board! and I hope we will talk more in the future.

Cheers ;)
Simmo

P.S sorry I just had to put in one face for good measure.

[wavelandscott]

Congratulations on you excitement and welcome to the club!

I always suggest that new folks enjoy what they have before lashing out on a lot of gear but when they are ready to buy carefully after trying if possible before you buy.

Having said that, some things that I have found helpful.

An adjustable height chair...it improved my enjoyment and viewing experience a lot

Good collimation tools...there is a recent thread on this topic with sound advice.

A dew heater and or boundary fans...

I like the Telrad zero power finder...the bullseye in the sky is helpful in finding things

Three or four high quality widefield eyepieces...you preferences and budget to decide which brand...

Enjoy!

[Allan_L]

Hi Simmo,
And welcome to IIS :welcome:.

I agree with Scott,
especially about the height adjustable chair.
These can be bought from telescope shop for about $160. (Or you can make one yourself if you are that way inclined, I think there is a project on here about that).

Get yourself a red light head light, so you dont trip over your chair and you dont destroy your night vision.

A good peice of computer software to tell you what is about, is Stellarium. This is a FREE download, and a truly excellent program.

You will need some star charts. Personally I recommend a subscription to Australian Sky and Telescope, they have monthly star charts, and articles on items that are good in the sky each month (well 8 issues a year actually).

I prefer a Red Dot finder to a telrad. A bit easier to use and less complicated, while doing a similar job at less cost. This will get you in the right area of sky first, then use the finder scope to zero in. If your scope does not have a right angle finder, I suggest you will appreicate the investment to upgrade to one.

As Scott said, good collimation makes a big difference, so good collimation tools will be helpful.

If your climatice conditions are like here, Dew Amelioration will greatly extend your viewing time. Read up on this and discuss with experts. Typically, a secondary mirror dew heater, and a (home made or other) dew shield, will be a good start. Also, a lot of scopes come with a primary mirror cooling fan. These are good to get the mirror to ambient quickly, but some people recommend that they are useful to slow dewing also.

Good eyepieces can cost as much or more than your scope.
Although the ones coming with the scope will probably be OK for starters, you will probably like to upgrade at a good widefield eyepiece for most deep sky objects. Personally, my favourite such is a Televue Panoptic 27mm. This may be around $450.

If you want planetary views, higher magnification will be necessary. In this area, my experience has me going back to a Televue Nagler 9mm regularly. Probably around $300.

Now many will say you don't need all this stuff at the start, and that is true.
But you did ask specifically.
And most will say look through the varouis optional extras first and speak to others on their experiences, and this is good advice too.

Again, I am not saying you need all this, but in my experience, these are items I have found that have improved my viewing experience over time. And thats what you asked for.

BTW, if you are getting a collapsible DOB, first recommendation will be a shroud.

[vaztr]

Simmo,

Love the idea - I keep thinking 'pimp my scope' :D

Here's what I've found while I've been using my 8" dob with 2 eyepieces (a 25mm and a 10mm) for the last 3 years.

I've needed nothing else except Stellarium and some good charts (Taki's free one is excellent).

But now that 3 years have passed I'm starting to get serious, so here's what's on this years Christmas list

A red dot finder, using the 8x50 is fine for the 'brighter' stuff, but a 'straight thru' is going to be much easier.
A 8mm to 24mm zoom eyepiece (about $70) a cheap way to determine what focal length I feel works best for me and the scope before I spend hundreds on that one (or two) special eyepiece
A 32mm 2" eyepiece, for those DSOs that are just too awesomely big for close ups
A 2x barlow. I don't plan on using this much, but for the kids - getting things as big as they can (jupiter, mars, SATURNs RINGS, etc.) gives the WOW factor (put stickers on the scope too for the kids!!)
REAL Thermal clothing, but I am in Canberra
And last but not least a 12" dob - like I said I'm getting a bit more serious (even moving house to a darker site away from the city!!) and like they say 'size matters!' - but for a first scope the 8" has been perfect.

VAZ

[simmo]

Hello again and thanks for the warm welcome and replies.

It has been interesting studying your replies and I was humbled by your words of wisdom. I can see that most of the things listed are geared to making your viewing session more comfortable. This was suprising but when I thought about it, it made a lot of sense.

