Binocular recommendations

[_DaveH]

Hi all,

I'm looking to get into astronomy and people on these forums are recommending a pair of binoculars before rushing into buying a telescope. I'm also trying to find some time to go to visit an astronomy club, but work's pretty hectic! :rolleyes:

I've got a mate coming back from the USA soon and binoculars look to be about 1/4 the price there as they are here so I thought I'd get him to grab a pair for me. However, I have a couple of questions:

- Are 9x63 binos a good starting point? Or would 15x70s be better?
- Are Celestron Skymasters well regarded here? I've read about some quality concerns. I was thinking of going for the Celestron Skymaster 9x63s.
- If Celestrons are out, what would people recommend?
- If I did buy binoculars from overseas and they had collimation problems, would I be able to either perform the collimation myself or have them collimated at a shop?

Thanks for any help you can give :)

Dave

[rmcconachy]

G'day Dave,

Have you used binoculars much before (I'm guessing probably not but best to ask)? What is your budget? Do you wear glasses for astigmatism? To address some of your your specific questions:

Are 9x63 binos a good starting point? Or would 15x70s be better? I'd strongly suggest avoiding any binoculars with a magnification above 10x unless you will be mounting them or you have lots of experience holding binoculars. A pair of 15x70 binoculars are not easy to hold still and it is hard to appreciate the view if it is jumping around everywhere. A pair of 9x63 or 10x50 glasses would be a better place to start IMHO.

Are Celestron Skymasters well regarded here? I've no direct experience with these binoculars so I cannot guide you here. There have been several posts on the CloudyNights binoculars forum (http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/postlist.php/Cat/0/Board/binoculars) from people who have bought these binoculars. I highly recommend reading this (http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/1723161/page/0/view/collapsed/sb/5/o/all/fpart/1) (http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/1723161/page/0/view/collapsed/sb/5/o/all/fpart/1) post by EdZ (and anything else on CloudyNights written by EdZ or BillC).

If Celestrons are out, what would people recommend? Depends in large part on the budget question I asked above. Second hand is also an option to consider.

If I did buy binoculars from overseas and they had collimation problems, would I be able to either perform the collimation myself or have them collimated at a shop? Probably a shop (e.g., Bintel) unless you are patient and used to fiddling with gadgets. Getting the optics in both barrels aligned with each other and the central hinge (so that the binoculars stay in alignment when you move the barrels closer together or further apart) can be tricky.

[adman]

I have had a pair of Celestron Skymasters - I think they were 15x70's, and to be honest I would never buy another pair. They felt cheaply made, the optics weren't too bad - but a lot of curvature to the field from about halfway out to the edge.

Then to bang in the final nail, they broke - right at the pivot point near the focusing ring. It was only held together with the most minimal amount of metal, and it fatigued while I was adjusting them for my kids to watch a whale....

I now own a pair of Pentax PCF WPII 20x60's, and the difference is incredible. Quality feel, much better eyecups - the twist-up type, much flatter field. Not to mention waterproof. If I had to buy more bino's I would definitely go Pentax. They are reasonably priced for the performance, but next time I would get maybe their 12x50's in the same range (here (http://www.ryda.com.au/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=6580 9&utm_source=getprice&utm_medium=cpc&Click=284)), as the 20x60's are a little hard to hand hold for astro use, but great for terrestrial use....

Hope that helps

Adam

[_DaveH]

Thanks for the replies guys. I don't want to spend more than about $200, which in Australia would be a low budget but seems to offer a lot more room to move with the current exchange rate when buying from the USA. Within that budget I can get binos like:

Celestron Skymaster 9x63 - http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0007UQNS6?tag=helubuy-20
Orion MiniGiant 9x63 - http://www.optcorp.com/product.aspx?pid=108-110-647-685-75
Pentax PCF II 10x50 - http://www.amazon.com/Pentax-65808-10x50-Waterproof-Binocular/dp/B00076QVQ4/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=photo&qid=1272937758&sr=1-5
Pentax PCF II 12x50 - http://www.amazon.com/Pentax-65809-12x50-Waterproof-Binocular/dp/B00076QVZ0/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&s=photo&qid=1272937758&sr=1-7

And no, I've not used binoculars much before. I don't wear glasses at all, so that's not a problem.

[Liz]

Hi Dave, yes lots of choices for you to check out, and hopefully try.
I have a pair of Andrews 10x70 which are great, think they cost about $100, and are not too heavy, and lots seen in their FOV. :thumbsup:

http://www.andrewscom.com.au/site-section-11.htm

hmmm ... perhaps mine are 10x60.

[rmcconachy]

G'day Dave,

The Pentax PCF II 10x50 should be a good pair of binoculars that will last you many years and $US137 is a very good price.

If you can find a few binoculars to look through even briefly (maybe a local camera shop?) you can get a better idea of what kind of magnification you can hold steady. Most people can handle 10X OK, some prefer a 7x or 8x instead and few (small percentage) can handle 12x, 15x or 16x hand held (generally only after practise). If you find 10x OK then I'd suggest buying a pair of the Pentax PCF II 10x50 you've listed above. If you find 10x too hard to hold still maybe choose the Pentax PCF II 8x40 instead.

