The 2012 Hoaxes

[jjjnettie]

I don't know about the rest of you, but nearly every day I get people messaging me, asking about the 2012 doomsday predictions.
Including one phone call from a friends 10yr old son who saw a video on YouTube and thought that he was going to die. :( He was so distressed, the poor lad.
Most are just ordinary folk, trying not to get sucked into yet another conspiracy theory. (Though some are trolls, trying to fire me up.)
So instead of writing the same thing over and over again, I'd like to make a collection of links that I can refer people to.
Here's a couple that I have so far.
If anyone has any others I'd love to be able to share them.

A video from David Morrison from NASA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=l4VuAeUO6yI

FAQ from NASA
http://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/2012.html

[ballaratdragons]

Yeah, not good JJ.

I had a Dad ring me about a month ago saying his 8 y.o. son was having panic attacks worrying about what he saw on You Tube and other places on the net about the end of the world in Dec 2012.
He wanted confirmation that we aren't about to die so he could tell his son all is well.

It will get worse as we get closer to December!

[TrevorW]

Bugger :sadeyes: and I was planning an invitation only ($20000 a head) "End of the Earth" party :rockband: :drink: for this December, got any predictions :bowdown:when it will be good to go with this.:shrug::help::question:



Cheers all :D

[Forgey]

The world is not going to end in 2012, i know this because (see image)

[erick]

The NASA FAQ is good. I use that when I have to.

[renormalised]

I'm in an unique position, having degrees in both geology and astronomy, apart from practical experience in both fields as well. Yet, despite all the reassurances I give and can give people about 2012 and all the nonsense that goes on about this, for some you just cannot convince them of otherwise, once they've got the idea in their heads that everything is going to go to pot on December 21. They've literally talked and scared themselves into a psychological fugue state that they don't seem to be able to come out of. This is only going to get worse as the time approaches. Young, impressionable kids and teenagers are going to be some of the most affected. I think despite our best efforts a lot of people are going to go over the edge and there'll be quite a few suicides and what not happening. I only hope some of the idiots promoting this trash are satisfied then with what they've done because quite frankly I would lock them up in psychiatric institutions for the criminally insane.

[koputai]

I've never had to try to convince anyone on anything like this, I don't have friends that stupid.

I find it amazing that people like this are allowed to vote and procreate.

Cheers,
Jason.

[Baddad]

And they hold a driver's licence. :eyepop:

[dj gravelrash]

im with jase:rofl:

[Barrykgerdes]

Get used to it.

The simple minded are the ones who respond best to media advertising and buy all the junk! Why do you think Pollies do so many aparently odd things. It gets the votes from the suckers!:shrug:

Barry:lol::thumbsup:

[Shark Bait]

December 21st? I did not know that someone had provided a date. Any chance that they might postpone? A few more days will be enough, otherwise I will miss out on my 40th. At least I won't have to worry about having a mid-life crisis :P.

It is interesting that normally rational people can get dragged into this type of thinking.

Recently a planet or comet was meant to collide with the Earth, I cannot remember its name. One otherwise intelligent person was trying to convince me of its reality and I tried to point out that if it were true anyone with a telescope would be able to look at it. They weren't because it did not exist. Next time I saw him, I gave him some astronomy magazines that had articles about events that could take place to create problems on a worldwide scale. Without being patronizing, it was my attempt to replace myth with reality.

I am sure it has been covered before, but these queries seem to surface at the public observing sessions. The only time I have not been willing to turn a conversation around was when a young bloke asked how far away a star was. I told him that the light had taken 'x' number of years to reach us. He then informed me that the data was wrong and the Universe was only 6000 years old. If he was so sure why ask?

Each to their own but sometimes there is little to gain by debating the evidence.

[leon]

Hmmm, very interesting, maybe a tidy up of this Planet wouldn't be so bad. :shrug: it's going to rack and ruin anyway with so many idiots around. :sadeyes:

Nothing like a fresh start.;)

Leon :thumbsup:

[Stardrifter_WA]

As long as yor not one of the things being tidied up, right? :D:P

[leon]

Anything for a good cause, LOL.

