Pentax 14 mm "Long story"

[Dave47tuc]

Hi All,:)
Well it had been a frustrating 6 months. With selling eyepieces, telescopes etc. :mad2:
Funny how life takes you on many roads. You think you have to sell this or that but in a few months things seem to work out.:rolleyes:
I had been very sad to sell my eyepiece’s most of all. Like my Tele Vue 31 Nagler and 12 Nagler 22 Panoptic 8.8 UWA etc.:mad2:
All very high-end eyepieces. After I sold all these and my scope 10” Dob with Argo etc, I set out sorting things out and rebuilding.:help:
I was lucky enough to get a 6” Maksutov and once I set this up on a EQ5 mount with dual axis drives and wooden tripod that package seemed very nice indeed.;)
(I once thought of selling in a moment of madness) Sometimes you don’t realize what you have sometimes.
So I then set out to fix my eyepiece situation. I first got a set of University Optics Orthoscopics. These are very nice eyepieces and excellent for Planets and the Moon and double stars.:thumbsup:
I did miss those wide field views of those eyepieces I sold.
Big eye relief and wide apparent fields.
Now you can’t get to wide in an f12 Maksutov but that won’t stop me. :D

So I tested a few eyepieces and was very fortunate to get one of my old eyepieces back.:)
Thanks to Mike who was not happy with the 22 Panoptic he was happy to sell it back to me. I first sold it to Stu. I think the 22 Panoptic is one of the best eyepieces out there. So I’m rapt to get it back.:thumbsup:
Next on my list was to get as big a field eyepiece I could. I tried many and have settled on a MK-70 University optics Konig 40 mm. This gives me 45x @ 1.5 Deg. Very good in a F12 scope. Stars are not perfect at the edge but I’m happy with that, as I wanted to get as wide field as possible.:shrug:
With the 40mm and 22 mm I was looking for one more around 120x. So I asked Geoff If I could try his Pentax 14 mm XL. I thought that was very nice indeed.;)

So after a quick ask in the buy and sell threads I decided to buy a Penatx 14 mm XW new.:rolleyes:
I rang Star Optics In Queensland. WWW.staroptics.com.au spoke to Lex, He was most helpful after a chat and settling on price I ordered one. I rang on Tuesday morning and the 14 mm arrived first thing Wednesday morning. Now that was great service.:thumbsup:
Thanks Lex I’ll be back.;)
My frist thoughts on the 14 mm is WOW very well packed in the box with one of those plastic screw bottle thingo’s!! With fitted foam inside as well. Eyepiece information leaflet. The construction is absolutely brilliant 10/10.:thumbsup: I have always owned tele vue stuff .
Even without a big test I’m converted to these Penatx’s.
In the future I may get the 10 mm and 7 mm.
So it will now rain for a while , but I’m happy with that as we need it.:D
Also I’m happy to be back on the track of high end eyepieces. Geoff and I will do some tests between the XL and XW just for fun.:whistle:
Sorry for the long winded story . But I’m one happy new eyepiece owner.:)
Cheers.:thumbsup:

[davidpretorius]

can't wait to catch up again, maybe later in year, The family and i are planning a trip to mt martha.

I remember looking thru geoffs pentax, but will pretty new eyes.

Rumples 24mm pan sticks out as being brilliant because of seeing and m42 detail etc.

I still would love to try these pentaxes, once i have finished viewing jupiter with the 5mm vixen and 4 mm TMB once she arrives.

Excellent report, another plus for pentax. Am I right, but I cannot think of a bad report on pentax????

[Starkler]

I remember when I got my first Pentax I thought it such an object of beauty and fine engineering:love: The machining and the way they are put together says "quality" :)

I tell you it wasnt long at all after receiving the 10.5mm that I ordered the 14mm, I just had to have it :D

[janoskiss]

Dave, I want one of those EPs! So tell me, ... how long before it's up for sale? :rofl:

Geoff, that's exactly what I thought about the XF when I got it. Never seen an EP that looks so well made.

[Dave47tuc]

I just orderd a 10mm XW also:eyepop:

Never Steve:P

[ausastronomer]

Dave,

I have been singing the praises of the Pentax XW's particularly in the shorter focal lengths, almost since they came on the market at which time I bought 4 of them, having previously used the Pentax XL's. Unfortunately, very few people listen, regardless of how loud you yell. I do have a couple of supporters in Geoff (Starkler) and Jim (Rapid Eye). Many newbies get swept up in "Nagler fever" and are spellbound by the wide flat field of view they provide even in fast scopes, not realising there are many factors apart from EOF performance to consider, in determining an eyepiece's overall performance. My favourite quote, by an obvious wa__ker, was, "If you don't own Nagler's you're just a WANNABEE." Fact is, the Pentax XW's particularly in the shorter focal lengths are the equal of the Naglers if not superior, in several critical areas of eyepiece performance.

