Let's talk Photography Filters (eg: cokin/lee)

[iceman]

Hi guys

Found out on Sunday morning that my old Cokin clone filter holder and filters, that screwed onto the front of my 24-105mm lens, obstruct quite a way into the FOV on the full frame 5DMkII camera.

Andrew Murrell was kind enough to loan me his for a few shots, which were much better and bigger, but at 24mm there was still a bit of vignetting in the corners from the filter or holder.

So, what are the recommendations?

For a $2000 camera and a $1000 lens, it's probably not a good idea to have a $20 piece of plastic in front of it all, so I'm happy to go for good quality (within reason).

What are the best (but good value) filter holders and slide in filters for FF cameras and wide field lenses (that don't get in the FOV)?

And where from?

I'll be looking to get a set of Grad ND plus maybe a circular polariser.. what else?

[gregbradley]

I just got a 77mm titanium Tiffen antireflection coated .6 graduated ND filter off ebay. It was about $100 or so as I recall which is good value as these normally are worth closer to $170.

At the moment it is on a Nikon 24-70mm F2.8 ED lens and it doesn't seem to vignette but thats on an APS 40D.

Also I use both a Bower 62mm circular polariser and a 77mm Kenko one.
They both work well and I use them all the time. Better than a UV glass filter as they do some work!

I also got a cheapish 720nm Infrared filter 77mm off ebay. It works quite well and is a lot cheaper than the standard Hoya R72 infrared filter. Although I have only used it a few times so a bit early to recommend it.
The Hoya one was fine (I misplaced it) but a lot more expensive and that was a 62mm or smaller one too.

If you are going to be imaging waterfalls you may consider a .9 ND filter to be able to do a slow enough shutter speed to get the water to blur. Same with your coastal shots. Get that lovely water blur even though you took it during the day.

There was one filter I nearly bought but I'd spent too much already on lenses. That was 2 ND filters that are circular and you spin them around to get the level of gradation you want. It sounded very clever. That was at a Photo shop in Castle Towers in Castle Hill. These filters were about $120 or so. Perhaps you can get them on ebay for a lot less. They sounded very handy. They replace these kits that have several ND filters in them.

Humi would know more on this subject about which ND filters are actually useful. Ken Rockwell for what its worth recommends the .6 and says he rarely uses the .9 or others. I can't confirm that.

I'd like to know more about filters. There was a booklet about Tiffen filters that had lots of different types of filters and when you use them.

I saw a fabulous image of the blue mountains where the sky was very dark blue. I thought maybe it was done using IR filters but they don't create that effect. It must have been done with a heavy graduated ND filter. Similar effects used in CSI Miami - they often show the sky as dark red or almost black as an effect and I wondered how they did that.

Greg.

[gregbradley]

These cross star filters could create an interesting effect in some images:

http://www.camerafilters.com/pages/star.aspx

Like adding diffraction spikes to your terrestial imaging.

The other filter that may be of interest is the red enhancing filter seeing as you will be in the Kimberly and I imagine a lot of the scenes will have a lot of reddish rock in them.

Greg.

[iceman]

I want to use the slide in filters, rather than screw on.

Having to screw on and off filters out in the field, would be a real pain.

I've got the knock-offs already and they're the ones that worked fine on my 40D but have severe vignetting with the FF camera.

[Steffen]

The trick with the "plastic" filters by Cokin or Lee is that they have the same refractive index as air. That's why they don't need coating and their exact shape/figure doesn't matter.

I agree though, with glass filters one shouldn't skimp. It pays to spend more on good (and easy to clean) coatings, good mechanical quality and a slim rim.

Since I don't use effect or grad filters myself I can't recommend any. With polarisers I've had good experiences with the B+W MRC series and the Nikon ones (which may not be available anymore).

Cheers
Steffen.

[gregbradley]

I was looking at those square types but I haven't used one.

Just out of interest I read this article about stacking 2 circular polarisers and spinning them to create the same effect as the spinning variable ND filters. I just tried it out and it works. At one point they are almost black (a deep blue).

http://www.digital-photography-school.com/create-your-own-variable-neutral-density-filter

I leave the polariser filter on all the time so no problem with screwing on and off but yes the graduated ND needs to be screwed in and its a tad tricky. For daylight shots rotating the polariser really gets a nice sweet point for the sky. I'm a bit new to my grad ND filter but it seemed a touch extreme so far.