Best of luck with your new binoculars whatever they may be! I use mine more than my scopes.

[jjjnettie]

No matter what size binos you buy, I'd still recommend mounting them on a tripod. It keeps both hands free to hold maps and a torch.

[dannat]

Dave, on the cloudy nights bino forum skymasters are not well regarded, and in australia some retailers have them for high prices.(though the japan made 9x63 skymasters are the 1 good one)

when you look at 9x63 vs 15x70 you are comparing unmounted to mounted..you can't really hold 15x70's too much magnification wobble

Pentax make some nice binos but they often have a limited fov - but most are waterproof & sharp close to the edge.

are the orion 9x63 japan made? the japanese ones should be ok, your friend could laos look at the garrett optical site - the 10x50 or 7x50 sig series are well regarded.

if you want them for scanning the sky 7x50(10x50) or 9x63 are the way to go..15x70 to hone in & catch some detail.

Do you live in light polluted areas??if so you will not get more light than a 5mm exit pupil allows (eg 50/10 - 5mm, 50/7 = 7.1)

IN the US the nikon action extreme is also well regarded & can be had at much lower prices than in australia..visit cloudy nights - goto the bino forum & look thru all the reviews of the ones on your list

[ausastronomer]

Hi Dave,

The philosophy for many decades was to buy a pair of binoculars as your first astronomy tool, so you could easily learn the sky; and then progress to a telescope. I still think this is a good way to go, but IMO it certainly holds less credence today than it did 10 years ago with the recent proliferation of cheaper telescopes with Digital Setting Circles and GOTO fitted.

What is your maximum budget and do you have any sporting/other interests which could see your binocular purchase serving double duty? Price is usually a reflection of quality, but not always. Some mid priced binoculars are excellent and some quite expensive binoculars are only fair, but you "usually" get what you pay for. You would be well advised to buy the best binoculars you can afford. Most of the cheaper Chinese imports IMO are pretty average and I would avoid them. This includes some products wearing a "name" label. Unfortunately, these products often get ravishing praise from newcomers on internet forums who have never used a top quality product to know this stuff isn't the greatest.

Keep in mind though that within everyones budget there always exists a product which represents excellent value.

Cheers,
John B

[mithrandir]

Did you look at the P&H costs? That seems to be where they make their profit.

[rmcconachy]

Andrew, the postage costs to a US address don't look too bad to me considering the price. Dave did mention that he had a friend in the US who could buy the binoculars for him.

As others have stated there are plenty of other good choices too, e.g., the Nikon Action Extreme 10x50 (similar US price to the Pentax PCF II). The Garrett Signature Series (same thing sold here by Andrews as the Ultra series for about the same price) get many very good reviews but a pair of 7x50 or 10x50 Ultras is $AUS279.

Another possible approach is to go really cheap and second hand for a first pair of binoculars and then spend a bit more cash on a better second pair only after you have a better idea of how often you will use them and what you like/hate about the first pair. This is effectively what I (unwittingly) did :)

[_DaveH]

Thanks for the replies all. At the moment I'm leaning towards the Orion MiniGiants... they're made in Japan and seem to be well regarded. Hopefully the bigger objective lenses will provide brighter images.

$200 is the max I'm willing to spend on binoculars right now. They're really just to help me learn my way around and if I'm still enjoying astronomy after using them a while then I'll buy an 8" or 10" dob reflector.

[astro744]

BINTEL are the experts and you can try in store. They have a wide range, expert advice and great after sales service.

I would recommend, 7x50, 10x50 or 9x63 as your first pair. 10x and over becomes a little hard to hand hold but of course you get a bit more magnification which helps with small deep sky objects.

I have used 7x42 Vixen Ultima for 18 years and love them since they are very lightweight and have held collimation well.

[ausastronomer]

Hi Dave,

If $200 is your upper limit I would recommend the Pentax PCF WP II 10x50's. These represent excellent value for money and IMO are marginally superior to the Nikon AE. I think 10x50 is the size you should be aiming at. The Pentax PCF WP series have excellent eye relief and are very comfortable to use in addition to being very good optically for the price.

Cheers,
John B

[Robh]

Dave,

I have had several binoculars and looked through a good few. I bought the Orion Mini Giant 9x63 binos just over a year ago. I notice they have come down in price considerably.
The Orion is most impressive.
For the aperture size, I find that they are compact and light enough to hold comfortably for multiple viewing stints . They are well made and the focuser has a smooth and easy to focus operation. The long eye relief seems to work well with the rubber eye guards out. They have a wide field of view (5 degrees). The resolution of the binos is excellent and the light gathering capacity seems to exceed its aperture size. Another thing that impresses me is that they also bring out truer star colours.

Regards, Rob.

[_DaveH]

I went down to Bintel today, which conveniently happens to be a 5 minute walk from work, and looked at a few binos. The Pentax PFC WP 10x50s were nice to look through but I found that they needed to be held in an uncomfortable position, with my elbows held together. I then tried the Nikon Action Extreme 10x50s and they felt nicer to hold but the eyecups weren't as nice. Finally I tried the Orion MiniGiant 9x63s and they were really nice, much bigger objective lenses, comfortable holding position. Really leaning towards the Orions right now :)