FWIW, the 10mm Pentax XW is a slightly better performer than the 14mm Pentax XW IMO, particularly in fast newtonians *** and is one of the best eyepieces I have ever used in any telescope. You can stack whatever Nagler you like up against it. In addition the 7mm Pentax XW is just as good as the 10mm.

*** The 14mm Pentax XW when used in a fast F-Ratio scope having a curved focal plane such as a Newtonian, exhibits mild field curvature. Its minor and not an issue IMO. This is not evident to any degree with the 7mm and 10mm Pentax XW's. The 14mm Pentax when used in a telescope design having a flatter focal plane such as an apochromatic refractor does not exhibit this field curvature.

ENJOY !!!!!! sounds like you're already converted :)

CS-John B

[matt]

I agree with you John. I bought the 10mm XW based on your recommendation and as you know, John, I'm very happy with it's performance particularly in my 8" f5 scope.

It's a beautiful ep. The contrast is fantastic and it's crispness is terrific. Sharp across the entire FOV and very nice on colour. You couldn't ask for more in terms of its build. Anyone would be happy to have this in their kit.

And it goes without saying it's a delight in the slower c9.25.

I'm looking to place an order for the 7mm very soon.:)

[janoskiss]

John, the Nagler eyepiece has gained reputation as the pinnacle of premium EPs and there is enough momentum behind it to sustain the monopoly that Televue enjoys on the premo EP market.

The 82 degree FOV of the Nagler vs 70 degree of the Pentax also has a lot to do with the continuing dominance of the Nagler, I believe. Newbies who have rarely or never looked through wide field EPs will be more impressed with Nagler specs and will be inclined to go for the EP with the largest FOV, without considering that in practice 70 or 82 degrees makes little difference (at least for me anyway).

[Dave47tuc]

Thanks John and Matt,:D
Using Geoff's Pentax's I have always thought very nice :thumbsup: indeed. I have as you know looked through many eyepieces.
Owned over 60 of them:P Many are very nice and I to have had the nagler only bug:lol:
But I went of them when they started to go 1.25" the fields really curved a lot. And ER was tight i thought. I do though love Panoptics and have the 22 on that count.
But I am very much a Pentax fan and have been for a while.
But never owned them till now.
They as you know are rated about as goods as it gets in Eyepieces. But everyone is different.
Newbies may not go for them as 2 has cost me as much as a 12" Dob :rolleyes: from Andrews.

But I will do nothing but add Pentaxs to my eyepiece collection for ever more.:)

[Starkler]

I think a lot of that has to do with the fact that the lions share of the online astronomy community is American and many seem to get a bit one-eyed about supporting an American product (even if manufactured in Taiwan). Along with that is the historical aspect of Al Nagler bringing eyepiece types to the market that were previously not available to amateur stargazers.

There will always be people buying the eyepieces with green writing on them just because they believe if its a Televue , it must be the best.

Im also in the camp where I feel that afov >70 degrees is unimportant.
Its nice, but I wouldnt trade off any other performance characteristic for it such as sharpness, eye relief or contrast.

[Starkler]

Dave, the XL's and XW's will look very similar in the dark. Better check that eyepiece case before letting me drive away after an observing session ;)

[Dave47tuc]

Don't worry yourself I'll keep an eye out for that :rolleyes:

I must confess people I had to off load something to help get the XW's ( the missus was well you know:mad2: )
My Ortho's are going to a collector some of you know down on the Peninsula:whistle: something had to give:shrug:
I'm sure the XW's will make up for any loss I may feel:whistle:

I will be looking for a top QL barlow in the future.:D

[janoskiss]

Geoff's got a nice 2" barlow. Maybe he will let you have it for a good price. :whistle:

[ausastronomer]

I think you have hit the nail on the head here Geoff. Americans probably provide 90% or more of the ONLINE astronomy community and 80% of those 90% are about as patriotic as it gets, when it comes to supporting a home grown and home owned company. The majority of them don't have a clue that the Televue eypieces are now manufactured off shore in south east Asia and have been for several years.

The progression is:-

1) they buy a cheap scope
2) use the cheap eyepieces that come with it
3) become dissappointed in the eyepieces they have
4) join an online astronomy forum and read about how bad their current eyepieces are
5) continually hear from any number of patriotic americans that Naglers are as good as it gets
6) attend their 1st star party where Naglers dominate
7) look through a Nagler for the 1st time
8) become spellbound by the Naglers wide field and good EOF performance
9) form an opinion that a Nagler is as good as it gets not having used any 1 of 5 or 6 other high quality eyepieces that are in the same class and superior in some respects.



Absolutely, I have no use or need for an eyepiece with an AFOV larger than 70 deg and FWIW I can't really see much difference between an 82 deg AFOV and a 70 deg AFOV.