I believe the advantage of the square type grad ND filter is you can slide it in or out to suit the scene more exactly rather than half and half like the screw in one does.

Greg.

[troypiggo]

G'day Mike,

Went through all of this not too long ago. H will be along shortly I'm sure as well. :)

After weighing up the cheaper grad filter options like Cokin, I went with the Lee filters. Think they're at the cheaper end of the higher quality filters. Only trouble with them at the moment is availability. Everyone seems to want them.

At the time I had some money burning a hole in my pocket for some reason, so I went a bit silly buying more than I really do need. But I figure it's an investment and they'll last. I got the foundation kit holder, 6x4 3 stop hard GND, 2 stop soft GND, and 3 stop reverse GND, 4x4 circ polariser, 10 stop big stopper ND. Think that's it.:ashamed:

Very happy with them. No colour cast like you get with some cheaper ones. The 2 I use the most are 3 stop hard for seascapes and the 3 stop reverse.

You don't need the holder, but I found I can't hold the filters in front of the lens long enough. Too clumsy. Think H does hand-hold the filters and "feather".

Don't forget to factor into your budget a filter holder/wallet so they don't get damaged/scratched.

[Octane]

:D

Graduated neutral density filters, how I love thee, let me count the ways.

I bought the best money could buy (spent about fifteen hundred bucks on a few bits of glass: 2- and 3-stop grads in both hard- and soft-step varieties, as well as variable neutral density systems with integrated warming polarisers that work from 2-8 stops). This was taken with the variable system at about 4 stops, from memory, and a hand-held 2-stop soft step: http://users.tpg.com.au/octane2/md.html

You can't go wrong with Lee filters, though. For some reason, despite the worldwide shortage, they're readily available on eBay -- brand new, from legitimate suppliers. Don't buy Cokin's. They're not neutral density, rather, grey filters, and, will leave horrible purple and brown casts that cannot be white balanced out.

You need a good quality circular polariser. Hoya Pro1D series are very good, and, have a slight warming effect which helps with natural in-camera saturation.

As mentioned, I don't use filter holders, preferring to hand hold. Yeah, they get scratched this way, but, the scratches have never shown up in any of my work (and, I shoot at f/16 most of the time, which, I know is well past where diffraction effects are theoretically supposed to turn your image to poo (around f/11 on the 5D Mark II), but, it just doesn't). The advantage of handholding filters, particularly when using strong densities, is that it can help prevent gradations showing up in your image. By carefully (slowly) dithering the filter in a random or circular motion for the duration of the exposure, you will go a long way to making the use of a filter subtle.

Hope this helps, some.

H

[gregbradley]

That's a seriously beautiful photo.

Greg.

[Ausrock]

Damn! I remember when I was buying Cokins they were regarded as the "bees knees" and relatively expensive. I must admit that was close to 30 years ago :sadeyes:. I've just (like in the last hour) picked up a 40D off Ebay so I might just get a chance to start using them again.

Dithering/feathering with filters seems to be akin to working the exposures under an enlarger. Anyways, I'm watching this thread with interest as I'm learning something new :thumbsup:

[acropolite]

Mike, as H suggests, it's not necessary to use the holder, simply hand holding in front of the lens works well enough for most situations.

[Octane]

Another example of strong neutral density and polariser: http://users.tpg.com.au/octane2/iaftw.html

They really are a must have. That shot would not have been possible otherwise.

H

[SteveInNZ]

Another option priced between Cokin and Lee are Hitech filters. They have both 85mm and 100mm (better for hand holding) and do a few more GND options like hard edge, soft edge and reverse. I don't have any yet but they seem to get a lot of favourable comments.

Steve.

[Poita]

I've used Lee filters and they are great.
We use a Matte Box though most of the time, as we have cine filters that we use.

Something like this:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/673923-REG/Cavision_MB4169_5DMII_4x5_65_Matte_ Box_Kit.html

We really need another forum for discussing general photography, not a lot of astro discussion in here lately :question:

[Octane]

I always thought this sub-forum was for discussing astrophotography and terrestrial photography/equipment. Am I missing something? :)

H

[Poita]

Maybe it is?

I don't really mind either way, just thought maybe a general photography section could be setup.

I'd love to see a Video Astronomy section too actually.

Anyway, back on track, I haven't tried handholding the filters, I'll have to give that a go.

[Octane]

Handholding filters, while a bit more difficult, having to juggle a remote release and depth of field preview button, has proven successful. For me, anyway.

