10 Sure Ways How NOT to Sell me an item on IIS

[Allan_L]

1. Assume that having an item stored in your garage unused for 10 years retains it attractiveness:
" I bought this beauty 10 years ago, and have only used it twice"

2. Never allow negotiation:
"Price is $xxx FIRM I won't take less so don't bother"

3. Never illustrate:
"You know what it looks like so I won't post pics"

4. Assume everyone is as nerdy as we are:
" For Sale an ABC with XYZ on an E10 with MCL"

5. Pretend to be a professional sales house:
"Today, folks, we have for sale, ...."

6. Try to make as much as you can, without committing to sell:
"Looking for Expressions of Interest on ..."
(But this is OK when trying to put together a group buy, of course)

7. Make payment difficult:
"I don't like PayPal and I don't disclose my banking details..."

8. Expect to get what you paid for an item, without researching what it sells for in shops today:
"I paid $11,999 for this CPC1100 3 years ago, but I will let it go today for $9,999)
[These currently sell for around $3,999. I use this example because I have one.]

9. Ignore the fact that the Store you bought it from paid 10% of the proceeds to the Government as GST; and that they offered a Warranty (which is not transferrable) and that the item was guaranteed free from fault, blemish, dust, and comes with appropriate packaging, and user instructions:
" Bought recently for $1,000 selling for a bargain $999"

10. Let people know you are not a regular here:
"I don't come here often so don't bother leaving me any messages here - call me"

OK, as I said this is just some stuff that turns me off.
I am not telling anyone how to do it, but as a seller too, i reckon people should be open to what buyers think.

Any offence is unintended.

[supernova1965]

Hey Allen

Love the list and the big one from it for me is #7 I wanted an item from a member but said member just made it impossible for me to pay them in the end I bought new:screwy: but other than that one #1,2,3,6 and 10 really hit the mark of my bothersome points when looking at the for sale section.

[PCH]

Well, I thought they were very humorous and quite true too. A great list of suggestions.

It is OK to point out valid objections as Steve has done, and whilst the individual objections themselves can't be flawed, the point being made here is simply that to sell an item quickly and easily, avoid doing these things that make it difficult for a prospective purchaser.

Sure, if you want your sale to be long and drawn out and possibly not happen at all, you can include some or all of the "don't do's", and you haven't done anything wrong as such, - you just may not sell your item.

But to be fair Allan, your own recent piano advert in "Non Astronomy" informs us you're - "Gone for a few weeks so I'll answer when I get back" :eyepop: ;)

[rider]

"Looking for expressions of interest"
is derived from the Swahili
"wala kununua bidhaa hiia"

which means:

Don't buy this product.

[Allan_L]

LOL :rofl:
Good One.
I thought I was clean, but I did forget about that one.

But in my defence:
1. No one enquired so no response was necessitated, and
2. I did NOT want to sell it, my wife pressured me into listing it, so I was in fact following my own instructions on how to list something that would not sell

But good pick up anyway.
I congratulate you on your research. (you remind me of me ! ) :lol::thumbsup:

[leon]

Yea your pretty well on target Allan.

However No 3 could depend on the Item, if your selling Canon L Glass you don't need to have photos showing what it looks like, the ones after this glass just know.

If it got to 7, I would just tell em to piss off, and forget about it.

Leon :thumbsup:

[astronut]

But the other side of the coin is..... the time wasters.
I recently had a scope up for sale....two time wasters, I went out of my way to help them, over a number of days. One just pulled out after many emails, the other didn't have the decency (after many days of changing my schedule to allow him time to come to my place) to say he longer wanted it.
The third is a serial pest, twice in one year in trying sell the scope, I was told that he wanted it straight away, so could I give him my bank details, so he could pay me.
Both times he pulled out, saying he had a better deal elsewhere. My scope is not of recent manufacture, it's over 40 years old. So all I can gather is that he wanted it, but not at my price....too bad!!
So Allan, as you can see there are two sides to the story.....

[Allan_L]

I did ! (although not quite in those words):

"Oh! You do not have PayPal and do not disclose your banking details.
Well that is your choice of course.
But I do not deal in Postal Orders!
So : Offer withdrawn"

[Zaps]

That's a great list!

One thing that always has me scratching my head is when a seller says something like "make an offer" then later complains about the "ridiculously" low offers they received. Buyer goes high, seller goes low, right?

[Gem]

Agree with most, especially #4 and #6.

One bizarre thing though, you need to be a little patient with people who are recently returned to astronomy... some things have stayed similar in price, while somethings are now really cheap! Someone might not realise that what held its price well from 1960-2000 is suddenly a fifth of the price when bought new!!

Definitely need more people to add simple words like "camera" or "telescope" next to xyz!! Some of us know the constellations well but not the brand names... :)

[stephenb]

Thank you Allan, I nice list of observations of the classifields. I take your points in good humour.

I must admit, I've been guilty of #1. "scope/camera/lens is a regretable sale/much cared for/only used once/never traveled etc etc." - whatever the exact wording used. I believe when you read statements similar to this, the seller is trying to represent a well cared for items in good faith.

All in all, I think that most sellers here post with good intentions, in the end the seller has the right to sell as long as they abide by the TOS, and a buyer has the right to either buy or not to buy.

Regards,
Stephen

[Terry B]

I agree with the list except for 2.
I would rather state a price. It isn't suppose to be an auction. Under the TOS you are suppose to sell to the first respondent. If someone offers more should you can the first person?
Hard to figure

[Rob_K]

Good one Allan! :thumbsup: What I want to know is, where do all the battered and much-loved telescopes, cameras and accessories go to die? Obviously not IIS, nearly everything is in absolutely pristine, barely-used condition, still with original boxes! :lol:

Another annoying one which appears occasionally:
"... bought off another IIS member 3 years ago, immaculate condition, you'd pay $1200 dollars for this new, just $995..."

= 3rd hand at least by the time you get it, of doubtful provenance & age! :P

Ah well, caveat emptor .... :)

Cheers -

[Hagar]

Good for you Allan. Sounds like a whole bucket full of self opinionated crap.

[Bassnut]

Ditto :shrug:

[asimov]

Sorry, but I'd still want a picture of that Canon L glass before forking over my money...Refer to one of Robs comments for the reasoning.

[M_Lewis]

Glad someone said it, cause I was thinking the exact same thing

[FlashDrive]

Boy's please ....!! :lol:
Oh dear ... what now .... !!!!! :face: :mad:

[The Mekon]

Someone must be feeling a little guilty. I reckon Allan is spot on in his assessment of some of the sellers on IIS.

[Hagar]

Do you really think so John. If I am selling something I reserve the right to advertise it for sale in any manner I see fit. Why should I listen to our new self opinionated sale moderator. While the rules are open and the item belongs to me I can and will sell it to whom ever and however I like. You as the buyer will make your own descision about a purchase.
Perhaps you haven't sold very much here and havent recieved rediculous offers for items advertised at a price, often a tenth of your advertised price but I am sure with time you will.

The last thing I need is this sort of crud advice from a sales expert. Ha Ha what a joke.

[cookie8]

Hey Moderators, could we have a sellers/buyers credit percentage system like eBay does? I buy and sell on this forum a fair bit and it appears the only thing to go with is the no. of post one posted, which is not a fair reflection of one's credibility.

[Octane]

Vincent,

This has been suggested before, but, the idea got knocked on the head. Can't remember why!

H

[iceman]

We'll probably move to a proper classifieds/sale system in the future which may have feedback etc.

To the haters in this thread, lighten up. I took it as light-hearted fun, not as gospel and "thou shalt sell this way".

No need to get narky.

[Hagar]

I am sorry you look at it this way Mike but why should I have to follow this blokes rules to sell him something. He has the same rights of refusal as I do as a seller. It's not light hearted fun, it's his dig at anyone who sells in a different manner to the way he does.

It is a sell this way if you want sell to me. Setting his rules for everyone to follow. To hell with that approach. All my goods are sold with photo's, price and detail and I doubt any purchasers are unhappy with their purchases.

[ballaratdragons]

The one that REALLY urks me is 'pull-out sellers'!

In a Mitsubishi Car Forum I am in, a long standing reputable member was advertising his 99% new Magna shockers at a really good price.
I posted that I will have them and willing to pay his price. I didn't try to talk him down, I was willing to pay his fair price. I needed them.
I sent him a PM and posted in the thread that I will buy them.

He PM'd me back and said that I was 1st and that they were mine. :thumbsup:

I PM'd him back asking how he would like me to pay for them. He didn't answer. :confused2:
After PM'ing him about every 2nd day, and posting in the thread for him to answer me, weeks had gone by!
Oh, he wasn't on holiday or whatever. He was still posting in other threads and selling other items off his car, and receiving thankyou posts from the buyers for his quick delivery of the items :shrug:

I placed him in the Sellers Feedback thread as a bad seller.
He then answered my PM! (this was almost 2 months later) saying that he had decided to keep the shockers. :mad2:
But he really didn't see that he needed to let me know. :mad2: :mad2:

To Sellers: If you advertise something for sale IT BETTER ACTUALLY BE FOR SALE.

[supernova1965]

It looks to me by your methods that you already follow most of the suggestions anyway and they were only suggestions not "RULES" photo's provided and good details I don't think the OP was aiming the list at you in this case.


I tried desperately to buy an item from one seller I offered Paypal but he had no account I thought thats fine not everyone has Paypal so I offered direct transfer no I don't give out Bank details even though I can't do anything except transfer funds into his account with the details I required.

I was expected to send a check/money order or cash which takes time instead of instantly arriving in sellers account I don't know about anyone else but average people don't have checks anymore and it costs me more to send money orders and sending cash is too risky.

The seller wants our money I didn't post a wanted add I was responding to an advertisement of goods for sale and was asked to jump through too many hoops. And then the goods were withdrawn:screwy:

[Hagar]

I do understand what you are saying Warren. With any trading type forum there will always be glitches which must be overcome.
I can honestly say I haven't bought an awfull lot from the forum but I have sold quite a bit of gear from the high end to the low end of pricing and as a general rule found people to be very honest and prepared to put money into my account which in todays climate is quite unusual.

I just find this set of rules or whatever you want to call them to be a very one sided view of a sale process with no regard for the seller, his goods or his end requirements. As I have said a purely self opinionated guide to selling on IIS.

Cheers
Doug

[Gem]

I understand people's concerns... but some "average" people still use cheques. Not everyone is completely electronic. I can see both sides on that issue.

[supernova1965]

A check book is considered an extra now and you have to pay to use them where as bank transfers are free. I can even do it from my home computer within minitues of agreeing to buy.

And Doug even if someone said they would transfer money and didn't you wouldn't send the goods until you had confirmed the money was in your account.

[Allan_L]

Sorry to have upset you Hagar.
But of course it is a very self opinionated list...As the title says, it is things that effect me when buying. It was never meant to be a do this or else. :)

But seriously, as a Seller, these are things I try to consider when listing an item, if possible.
And from responses it seems a few people think similarly.

But I am interested which one(s) you consider to be unfair to a seller?

Thanks,
and Again I am sorry if my politically incorrect humour offends anyone.

[FlashDrive]

Some time ago, I listed a small Apo Refractor here on IIS. One member practicality " begged " me to keep it for him ... even sent 2 messages to me... stating he would DEFINITELY come around and pick it up and pay for it. On the first day .... he didn't show .... on the 2nd day he said he would come over. .. guess what ...." a no show again " .... so I waited 1 more day... and never heard from him since ..... and to this day ... still haven't.

I still remember who he is ..... and he has logged on since that " time wasting" exercise he put me through.... I will ignore any messages he sends regarding any items I may have listed here. A complete idiot and time waster.

I am sure other IIS Members have dealt with this kind of individual to.

Anyway ... that's my gripe for the day .... I feel better now that I got this off my chest. :)
Seriously ... we don't need this people....!!:mad2:

[MortonH]

What annoys me is that I never have any money buy some of the fantastic equipment sold here... :violin:

...except for right now cos I just sold a bunch of stuff, and now I don't know what I want or can't find what I think I want! :shrug:

Morton

[Jules76]

One idea I've seen on another forum is that users have taken the initiative to post the username on their signature of people they have had "sucessfull trades" with. It's quite a good idea I think because those users can then act as references if need be to see if they are a good seller/buyer. Only downfall though is that you then rely on waiting to hear back from their "references" as opposed to an Ebay type system where you can read feedback straight away.

[GraemeT]

Might I add: "Don't know what you have for sale."
A seller offered just what I wanted, several emails went back and forth confirming that the item was as originally described, I drove 60km with cash in my pocket to find that the scope was nothing like the description. The seller had seen some words and decided that they looked good - they did - and he used them, not only in the ad but in the confirmation emails.

[GeoffW1]

Ummm well....... Deception Bay.......:rofl:

Sorry, sorry, could not resist

[FlashDrive]

Yeah .... :D Good one Geoff .... :P I'll pay that one .... ;) .... !!!

[stephenb]

Ive read it all now! That's the pot calling the kettle "sooty bum" isn't it? :lol:

[ballaratdragons]

:rofl:
unbelievable!

[Octane]

I think that is the finest example of ironic poetry in motion I've ever seen.

H

[PeterM]

Allan, I tips my hat to your humor. I love it and it is pretty well spot on.
But who really cares, we are all here to screw the best price when selling or buying, I do it and if anyone here reckons they don't....... bollocks!
PeterM.

[Screwdriverone]

LOL, yes, # its like getting 10,000 spoons, when all you bought was a knife.....#

Although, we all know that the only irony in that song is the fact she doesnt know a thing about irony.....:shrug:

Cheers

Chris

[ballaratdragons]

Not everyone!

I sold an item to an IIS member and they offered more than the price I asked.
They said I was asking too little.
I said no, but they still sent more when the deal was done.

Yeah, a rare incident, but this shows that it can happen. So Bollocks to you :lol:

[marki]

Not true Peter, I always buy for the advertised price (those I have purchased from will confirm that), if the price is unrealistic I give it a miss. Like wise I always state the price I want when selling and do not bargin. If the buyer does not like that tough luck go elsewhere.

Mark

[OICURMT]

I completely agree with your list...

HOWEVER, you've forced me into a corner & admit I'm going to have a serious dilemma on my hands...

If you read my signature, you'll know that I'm an owner of an LX90 I acquired in 2006, Brand new... opened ONCE to see that the optics survived transport to my house in Colorado and it has been in storage ever since (i.e. NO first light)...

So, when I get back to the USA in about 2015, I had planned on selling it to upgrade (geez, that makes sense... :screwy:) my ad will read...

"MINT CONDITION, BRAND SPANKING NEW 9 YR OLD MEADE 12" LX90 GPS with a HEAVY DUTY FIELD TRIPOD... NEVER USED..."


I can see the eyes around the world rolling around... :rolleyes:

OIC!

[JohnH]

Hmm...

I have sold items for the price of "donate what you think is fair to IIS" a couple of times and have seen other items go for "free to a good home" so I think you can keep your bollocks mate!:D

I have found the forums to be well behaved place as a buyer and as a seller, but juding from these posts I guess there must be a few rogues out there. it seems to be part of human nature whatever the endevour but they are the exception here, IISers are mostly harmless.

[PeterM]

Ok, I retract my bollocks.
We never get to see the "negotiating" pms (nor should we) but we sure read about some of them when sellers get upset.
Donating and giving away are not selling items and good on those who do. Allan's 10 are a jovial way of looking at human nature, when selling - many ask top dollar (often not taking into account one or a combination of Allan's list) or when buying - make a ridiculously low offer they may bite (its a pm offer so nobody here knows).
Either way your freedom of choice remains.
PeterM.

[plmedcraft]

I have never sold anything on this site that wasn't exactly as described.
I have never bought anything on this site that wasn't exactly as described.
My descriptions ere exactly what you describe in item 4 and so they should be, they are scientific instruments. If you don't know what it is it is not for you.
Try googling the description, it's not hard to find out.
Maybe I am grumpy today but I get peeved off by people who use Chinese cardboard scopes *****ing about people who are buying and selling high end scientific instruments.
If you can't work it out go back to the shallow end.

[allan gould]

Thats a handy ability Peter, especially when entering the fray.

[Logieberra]

I recently listed an EOI for used Borg accessories. Why? I had no clue of an appropriate used value. Going back to the early days of contract law, reach a bargain as you see fit. No need to list stuff to please everybody :)

[supernova1965]

Or when it is cold:P:rofl:

[irwjager]

:rofl:

Thanks for lightening the thread a little Allan :)

Seriously though. I've never had trouble with sellers here, but then again I try to only purchase from people I trust (e.g. frequent posters and proven enthusiast).

I'd rather buy a used scope from Doug that he says is in mint condition than a new one from eBay from some random guy.

The way an ad is written doesn't bother me that much. :)

[rat156]

Hi All,

Thanks for the thread.

I don't post here often, but... Oops.

I agree with all the reasons, hate them all, even though I'm guilty of them.

I also have real problems with people that take a nice thread (like this one) and get all nasty, because they don't agree with something that's said, and essentially get the thread shut down because they're cranky A$$holes.

Unfortunately they seem to be favorites of the mods, so they can do as they want with little chance of any consequences.

Signing off again for a while.

Cheers
Stuart

[plmedcraft]

Stuart, me thinks you are understating it a little...




As for cranky and A$$hole, yeah, fair cop.

[DavidU]

After two recent purchases from IIS members I can say that Dannat & Jeff65 are fantastic to deal with.Thanks.

[jjjnettie]

My dealings with Flashdrive and Hagar were trouble free!!

[FlashDrive]

My purchases from jjjnettie and unipol are without question.
All items as described .... fast postage from unipol and great " tea and bickies " from jjj .... awesome :D

[Logieberra]

My purchase from McDonalds this morning went well :)