My ideas haved changed a lot since reading your posts and I think the common points that you have listed are not by coincidence. I will be sure to add them to my list. The finders I'm not so sure about which one though and I think I'll use your advice and research them a little more. The ones listed are they easy to use for beginners or do they reqiure some mastering?

Allen where do you find the head torches as I haven't found any online? They would be a good buy as I'm sure if I get a normal one I'll lose it in the dark.

Just downloaded Stellarium so I think I'll go play after posting this reply.

About "Pimping the ride" vaztr I'm all for it too. Pin stripes and chrome dust covers oh yeah! ;) In fact just chrome it all, I'm sure I'll turn heads then. Tell me how the zoom goes as I was toying with this idea too. Does anyone have experience with using one in a dob?

Thanks again for the replies
Simmo

P.S. wavelandscott 5:45am and on icies! :lol:

[wavelandscott]

Hard to drop the habit!

The majority of mass produced scopes are really pretty good in terms of fit and finish. Adding higher quality parts soon puts you in the custom made category and at that point, unless you enjoy doing it, you might as well order an SDM.

You can swap out focuser for a Moonlite or better yet a Feathertouch and trade out the secondary for a curved one. Replace the mirror to a hand crafted gem and rebuild the base but at that point you will have spent several times your original buy price.

The current mass produced scope are pretty good so yes, concentrate on your viewing comfort and ergonimcs...scopes change, owners don't figure out those things that will keep you viewing longer.

The optics that you already have are light years better than those available to scientists of th past....now you just need to use them.

[Steffen]

This, a hundred times!

Short of Sydney skies, very few things limit what you can see through a telescope as much as an uncomfortable viewing position. The ability to relax at the eyepiece and look at things for a prolonged period of time without tiring is worth more than a $1000 eyepiece upgrade, IMHO.

Cheers
Steffen.

[Allan_L]

I got one for $29 from BCF.
It has two settings: a three white LEDs, and a one Red LED.
[Use the RED during observing and the White after to pack up]
My wife got an identical one from Woolworths (supermarket) for $20.

Also a bit of refelctive tape (from Supercheap Autos) to stick on the chair, scope etc., also helps to see them in the dark with the Red light.


Additionally, to assist with comfort, warm clothing REALLY helps (as the clearest nights are often the coldest). Ice in Space Beanie; gloves (fingerless with covering mitten (Camping world); Freezer suit and boots (refer to IIS user GTB_an_Owl).

Enjoy..:thumbsup:

[Shark Bait]

If you are going to stick with a manual dob then setting circles could be very handy when trying to find the faint fuzzy stuff. For this to be useful you would need to have Stellarium or similar with you to get the Altitude / Azimuth coordinates of an object for your location.

There is little cost besides some time required to scribe your own setting circles onto your base. I have set mine up so that they can be removed if the scope is ever sold and the new owner does not want them. The 0 to 90 deg altitude scale came with the scope.

This scope is a Goto but I have done this to test the accuracy of the Goto system. With a little luck the skies will be clear tonight and I can run a good test.

I think giving my scope a rolling base with locking castors has been one of the best mods made so far. It would be a perfect world if all big dobs were sold with wheels.

Edit: You are probably already aware of this, but to get the setting circles to work well, the scope needs to be set up on level ground with the OTA pointing at True North.

[barx1963]