On a related note, I recently spent 4 days at Coonabarabran with a couple of members of AS of NSW and some visiting American amateur astronomers. One of the Americans had an 18mm Denkmeier Wide Angle Eyepiece

Here are a couple of links to the 21mm focal length of the series:-

http://denkmeier.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.displ ay&category_ID=2&CFID=8922&CFTOKEN=61533983

http://www.optcorp.com/product.aspx?pid=30-719-725-4237

The 18mm is obviously a new focal length, as it is not listed anywhere on the internet. Also not much is available about the 21mm on the internet. They are obviously a premium product costing $US 279 or about $US 30 less than a Pentax XW.

Conclusion ? One of the best 1.25" eyepieces I have ever used in this focal length range. Very sharp, high contrast, high light transmission, well corrected to the EOF in my F5 scope and 20mm of eye relief. It doesn't get much better and it certainly does everything those things with green writing on them can do, probably more. I will be getting the owner to buy one for me on his return to the USA.

CS-John B

[Dave47tuc]

Another side to all this is advertising. TeleVue and Meade spend a lot of money on advertising. Look in the popular magazines and you will find there full to half page ads.
Most things are sold through advertising.
I don’t remember seeing a Pentax eyepiece advertised ever. !!
If you don’t advertise you don’t sell.
People buy Meade products weather been good or bad because of advertising.
Same with Celestron and TV.

It mostly comes down to a personal thing I think. Budget and what your partner may have to say may come into it!
But for anyone looking at spending there money on eyepieces and maybe thinking I mite spend a little extra on some high-end eyepieces. :help:
Geez you must look at the Pentax’s as well as others on the market. They’re some truly wonderful eyepieces out there now and spending money on a scope is only half the story.:D

[Dave47tuc]

Word is there is a newer member to the Pentax club than me:shrug:

[janoskiss]

Really? :whistle:

[OneOfOne]

Interesting comments guys. I am looking at getting a high end eyepiece in mid year for an F5/8" and was originally looking at a Nagler, but now I have added a Pentax to the selection choices, that makes 2 now. I look forward to following the thread over the next few months while the battle continues.

[janoskiss]

Add the LVWs to your list too, if you haven't already. The 22mm in particular should be superb in your scope. It has some coma-fixing field-sharpening built-in magic that not even naglers and panos can compete with in an f5 Newt. :)

[iceman]

I'll hopefully get my 22mm Vixen LVW (that I won :clap: ) soon, as soon as I get time to go into Astro-Optical in Crows nest to pick it up.

I'll do a review and compare it against Rod's 22mm Pano when I get some time to use them both.

[janoskiss]

Great news, Mike! Looking forward to the review. :)

[ausastronomer]

Actually I just found out the Denkmeier eyepiece I recently used was in fact the 21mm and they have never made an 18mm, which is what I thought I was using. The old fellow who owned it got his wires crossed.

It is one of the best, if not the best, 1.25" eyepiece I have used in this focal length and marginally superior optically to the 22mm Vixen LVW IMO for about the same money. Another upside is that it is much smaller and lighter than the 22mm Vixen LVW (1/2 the size and weight). The 21mm Denkmeier eyepiece would run out around $AUS 350 imported direct from the USA. I am not sure if they are available from an Australian dealer yet and at what price, however, I will check with Daniel from Frontier Optics who does sell the Denkmeier Binoviewers.

The 21mm Denkmeier eyepiece is very small, light and compact at 7oz, has 20mm of eye-relief combined with a good sized eye-lens and very sharp optics. The downside is they are only available in 2 focal lengths (21mm and 14mm) due to the power switch on the Denkmeier Binoviewer giving multiple magnification options with each eyepiece focal length making a large number of different focal lengths superfluos.

I intend to buy one for myself and cost doesn't come into this equation.

CS-John B

[RapidEye]

Well you can see from my Location tag - I've got a different Point Of View on this :D
I honestly doubt that you'll find many people willing to shell out the $$$ for a Nagler that believe Uncle Al hand grinds and assembles those EP's out in his lil' ol' shop :screwy: The people that collect that level of EP are quite a bit more informed than the average dolt that wanders into a camera shop to buy a scope.

For me it was a pretty easy choice - eye relief, eye relief, oh, and yeah, eye relief!!! :P I know I could have gone with a Radian, but that wider FOV, and heftier EP fit my needs better. The bigger assembly that the Pentaxes have are much more resistant to fogging.

I think someone earlier hit it better: advertising! Uncle Al shells out a LOT of money in the US publications for pretty full page ads. A lot of the major retailers also take out big ads and their TV gear usually gets center stage.

Pentax??? I've never seen an ad from them.

Are we all a bunch of sheep, only willing to buy what has the prettiest ads? No - but you can't deny advertising works: why else is does XXXX spring for those big signs around the football stadium :D

I've got 4 XW's right now: 7mm, 10mm, 14mm, and 20mm. I am going to add the 5mm, probably later this year. Heck, I might even go crazy and toss a 3.5mm and/or 30mm into the order (moment of weakness honey - honest, I couldn't stop myself). Are they the best??? I don't care - they SUIT MY NEEDS BEST! :thumbsup: