"Flee Now, All is Discovered..."

[dugnsuz]

Hi all,
Well, they're onto us!!:lol:
Fed Gov't about to launch an enquiry into the viability of the $1000AU GST import threshold as some people have been getting around it!!:eyepop:

http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/8532830/online-buys-prompt-retail-inquiry/

:scared3:

[OzRob]

Actually it sounds like they are after businesses trying to get around it. This is highlighted by Myer and Harvey Norman stating that they are looking at setting up foriegn websites. IMO that is out of order and should be sorted out.

They need to have a look at eBay as well. I have bought things that were stated as being located in Australia only for them to arrive from Hong Kong. When I complained about it to the seller they stated that the samll print stated that if they did not have stock it would come directly from thier overseas supplier...yeah right pull the other one it plays Jiggle Bells.

[dugnsuz]

Luckily for me all of those $1k+ ebay overseas transactions have gone off with no problems and no warranty follow up problems - now that would be a headache - but, we know all that stuff going into the purchase. I scrutinize the fine print in any ebay purchase with a critical eye - and these guys 'help' the customer with any GST import issues by undervaluing the cost of the item on the customs documentation.

I've found these type of purchases to be nerve-wracking affairs.
Doug

[Waxing_Gibbous]

Apparently e-tailers will bring in $999 worth of something like trainers or iPods, in numerous (50-100) batches, avoiding duty and GST and then flog them on-line at a much cheaper price than a retailer can afford.
Fair enough, its legal and everybody should be able to make some scratch, but it obviously hurts locals who provide full service outlets.
I don't normally defend ratailers, but here they have a point.
A sensible option that will doubtless be passed over is to keep the threshhold, but apply it only to 'X' number of items per year, per individual, organisation or business. I know there are a number of ways around this but provisions could be made for those that abuse the process.
Just my thoughts.

[rmcconachy]

I believe the Australian Customs Service already has discretion to consolidate the value of multiple shipments to one person/company if they believe that the items have been split up purely to keep the individual shipments below the $1,000 limit. I have no idea how often and closely such discretion is used.

[dugnsuz]

Correct as I read it on the customs webpage...
http://www.customs.gov.au/site/page5549.asp

[snowyskiesau]

As far as I can recall, the $1000 limit was set because it was a minimum level at which duty/sales tax/GST recovery was economically viable.

We should start a new slogan ' I import and I vote' - How many votes does Gerry Harvey have?

[Colin_Fraser]

Retailers have been ripping off Australian consumers for years.
If a retailer sells a locally produced product, he will have no hesitation sourcing a similar product at a much cheaper rate from, say, China.
He will sell that product slightly cheaper than the local product, driving the local manufacturer out of business. Then the price goes up.
Now they have got their nose out of joint because the consumer has found a better way to purchase those goods.
Stuff 'em I say.

[Paul Haese]

This is an interesting concept really.

Even if GST were applied to all items (I don't really care if they do) in most cases the imported item will be near 40% cheaper than the product sold here.

Several things influence this problem and the main being the cost of labour. If labour was cheaper the goods should theoretically cheaper. Mind you in practice this is almost never going to happen. Look at the deregulation of electricity and water as an example. Other factors influence cost too such as rent and yes electricity etc. Once you start adding all this up you can see how things cost so much.

However, I often feel that things could be sold for a lot less and then volume selling would apply. With any luck this will be highlighted to the commission it might make some recommendations. If you can afford to sell a product at 50% cheaper then perhaps grizzling about how much internet sales is reducing your business might be seen as hypocritical.

I am sure the $1000 limit will be reduced but even if it is the product will most likely be cheaper by a long shot. Retail here will not learn the lessons to be had.

[omnivorr]

This is another complete crock.. GST on a $1000 purchase (including delivery) is $100.... transport costs quickly eat up any advantage in OS-purchases as the size/weight of the commodity increases... $100 GST is soon surpassed by transport costs.

Remember that you pay retail transport costs.. not the wholesale and 'economies-of-scale' rates Gerry takes advantage of.

So, only smaller items render any saving for the purchaser.. no-one is buying fridges n freezers direct from China, Gerry...

Any computer-parts retailers in Australia can and do already sell any part for half the price Gerry's lot gouges.

This is all about Gerry using his 'celebrity-millionaire' status to achieve some underhanded political agenda.. absolutely nothing to do with Australia's retail industry hitting the wall and going under.

Here's another case of a FAT Capitalist 'Free-Enterprise' 'Small-Government' advocate calling on Government to trounce on the "lil' guy"s cos they've found a way to avoid his parasitic clutches.


My bet is, the troglodyte couldn't manage web-sales as a business model in his steam-powered mentality, and will soon be in receivership no matter what comes of this. Harvey Norman shareholder?? SELL.. NOW.

:p

[marki]

Agree totally Collin. The local retailers are now feeling the impact of their own actions. Problem is so much of our manufacturing industries have been lost in the process. It's about time it came and bit the @#$%^& on the backside.

Mark

[mswhin63]

I am amased that most people consider all Australian business as liar cheats and so on, especially on this forum. I am looking seriously at this forum and the attitudes. All I can see is 80% of people here discredit all business based on a few large business's trying to rort the system. I really thought most people should be intelligent enough to look a bit further than the cover of a book.

I am a very small retailer and I also try to give the best prices that I can possibly afford to give, but while the Australian Dollar is so high and cheap labour overseas it does make it difficult for us to sell. I am considering the option of providing a honest business opportunity to astronomy but with attitudes like I see here is it really worth it.

[Cloudyagain]

What really gets up my nose is the price of books in this country. We must have the most expensive books in the world! Why? Are they supertaxed or is it just the local retailers?

For the last few years we have bought most of our books from Amazon but the shipping cost negates most of the advantage (but we persist). Might be time to get one of those E Book readers, I see you can get an Ecopy of Alice in Wonderland for 5 cents. :lol:

[Barrykgerdes]

Much as I hate tax like everyone else it is what pays for running the country, even if the pollies are botching it.

The sooner GST is applied to all privately imported good the better. Otherwise the government will need to find another source of revenue.

If you think retailers (other than the fashion rag trade) are ripping you off. Think about the people in the retail industry who are earning their living in sales. The overheads are enormous. Remember every item purchased overseas does nothing for the Australian economy and increases our overseas debt.

Barry

[mswhin63]

Maybe we should start paying staff in Australia the same wage as the Chinese. Then I will have a better chance to compete with overseas suppliers.

[dugnsuz]

Hi Malcolm,
Personally I have no axe to grind with Australian businesses, but with examples like below, it's clear to see which way one is more likely to go and why feelings may run a little high...

Web search/price comparison for Canon 24-70mm f2.8L lens

AU -
http://www.teds.com.au/www/6/1001102/displayproduct/2105562.html?utm_source=getprice&utm_medium=cpc

or...

O/S -
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Canon-EF-24-70mm-24-70-f-2-8L-USM-50D-7D-5D-UV-/160518957090?pt=AU_Cameras_Photogra phic_Accessories&hash=item255face822

$465AU difference. Shame to single out Ted's - I am aware you can certainly find the lens cheaper in Aus, but the point is made.
That's the reality.

Doug

[sasup]

spot on

[mswhin63]

Well I suppose I wouldn't sell anything unless I can compete or provide the service backup that would be needed for solutions. I have no short term ambitions for optics anyway as it is way over represented but may consider it if worth it.

Singling out Ted's is the reason why business's in Australia as going to suffer as we see one overprice or maybe 2 and give-up and go overseas to look for 10 or more. Advertising is only available to select high income business's.

I will be doing a test run soon to see if it is viable. I need to change my business as I go in for shoulder surgery and the recovery for a full shoulder re-construction will impede my business. I still have ambition to keep it going but I decided to leave the avenue open for other opportunities and going to Uni next year to see if I should hand over things to a larger corporation.

Just to represent Australian attitude i used to offer free advise to help assist people before selling, and realised the advise was being used to purchase stuff overseas (I have stopped this now). So is it business to blame or is it the consumers that are at fault.

[marki]

Malcom you are correct in that the big retailers started this but the small retailers followed suit in a bid for survival. When the buy australian goods campaign was active I always bought oz made goods where possible over imported goods. Now I cannot even buy a pair of oz made jocks. You need to remember a lot of people have had their livelyhoods destroyed by the lust of cheap goods so the feelings associated with all of this are going to be personal for many. The retail industry showed little quarter to oz industry in this process and are now whining because consumers are by passing the retailers in droves. If as the retailers have said "this is just a fact of the market economy, manufacturers need to be competative or perish" why can't they accept the same fate?

Mark

[astroron]

Wasn't it not long ago that Bonds closed all their factories in Aus and took their manufacturing over seas putting over a Thousand employees or so out of work.:sadeyes:
I always used to buy Bonds because they were Aus made then I noticed that they started to be labeled made in china :mad2:
So I now buy Rio and know that they are made over seas :shrug:

[Colin_Fraser]

Great example. I bet the retail outlet can purchase the item even cheaper than the ebay price.
They don't have one in stock? No worries, they import it from China, whack on $500 or $600 dollars and sell it to you. You pay their tax liability as well.
Malcolm, members do not consider ALL business as liars and cheats. If 80% of the people on this forum feel the way they do, then maybe 80% of ALL people in Australia think the same. People have just had enough of being ripped off, simple as that.

[dugnsuz]

Granted and referred to in my post, but fair goes - the best price from one of the better known discount Aus dealers is still around $350 more expensive than the eBay HK price - I'm always going to go with that.
Some of the bigger eBay stores are getting their acts together in terms of the warranty issues too which make O/S purchases more attractive and perhaps less of a worry too if the item is stuffed on receipt. The only major 'punt' is whether or not one is going to cop GST via a customs audit - obviously a gamble many will take, hence the reason for the thread.
Doug
Doug

[OICURMT]

Amazing how O/S v AU gets so much banter... this must be the up-teenth thread on the subject.

I agree with some that even with the 10%, O/S products will probably be cheaper. The only significant risk IMHO is the warranty. Thus, if an item could have issues or if I think I'll need support, I'll but local.

Eventually, the system will equilabrate once more competition arrives. I'd love some of the US retailers to enter the market here... you would see a price war on an unimaginable scale.

OIC!

[mswhin63]

What I can actually see, as overseas purchases increase the government will lose GST revenue. Time are tough and to make the windfall they will have 2 choices.
1. Retrieve GST from import under $1000.00 as the thread suggest or
2. Raise GST to all people for generic services

The government promised a revenue raising target in the last election and it looks at though they are not going to make it. Obviously raising GST is a very unpopular move so there is a possibility of other alternatives. Maybe the raising of Electricity and Gas is just the start of this recovery. I am not an economist but I have been running a business for nearly 15 years and I can see this as a logical step to ensure safe way to raise revenue for services that cannot be imported.

If people complain about the raising of essential services then this is possibly a consequence of the open market.

[mswhin63]

History has shown that equilibrium can only be achieved after a recession. We did not suffer from it massively instead we were given loads of money to recover, so we can spend it and most people did.

Personally I think it wont happen again until the next recession.

Competition can only happen from overseas entering our market. Rich Australian's are not about to invest in a flat Australian market. The offshoot is much of the profits going back overseas.

Overall I do not like making my margins too big, I suppose that is why after 15 years I am still renting. The temptation has been there for me to over-inflate prices but I find it hard to do. I know that when I purchase from the local distributor their prices are more than if I buy overseas.

I think a lot of people may not be sure of what they are really getting either. I have seen some items for sale from stuff I distribute. One was advertised cheaper than i could buy and was from an Australian Distributor. Why because it is refurbished. grays-online a great seller of refurbished gear and I see a lot of their products resold online later.