Leon

[Stardrifter_WA]

Not me Leon, I am going out screamin' and kickin' :D:P

[FlashDrive]

I can just see it .... all the dooms day prophet's ... at 23.59 and 45sec's to midnight ( on the 20th Dec' 2012 )

then as 00.00.00 ticks over

wait for it .... wait for it ... wait for it ... wait for it ... :eyepop:
oh ... !!!! why are we still here.

Flash :screwy:

[Stardrifter_WA]

Just like Y2K, hey? Nothin' happened! :D

[Kevnool]

Yep the doomsayers are all over this.
I dare say there will even be a party at stonehenge.

Cheers

[Baddad]

:thumbsup:

A friend of mine was groomed as a staunch Catholic by his parents. As he progressed through school. He excelled in science. Gave away the religion. He had an intense enquiring mind. He also enjoyed a debate.:)

Often on weekends people promoting their church knocked on his door. He would keep them debating for hours. I am like you Stu, I wont tolerate those type. Yet Joe, thrived on arguing with these door-knockers. I am sure he liked to shred the elements supporting their arguments.

He enjoyed reporting the results to me.:D

[jjjnettie]

That's nice.

But I don't consider my friends 10yr old son "stupid" for getting worried about what he saw on YouTube. Kids his age tend to believe anything they see on the Internet. The fact that he rang me up to ask if it was true, to me is a sign of his intelligence.


I'm guessing you don't do much Astronomy Outreach.
I'm fortunate enough to be able to do so on quite a large scale. I get a lot of personal satisfaction from doing it.
This year there are going to be more and more people looking for the truth behind these hoaxes.
I find that people are more willing to ask questions if you don't make them feel that they are stupid for asking them.
One should never deny a curious mind the answers they are looking for.

[jenchris]

Churchill said much the same thing.

I'm selling insurance for pets at the moment - for $10,000 I'll come and pick up your pets and look after them for the rest of their lives after you die

[mithrandir]

The difference being there was truth in Y2K having the potential to cause computer grief.

We had to start making provision for it by 1985 so that files we legally had to retain for 14 years didn't get deleted by expiry dates wrapping to 1900 and getting automatically cleaned up.

Nothing significant happened because lots of attention had been applied to the potential problems.

[ballaratdragons]

I totally agree JJ.

It is quite negative of Jason and Dino to have that attitude.

As I am the contact 'by phone' for the SVAA I get quite a few calls about 'end-of-times' reports that the irresponsible media and conspiracy groups scare people with.
I believe it is very responsible of misled people to call someone to double check instead of running around telling everyone else that the world is going to blow up.
I was quite happy that the 8 year old's dad cared enough about his son to check, and put his very scared son at ease.

I don't mind the approx 50 calls I get every time the story goes around that Mars will appear as big as the Moon.
I don't mind when I get calls and visitors asking if the Asteroid is really going to hit the Earth.

They are great opportunites to Outreach Astronomy.
It also shows that people want to know about 'out there'.

Stupid? No, they are the smart ones.
It would be nice if far more people would question these false predictions. Then the Predictors may have to be more accountable for their claims. Not just blindly believed by the masses.

[koputai]

Children, fair enough, but any adult that hears stories about the world ending on a particular date who doesn't dismiss it out of hand, is a sandwich short of a picnic.

Physical phenomena like the apparent size of objects, these are fair game, and non-scientific people wanting more info is fine, to be encouraged even, but once again, end of the world stories, see above.

Cheers,
Jason.

[desler]

I keep telling my kids, the only stupid question is the one not asked!

It's how I learnt, I kept asking.......
These doom day things will come and go, just like pyramad money making scams. Also, the Nigerian lotto comes to mind, will go on and on.

Why? because the people that need to ask questions are too frightened!

I'd be still trying to take digital quickies through a 4 inch camera store reflector if I hadn't asked questions. The truth really is out there! If only you'd bothered to ask!

My 2 cents worth from an overworked and very tired mind!

Daz

[bartman]

Chris, do you need somebody to help with the waste disposal side of things?
I can help there.... for a cut that is.....
:D
Bartman

[Vartigy]

Or you could turn the issue on a flipside to all the doomsayers.

Well. Being in Aus, we'll be one of the first few countries to fade into existence. I'd hate to be the US as they'll have to watch us burn on TV 12 hours behind and sit there twiddling their thumbs in anticipation of their burning.

I mean... that's how time works doesn't it? :P

[John0z]

You know, it is hard for the average person to know what is going to happen tomorrow, let alone in 11 months time. One day, it is smooth sailing, and the next - have to evacuate because the ship is sinking. Most people now are just having enough trouble surviving. Ok - I am digressing.

What I want to say is that there are people who have time on their hands. If they get it into their heads that something is going to happen, it is very hard to convince them otherwise. There are others who will believe it so much that they will try to make it happen, i.e. the world is going to end anyway, so why do they go to work... Extremist groups might even help it along, i.e. fighting, warfare - and then there is the other side who will use this to their advantage, often criminal elements.

I remember a part in a movie where these guys had to fly to an asteroid, drill some holes and blow it up with nuclear weapons - one particular guy borrowed a lot of money to blow it on a night with the girls - imagine his disappointment when he finds out that he gets to come back and have to pay all that money back!

[FlashDrive]

Burn ...????? ... Where did you get that idea from ..... Is that how we're all going out ....is it ...????

What makes you say we're gonna " burn " :eyepop:
Do you know something the rest of us don't .. ?? .

Oh .. pray tell us would you ... :D

Flash :rolleyes:

[AstralTraveller]

I agree with the thrust of what Jeanette and Ken said but I've found that sometime you just have to cut your losses. Sometimes it's because the person is a lost cause but mostly just because they want to dominate your time while others are getting impatient and walking away. It's especially disappointing when it's kid walking away dissatisfied.

I think my least favourite is the 'how much does that cost' or 'what should I buy' when I have twigged that they will never actually buy a scope or get into the hobby. Too often I've told people that you can get a decent scope for $300-400 only for them to reply to the effect 'that much?' or 'wow, I didn't know it was that expensive'. :screwy: I feel like telling them to take up golf. :P

[jjjnettie]

I'm not interested in trying to convert the nutters. I make that quite clear in my profile where I stand and who I will respond to. No trolls or time wasters thanks.
I only deal with people who show a genuine interest in learning the truth behind such things.

[Baddad]

Hi jjj,:)
Conversely the nutters are often trying to convert you.:eyepop:
They want your respect. They try to appear "all-knowing" and gain control.
Afflicted with self denial they are blinded in the march to their goal.:shrug:

They do not learn from failed attempts. Failure just makes them drive harder. :mad2: It is sad. We simply need to accept it and move on. Enjoy our past time.:thumbsup::)

Cheers:)

[jjjnettie]

They can spout all the pseudo science they like.
LOL they have buckleys chance.

[Baddad]

The following was in a documentary on Foxtell recently.
Reversal of the Earth's magnetic field became the subject.
I apologise for the lack of accurate detail. I think they mentioned that polar reversal occurred about every 200,000 years. (Other sources say 100,000 to 50 million years and 50,000 years had been recorded.)

The issue was that when reversal did occur the protective shield would be severely compromised. All life would be threatened and blasted by radiation. Mass extinctions would result.

The last time it happened is long enough to it being due now.
The affects of geomagnetic reversal that the doco explains is not consistant with info from other sources.
In the documentary it suggested doom and gloom and that the transtion was rapid. Yet other info is very different.

Perhaps its a lead up to 21/12/12 :lol:
It is misleading to the audience. It promotes the sensationalism that these "friends" of jjj are trying to sponsor.:lol:

I think the title of the doco is "How The Earth Was Formed".
Much of the explanations were over-dramatized but interesting.

