Plane crossing middle of moon.

[hotspur]

Today,I achieved something I have wanted to do for a considerable length of time.A plane crossing the moon.

Everyday this Qantas Dash 8 Q 400 flys over our country property,always at 5.30 pm,without fail-I have watched it fly 'through' the moon a few times.

Today,the moon was at the 'right' phase-approx in line with the planes flight path.So I set up gear (I have done this drill quite a few times!)

I saw the plane along way of and thought 'no-its not going to hit',I stayed beside scope just in case,then as it got closer,I could see "it was going to line up!"

My palm started to sweet-'buck fever',I only want to pull the trigger when I knew the plane was in the centre of the moon.-I got my wish!:)

Technical details-Vixen 103 ED refractor on Vixen GP mount,guiding by Vixen SS2K,camera 450D at 250 sec 200 iso,And a nerve of steel!

I have also enclosed photos of set up at time of event.

I have a RAW file,and will tweek when I have time,my son helped me get this photo-he has already done a 'auto contrast',and we will upload when we have a improved version.

[Matt Wastell]

Great capture! A really crisp image!

[DavidU]

That's a fantastic shot ! All your hard work & planning has come together beautifully. A classic image.

[kinetic]

Superb stuff Chris, you must be SOOO happy :)
I've wanted to do this too for many years. I live under an excellent
internationals flightpath and have setup countless nights when the phase is
just right over the flightpath....only to spend hours with nothing.
Brilliant mate :):thumbsup:
ps: send it to APOD or Spaceweather.com!

Steve

[multiweb]

Cool shot! :thumbsup:

[Dennis]

Wow – those are quite astonishing photos Chris – well done on the execution of your plans. All the dry runs paid off huh! These shots are really quite spectacular.:thumbsup:

How did you manage to download the flight planning elements into the Skysensor 2000 in order to command the GoTo to centre the airplane!;)

Cheers

Dennis

[hotspur]

Ha-ha:lol:,quite funny Dennis-re flight elements into SS2K.!

Really-lot of 'dry runs' and practice really,knowing my equipment well,and doing lots of observing of this plane's flight path and time,and understanding when the moon would be well situated for such a photo.

But the final part-pulling that trigger,knowing it was for real,got me a little nervous!Not only could I 'see' it was going 'through' the moon-but I could see the angle the plane was on was really going to make a 'classic' shot!

I went for 'the one shot option' only,I could have taken mutipal shots,but I would have lost my 'count' as to when plane was exactly in middle,I prefer a 'one shot' method.

Thank you to all the other people who have kindly left a comment.

I have here two adjustments my son has made,I will open the RAW file when I have more time,I am feeling a 'a bit over the moon' at the moment!

[h0ughy]

well done - least you have a raw file

[Liz]

Fabulous shot Chris!!!! :thumbsup:

[leon]

Man that is so good and excellent capture, well done indeed.

Leon

[DavidTrap]

What a cracker - that shot all comes down to the 5 P's:

Prior Preparation Prevents Poor Performance!

DT

[Inmykombi]

Amazing.

Well done indeed.

[StephenM]

That's brilliant Chris!!! Like Steve said, send it to APOD!

Cheers,
Stephen

[Moon]

Wow! The trails from the engines look especially cool.
Very well done.
James

[sheeny]

Very cool!

Al.

[Typhoon Season]

Hi all,
This looks like my kind of site and I absolutely love that photo of the Fokker crossing the Moon, Chris. I hope nobody tells you but I have used it for my Desktop. I am from Adelaide in South Australia and a dedicated Gazer. I have no particular expertise and though I have been at it for around 17 years and 4 scopes later, I consider myself a Learner BIG TIME. Background: Royal Australian Navy, Professional Long Distance Driver conducting Coach Tours of Australia and am now enjoying my retirement, Computing, Star Gazing and my huge collection of Country (Outlaw) Music. I hope you can handle an Aussie in the mix - I certainly won't cause any pain for my part, Noel. :eyepop:

[M54]

That's an amazing shot Chris!:):thumbsup:

And Welcome Noel.
(We can handle an Aussie, cos most of us are Aussies as this is an Australian forum!:D)

[Screwdriverone]

Simply Excellent Chris.

I especially like the 5th pic of the setup with the capture on the camera's LCD, really shows the accuracy and skill used to grab it from SO far away, the scale of that pic works really well.

Pair that pic with the main crossing pic and send it off, guaranteed it will get on APOD. Also, send it to AS&T, they'd love it.

Very impressive.

Cheers

Chris

[Dennis]

Hi Chris

I had a quick play with your jpg – I hope you don’t mind! Here is my interpretation of this amazing image.

Cheers

Dennis

[DavidTrap]

What about IOTW Mike?

DT

[suma126]

great shot chris

[michaellxv]

Wow, what a great shot.
As well as other suggestions LPOD would like it too.

[troypiggo]

I've seen a couple of shots of planes across the moon, but this is by far the best by a long way. Fantastic scale and detail! So well done! I reckon most would be flukes, but you set this up intentionally! Kudos!

[DavidU]

Now on my desktop. Fab image again Chris.

[Quark]

What a super shot you have there Chris,

Very well done, congrats on a top result.

Cheers
Trevor

[hotspur]

Hi All.

Thank you to those who have commented and viewed.

I had a very quick PP in CS 5 today,here are the results.

regards Chris

[iceman]

This is now IOTW (http://www.iceinspace.com.au).