Simmo
Red headlamp torches can be bought at Safeway or Woolies. Just be careful with them as they switch one way for red and the other for white and cna blind your night vision if not careful. I cover mine in red cellophane to reduce that risk. It also dims it a fair bit as they are still fairly bright in red mode and will affect night vision anyway.
Adjustable height chair are a must, especially as you get more experienced and spend more time at the eyepiece.
If using your scope manually, good charts are essential!!! Computer programs are all very well but difficult to use out at the scope with dew, you have to have extension cords which are a tripping hazard, as the batteries do not like the cold and the screens are still quite bright even when dimmed and covered with red stuff.
Good charts will last years and alway be available. A basic chart is here http://www.bintel.com.au/Accessories/Books--Charts-and-Software/Star-Chart-Laminated---CD-ROM/655/productview.aspx I purchased these to get me started, pretty basic but helps you to learn the night sky. The next step would be Sky Atlas 2000, the Cambridge Sky Atlas or the Cambridge Double Star Atlas (don't be put off by the double star bit, it is actually a really good basic atlas with lots of deep sky objects). Then there is Uranometria 2000. The charts come in 2 volumes and are excellent quality. There is also a Guide volume that has info on all the objects listed.
I can also recommend the Deep Sky Observers Guide, also in 3 Volumes that has some basic charts but gives lots of good "leads" on what to look for and what you can expect to see when you find it.
With Eyepieces, don't jump in too soon! THe wide field EPs that will come with a scope, usually around 25mm are OK to start with. The higher power ones are often hard to use and so you will find yourself sticking to low power most of the time. Premium EPS are definitely worth it but are expensive and you need to be happy with your choices. Try a few out, talk to others then decide. If you MUST buy a premium EP straight off a 24mm Panoptic or 13mm Nagler from Televue are always good choices.
Cheaper zooms are an idea, but the optical quality is only passable. They still cannot beat a good premium fixed EP. The more expensive zooms are better.
Dew protection is a must unless you are very lucky and live where ther is none. Nothing spoils a good night like have to go and get a hairdryer and wait 10 minutes while you remove moisture from finders, EPs and secondaries. I use the Kendrick controllers and have a EP rack on my scope so all the EPS are permanently setup with heaters as well as the finder, secondary and green laser pointer. All that requires 2 controllers but it is definitely worth it.
One other usful thing is a little foldable table for your charts and bits and pieces. When I go away to Star Parties I set it up in a shower tent to help keep the dew off my charts. Also Bintel sell these little things http://www.bintel.com.au/Accessories/Observing-Aids/Bintel--K-Light--Red-LED/1113/productview.aspx you can clip the on your table to illuminate your charts etc. I think they are still a little bright if using both lights but about right if you only use 1.

Anyways, thats all I can think of for now. Good luck with your choices and happy observing!!

Malcolm

PS and welcome to IIS!!:D

[barx1963]

Oh and a way of transporting the tube is a good idea Here is my attempt which I am still using BTW http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=47433

Malcolm

[Aidan]

Gday,

Glad you are loving the scope, and having some time with your son. My three year old loves being out with the scope and her dad, it is great family time for us, and has become a very special part of our lives.

I would recommend Astronomy 2013 Australia, this is available from the Ice in Space shop, and other bookshops. It gives month by month stuff for you to find, star charts, satellite guides for Jupiter and Saturn. It is a great starting point.

PS I never get sick of the moon, the detail in craters, and surface, is nothing short of amazing.

Aidan

[Jen]

Hi Simmo welcome to IIS :welcome:
Just empty your wallet out on the front counter of any astro shop haha it never seems to end on what astro toys we can buy to pimp up our scopes lol :lol: happy viewing with your son cheers :thumbsup:

[simmo]

Hello all,

Thanks for your replies and welcomings. :cool2:

Wavelandscott I hear what your saying, just enjoy my scope and if I want to upgrade seriously then it might be time to buy something a little more exotic. I will remember this well.

Thanks for the advice on everything else everyone because I think that EVERYONE has given me something that will definately be used straight away. I'm really glad to have talked to you all and it has been very encouraging for me to gain some of your experience.

Thanks Allen and barx1963, I'll go down and check out woolies next time I'm shopping.

Shark Bait I love your idea with the Alt/Az marks on your scope. I think bearings will give me some guidance to where I should be roughly pointing while I'm learning. I even thought while I'm concreting in my new fence that I'll stealthly put in a conc. pad with a north sign on it in the vacant land across from my house! :lol:

Barx1963 I'm definately using your trolley idea as I have to navigate some bumpy areas and kerbing getting across the road. The charts and lights are also on my list.

Now for the chair. From what I've seen the chairs don't look to comlpex to make yourself and I'm quite handy at wood/metal working so I might give that one a try myself. I think I'll have a go and see if I can modulate it later by incorporating something with a small table on the side. Kind of like a lecture chair but with the ability to rotate the table away. On the other side maybe a place to hang the charts and storage for the eypieces. I think I'll have to keep it light though. Hmm, I'll keep you all posted on that one!

Aidan the calendar looks definately on the list too. I think it would be great to hang in our kitchen so the rest of the family can enjoy it too. Which reminds me I turned stellarium on for my boys today and got wow's alround. It was great fun for them and me as we zoomed in on different things. My oldest was so impressed he got out the camera and started taking pictures of it. :lol2:

Thanks again and If there are more ideas then please keep them coming.

Questions -
Do the dew heaters need a mains power source or are they portable and maybe battery operated?