Now that we've been discussing them, I'm afraid I'm going to have to buy some reverse grads. Argh! :)

H

[Poita]

At least the MKIII finally has the DOF button where I expect it to be!

[gregbradley]

We really need another forum for discussing general photography, not a lot of astro discussion in here lately :question:[/QUOTE]


Its been so cloudy for so long. At least there is still light during the day at the moment!!:lol:

Greg.

[gregbradley]

This is an interesting thread as I have the Nikon 14-24mm F2.8 ED and its a beautiful lens but it is often commented you can't use filters on it because of the large aspherical lens at front. The Lee or Cokin holder for it is a cool $700+. So do you think I could handhold a 100 x 150mm filter in front of it and light would not get in through the sides?

What sort of graduated or straight ND filter would you recommend for landscape type shots? I am using a Tiffen titanium .6 grad ND 77mm filter on my other lenses. It seems fine except it is rigid in that the graduation is at the halfway point only. Whereas a square of rectangular filter you could slide up or down to suit.

Greg.

[Octane]

Hi Greg,

Handholding a graduated neutral density filter in front of that particular lens will be problematic. I tend to hold the filter flush up against the lens. With the aspherical element, unless your filter is orthogonal to the lens and parallel to the image axis, you will introduce surface reflections of your surrounding environment. I feel that it would be prudent to invest in a filter holder for such a beast.

Get the Lee filters, straight off eBay. They do the whole 1-, 2-, 3-stops and beyond. The soft step filters fade gently from halfway up the filter to the top of the filter, whereas the hard step filters typically gradate from nothing to maximum in the space of 5% of the filter length; on an 6x4" filter, that equates to 7.5 mm.

The hard step filters are typically used for flat horizon/ocean shots where there is no subject or object that could be obscured, whereas soft step filters are used primarily for scenes involving subjects such as mountains, and, the like. Reverse filters reach maximum density about 2/3 to 3/4 through the filter and then soften out again. This is so that cloud features don't turn too dark at the top of your frame. I avoid this typically by gently blending in a second exposure or a pushed double-processed RAW.

You always have the ability to double stack filters, too. Typically, beyond 3-stops of neutral density, the filters shoot up in price quite dramatically, like, 50%+ hikes. So, you can get a couple of cheaper ones and stack them together to get the density required.

A recent 3-stop hard step filter in action: http://users.tpg.com.au/octane2/b.html

Hope that helped.

H

[gregbradley]

Hi Humi,

Oh my God that shot is amazing! That's exactly one type of shot I would like to take.

CSI Miami does that sometimes - they get the sky to be deep red or black. I also saw a wonderful landscape shot of the Blue Mountains with very dark blue/ almost black skies. It looked fabulous.

So you used stacked filters eh?

With the 14-24 it also has a lens hood so I could potentially put it up against the hood. I think though I am likely to shoot with the 24-70 F2.8 more often.

I also like to shoot mosaic panoramas with several rows of images. Because I shoot these in manual mode, exposure is locked and I think a filter would be good to introduce during the rows that shoot the sky.

I have seen that dark cloud effect you mentioned.

Have you ever used variable circular ND filters?

I read an article yesterday about stacking 2 polarisers. You spin them and they will black out the view at some point. Although I am not sure if it affects colour as when it blacked out it was really a deep blue. I'll have to test that as its very convenient to simply stack 2 polarisers on your lens and spin them against each other.

Do you have a website for your images?

Cheers,

Greg.

[White Rabbit]

Hi Mike.

I have the Conkin z pro series with my 5d MKII and 24-105 , I found the vignetting to be an issue as well. If you look at the bracket that holds the filters there are two slots so you can use two filters at the same time, you can screw one of them off and they no longer obstruct the view, of course this doesn't help if you want to se two at the same time though.

[troypiggo]

I cry every time H posts a photo. Not sure if it's from the joy, or the realisation I'll never be able to achieve it.

[Poita]

That is why I use the Matte Box, I am used to them from cine work anyway, and it is so easy to swap filters in and out, and lets you use big buggers.

Same reason I use a filter drawer on the scope.

[Poita]

There is also a Lee holder
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/693472-REG/LEE_Filters_KIT_SW150_SW150_Filter_ Holder_Kit.html
http://youtu.be/fMX5p9Iwx3Y

and a Hitech one:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/834371-REG/Hitech_HTLNWAH_165mm_Lucroit_Wide_A ngle.html

or you can make your own.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/13847280@N03/2655841619/
http://www.amateurphotographer.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?63793-Filters-on-a-Nikon-14-24mm-lens&p=713499

[gregbradley]

Thanks for those links Peter.

I may end up getting one. Although the 14-24 is probably going to be doing night time lapse shooting on a Nikon D800. Or even my 40D. I have the Novoflex adapter and it works great to fit this lens on a Canon body.

Greg.

[iceman]

I can't find any AU store on ebay with Lee filters.

There seems to be a few in the UK, but they only have the hard ND. I'd prefer the grad ND.

Where else can I get them from?

[iceman]

Found robertwhite.co.uk and did some online shopping. Haven't bought yet as was floored by the price.

For:
- 77mm adapter ring
- Digital SLR starter kit (contains the filter holder, 0.6 hard grad, 0.6 ND)
- 0.9 hard grad
- 0.9 ND
- postage

It'll cost me around $620.

Anywhere cheaper? :)

[gregbradley]

I don't know about their prices and what they stock but Mainline Photographics at Crows Nest definitely had a large stock of these square glass filters and holder.

Greg.

[Octane]

Hi Mike,

Yeah, unfortunately, none of this stuff is cheap.

In the meantime, you can continue to exposure blend!

Greg, I'll send you an email, re: site.

Troy, you are far too kind. As said previously, you've got the gear and the skill, you can make pretty pictures with intent, too! :)

H

[troypiggo]

I got most of my Lee filters from US (Adorama) after a loooooong waiting list for them to come in stock. The one exception was the Big Stopper, which I got from Vanbar Imaging in Victoria. Bit more expensive, but at the time they were the only ones to have them in stock in the world from what I could tell. Might try them?

The prices you list don't seem unreasonable for what you're purchasing/investing.

[iceman]

Yeh I know, it all adds up.. :)

[troypiggo]

Why don't you do the opposite of what I did, ie just start with one or 2 filters? ie just get the lens adapter, filter holder, a 3 stop hard and a 2 stop soft, or something like that? Or 3 stop hard and 3 stop ND?

[iceman]

Yeh I might. I think I'd prefer the soft grad over the hard grad though. Why do you prefer hard?

[troypiggo]

Just that I've only used them for landscapes with a relatively flat horizon so far. That's all. If I understand correctly, if you hand-hold a hard grad, while the shutter is open for longer exposures, you can feather (H uses the term dither above I think) the filter to soften the edge anyway.
Tried to find a youtube clip that showed the technique but can't find it at the moment.

H would be better at recommending the first one or 2 to get. The above is just based on my preferences. But if you're shooting different things, the advice would be different.

[Octane]

The 3-stop is the most universal (and, also toughest) to use.

I'd get a hard-step for the reason Troy mentioned above; you can always dither the filter. However, if you're set on using a holder, then, get the soft-step filter for starters.

Using filters is joy and getting it right in-camera first up makes you swell with pride. :)

H

[Omaroo]

I've witnessed this phenomenon first hand. It's bloody dangerous to all around. Humayun gets out his filters....run. :D

[pin3appl3]

Ok I thought I would add my two cents here...

Firstly my mate had diffculty finding Lee filters, he ended up going with a UK or USA company and it took like 2 months or more for them to get over there.

I saved enough money and had a look myself:

http://www.mediavision.com.au/

I think the digital starter pack (holder kit, adapter ring, Hard Grad and ND) cost me $443.85 AUD Delivered. Service was great and it took like 3 days for delivery (waited about 2 weeks for them to get stock) to Brisbane.

Ive been playing around so far with the Lee filters and they seem great so far...dont screw around with the colour etc.

One thing H... I know Ill eventually want to hand hold and dither with the Hard Grad... but how to you ensure there is no space between the front element and the filter whilst not bumping or moving the lens? Just practice holding your breath and work on the dexterity? haha

Say for example I was using my 24-70 @ 24mm as its reversed glass elements make it zoomed out @ 24 I keep doing my head in thinking I will push the lens back in thus adjusting the photo compostion? Does solving this problem just come with exp and practice because thats basically all I can conclude I just thought you might have some sneaky tips haha

Anyway hope the above link helps :)

Cheers

[troypiggo]

All this talk about hard/soft, and H swelling... I'd be running too.

[Octane]

lol, you guys. :P

Darcy, I have a very, very sturdy tripod with a big head (shush, Troy!).