Fantastic shot! No luck involved - plenty of preparation and practise paid off!

[troypiggo]

Congratulations on the IOTW mate! It's truly a unique and awesome shot.

Hope my comment about "flukes" wasn't misinterpreted. I was in no way saying yours was luck. In fact, I said the opposite. Yours was intentional and it paid off!

Oh, and I'd definitely send it in to APOD! Gotta give that a go! :)

[RB]

Congratulations Chris.
What a great shot and worthy of IOTW !
Well planed and executed.

:thumbsup:

[sasup]

that is the coolest thing all day

[seeker372011]

late to come across this thread..bravo, well done sir!
a fine result indeed

[multiweb]

Very cool! Nerves of steel alright... one single shot? Mate you're game. :thumbsup:

[bartman]

Chris that is an amaaazzing shot!!!!:eyepop:
Absolutely well done and executed!
I have a similar flight path situ and have always wanted to this kinda shot!
Now just to be patient and figure out when the moon will be in the right spot at the right time.

BTW welcome Noel!

Bartman

[ChrisM]

Great shot - perfect timing.

Well done,
Chris

[Virgs]

Excellent in every way

[hotspur]

WOW!:eyepop:IOTW!

Thanks everyone for the comments:thanx:.Yes-lots of Planning and Preparation.

The plane follows the same direction every day-in a similar portion of the sky,I have seen it cross the moon 5 or 6 times over a few years,so I knew what I was doing was achievable.

I have noted the moon phase always one day after first quarter to four days after first quarter.

The hardest thing-was pulling that trigger! for real!,Yes Marc,only one shot-reason,I felt most comfortable with the trigger with one shot-and I just had to go by feel and to go by what I could see was going to look the best.

The other reason is the 450D is slow in quick shot mode,I was in RAW as well as JPEG,and I did not want the plane to be 'poking its nose out' from moon,or tail 'sticking' out.So one shot,I felt most comfortable with.so that's what I went for-yes-very game!

I have a 50D so may be next attempt might give it a go,but will do some dry runs first.Even then I am not sure if I will take quick burst of shots.for the above reasons.

Anyhow-adds to the 'thrill of the chase'-like a 007 movie "You only have one shot Mr Bond":thumbsup:

[erick]

And you didn't leave the focussing mask on :D

The lighter one showing the lovely red on the tail is great! Against the blue sky - I like!

IOTW - congrats Chris!

[ballaratdragons]

Forget about Image of the Week.
That is Image of the YEAR!

Absolutely Stunning!!!

Waiting for that exact split second the old heart must have been pounding in your ears, pulse racing, stomach churning, and sphincter muscles jammed tight. :thumbsup:

I can only imagine the feeling of exhilaration when you knew you got it :eyepop:

An extremely wonderful piece of work :clap:

[rcheshire]

Fantastic shot. Great advertising potential for QF and Bombardier? Makes me want to strap in and take-off. Puts the romance back into flying.

...the props seem to be in sync...

[Manav]

I havent commented to many IOTW but this one is an exception! Well done :) :thumbsup:

[ChrisM]

Chris,
Have you thought of tracking down the pilot to offer him a copy? If I were the pilot, I'd certainly like that pic on my wall!

Chris

[DavidTrap]

Peter Ward might be able to track those details down.

DT

[hotspur]

Yes,I had thought of that,It would be a very interesting thing to do,I think a signed copy by the photographer and the pilot framed in the office would be wonderful!.

I would have no way of trying to find that information,and the airline may not be interested in giving out those details.However if there is someone on this forum that is in the airline industry and wants to set about trying to find the pilot that day.

Here are the details as I know them.The plane left Brisbane airport at (my guess-approx 5.15 pm)

Photo taken at 17.24.35 on the 16-9-2010 as the plane flew over Blackbutt Range,aprox 2 Hours drive by car from Brisbane in a N.W direction.

I do not know where this plane goes,may be Longreach,Roma,or Emerald.It could be Emerald,as I have heard some locals here call it 'the mines plane'.

[bkm2304]

Hi Chris,

Great shot. Contact QANTAS' marketing people. They would love this, I'm sure. Tell them you want the pilot to have it and perhaps they will make a story of it for their inflight mag.

QMedia runs the mag and the Queensland contact is:

QLD Contact
Kelly Myers
Advertising Sales Director
61 7 3000 8501
kmyers@acpmagazines.com.au


They handle editorial stuff as well apparently.



Good luck!


Richard

[Ric]

What an excellent image Chris

Well done

[Jen]

:thumbsup: that is so cool i shared it on facebook too heheh ;)

[hotspur]

What did they think of it over on 'Facebook' Jen?

I am not on 'Facebook'.I have'nt had time to uploaded it on other photography

sites that I visit,I am still a bit stunned at how well this image came out.

Thanks too,to Richard- who gave contact details of lady at QANTAS,I will send Kelly a email,this week.

Cheers Chris

[Jen]

You got lots of likes of facebook Chris :thumbsup:

[Lester]

Fantastic Chris.

[spearo]

Very Awesome!
perfect framing of the plane against the Moon
I'm seriously impressed
frank

[midnight]

Truly spectacular!

What stands out for me (apart from the plane!!) is the crisp focus of the moon behind!

I have spent the last month tackling the moon trying get a decent shot and relying heavily on stacking multiple frames and your single shot Chris is superb. Just goes to show what good optics can do!! (and nerves of steel!)

Well done mate!:thumbsup:

Darrin...

[hotspur]

Thanks Darrin!

Yes,the optics is just so fine on the Vixen ED 103 refractor,It was expensive-the tube cost a fair bit-but it was worth every cent.Mate-do not worry about what a good tube cost,once you have it and use you forget about what it cost to buy.

As the enjoyment you get from great optics is a real pleasure,and you can go about planning photographs and know the optics will not let you down.I am so pleased you enjoyed the photo of the moon (and the plane too).

Hope you do really well in the future with your imaging and viewing:thumbsup:

regards Chris

[ChrisM]

I've just done a bit of simple maths on Chris' wonderful effort:

The plane appears to be a Dash 8-400 series (based on the ratio of the plane's length to its wingspan).

Assuming that the moon (diameter) subtends an angle of 31 arc minutes, and knowing the length of the plane (107.75 feet), the height of the plane is just on 21,000 feet.

Based on the advertised cruising speed of 602 kph for this model, the plane travels its own length every 196 mS. And given that the plane just fits comfortably in front of the moon at this distance, I estimate that Chris had a window of +/- 5 mS in which to capture the plane, and he got it right in the centre of this very narrow window. A superb effort given shutter lag and other delays.

Well done again!

Cheers, Chris

[hotspur]

Thanks ChrisM for doing the Maths_I was hopping someone might do that!

Thanks Richard for details to contact QANTAS-they have been in touch.

Thanks StephenM for kind comment and thought of APOD,however "Kangaroo Moon" is unlikely to make that grade,They have been in contact and I had to give permission for them to post on their 'feeder forum' Spaceship Astrisk

Here is the link of that post http://bb.nightskylive.net/asterisk/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=21170

They said that is first hoop that it has to go through before it is then considered again,only may be it might make the grade.I did contact a few magazines- Sky and Tel,Australia Air,Spellcraft,as suggested,They are very keen-so Stephen you will see it in print.

Anyhow,I am more than happy to have captured this image for myself,by myself,and to share it here on IIS with real amateur astronomers,who appreciate it too.

Anything else is simply a bonus.Cheers Chris

[spearo]

I'd approach Quantas, they might be interested in purchasing a high res version?
frank

[Jeffkop]

Just back from my honeymoon Chris .. so late on the thread .. better late than never though for this masterpiece .. BLOODY AWESOME !!!!!! .. Congratulations on the IOTW .. should be IOTM I reckon.

There are a many things photographically that are very commendable here, I am also really impressed with the observational side of things too ... Great perparation .. there are some fine talents in this forum, count yourself in there, cant say anymore.

[Lucius]

Great image. My screen saver already!!

[Jay44]

Just fantastic Chris!

Keep 'em coming!

Jill

[Rattler]

Hey Chris,

What on Earth can I say that has not already been said?? "Ripper" perhaps?

Anyway, I popped over to Astrisk and left a strong vote for your photo to be elevated to APOD. Hope it helps and it makes the grade in their eyes. It has with all of us here.

Oh, hang on tight to copyright!!!! Really.

Well done and have fun!

John.

EDIT:: Get over to Asterisk and outline what you had to do to get that shot!! That is half the story behind it. Some won't get how hard it is to grab such a balanced photograph and thus you risk "under impressing them" J

[Jabba]

oh wow thats awesome!

[Rattler]

Chris!

Just visited Asterisk again and supported your photo for NOT being a montage. Pointed them to this thread. I hope 'they' read it and realise the work you put into it given it had resulted in a truly gun shot.

John.

[DavidTrap]

Ditto!

DT

[hotspur]

Hi John.

I Did go to astrisk this morn,and put a detailed account of how the photo was taken.I find the site difficult to navigate,so it took a while,the layout of their forums is different to what I encounted before.But its in the thread.

I have been a bit overwhelmed,with the amount of replies in my email box,many hundred to go through-so if I have not replied-that is why.

I did get some that I really never expected to see-a N.T.S.B flight investigator officer,was seriously impressed!,The gentleman has shown it to his co-workers and it got alot of positive comments.Really I was so amazed.These people would soon say if anything was not right.

So do not worry John!,not sure a higher tick can be given to this photo!N.T.S.B examined!

Thanks too,to all the other people,who are very new to this forum,who have come on board to leave a comment:welcome:.and the regulars-for looking and making a comment.:thanx:

Kind regards Chris

[jjjnettie]

Bloody brilliant Chris!

[bird]

Absolutely fantastic shot - nerves of steel indeed, and also in just the right spot laterally...

cheers, Bird

[kenthoi]

Totally amazing! Good luck with APOD.

[multiweb]

Next APOD is titled 'moon plane' so I think that's it. :)

[one_iota]

Indeed it is on today's APOD and deservedly so

http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap100929.html

.... congratulations Chris

:clap:

[erick]

To Chris :thumbsup:

[iceman]

Well done Chris! Congrats!

[troypiggo]

OMG congrat's Chris! Doesn't get any better than that!

:cool::cool::cool::party2::bowdown: :clap::clap::clap:

[Jay-qu]

When I first saw this image, I thought "there is no way this cant make APOD", lo and behold today it shows up :)

A well deserved Congratulations to you Chris!

[StephenM]

Yep, congratulations Chris! :thumbsup: Well deserved!

Cheers,
Stephen

[DavidTrap]

You the man!

DT

[Octane]

Congrats on the APOD. : )

H

[DavidU]

CHRIS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! MATE I am so happy for you. Bloody fantastic:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumb sup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

[Paddy]

Congratulations, Chris. A stunning photo and well deserved APOD!

[mswhin63]

Gratz on APOD well deserved

[Jen]

:eyepop: APOD woohooooo congrats :thumbsup:

[alphamone]

Just logged in to also offer congratulations at getting featured on APOD

[hotspur]

Thank you all for your kind words.Although APOD is good,I thought the write up I got from the owner of this forum was much better when I achieved "IOTW",here.

The write up on APOD makes out it was all 'luck',which clearly everyone on IIS saw that it was no such thing.

I am also unimpressed by the amount of emails I have recieved from people that have seen it on APOD,and wanted to know how I did the 'Montage':shrug:.

Clearly,IIS forum members are far more advanced in their studies in astronomy,as everyone could clearly see what was achieved.

On the up side,the Russian Space agency have contacted me,They certainly know it is a very well planned image,and no luck involved.

Thanks again IIS,I really feel more pleased to have shared it with you!

Cheers Chris

[Kevnool]

Congrats Chris on the APOD well worthy.
Cheers Kev.

[Radiation]

Congratulations!

I just saw this on APOD and remembered that I had seen it here too. Shame about them stressing the whole luck thing.

[alexch]

Congrats on the APOD - well deserved!
Alex

[hotspur]

Thank you everyone on IIS for all of your emails and kind comments.

I am a little stunned at the hUGE amount of feed back on this image.

Just one last note the plane is at 7200 metres,a few people on the APOD

thought the image was a fake,and did some maths-well quite a lot of maths!They also checked all the specs on the Bombadier Q400,apparently it cruises at 8000 m,so the plane was still climbing.

and found out is was not a fake.Some amazing calculations involved.But they seem happy now.

I must say I am really impressed with IIS,no one here thought it was a fake-Some how most people who have done PP or photography can tell immediately if something is not right,and will soon say so-without the maths!

Cheers Chris

[iceman]

Hi Chris

Don't forget it's a completely different audience. IceInSpace is mainly enthusiastic amateurs or star gazers, whereas APOD is a mix of everyone - enthusiastic amateurs and a lot of general public who simply like looking at pretty pictures.

Enthusiastic amateurs know what they're looking at when they see a photo, and they would know if it's legitimate or not. Many of them may have even tried/or taken photos themselves.

The general public just wouldn't know so it's more likely they'll jump to conclusions etc.

Getting an APOD is quite a unqiue experience - enjoy the ride while it lasts!

[mental4astro]

Chris, nice one!

[and]

Hi, i'm here to let you know that your amazing shots today are on the homepage of one of the most important italian newspapers (www.repubblica.it and http://www.repubblica.it/scienze/2010/09/30/foto/l_aeroplano_davanti_alla_luna-7573245/1/?ref=HRESS-6 ). Good job! :D

[Rattler]

YAY!!!!!!! I am cross with the supporting paragraph and have sent them an email saying as much.

But still.....I have not achieved such a thing!

Have fun!

Rrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[ChrisM]

[QUOTE=hotspur;640382]

Just one last note the plane is at 7200 metres,a few people on the APOD

thought the image was a fake,and did some maths-well quite a lot of maths!They also checked all the specs on the Bombadier Q400,apparently it cruises at 8000 m,so the plane was still climbing."
------------------------------

Hi Chris, just interested to know how you found out the plane was at 7200 metres. My calcs from the image came up with an altitude of close to 21,000 feet (6,400 metres).

Congrats on the APOD and other press!

Chris

[avatorotava]

I am sorry man, but something isn't quite convincing here..
I don't do any maths but I am a professional photographer and
from the pictures of the set you published, the moon is so small and faraway, that for the plane to be in the position it is, it should have been almost landing on his surface in order to have those proportions...
great trick man! arrived all the way to italy...

[troypiggo]

You joined the forum to post that uninformed rubbish?

I've mentioned this to Chris off-line, but will repeat it here. Comments like this, at first glance, might be hurtful. People don't believe that you could take such a wonderful capture, they don't trust your word etc. But when you think about it, someone suggesting that the shot you captured isn't possible and it must have been photoshopped, is actually the highest praise you could get. Especially if the person saying it is "a professional photographer" (even if they don't do maths).

So Chris, don't be dis-heartened by these sort of comments. I know you've been getting a few. They're all the ultimate compliment, even if they weren't written for that purpose.

[Dennis]

I assume that your native tongue is not English and therefore something may have been lost in the translation?

I’m also not sure that claiming to be a professional photographer (simply means one who is paid to take photographs) is a justifiable qualification to do away with the need to apply mathematical rigour to the data captured in Chris’s photo, before making such unnecessary and quite pointless comments.

Amateur astronomers (unpaid; doing it for the love of their hobby) perform many simple mathematical calculations to characterize the field of view of their instruments and photographic systems. There is no (data driven) conflict here between the apparent angular sizes of the Moon’s disc and the airplane as recorded through a Vixen ED103S F/7.7 refractor fitted with a Canon 450D. The lighting appears as expected to those who have viewed the Moon under similar twilight conditions. The small amount of motion blur of the airframe, based on the apparent field of view, aircraft altitude/distance/ground speed seems appropriate based upon the author’s published exposure details of 1/250 second.

Sometimes, you just have to trust data rather than an opinion based on, well in this instance, I don’t know what!:shrug:

Cheers

Dennis

PS – Chris, I would ignore there naysayer posts, you cannot have an open conversation with a closed mind. You know what you recorded, and how, and you don’t require any other justification to prove the authenticity of this amazing image.

[hotspur]

Hi ChrisM,re height of plane-if you go to that image on APOD site,click discuss you will get into thread.

One chap did some maths to work out the 7200m,he later revised that figure to 6500m.Given I live 160 km (approx)Brisbane,This,and your figure are more likely to be correct,the plane is still climbing.

Not sure about speed,but that far away from Brisbane,should be very close to to cruising speed.

Troy-thanks for your comment,some people may be professional photographers',but there are many vast fields of photography,and not everyone is going to have a firm understand of application of gear and skills needed to obtain an image.

cheers Chris

[jjjnettie]

:) Just sitting back and watching you enjoy the ride. Congrats on the APOD.

[astroron]

Frame it Chris and hang it in Pride of place at home :D
Well done :thumbsup:
As Dennis says take no notice of the Doubting Thomas's
Cheers and congrats on the APOD:thumbsup:

[Suzy]

A well deserved congratulations to you Chris. "Carpe Diem". :)

Proudly waiting for Australian Sky & Telescope Magazine to print this story, and as JJJ mentioned, watching this ride is very exciting!
Any word from the pilot yet. :question:

Regards,
Suzy.

[Waxing_Gibbous]

Fantastic! Try Smithsonian Air & Space if you haven't already had it published.
PJH

[Octane]

Chris,

Ignore the people questioning the authenticity of the image. You shouldn't have to re-iterate yourself or explain yourself or justify yourself.

Can it be faked? You bet it can. And, this is the problem.

The difference here is that you're a regular member of this forum, and, we know who you are; we know your interests; we have no reason to doubt you.

External viewers, whether they be on APODs forums, or other fora/site where the image has been published don't know you from a bar of soap. And, so, of course peeople are going to chime in and say the physics are all wrong and that the image is an impossibility. Not everyone has photographed through a long focal length instrument before and therefore doubt its authenticity.

There's a particular photography message board I'm on where I post my landscape images, and, while I was new there, I had a barrage of people claiming that my landscapes were HDR images (an insult) and in general, a lot of negative sentiment was being bandied about. People who don't photograph at those special times of the day don't realise that a photograph can resemble a painting. It's all to do with the light. Now that I'm not so new there, I've gained their trust and they take the images for what they are now.

So, all in all, don't be disheartened. We know you took the shot.

H

[Chancellor]

Hi Chris
I fell in love with your photo the first time I saw it on IIS and have been reading about it for the last few days in a few places.

I just wanted to say congratulations on your photo. One hell of a lot of planning really payed off to get that shot.

[[1ponders]]

Wow what an absolutely cracker of an image Chris. Your hard work has definitely paid off. Congratulations on a fine shot and your APOD :clap:

[hotspur]

Yes,Jenette-Its and interesting ride!!

A bit like the internet version of riding a Brahmin bull in a bush fire,lots of action,and a few clowns on the side line (naysayers).but all good.

Thanks Paul,Dennis,Humayan and all other IIS members who have recently commented.Its been am interesting and educational experience.

BTW,I have come to an arrangement with a U.K publishing firm,who are doing a story on the whole image-how I got it,what I did,preparation etc,etc.

The story will end up in many various publications in Europe.The Italian internet news story,appears to be just taken from the IIS thread-without permission from me to publish photo.The U.K chaps will handle all that sort of thing now.

Unfortunately my dealings with QANTAS have been unfavourable,so off-shore was the only way to go.The image is also been used in Bren Planetarium,
Germany-I gave my permission for that.They will send over documents of how the images is used etc,so I could post it,if people feel it could be of interest

Cheers Chris

[Dennis]

Hi Chris

I was just playing around with the objects and data elements in order to do some calculations and came up with this diagram to help me plug the values into the various equations!

Cheers

Dennis

[troypiggo]

Dennis.

I am sorry man, but something isn't quite convincing here..
I don't do any maths and I am not a professional photographer and
from the pictures of the set you published, I think the image you posted there has been photoshopped. great trick man! arrived all the way to Brisbane...

:)

Kidding of course. Fantastic work mate!

[iceman]

But what's the answer, Dennis!? :)

[hotspur]

What a hoot!great diagram Dennis-its going up on the wall of the observatory!

Lots of belly-aching laughing after reading Troy's post.

On a totally different subject,does anyone know when these clouds are ever

going away from S.E QLD.?

Cheers Chris

[DavidU]

Nice bit of work there Dennis.:thumbsup:
I think the doubters need a bucket of cold water thrown over them:D

[Jen]

:eyepop: You obviously didnt look at the first 5 photos that Chris posted on this thread it shows the pic clearly on his camera while hooked up to scope :screwy:

[astroron]

[QUOTE=Jen;640918]:eyepop: You obviously didnt look at the first 5 photos that Chris posted on this thread it shows the pic clearly on his camera while hooked up to scope :screwy:[/QU

Go get him Jen:thumbsup:

[multiweb]

Here's another one (http://www.geekologie.com/2010/09/allegedly_genuine_photo_of_pla.php) someone just emailed me. It does go around. :)

[DavidU]

Wow,11,000 views.

[Dennis]

Okay Mike, here’s how I did it, although I am open to review and any corrections for the procedure and maths, as it has been such a loooong time since I did this stuff at school!:P

Using Photoshop CS5 I measured the diameter of the Moon and the length of the airplane fuselage and came up with the following:

PART A: Relative angular size of Moon/Airplane.
Moon Diameter = 1370 pixels
Body Length = 760 pixels

Therefore Body Length/Moon Dia ratio = 0.5547. If the Moon subtends an angle of 30.3 arcmins, then the Airplane Body subtends an angle of 0.5547 x 30.3 arcmin = 16.8 arcmin.

16.8 arcmin / 60 = 0.28 degrees.

PART B: Line of sight distance from Chris.
As a good approximation, 107.75 feet / Tan 0.28 degrees should give the distance of the airplane from Chris; that is, some 21,500 feet which is approx 6568 metres.

As we know the altitude of the Moon above the horizon (ignoring Chris’ height above sea level) and have just calculated the line-of-sight distance from Chris, we can calculate the ground distance using Cosines.

PART C: Ground distance from Chris.
That is, Cosine 73°46’ x 6568m = 1.840 kms approx, giving the ground distance some 1.84kms from Chris’ observatory.

PART D: Height above ground of aircraft.
The height of the aircraft above the ground can be obtained using Sines as follows:
Sin 73° 46’ x 6568 m = 6306m approx. (ignoring Chris' elevation)

LUNAR LIBRATION CHECK:
As amateur astronomers, we are aware of the effects of Lunar Libration; attached is a Lunar Map Pro screen capture of the Moon as simulated for Blackbutt at 5:24pm on 16th Sept 2010.

Well, that was a pleasant stroll down memory lane - please feel to correct any bad assumptions and poor memory recall!:)

Cheers

Dennis

[hotspur]

Thanks Marc-How does this work? I mean I did not give permission for them to use image-and what's a 'geekologie'

I have a given permission for a U.K publishing company to manage image.I will send them this link. that Marc has given us.

It appears the image Marc found has been taken off APOD.

If any others pop up let me know-I will let my agent know and they can deal with it (woha-sounding a bit 'un-Chris-like') I mean "let my agent know"-(giggles.)

But,I mean I wonder how all this works?with copyright etc.

Thanks Marc

[troypiggo]

Anyone else find it kind of ironic that probably 99% of images chosen as APODs have lots, lots more post-processing and photoshopping than Chris' image here, yet his single frame image with minimal processing is being picked apart?

[Dennis]

What’s really ironic, (and please excuse me here Chris), is that Chris is a novice at Photoshop!:)

To make a believable composite from a correctly illuminated, scaled and oriented airplane, aligned to a Moon image at the appropriate Libration, would probably require more effort that doing the real thing! :lol:

Cheers

Dennis

[hotspur]

Novice-Dennis-wow!I hope I make that grade one day!

To be honest-I am hopless at PP,I do hope to learn some skills in it one

day.

Troy,that's an amazing observation!and so true-makes my APOD even more amazing!

The UK press corporation who is handling the whole story said its all good.The "kangaroo Moon" story is about to go really BIG in Europe very soon.:)

Dennis,great maths you have posted,I look forward to getting all that printed out along with your diagram.

Cheers Chris

[om]

that's only if the plane was perpendicular to the line-of-sight; otherwise you'll just get an upper limit, right?
looks quite close though; one might be able to get an estimate of this angle by comparing the ratio between the wingspan and the fuselage length in the photo to the real ratio, but you'll have to make other assumptions about yaw and pitch here.

[hotspur]

The Good people at BOMBADIER from Toronto-Canada (where the Q400 is made)
Have been in touch! they are keen to make big posters of
The "Kangaroo Moon" image!

WOHA! Chris:):D:)

[DavidU]

Sensational news Chris ! Congratulations yet again.:thumbsup:

[OICURMT]

I wonder if Avatorotava thinks Thierry Legault was floating around in space when he took his photos of the Shuttle transiting the sun... probably thinks the shuttle is so small at 600km that no one could be able to image it and hey.... imaged in less than a second of transition time.

I assume he meant the image and article and not the plane... :lol:

http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/090515-sts125-sts125-solar-transit.html

<Late edit: Took another look at the original pics... "impressive" doesn't quite describe it. Great job>

[hotspur]

Bombardier Q400 makes it all the way to England!

Today's "London Daily Times"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1317072/Lunar-landing-Photographer-captures-moment-passenger-plane-flies-Moon.html

I see this thread has had over 12000 hits,I wonder if I get awarded a IIS
'Beanie' :P (tongue in cheek.giggling)

Cheers Chris

[OICURMT]

What's up with all the "nay-sayers"? Man, can't anyone believe that a shot can be setup via hard work and patience?

[Dennis]

Here we go Chris; I have just updated the stick diagram with some of the calculations at the bottom of the drawing.

I’ve also attached a screen capture from TheSkyX Professional showing the FOV for the Vixen ED103S and Canon 450D combination.

Cheers

Dennis

[hotspur]

Well done Dennis!

A fair amount of work there!,many people will enjoy seeing that and

the calculations.

BTW, a few more U.K papers have done a small story and print the image

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3162208/Sensational-snap-of-plane-flying-across-moon.html

and another....... http://www.metro.co.uk/news/842846-plane-snapped-flying-across-moon

I particularly like the very last sentence in the "Metro"

My U.K agent said there is more to come!,and magazines all over the world too!!

Chris:)

oops,and here is another,"Picture of the Week" in the "Telegraph" http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/picturegalleries/theweekinpictures/8037445/The-week-in-pictures-1-October-2010.html

[multiweb]

This shot is going around like a trail of fire hey? :lol: So popular. It appeals to a lot of people and generates controversy as it should but in the end I reckon a lot of nay-sayers will end up with their nose in it. Dennis proof should do it. :thumbsup:

[erick]

You had that pilot on the mobile phone, didn't you? "Come a bit left...a bit more...now steady.........slow down a little." :D

Great to see the interest in your image. Hilarious to read the uninformed commentary! Well done to take a photo of the equipment in situ with Moon visible and image on camera pre-view screen - a good tip for others.

[DavidTrap]

I love the way you so casually say "My UK agent..."

Well done!
DT

[DavidU]

I'll get my agent to talk to your agent Chris LOL.
Good to have the info from Dennis.

[lacad01]

Great work Chris, outstanding shot. Quite amusing reading the negative and stupid comments from the various sites :rolleyes:

[Dennis]

Is this your UK Agent Chris, Rex Features (http://www.rexfeatures.com/features/m132b73431/how's_this_for_a_moon_shot...?pl=16 )?

Cheers

Dennis

[hotspur]

Yes,Dennis that is correct.

They have sold to the story quite a number of U.K papers.

Also other parts of Europe,I am told it may be going to magazines too!.

Cheers Chris

P.S I have just received some scans from Rex,of the hard printed version in those papers.

I am rather pleased with the first line in the first picture,rather a good chuckle here for our Australian photographers'!

[Dennis]

Here we go Chris. I have just updated the stick diagram and added a few notes to explain a few important details, such that the Moon was high in the East, with the Sun at 3 degrees in the West, hence the airplane is illuminated by the setting Sun.

I have also attached a screen copy of the XLS spreadsheet so that the calculations and assumptions can be independently assessed for errors.

Cheers

Dennis

[leon]

Man this thread has so many hits it's, any wonder, what a shot.

Leon

[RobF]

Ok Dennis, just out of interest, how far left or right of the plane's course could Chris have been before the aircraft wouldn't have been reasonably centred in the pic? I wonder how many metres it would have to be?:question:

Fantastic pic, and congrats on APOD too Chris - heck, you've become truely famous since I last visited this thread :eyepop:

[hotspur]

Now that Rob,is a excellent question,I have been thinking about this quite a bit.May be Dennis and ChrisM and others might like to have a graph or similar to let us know.

Thanks all for the comments,input and support,I have been rather busy with many emails lately and have not had time to 'crunch the numbers'.

Just a hunch,on Robs question- I reckon about 600 metres either side.for the full 'Planar" eclipse.If I was at the local saw mill about 3 kms with gear set up ,I feel it would have been a "graze".

Finally,we start to see the image in Australian Newspapers today in QLD
"Courier-Mail" page 7,and a good little write up,no mention of the "L" word.

Any others around the country-let us know.

re-the "famous" bit-well its almost a little embarsing,I just applied my skills in a tradesman like manner on my observations which I had aquired over time.

Did my calculations and did the job.Those last few seconds though-no amount of dry runs could prepare for that!but it all went as I had planed.

Looking forward to my next missions! (if this cloud ever goes)

Cheers Chris

[koputai]

Awesome Chris, what a hoot! Great work.

Cheers,
Jason.

[Dennis]

Okay, I’ve approached this in 2 ways and either, or both, may be incorrect so you maths geniuses out there please let me know what you think!:)

Simplistic analysis from image in Photoshop CS5:
Measured distance from fuselage to “top” of Moon = 470 pixels.
Measured distance from fuselage to “bottom” of Moon = 520 pixels.

At a scale of 23.44 pixels/metre, then the airplane would skim the “top” and “bottom” of the Moon some 21 metres and 23 metres from Chris’ observatory respectively, taking into account the ground angle of 73° 46’.

Parallax calculations:
Using Parallax per the attached diagram, the answer comes out at ± 30 metres.

I don’t know what you all think, but these values seem surprisingly small?:shrug:

Cheers

Dennis

PS – I have ignored the altitude of Chris’ observatory and the angle of attack of the Airplane to the Moon’s equator of approx -27°, plus other stuff I probably haven’t even thought of!

EDIT #1: Added a screen capture of updated spreadsheet with the calculations for the width of the ground track that straddles Chris’ observatory – a measly ± 30 metres!!!

EDIT #2: Updated diagram added with improved text quality and typo corrections.

[Dennis]

Another approach is to use the existing data and calculations on the spreadsheet.

The Tangent of half the angle subtended by the Moon’s disc (30.3/2 arcmins) = 0.00440698 x 6719 metres (LOS Distance) which gives a value of 29.61 metres which closely matches the Parallax method.

That is, Chris would only have to move ± 30 metres in the appropriate direction for the airplane to skim the limb of the Moon.

Good positioning, timing and shooting Chris!

Cheers

Dennis

[RobF]

Thanks Dennis

I'm actually not too surprised at that. It just goes to show how hard it would be to plan to reproduce this at another site.