(Oops, apologies to jjj- Re 'friends'. It was intended as sarcasm):lol:

[jenchris]

Well I think that laying a bet with them would be a good idea - it's a win win - if the end of the world comes, they win and you pay nothing -
if it doesn't, you win and receive the tote.

[AstralTraveller]

Yes Marty, it's very unfortunate when a 'documentary' contains such gross errors. I think docos are overwhelmingly accurate and so it would be easy for errors like this to be believed, even by people who think rather than blindly accept. I've been caught out before now, normally much to my embarrassment. :(

In this case the British Geological Survey says: Is there any danger to life? Almost certainly not.

BTW Although the science in docos is generally good I sometimes grin at the portrayal of how science is conducted. For example, Dr TV Archaeologist drops off a piece of bone for carbon dating and returns the next afternoon to get the result. Not physically possible! But receiving an email three months later just doesn't make a good show. Also, all material is able to be dated and all dates make sense. :rofl: In your dreams.

[mithrandir]

Last night on SBS they repeated "Judgement Day: Intelligent Design On Trial Ep2". At the end ID apologists were still saying Darwin and evolution were wrong, and some had sent death threats to the judge who ruled against them.

How to the sane move on when the nutters are threatening violence?

[ballaratdragons]

I'm not too sure about the geomagnetic reversal bit (I know the Sun does it), but I have never doubted that Earth has had a Polar Shift a gazillion years ago. At least there is reliable evidence of that :thumbsup:

I looked at some Conspiracy websites last night. I needed a good laugh :P

[renormalised]

Yep Ken, the Earth's magnetic fields do shift.....the period of the shifts isn't a set number of years, but there appears to be, from the rock records, a series of shifts which occur....some on a 50000-75000 year timescale, others on timescales up to a million years in length (but usually around 675000-750000 years). Our atmosphere is more than thick enough to protect the life on the surface of the planet, but I wouldn't be too happy for electronics and the electricity grid. Navigation would be a problem especially when you can have up to a dozen or more weak magnetic poles present when the field is down to the minimum. Travel to space, unless you had good shielding, would be hazardous and satellites would be in trouble. Could even be some climate changes occurring (increase in aerosols and such due to more radiation being allowed to enter the upper atmosphere, changes in condensation nuclei size, shape, composition and longevity etc etc etc) because of the flip, but nothing that would mean imminent disaster.

[John0z]

Regarding pole reversal, there are lots of numbers involved and it can be difficult to determine what the numbers actually mean. For instance, http://earthsci.org/education/teacher/basicgeol/platec/platec.html this article on plate tectonics also talks about paleomagnetism, then further down under Sea Floor Spreading there is a diagram that shows that the current magnetic polarity has been like this for 300,000 years and the last time it was the opposite occurred 750,000 years ago - but stayed like that for 350,000 years. So if we look at 2.3 million years and take the number of polarity shifts in that time, we can come up with an average of around 300,000 years give or take. If our current polarity has been like this for 300,000 years - it just means that a reversal in the future is very likely. Current evidence suggests that this reversal is very unlikely to occur on a particular day, but more likely over a period of hundreds or thousands of years.

Now, what is more interesting is this article from ASNSW http://www.asnsw.com/universe/alternate/AU10/polarissima.asp that suggests that gamma ray bursts from Polarissima Australis in Octans coincides with our magnetic polarity reversals.

Most people say that magnetic pole reversal should not affect life as we know it, but what about the side effects?

[ballaratdragons]

The Pole Shift I am referring to is when the Earth tips over and the 'old' Poles are now at the Equator (or some other place other than where they were), and the old Equator is now the North and South Poles.

Like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-l0SC3bRLn8

[renormalised]

Crustal Displacement.....yes it does happen and has happened in the past to several of the terrestrial planets and the Moon. It's a slow process...takes millions of years. Unlike Plate Tectonics, crustal displacement occurs when the crust and the mantle rotate with respect to the core of the planet, as a whole. It's basically the planets balancing out their centres of mass created by instabilities due to uneven mass distribution, which in Earth's case can be caused by the continents clustering more to one side of the axis of rotation than the other.