Kind regards
Simmo

[simmo]

Thanks Jen. Your comments put a big smile on my face!! Probably some store owners are smiling now too.

Kind Regards
simmo

[barx1963]

The Kendrick dew heater controllers run on 12v power, Bintel sell a battery kit that I have and it was really useful. Includes a nice heavy bateery, charger and dual giggi lighter adapter.

Malcolm

[Jen]

:lol::lol::lol: lmao at your edit :rofl:

[ColHut]

I'd second the analogue setting circles. There is a long thread on Cloudy nights about them too. Add three levelling feet and a digital level and its pretty much point and shoot. Maybe a hand held with some astronomy software (I'm still using a Palm iii with Planetarium, but you can do so much better!).

An Adjustable height chair (Make your own if your handy!) Honest comfort wins!

regards

[simmo]

Hello everyone,

Thanks for the seconding the setting circles Colhut.
I am definitely going to set them on my base and it’s probably going to be sometime this week if I get the time. I'm jumping in and buying tomorrow if things go well. It'll be a 10" skywatcher as the price isn't too bad at the moment over here. Not sure whether it'll be truss, $ vs. comfort? :fight:
I like your idea of using the adjustable levellers on the base too. If my stealth pad (or anywhere else) is not quite level these will come in handy. Your reply also prompted me to do a search for setting circles and I came up with this site: -

http://www.homebuiltastronomy.com/ManualDobSettingCircles.htm (http://www.homebuiltastronomy.com/ManualDobSettingCircles.htm)

This is probably pretty close to what you’re explaining I think. With this and Sharkbaits photos I reckon I'll nail it. If anything I just loved the look of the telescope (just scroll to the bottom)! Vaztr, I think this is definitely an example of a custom pimped up scope! :cool3: Check the matching seat too.

Jen you are a good soul with a great sense of humour I think. I was so embarrassed when I realised I’d called an easty a westy. In the interest of not being warned for offensive behaviour by administrators I thought I’d better change it. Your post count is very impressive too. I'd tried doing the maths but could not contain my laughter. :lol: :thumbsup:

By the way Colhut good to see a westy online (I can actually use that now!).

I've had such a good time so far and it’s great to know I’m surrounded by such friendly and helpful people.
Keep in touch and the posts and ideas coming
Simmo

[Jen]

[COLOR=black]Jen you are a good soul with a great sense of humour I think. I was so embarrassed when I realised I’d called an easty a westy. In the interest of not being warned for offensive behaviour by administrators I thought I’d better change it. Your post count is very impressive too. I'd tried doing the maths but could not contain my laughter. :lol: :thumbsup:

:D haha it all good simmo u had me confused there for a while :rofl: I've been called a lot of things but never a westy haha :P good luck pimping out your scope with a matching chair to boot woohooo we will be looking forward to seeing the pics happy viewing :D hope to see you around the forums cheers buddy :thumbsup:

[simmo]

Got the scope. WOW!

First thing to note. Please do not look at the moon when its full. Ow. My brother doctored the eyepiece out of a welding mask and then it was ok to look at.

Putting it all together we (family) took it out to the balcony to have a look and I started to adjust the finderscope. After using some street lights to get somewhere close:
- picked the brightest star
- set in the low powered piece
- hey presto jupiter and co.
My kids were quite amazed as everyone else too. Conversation circle for them is going to way different tomorrow. It was hard getting them back to bed.
Got on stellarium to check that what we were looking at was Jupiter cause we thought it couldn't be that easy. But sure enough it was.
After that we looked for the closest cool object on stellarium as well. The neb. in orion and found it no worries so big thanks Allen and vaztr for that one.
I'll set to work in the next couple of weeks and see if I can "juice" up my scope a little. I'll check back with the results, send some photos and some idea of how much it costs.
This has to be one of the coolest things to do and even my brother commented tonight why hadn't we taken it up earlier.

All regards
Simmo ;)

[Jen]

Wooohoooo happy viewing :D

[louie_the_fly]

The Orion nebula group is what got me hooked when I was a high school lad. So easy to find, and I still look at it regularly and think "wow".

[simmo]

Hello Again,

It's been several weeks now since I got my scope and I'm still hooked after the initial sparkle. The weather here in Perth has been great and the moon's been hiding so there has been quite a few chances to get out on the scope.
With the festive holidays I've become a bit of a web junky during the day reading up on as much as I can. Both of these combined has been great cause it's given me some time to reflect on the the comments you guys left and to find out what has worked or been needed to get started comfortably.
So here is what I've done so far.
I took what wavelandscott said and tried to just enjoy the scope I have without adding too many things so far. I haven't been dissapointed yet.