It really doesn't take all that much of a push back against the lens.And, in actuality, what I'm doing is sitting the filter flush upagainst the lens just prior to taking the exposure. One of my filtershas curved slightly from sitting in my bag pushed upa gainst otherequpiment, and, even then, I still don't rock the camera when exposing.

You just have to be gentle. If you have a solid tripod with a solidhead, dithering the filter across the front of the lens will/should belike brushing a tissue past the lens. It shouldn't move at all.

Give it a go!

H

[gregbradley]

Another thing worth a look is doing similar in software.

Topaz Labs - lens effects has a free trial. One of presets is ND filters.

Its not the same as filtering the data as it goes into the camera but you can emulate these effects.

Its worth a look. Its certainly cheaper at US$79.99 (about AUD$75).

Greg.

[Octane]

Or, you could just use the gradient tool in Photoshop with a little customising, for free! :)

Getting it right in-camera first time is way different to fixing stuff in post.

Once you get your shiny new camera, you'll see. :)

H

[gregbradley]

Yeah I figured that. Same with astrophotography. Shadows/highlights tool can recover some blown highlights but its really quite limited otherwise we'd all be doing 10 minute M42 exposures with core details.

Greg.

[iceman]

Is it worth getting the "ProGlass ND (http://www.leefilters.com/index.php/camera-directory/camera-dir-list/category/proglass-neutral-density-standards)" filters from Lee, or the standard (http://www.leefilters.com/index.php/camera-directory/camera-dir-list/category/neutral-density-standards)ND's (resin)?

The graduated ND's (http://www.leefilters.com/index.php/camera-directory) are resin anyway, so I wonder how much difference the ProGlass would make anyway..

MediaVision have stock. I'll be getting some from them shortly.

I can't afford to get a circular polariser yet.. that'll have to wait a little longer.

I'll probably just start easy and get the:
- 77mm Wide Angle Adaptor Ring
- Digital SLR Starter Kit (contains the filter holder, 0.6 hard grad, 0.6 ND)
for now.

I can add 0.9's and CP's on later.

[Octane]

I use resin filters. It's plenty good.

H

[iceman]

The CP is $429! Ouch!

[Octane]

You get what you pay for.

Go the Hoya Pro1D one. It's plenty good.

H

[iceman]

Ok so I'm getting:

- 77mm wide angle adapter ring
- Foundation Kit
- 0.9 soft graduated ND
- 0.9 standard ND resin
- cleaning kit
- 10 filter pouch

Next will be:
- 82mm wide angle adapter (for when I can afford to get the 16-35).
- 0.6's of the above (maybe)
- 10 stop ND (maybe)
- Circular Polariser

and of course the 430 ex II external flash, and.. and.. Never ends!

Thanks everyone for your help and advice in this thread. I've learnt a lot!

[troypiggo]

Mike, got an idea for you. Wanna borrow my filters to give you an idea of what you like better in terms of hard vs soft, and 2 stops vs 3 etc? I think you'll like the 3 stop hard more than the soft, but best to test? I can do without them for a few weeks.

[iceman]

That's a lovely offer, thanks Troy.

I'll PM you.

[gregbradley]

What sort of improvement in performance do you see H? I have 2 circular polarisers and both seem much the same. They weren't that expensive though, more like about $40 or so.

Greg.

[iceman]

While we're on the subject of filters, do you guys still use UV filters on the front of the lens?

Do you use it for any sort of noticeable effect, or really just to protect the glass?

Again though, how much is quality degraded when you have a $40 piece of glass in front of a $1000 lens.

[Octane]

Using UV filters on the front of lenses is the biggest con, ever.

You're effectively adding another layer of glass to however many layers of glass are already in the lens. It's another cause for internal reflections. Most of them are cheap pieces of junk to begin with.

Don't worry about getting your lenses dirty. They can be wiped clean. I've had my L-series lenses out at the beach, under thundering waterfalls, deep in forests, and they've managed to survive without a scratch. You just have to be sensible. The lenses were meant to be used. Don't let a cheap filter adversely affect your images. Never used one, never will.

If you're really concerned, just leave a good quality polariser on the front -- at least a polariser makes a visible difference to your images. I don't use them for people photography.

Greg, I can't comment on cheap polarisers as I've never used them. I've always felt that I have good gear, and, it should be treated with good accessories. It does not make sense to me to skimp out on accessories when I've already spent thousands on the rest of the kit.

The Hoya Pro1D is multicoated, to reduce reflections, and has a slight warming effect which I like. It means I don't need to add saturation in post. I let it all be done in camera. :)

These are just things that work for /me/. Other people's mileage may vary.

