M42 The Great Orion Nebula Repro!

[gregbradley]

Orion is reasonably high in the sky now in the early morning.

I was imaging the other night and thought I would image it despite a 2/3rds full moon.

Tak BRC250, FLI Microline 8300, Astronomik filters. LRGB 44 24 24 24
The core is a composite of 5 x 15 and 5 x 30 second shots for each of
LRGB at a chilly -45C CCD temperature. At these sorts of temperatures
the FLI is virtually noisless.

Best viewed hitting F11 to make it more full screen.

http://upload.pbase.com/gregbradley/image/116832902/original

Greg.

[mick pinner]

magnificent Greg, with the M42 season ahead that will be hard to match.

[batema]

That is an amazing photo.

Mark

[h0ughy]

it certainly is an excellent teaser this early into the season. Lovely work

[Benny L]

very nice indeed.. cant wait for these bloody clouds to piss off so i can have a crack at it myself lol

[lacad01]

Wow, that's a beauty:eyepop:.
Funny enough I was up at 5AM this morning and was good to see Orion again:)

[toryglen-boy]

excellent !!

i will resist the usual "good focus, excellent tracking" comments.

:lol:

but, its a nice vibrant image, with a wide range of colours, and its a cracker


well done.

:thumbsup:

[renormalised]

Wonderful image, Greg. A real pearl for the beginning of the M42 season:D:D

It's going to be a hard one to beat:D:D

[peter_4059]

Magnificent image Greg. I really like the colours.

Peter

[desler]

Simply beautiful greg.

Darren

[Rigel003]

Terrific detail in the core. Great image, Greg.

[multiweb]

Awesome shot Greg! Love the colors you got in the process. :thumbsup:

[Paul Haese]

Looks a great image Greg,

just a couple of things. It looks like the layering in the core needs a little colour matching. I can see a distinct division between the core and the outer image. Is the colour deliberate or am I viewing this incorrectly?

Also quite a few stars have double diffraction spikes. A couple of them are certainly double stars, but I don't think all of them are. Is some of the data a bit doubled? Again, tell me if I am wrong. Not the first time.

Aside from these small things, I would be very happy with an image like that. It certainly gives me some idea what I will be looking at with the RC and the QSI.

Paul

[Matty P]

Awesome image Greg. I love the colours you have managed to bring out. Very nice indeed. Excellent detail as well.

:thumbsup:

[renormalised]

M42
season open today
$24/pelt

:D:D:D

[Hagar]

Lovely Greg. The Tak certainly produces the goods. I can't help but wonder if your focus may have been a little off due to the double difraction spikes or was it a result of registration or filter use.

A hard one to beat from my location and it's still a bit low at the hours I keep.

Very nice.

[dpastern]

That's a good shot! I can't wait for M42 season again :)

Dave

[sjastro]

I'm not in the market. M42 is an overdone boring object.

Steven

PS Nice image Greg.:)

[multiweb]

:eyepop: nooo waayyyy! :lol:

[gregbradley]

Thanks Mick.



I am glad you like it.



Thanks Houghy.



Clouds grrrr





Its an interesting area.Lots to image.



Thanks for that.



Thanks Peter. It is always an area of outrageous colours.







Yes I was happy with the core detail. 10 inches of Tak aperture helps. Plus the seeing was good at 3:20am!



Thanks Marc. I toned down the colours they were a bit over the top in some versions.



Thanks Matty. I was happy to get so much data in the core. That was the combo of 15 and 30 seconds.






Not sure what the double spikes are. Its not the focus as you can see some really tiny stars there. I wonder if it had something to do with the moon or possibly double stars. Its in the single subs of red and lum that I checked so not a filter or focus. Its also in a galaxy shot I did so perhaps its something to do with the moon.

Yes it is pretty early in the morning. I didn't start this image until 3:20am!



Its duck season I mean Orion season again.



I know what you mean Steven but it'd be nice to do a 20 hour version though! Just count your lucky stars we can't reach NGC7000 here!

[TrevorW]

Might be my monitor but a tad too pink for me although Jen would love it

Good image by the way

Orion shall I or not, me thinks maybe too soon

[gregbradley]

Hi Trevor,

Monitors very tremendously. I use my laptop which is callibrated as part of Adobe. But the business computer monitor makes any red look ghastly.

It is quite red although not particularly pink on my monitor. I toned down the red from earlier versions and it is vibrant for sure but the red histogram was twice the size of the blue and green so there is a lot of red in it.

Colour is a hard one and I try to pull it back a tad as it is easy to present an image too saturated and I have done that many times in the past.

Greg.

[renormalised]

You'll have to make a trip up to my neck of the woods. The "NAN" is an easy target from here:D:D

[javier alves]

:eyepop: is very very nice.

regards.

[AlexN]

I agree with Paul Haese regarding the core area blending... The colours in the core are very different, making the blending job look fairly obvious.. Other than that its great to see M42 in the sky again.. I can't wait to have a crack at it again this time around...

Steven - You've got to be kidding right? Overdone, yes, I wont dispute that.. But boring? I want what you've been smoking! M42 is one of those targets that no matter how many times you see it, its still awesome.. and the deeper you go, the more you realise there is a wealth of beauty in the area surrounding M42... The gap between M42 and the running man for instance is a perfect example... theres plenty of dusty areas, reflection neb, emission nebs and colourful star clusters all in one tiny area of the orion region..

Each to their own I guess.. but M42 is the staple of my astro-photography year... I have more images of M42 than I have of any other target, I can't wait to hit it and the horsehead again this year.

[Alchemy]

lovely colors, rich yet detailed

[sjastro]

The trouble with commonly imaged objects such as M42 is that when Joe Bloggs takes an image which is considered to have "raised the bar", it usually initiates a flurry of images that may not have superior data, but end being sharper and have greater contrast and colour saturation to Joe's image.

Now while this may not be such a bad thing, the obvious question arises, at what point does artistic license ruin an image?

The fact is that over the years M42 seems to have developed a range of multicolor unknown from the days when David Malin imaged M42 with the 4 metre AAO. The AAO picture looks very ordinary compared to many M42 images today.

I find objects such as M42 not particularly interesting given that we have probably lost what M42 should actually look like in a typical colour image.

Regards

Steven

[bmitchell82]

Unfortunately for you 20 years ago technology has lept ahead so far its not funny. 1995 486 DX 66 4mb ram 1 gig hdd... 2009... crist i don't know but its unreal.... cameras are far more sensitive in different wavelengths. Im guessing that if David Malin utilized the current technology these colours would magically appear. This is a common thing i come up against in astro photography getting told im cheating and i really don't know what im doing by the more experienced and even more commonly the older people of this hobby (no offence to all you guys that arnt like this because you are out there and i really appriciate your input to my learning). but really im a hobbiest and i utilize the best equipment i can afford (uni student budget) if this produces a colour that you have never seen. oh well now you have seen it!

I myself only have a 10" telescope, raw straight out of the camera though nebulosity when it reads the raw data and runs its de bayer filter comes up in orange/blue/purple/red colours.

If you cant see how well technology has progressed then just go along to your local deep sky night and see whats happening. go along with no preconcived ideas and take what you see on board.

Im with alex on this one. M42 is a beautiful object and well worth the imaging time spent on it... KEEP BRINGING ON THE WEIRD COLOURS PEOPLE I LOVE IT:thumbsup:

[RB]

Very nicely done Greg, the image as a whole really appeals to me.
I can't explain the double spikes, would be interesting to find out why they occur.

Thanks for sharing.

:thumbsup:

[Nightskystargaz]

Greg.

:), That was a beautiful pic. I really like it, I'll be looking for some more.

Thanks,

Tom

[prokyon]

Wow, a great pic!

I like it how you captured the heart of the nebula.

regards

Werner

[gregbradley]

I've been told by another that the collimation is off slightly.
That may well be the case. I had it collimated by Texas Nautical but that was a while ago. I'll check the collimation next time I use it.

Greg.

[gregbradley]

Bring on the NGC7000 images! That's interesting you catch it up there.
I suppose you could get M31 and the Veil as well?



Thanks Javier and nice to hear from someone in Argentina!



The core could be lightened more perhaps. I used a different technique than before for blending in the core. Perhaps that is why. I couldn'tm find the earlier technique on the net which had too many steps to remember easily. It was making a clipping mask and you blur the core as a mask down to the area you want and then combine them. But the steps were a bit involved. This one was using the colour range tool to select the bright area of the core and large feathering then saving the selection. Then loading the selection on the main exposure and adjusting the brightness etc.

I agree M42 is a very photogenic area and deserves attention and I personally don't tire of it. Each year though I decide to do a mage exposure version and haven't yet ( except for an FSQ shot about 8 hours). Maybe this year once my new observatory is up and I'll have more imaging time available.



Thanks for that. The red histogram was 3 times bigger than the others.



It probably is the most imaged object but remember back Steven when you were first imaging and the thrill of a decent image of M42 was pretty good eh?



Weird colours coming up!



Thanks Tom. There'll be more coming.