What I needed first is what nearly everybody suggested and that was an adjustable height chair. Luckily my next door neighbours were getting rid of their computer chair so I snagged that one for free and it works almost perfectly. (*almost - not quite low enough at horizon and not quite high enough at straight up but still better than a sore back!) I find that I can sit quite comfortably and really get a good look at what I'm observing.

*Important Edit - please see barx's warning 2 posts on concerning Aeroguard!
Next I tried to go out one night and totally got eaten alive by mosquitos so aeroguard was the cure for that. (I think my blood donations have provided for many millions of offspring).

My brother had an IPad with app so that was good for starters but I needed some charts when he's not around. I looked online and was about to buy when I spotted "Cartes du Ciel". It was free so that came aboard. It is challenging at first but you get used to it if you play long enough. I've found it great when used with stellarium. I can zoom around stellarium, find something for the night and then go to cartes and print the chart off for the night. Cartes has some cool options like being able to change the amount of stars seen to the naked eye so it can suit the area you live in (city vs country and in between). You can zoom in and print off what will be seen in your finder and again to see what will be closely around the intended target(great for hunting and referencing with the eyepiece). Also has a picture of the object so that you can somewhat recognise it.

Next I needed to see the chart at night. Went to woolies and BCF but due to mining boom we are being ripped off over here (apart from telescopes). $37 compared to $20 you guys are getting over east. So remembering barx's trick I cellophaned my wife's el cheapo torch that she's had since the '90s. Works a treat.

Next was lens cleaner. My wife is keen to share the views and so is her eyelashes (please, not to seem sexist so has mine, I saw what you all did to the guy that said that girls shouldn't get\lift dobs!) With just one look the lense (plossl) became unusable with oil that nicely deposited itself right in the middle. It was easily fixed with a lense cleaning kit from the local camera shop.
So far that is all I've needed to get through the first month of viewing.
So $ value it equates to
Chair - free
Aeroguard - $6 (and that was at a allnight servo) Edit - please see further posts concerning this product!
Stellarium - free
Cartes du Ciel - free
Torch - $2 (in the nineties)
Cellophane - $1 (a lot left over)
Lens cleaner kit - $20 (can get cheaper stuff, or just add spit and rag)
All this has added up to a great nights viewing in comfort. I'm sure though as the season changes there will be a few more things to add but so far so good.
As far as the gadgets are concerned I haven't forgotten about those either but they are a bit more about personal tastes of how much can you spend and what will you be likely to be looking at.

Collimation - I decided to go down old school road and buy an astrosystems dual sight tube/cheshire and autocollimator for extra precision. The catseye looks great but just too steep in price and lasers don't seem to be able to do the whole job and have their own collimation problems according to some threads (*might be not be totally true, please elaborate if experienced for greater good of sharing knowledge). Astrosystems imports to Australia and has a deal for both items + shipping. I'll report how that goes and how easy it is to use for a first timer.
Couldn't resist the eyepiece bug either. Old school again. After reading some reviews on orthos being very bright with good optics in a dob I decided to go with some from UOptics. I know this is probably against the trend in regards to wide fields as they have a smaller field of view than the plossls I have with the scope. The plossls to me seem wide enough to my small experience and have delivered good results. I would be happy to keep them for the future but my curiosity has gotten the best of me! I chose the 12.5mm and 18mm so that I could barlow them if it comes to that. I wasn't sure about sizes below that as the eye relief supposedly gets smaller and harder to use with non-tracking dobs. All this is heresay scattered on the web but I'm keen to see how they go and like I said somewhere on the thread I like a challenge! Again I will report back on how those go too. Aside they might not be around for much longer according to some sites so maybe an investment too? I'll see... Probably won't stop here and will have too seek out a wide field in the future and probably a planetary just to kill the cat curiosity. Oh, I forgot they have nine lives, Darn!
In the foreseable future though my next tasks are to put the az alt circles on and hunt down a good camera case to put all of my stuff in cause the cardboard box that came with the scope is already overflowing with goodies. Both of these are pretty inexpensive and will probably be very helpful. I think definately the alt az circles as I try to narrow in on harder DSO's. Apart from that I think this will do for now as from now on I'll save my money for the next scope upgrade.
This last section can be ignored if you don't have the money for them. The scope and eyepieces are good enough by themselves. If anything it is definately the things that bring you the most comfort that have been the most valuable so far.