I suspect the planes are on a relatively tight course by VOR or GPS and thus their course (for that Flight number) relatively reproducible. That coupled with Chris' observations over the year + phase of the moon allowed it, but heck I don't think we'll see too many other planned shots like it anytime soon!

Closer to the terminal area at destination the aircraft are probably more likely to get air traffic control course adjustments making this sort of thing very difficult near an airport, but also the aircraft would be too low and appear too fast.

Great maths too BTW Dennis :thumbsup:

[hotspur]

Thanks Dennis.

The manager from Bombardier sent a email today-the whole factory has viewed your diagrams and spread sheets,they enjoy looking at them very much too!.

The last one you posted-that's a very small window there,Are there any other maths people here that want to go over Dennis's numbers?

If that last diagram is correct-and Dennis has done two methods and arrived at a similar/same result.It really is amazing!

While all of this has been a hoot,a bit of fun,and a wonderful feeling to have my image around the world.

Unfortunately,there is a down side,a lot of people are now sending very nasty.attacking emails-as it appears they cannot prove the image to be fake.So now it appears if they cannot prove it fake-attack is the option for them.Going by some of the emails,it also appears some are astro=photographers,who are very PO and annoyed with me and my image.

I am really shocked about this,such ashame,that such people would send nasty emails and put down another astronomer.

I do hope that people can accept the image for what it is and move on.

Chris

[rcheshire]

PM sent.

[OICURMT]

Chris

you added a google e-mail link, not a website


OIC!

[ChrisM]

Chris,

Using similar triangles, I've done a calculation for how far laterally (relative to the plane's track) away from your original photographing position, would you have to have been, to have the moon appear shifted one diameter sideways.

The answer is 57 metres - not very much!

This is simply (diameter of moon) x (height of plane)/(height of moon)

= approx. 3474 km x 6.5 km / 395,000 km

This does not take into account your own altitude, which I think was around 500 m ASL. The answer would then be around 53 metres.

Note that these answers are of the same order of magnitude as those calculated by Dennis, however I have worked out the answer to a slightly different question: For a fixed plane position, how far sideways do you have to move to have the moon appear to shift one diameter?

Regarding the consistency of flight routes, there are standard routes between well-defined navigation points but a certain tolerance is allowed, and permission can be sought to move left or right of track to avoid weather cells. There would be a probability distribution for the plane to line up with the moon, such that every so often, the two would align, as has been perfectly captured by your picture.

Cheers,
Chris

[bartman]

Great Shot Chris,
But enough already..... everybody.....
It's a real pic!
Can we please stop the yay and nay!
Lock this please.
Lets move on ...
For Moon and Planes sake!

[OICURMT]

17000 VIEWS !!!!!!!!!!! :eyepop:

Hooah!

[hotspur]

Confirming registration

is VH-QUV this is what it appeared to be when I magnified image.

It has now been confirmed from another source.They will do even more

checks.

The flight number is QF-2406 the flight is From Brisbane to Emerald QLD.

I do hope the thread is not 'locked'.

There is a great deal of public interest in this image.

BTW image is now IOTM on QLD plane spotting.Link is http://qldplanespotting.webs.com/apps/auth/redirect?inviteID=82789108&hash=8e8f48b370ac21c110317903dd9360 33&action=respond&next=

The rego could also be VH-QOV,but looks more like QUV,the airplane spotters,will and can find out more,I just post

this information as most here wanted it and enjoy the facts and figures.



Cheers Chris

[OICURMT]

Just googled "Plane Crossing the Moon" in Google Images

Your's is now 4th.. (didn't realize there were so many images of planes crossing the moon :eyepop:)

I noticed that in most cases, there were people claiming "Photoshop" ... honestly, people just need to "Build a bridge"...

http://www.google.com/images?q=plane+crossing+the+moon&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=og&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wi&biw=1645&bih=857


BTW: The "famous" E.T. Photo also comes up.. :) Why don't people complain about that one being Photoshopped? :rofl:

[Dennis]

Here we go Chris – this is the best I could do from the jpg.

Cheers

Dennis

PS - do you have a link to Qld plane spotting?

[RobF]

Time to dig out the deconvolution! :P

[rcheshire]

...because they want it to be true...

Probably VH-QOV (QUV is not on the CASA register).

http://www.casa.gov.au/scripts/nc.dll?WCMS:PWA::pc=PC_90127

Manufacturer: BOMBARDIER INC
Model: DHC-8-402
Serial number: 4277
Aircraft first registered in Australia: 17 December 2009

[Kevnool]

Hi Chris

Does the pilot know he is a bit of a celebrity yet ?

Cheers Kev.

[OzRob]

You can vote for this for the APOM for September. It needs some help!!

APOM voting (http://bb.nightskylive.net/asterisk/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=21562)

[steve000]

Nice mate, just reading the feb/mar issue of Sky and Telescope and notice this pic on page 91.. gratz mate well freakin done!

[Dennis]

Hey Chris

I just saw your Aeroplane-Moon photo on the Channel 9 News just before 7:30am, when they were showing a series of “how did they do it” photos that captured just the right moment.

Cheers

Dennis

[Solar]

Hi Chris,
Great going my friend. Especially when so much thought went into the result. Dont worry about the knockers they have nothing else to do with their tiny minds. Pretty much impossible to Photoshop the engine exhaust anyway. Check this out. http://www.eyesonthesun.com.au/gallery.htm

[CJ]

Amazing pic!
Amazing thread!