Thanks Werner. M42 core burns out very very easily so 15 and 30 second shots were taken. Even with that short I checked a few test images first to make sure the core wasn't burnt out before I did the imaging run.

[sjastro]

Greg,

If it needs collimation don't worry. BRC-250s are not as difficult to collimate as their reputation suggests.

I've been able to accurate collimate mine using my ST-XME.

Steven

[strongmanmike]

Yeeeeh noooot baaaad Greg :confuse3:....some minor improvements possible I guess but oveall hard to complain about an up close and personal image of M42 like this :thumbsup:

M42 is perfectly ok to image as often as people like as far as I am concerned......err?..just like Centaurus A :P

Mike

[gregbradley]

That's good news Steven.

How do you collimate using your camera?

I noticed in out of focus stars lately the rings weren't concentric but wasn't sure if that is required with an RC as my RCOS often seemed a bit like that even when the collimation per the Tak collimation scope seemed to be very close.

Greg.

[sjastro]

The most important point when using a CCD for collimation is to make sure the camera is perfectly square to the optics.

I collimate the BRC-250 very slightly inside focus. I use planet mode in CCDops software to produce a highly magnified image of a star. This allows small errors to be easily detected.

The exposure time is important. The exposure should be as short as possible to catch periods of good seeing. I collimate by centering the small spot of light in the shadow the secondary.

CCDinspector typically gives 1-2 arc-second error.

Regards

Steven

[gregbradley]

That sounds easy enough.

Do you leave the secondary alone then and just adjust the primary?

Greg.

[sjastro]

The instructions are for adjusting the primary.

If you need to centre the secondary you will need to use the Tak collimation scope.

Steven

[gregbradley]

Thanks Steven. That is very helpful

Greg.

[gregbradley]

I've reprocessed the original image to blend the core in more naturally.

http://www.pbase.com/gregbradley/image/116832902

I have also added a cropped image of the core image which was blended.

This image is:

LRGB 5 x 15 seconds each and 5 x 30 seconds each with luminance 1x1 and RGB 2x2.

This gives a massive 225 seconds total exposure! Fast download times are appreciated with lots of little exposures and 3:30am in the morning:)

http://www.pbase.com/gregbradley/image/116885128

Greg.

[Octane]

Greg,

Ah, another oil painting. I love it.

Steven, I know what you mean about it being overdone. However, bear in mind, that there's new people entering this hobby all the time, and they, too, want their own version to take home and show everyone. That's quite understandable, yeah?

I had a go at it once in 2006 and it looked pretty crap (it's posted in this forum if anyone's interested in seeing my horrible attempt). I look forward to doing it again now that my processing and image capture skills have improved. Not to mention better equipment than in the past.

Cheers.

Regards,
Humayun

[RB]

Greg that's a lovely repro mate !
The image now looks better balanced imho.

Cheers
Andrew

[sjastro]

Unfortunately my comments have been taken way out of context.

Anyone is perfectly free to take an image and do anything to the data.
If I was to image M42, I'd be very proud if it came out looking like the Malin image. Malin's image is a scientific image.

My perspective perhaps is a bit different to others. When I look at an image, I hope to see the scientific content. Unfortunately the more an image is processed, the more the scientific content disappears.

It's no coincidence that Hubble telescope images are separately processed, one for public consumption with a WOW factor, the other for the scientists.

Regards

Steven

[gregbradley]

Try taking 2 or 3 sets of exposures. You have to know at what point a short exposure starts to burn out. On some setups that may be as quickly as 15 seconds. Take a set of those. Then take your long exposures. Then do the technique below.





Thanks Andrew. Yeah it was a different technique although simpler to do.

Here's how its done"

1. Long exposure image/colour range tool/select the burnt out core/feather 100pixels/save selection

2. Short core exposure/load selection/edit/copy.

3. Long exposure/edit/paste.

Now do curves or colour balance or shadows/highlights to adjust the core.

I used a bit of the sponge tool set to dodge to rub on the junction to further brighten the junction where it was a bit dark/light at the junction.

That's it.

Greg.



Don't worry Steven I understood you perfectly. I guess there are different audiences and the science community would definitely have different needs. For example I don't think they would appreciate a starless version of the Lagoon. But for the audience that likes colourful space images it is awesome.

I like your images of little known objects and you have nice niche going there just like Thomas Davis has with imaging dust areas.

Greg.

[gregbradley]

Thanks Mike did you see the repro? I intend to do a really long exposure job one day. One time when the weather is good and I have a few days there.

[tornado33]

I like how such a huge dynamic range is shown in such high detail.
Scott

[gregbradley]

Thanks Scott. It does take a special approach to get it all.

Greg.