H

[troypiggo]

I bought UV filters for all of my lenses when I first got DSLRs. Shortly afterwards I did some testing with and without, and much preferred the images without. No I never use UV filters, but always use a hood. Only exception is for macro, and of course you can't use a hood with the GND filter kit on the front of lens.

I'm very careful with the glass, keep it regularly cleaned free of grit and marks. The hood offers protection, better contrast, and protection from flares just out of frame.

[Octane]

+1 to what Troy said.

H

[troypiggo]

+1 to what H said.

T

[Steffen]

+1 to what H and T said ;)

I'm also a strong advocate of using filters for filtering, not for protection. Lens hoods are much better at protecting the front of the lens.

Cheers
Steffen.

[iceman]

Hi all

An update after my first sunrise shoot after receiving my Lee filters.

1. I took off the UV filter.
2. The lens hood doesn't fit with the filter holder so can't use the 'use the lens hood to protect the lens' line :)
3. Using filters is harder than I thought! :)

I did order my own Lee WA adapter ring, fundamentals kit (the holder) and a 0.6 standard ND, and Troy was kind enough to loan me his Lee filters so I could test out the soft grad vs hard grad.

It was a very clear morning yesterday, not a cloud in the sky and I was out at the beach so it was the usual very trying/difficult conditions trying to get the exposure right with a darker foreground and sky that gets light very quickly around a 'dome' where the sun is going to rise.

I tried the combination of 0.6 SND and 0.9 HND, and the HND (and even the 0.9) are much harder to use than the Soft.

When the light can change within minutes, it can be frustrating trying to 'see' where to put the HND on the horizon - too high and it's ruined, too low and it can look weird.

I also sometimes found myself composing the shot to take effect of the HND instead of the other way around. The 0.9 was also quite difficult to get the exposure right at times.

The 0.6 soft was a lot easier, as it wasn't as essential where it was placed. But it also didn't have as big as an effect - and in those pre-dawn conditions sometimes the 0.6 SND wasn't enough.

I tried both of them at once too and seemed to work ok but once I process the photos will probably find the sky is too dark and unnatural looking when the Sun was just over the horizon.

So, conclusions:
1. SND is easier, but may not have enough of the desired effect at times
2. 0.9 is harder than 0.6
3. I can see why 'hand holding' and 'dithering' may be useful - would allow you to concentrate on composing the shot and not get distracted by where the HND is sitting.
4. More practise is needed!!

Suggestions or comments?

[gregbradley]

I made a variable filter by simply fitting 2 polarisers on top of each other. Rotate one and they vary to almost black (mine goes a dark blue at the extreme end).

I have only done this once on a daytime shot of a fast moving stream to create motion blur.

The image looked fine on the viewfinder. I'll process it and see how it turned out.

I also ordered a cheapie variable nd filter. Not sure if vignetting is an issue with full frame. I am using a 40D for now.

Greg.

[troypiggo]

G'day Mike. I definitely compose the shot first, lock the camera/tripod in position and manually focused, then slide the filter down. I don't use LiveView very often, usually do it by eye. But last time I did use LV and it did seem to help with where to position the filter graduation on the horizon. That seems to be the trickiest part, but I think you're better off erring on it being to high than too low. Just because I don't like seeing that dark band on the horizon, makes the use of the filter obvious. Guess you could dodge it out or something, but better to get it right first.

Don't ask me about mountainous horizons. I've only used them on seascape/level horizons mostly so far, just getting used to that. That's why I've kept it simple. :) Definitely be using the soft grad on horizons that are uneven I think.

[Octane]

LiveView Exposure Simulation is mans best friend.

H

[RickS]

I just ordered a bunch of Lee gear including adapter ring, foundation kit, soft and hard ND grad kits and a (non Lee) 10 stop ND filter from these guys in the UK: http://www.studiokitdirect.com. They had everything in stock and shipped the same day. Their pricing looks very competitive too.

Cheers,
Rick.

[troypiggo]

How's the filter shooting going, Mike?

[iceman]

I've had one other session using them since my post above and had better results. Still takes some getting used to though.

More sessions required.

I'll have to send yours back soon - I don't want you to be without them when you need them.

[RickS]

How Lee filters are made:
http://diyphotography.net/how-lee-filters-are-made

After watching the video you'll understand why there are sometimes long lead times on these items!

Cheers,
Rick.