Anyone got experience stargazing with kids?

[traveller]

Hi all, I was asked by a few parents to do a stargazing evening with them and their kids (primary school aged) now the weather is warmer. But I have no experience with it.
I am sure others have done this before, so I'd appreciate some advice as to how to get it started. I plan to borrow a couple of dobs as that's the most straight forward thing to do. I also want to restrict the numbers to 20 max (parents and kids) and have one or two others to help me out.
Any other tips?
Thanks, Bo

[Forgey]

Having done a pubic viewing night for 100 primary school kids/teacher/parents in narre warren, my advice is to have lots of patience and be prepared to answer questions about what you are showing them.
Be prepared to have to move to object back into the field of view a fair bit.

[Colin_Fraser]

Bright Astronomy Club hosted an evening with the local primary school of about 20 children. It was a really great night and well worth doing.
The children were told the basic rules and type of clothing to wear well prior to the evening.
They arrived with their parents while it was still light enabling them to see what a real telescope looked like (not the Pirate Pete type).
I was fearful at first but they were so well behaved. They formed a queue and patiently waited for their turn.
They were pretty much awe-struck at the views. Most came back for second and third looks.
The only thing we did not bring that we should have, is a box or small step ladder for the little ones. I had to stand them on my chair and held them to keep them safe and steady.

[jjjnettie]

Colin is right, don't forget the step stool for the littlies.
You'll need to explain to them first not to hold onto the eye piece or you'll be having to realign the scope all night. :) If they are really young, they will need to learn to close one eye and look through the other.
Faint fuzzies won't excite, but big fat globular clusters and planets do. :)
So Saturn and Mars will probably be first on the agenda, followed by Omega Centauri. The Jewel Box is lovely too, with all those coloured stars.
:) Have fun!! You'll get a blast out of all the oohs and aaahs when they first see Saturn. :D

[Varangian]

Make sure they don't all grab the end of the Dob and put their fingers all over the secondary. Also they tend to knock the object out of the field of view with their heads or foreheads before they even see it in the EP.

Have them line up for a turn. Have fun it's great to see kids faces light up even at a cratered lunar surface.

[jjjnettie]

Don't bring along your "good" eye pieces. Expect sticky fingers and star struck adults who won't share the scope once they get their hands on it. LOL.
oh and binoculars are good too.

[mental4astro]

Hi Bo,

I've participated in many school kid star parties, from kindy to high school. Here are some suggestions you may like to consider:

* Look for an evening that has at most a first quarter Moon. This will allow for easier DSO observing.

* Have a few scopes available as stations, each on a particular target. Even if the folks who help out have next to no experience, the Moon is one of the easiest targets to re-aim a scope at.

* Choose just three or four bright objects. If some planets are visible, limit magnifcation to around 120X max as anything more and vibrations will make for poor image with novices.

* Have a short talk prepared to start with, pointing out some naked eye features of the sky along with whatever skylore that belongs to some constellations. If you can, a green laser pointer is a great tool. This talk will also serve you to lay the ground rules for how to treat the scopes, such as not to grab at the scope or eyepiece, and to note that some scopes may have their eyepiece located at different ends.

* Check if that night the ISS will be visible. It will cause a major stir!

* Don't use your best EPs! Grubby fingers, make up laiden eyelashes, and what ever type of microbes will be unleashed on them.

* Be prepared for very challenging coming from the kids. They will proove much more challenging and in-tune with all things science than their parents, even from kindy. The kids will be able to grasp very abstract ideas surprisingly easily.

* A video camera with a small monitor can be a good tool to view dimmer objects such as nebulae or galaxies. Novices will not be able to master averted vision to view these.

* Involve the teachers to have a themed night to create some excitment for the evening. Maybe ask the families to bring their own binoculars too as binos are very underestimated for astro. This will help keep folks entertained while they wait for their turn at a scope.

* Give them simple instructions on how to view into the scope while at the scope, such as "look into the glass window", and have them slowly bring their eye to the eyepiece. A little red light torch will help some people 'see' where they need to look into.

The Kindy session I had was themed as a "pizza and planets night" :scared:. But careful crowd education saw everyone wash their hands before coming out to the scopes. My wife minded the school's 4.5" dobbie on the Moon with no prior scope experience and did a great job, my C5 tracking Jupiter and not once did I need to re-acquire it, and I focused my 17.5" on the Jewel Box. Some 100 students, parents, siblings and teachers had a blast.

You will be surprised how many people you'll be able to deal with with a few scopes and a couple of people to help out. The kindy session I was asked to host was my first "solo" session, and it was quite a buzz. The teachers that will attend will be your greatest allies, so your conservative number of 20 can be easily doubled.

If anything else comes to mind I'll post it too.

These sessions can be very rewarding for everyone. The sense of community they espouse is fantastic.

Mental.

[mental4astro]

Step ladders! Yes! Colin, great tip!!! Not only will these help the shorter kids and adults, but they will also be your best friend for folks to hold onto the ladder and not your scope.

[wavelandscott]

I have done several outreach evenings for scool kids and it can be a blast.

You have been given some good advice...some things I have learned.

Have a step stool or box for the kids to stand one

Choose a night with a quarter moon or less

Keep the objects simple...moon, planet (Jupiter or Saturn), Jewel Box and a few constelations or asterisms.

Have some basic information available, how big, how old, how far away...and of course some background info on the types of scopes and how thy work.

Enjoy!

[supernova1965]

One thing that I found useful if you have the gear is to setup a projector and screen connected to a computer with camera connected to a scope to show objects to a bigger crowd at the same time.

[tlgerdes]

As Alex said, only pick a few objects, maybe around 4-6. Create a one page cheat sheet with a list of these objects, a few words about what each one is and a small picture of the object. This helps the kids to identify themselves what each object is and gives them something to take home.

Moon, Planet, open cluster, globular cluster, bright galaxy, bright nebula, double star

[Gem]

With the sheet - also put a couple of "why" questions on it. For example, observe saturn and Nepture... then ask why the size difference. Sounds simple and obvious, but it turns a disappointing view of Neptune into a learning experience. Phases of Venus are good too if it is up.

[traveller]

Thanks everyone, great tips.
A wealth of knowledge as always :thumbsup:
Bo

[xstream]

I bet that was a hairy experience Paula! :lol::lol::lol:

[Poita]

For future events, if you can get your hands on a Mallincam or similar, the kids absolutely love it.
I stick one of them on the ipod touch to look up the information on each object we slew to, and they share the info on it with the group, garners a lot of interest and excitement, and with the mallincam there is detail and colour to the various galaxies, nebulae etc. which is a real plus, and the kids don't have to struggle with the eyepiece.

[mental4astro]

Don't have a totally dark environment as folks can trip over gear or stumble up and down the step ladder/s. Make sure you have folks hold onto the step ladder in case they lose balance in the dark looking into an EP.

[pmrid]

The "How big and how far away is it?" question is almost always the first one that non-astronomerrs will ask - kids and adults. They won't be able to grasp parsecs, Angstrom units or light years but the latter is probably the best to use. Have some standard candle answers ready - such as the light from the sun takes 8 minutes (or whatever it is) to get here, and the moon, 30 seconds or whatever; then follow with the light from Mars takes 14 minutes (that's also how long iut takes Mars Curiosity's pictures to reach us). And so on. Then, the light from that star started it's journey before I was born or before your before Australia was discovered by Cap'n Cook etc. You get the picture.

Also try to explain that all the stars they see (let's not get too pendantic about a few exceptions) are in our own galaxy and then, show them Andromeda, if it's up, or the SMC/LMC and explain that these are other galaxies of billions of stars they are so far away we can't actually see individual stars etc. and on it goes.

Peter

[traveller]

Thanks again for the tips.
At this stage, I will limit the star gazing to 10 adults and 10 kids with two volunteers. I am currently seeking permission from the school to access the school oval and run a couple of extension cords from the school gym.
I will need to borrow a dob from someone in Melbourne is due course (prob Oct/Nov time) and maybe a couple of cheapie EPs.
I will set up my laptop with a webcam feed from my 8" SCT. May also look at a motorised EQ mount (3 and above?) for my ED80, I think 3 scopes should be enough :shrug:
Cheers,
Bo

[Shark Bait]

Lots of great tips posted in this thread. I help out with the BAS school nights (when I can) and they are enjoyed by all. The group sizes range from around 50 to over 200.