Regards and clear skies
Simmo

[Jen]

Good on ya simmo happy observing you never know what Santa could bring you :D

[barx1963]

Just a couple of things Simmo.
Be VERY careful with Aerogard around optics. DEET eats optical surfaces so don't use spray, only roll on and keep it away from the face area near the eyepiece and your hands.
Bintel do nice cases with pluck foam that I found really useful.

Malcolm

[simmo]

Wow! Thanks barx, That's something I would never have guessed. I just looked at the bottle I have now and the type of areoguard I'm using is the spray type and from what I can gather using chem data actually contains picaridin as a substitute to DEET. Ingredient list of Aeroguard bottle - water, alcohol denat.(methylated spirits if I'm right),picaridin. I found this link to the info. -

http://www.picaridin.info/

My brother recommended Off! and I'm not sure if that has DEET ( haven't used it yet or seen an ingredient list) but I have just seen a website that referred to it having it as one of its components. So buyer beware and check your bottle hey!
My heart did a backflip when I read your post and it is some great info Barx. Phew I had visions of my telescope melting in front of me! I will still be careful with the spray and probably change it for roll-on just in case picaridin has the same effect!

Cheers Simmo

P.s Jen I'm not sure i've been good enough this year!

[simmo]

http://www.outdoors.org/publications/outdoors/2012/equipped/picaridin-vs-deet-insect-repellent.cfm

Just found this site too. If you scroll down it claims that picaridin does not eat plastics or synthetic materials. Will take it with a pinch of salt but at least my heart has slowed a little now!

Off to the beach with my wife to have tea now and a little stargazing.

Regards
Simmo

[barx1963]

Simmo
I have heard stories on newcomers at astro camps spraying aerogard and basicly wrecking very expensive refractors. Best to be safe. Best protection is long pants and sleeves.

Malcolm

[Shark Bait]

Almost happened to me earlier this year with my new dob. I heard the spary can just behind me and must have given a look that could kill. He stopped spraying instantly. Luckily no damage done and shared a couple of jokes afterwards.

Great update Simmo. Glad you are getting some scope time.

[naskies]

I don't know if it's a tropical mosquito thing, but our mozzies up here can quite happily bite through multiple layers of clothing - e.g. jeans *and* thermals :mad2:

Aeroguard, however, does work very well. I usually take care by only spraying it well and truly away from any equipment - many metres away and downwind.

[simmo]

Hello All,

An update on the Repellants. Nipped down to the local stores to do a little research. This is a list of what I found.

Products containing DEET:-
Aeroguard - all "tropical strength" products - aerosols, liquid spray and roll -on
Coles brand repellant, not sure about woolies.
All Bushmans products - they have it in big writing on the front

DEET is N,N-diethyl-m toluamide, though DEET also is expressed often as N,N-diethyl-meta-toluamide and N,N-diethyl-3-methylbenzamide if you are looking for the chemical name. Aeroguard/Coles does not name it as DEET but rather as its chem name.

Products containing Picaridin:-
Aeroguard - all low allergy/odourless types
OFF! - all products including Tropical strength just the percentage of picaridin increases/decreases.

So anybody reading please take it as you will and use precautions as you find fitting! Please read the bottle too hey!

Personally I wouldn't mind testing or seeing a test done to clear up whether picaridin is safe for optics as well. Maybe one of the companies could clear it up for us. I'll send a message through to one of them and see if they bite. Alternatively does anybody have already redundant/non-usuable optics that could be tested?

Maybe a new sticky could be created for this forum for clueless beginners like my self! Could save a lot of heartbreak as well not to mention stop people turned off for life. Would be a shame. If this had happened to me I would of. I sold my collectable two stroke road racing bike to fund this telescope which had been my pride and joy. I still get a tear when I think of it but no regrets still!

Aside from that had a good night last night and scored the first of many galaxies I hope. I can totally see what you meant Louie about the Orion neb too. Every time I see it I reckon it gets better and can see something that wasn't there before. Last night it just looked huge! Truly an astonishing thing to look at and considering it's so far away.

Naskies maybe kevlar could be your only solution to combat what seems like SAS trained mozzies!

Regards and clear Skies!
Simmo