With 10 adults and 10 kids your group will be getting a lot of time to enjoy the views on offer through your scopes. Don't be surprised if you end up with a few extras turning up on the night. :thumbsup:

[multiweb]

Yeah I go to Ilford with Trevor and Barry Guerdes all the time. :P

[Osirisra]

Great tips, I like to make sure I have my ipad with skysafari handy to so as to be able to show a picture of some of the objects and have that all important 'how far is away is it' info.

[alistairsam]

Bo, Let me know if you need a hand and a scope, I have an 8" on a dob mount as well as a 10" on an eq mount which will help track the object if it doesn't end up in an unusual position. Happy to bring one or both and give a hand.
Cheers

[Regulus]

Bo.
First don't be anxious, they'll love it and you will have a very enjoyable evening.

We, me and David - Omegacrux, took his 8" Dob to a nearby rural primary school for an astronomy night and it was wonderful. Cold, crisp and fun.
Martin George from the Hobart observatory gave talks inside and about 10 amateur astronomers turned up with their scopes. However, the Dob we took turned out to be most popular and I can only think because it looked impressive to young eyes against 100 refractors and 8"-12" Meades on impressive tripod mounts for some reason. All I know is for 1 1/2 hours I seemed to have at least 10-15 people lined up to look at Saturn.
Also a surprise (but not in hindsight) was that the kids were quicker to grasp the essentials of looking through the eye piece than adults.
They liked it when I focused their attention on one thing at a time ie the planet / the rings / the moons so they could understand what they were seeing. They weren't impressed by adult stuff like distance and size.
It was also interesting to direct there attention to the Orion Neb and get there opinions about what colour it was.
Advice take a deep breath. Slow yourself down and keep it simple. They'll love it.
A chair for them to stand on and get them to hold the Dobs tensioning handle to steady themselves and it will be a lot of fun.
Eta Carina Neb, Omega Centauri and any large planets should work fine, as would the moon.
Trevor

[traveller]

Thanks Trevor and everyone for your kind words of encouragement. Alistair, I will keep you in the loop, we talked about this at school council meeting tonight and we may have to do it early next year instead.
Cheers, Bo

[astronut]

Don't forget a crescent Moon.

[astro_nutt]

Hi Bo,
I've done a few public viewing sessions.
Check to see if a "Working with children" I.D. card is required.
Have the children wipe thier eyelids with a tissue while waiting to have a peek.
Have some "Junior Astronomer" certificates printed up.
If possible, have some pictures of the objects you are going to view. The children can then relate to the object they see in the eyepiece.
Have fun!

[traveller]

Thanks, great idea re the certificates.
There is no need for blue cards as it is not a school activity, we just happen to use school oval (and gym for toilet and power). The school principal is very supportive, her main concern was public liability insurance, but we have since clarified that with the Education Dept.
Cheers,
Bo :thumbsup:

[wayne anderson]

A good idea to help make the viewing area and surrounds safe from them triping at night is to have some red garden lights near by, just get the cheap $2 solar garden lights from bunnings and place a red pen lid over the LED mount. Works great when fully charged for about 4 to 5 hours of viewing time and some kids say it looks like a spaceship landing and take off pad.

[andyc]

One quick tip, mentioned above, is to watch your language when trying to describe things (not the swearing!). Something I've noticed at a number of astronomy-related outreach events is the over-use of some exceedingly obscure terms, things that few of the public will know, and that will make their eyes glaze over double-quick. Stuff used by astronomers all the time: arc seconds, parsecs, astronomical units and more. A quote I heard at a Transit event: "Venus subtends a minute of arc" is an example - it's right out of the textbook, but it's dry, dusty, obscure, and who of the public is going to be anything other than turned right off by that sentence? The person who was being spoken to just looked utterly blank at this.

Do your best to use units, descriptions and analogies that ordinary people can relate to, even if the numbers are big, like distances in kilometres (or 'so many times as far away as the Moon/Sun/whatever'). Simpler analogies are better even if they end up not being absolutely technically correct - pedantry can also turn people off. A big challenge with astronomy communication is not to lose your audience in jargon, as there's so much of it about!

[pmrid]

I thought I might add a link to this site if you haven't already held your observing night for kids- it's a northern hemisphere site but it does deal with southern views so all you need do is reverse the seasons they list and you'll fnd really useful information for assisted observation by a group.

Try it:
http://www.rocketmime.com/astronomy/index.html

Peter

[niko]

maybe someone can also comment on the usefulness of this?

http://www.oneminuteastronomer.com/southern-sky/