Milky way from Sydney- My first stacked photo.

[Lumen Miner]

I really shouldn't post this. It is unfinished and only just acceptable.
I haven't had enough time to try, subs, flats, darks??? (so confusing, still working out exposure)
I just enjoy placing sometype of time stamped example of my progress in astrophotography.
I have had my first dslr for all of a few days. I hope to do some much much longer exposures, very soon.

This is a total of 14, 20 second frames. It also constitutes my very first stacked image.

No tracking mount, just astride must trusty Alt-Az mount. Rigged ontop, a ball mount with a pan/tilt head connected to that.


Thanks for your help, getting this far everyone!! :D


Edit~ is there anymore clusters visible (i know my labels are sloppy)? I have to keep going.

[multiweb]

That's actually not bad at all Mitchell. Keep at it. :thumbsup:

[Lumen Miner]

Keep at it I will indeed!! I really enjoy this learning curve.

I constantly chuckle at myself, as atleast three times I have been caught out.

I have been at astronomy for 3 months now, astrophotography 2 months.

I keep thinking that I have reached the limits of my equipment.
I find myself realising that I have indeed not reached my equipments limit, yet my own.

It is a very humbling experience, I am enjoying every moment of it, as it means I can improve myself. :)

[AlexN]

Looks nice to me!

Well done on your first stacked image! Looking forward to more!

[leon]

Mitchell, for your first attempt at any combined image, regardless of flats and darks etc, you have done well with such short exposures, ;)keep at it mate, we all started were you are now. :)

Leon :thumbsup:

[Lumen Miner]

Thank you for your very encouraging words.

Leon~ I must say, you have been a particular inspiration in regards to trying to achieve some adequate shots.... I am only beginning to build my double arm barn door and would love to pick your brains on a couple of concepts. I have studied your pictures you have up and hope to replicate some of your principles... you do realise you are very close to having your own "named" barn door design... It is simply EPIC!!

[RobF]

Well done Mitchell. You can already see more Milky Way than most of Sydney likely knows exists!

I'd be very happy with that for an early effort. :)

[DavidU]

Mitchell, you have done very well ! Much better than my early shots.
There is a program Nebulousity (spelling) that easly tames the back ground color.
Still, great job !
http://www.stark-labs.com/nebulosity.html

[Lumen Miner]

Oh, I am more than happy believe me!!! :D
Although I know my efforts, at editing have much to be desired. I can see I need to put many more hours, into learning this craft. :)

I live near / level with Thompsons Corner. I believe this is one of the higher / highest points in Sydney. My skies seem fairly clear, when the weather allows.

[Lumen Miner]

LoL!! I downloaded it for exactly that reason (background), but I think I got the Mac version... Weird DMG file extension after download.
Almost finished downloading now, will post results soon...

Thanks for the advice..

[renormalised]

That's the Mac version:D:D:D

Very good first effort...well done!!!!:D

[Lumen Miner]

Ok, I still can't figure out how to dim down the background in Nebulosity. Although it has allowed me to bring out some colours...

Can anyone tell me, if that red hue is fake and just me stuffing with the colours?



Edit~ Just noticed I lost alot of detail to get the colours... back to the drawing board...... <---- Funny that expression now, not so may draftsman left. CAD is the devil I tell you!!

Edit2~ It knocked out a lot of the over exposure though, didn't it.... hmmmmm, trade-off.... Which looks better???

[DavidU]

Mitchell, what camera are you using?

[Lumen Miner]

My BRAND NEW (:thumbsup:) Canon 350D with Tamron lense. ;) Had it less than a week. My first DSLR, and I am STOKED!!!! I would be happy if I could walk around all day with my eye to the eye piece.... I really really dig the no live-view on it.... So so happy I got a camera without it.... feels, I don't know, more... earthly...?? Sorry i'm talking gibberish.... I'm 26 years old, I think I am in some type of time warp continuim. I would be in my prime when SLR's were peak technology... I like my night vision too. ;)

[Astrobserver99]

Congratulations on your first image. Very well done.

[Lumen Miner]

Thankyou!! I must say, I am very overwhelmed with all the responces. I was really just posting for my own purposes. Your reponces have given me much enthusiasm. I can't wait to stack many more than 14 images... this hobby is truley ever perplexing, is has me deeply entrapted in its clutches.

[Kirkus]

I think those are wonderful, Mitchell! We're a strange bunch, those of us who enjoy the learning as much as the results.

Keep at it. :thumbsup:

[StephenM]

Nice image Mitchell! I've just started image stacking as well, and I'm also learning the art of image processing as I go along. I can see I'll have to try a wider-angle image with my 18-50 lens...perhaps even tonight...

Cheers,
Stephen

[Lumen Miner]

I know you have!! ;) Whom do you think I'm following, step by step.... 20seconds exposures sound familar? LoL. You would also notice I used your, image and clusters to label my image. Thanks. I probably should have asked first.

I know what you mean on the wider-angle image. I was hoping to capture more area of the sky. I have high trees surrounding my back yard limiting my scope of view.

I will try and go to a local park and try wider.

Thank for your comment! :)

[Hagar]

Great Effort Mitchel.. A very lovely area of sky, well imaged.

To use the background offset in nebulosity, just open the image in nebulosity and click on the backgroung offset menu item. When the chart comes up do not adjust it just close the chart and save your image. Do NOT ADJUST THE SLIDERS.

Coming along very nicely for light poluted Sydney and short exposures.
Well Done.

[Lumen Miner]

Ok then, oh that turned out better!! Thanks!

I would still like to bring more colour out. Any ideas anyone, or should I just take more shots?

[DavidU]

There ya go Mitchell ! Awesome.
You realise you will be poor for the rest of your life LOL

[Lumen Miner]

Well, I intend on fully reaching my current equipments potential, before purchasing better.

Hopefully that will keep my spending to a minimum... :D

I know what you mean those, the "itch" has already started.... :P

[Hagar]

If you have Photoshop or similar program. Image Adjust, Hue and Saturation, and lift the saturation slider a bit until you are happy with the colour.

Your next big step is to start calibrating your images with Flats, Darks and Biaas frames. This will lift the dark region on the right of your image which I suspect is vignetting and even up the whole image quite a lot. Just remember to get the best out of Flats you really need to take Bias or darks of some kind.

Good luck and keep at it. (Start Saving, your hooked)

[Lumen Miner]

Thanks, I am using gimp and have had lil' play with hue and saturation. Just stabbing in the dark though.... I'll give it another go, after work tonight. I also want to try and take alot more exposures....

If I was to take say 100 20 second shots, would I therefore need to take 100 20 second dark frames to be successful?



"Good luck and keep at it. (Start Saving, your hooked)"
Oh!! I was wondering what that sharp pain, in the back of my shoulder was!!! :rofl: :thumbsup:

[renormalised]

Wrong part of the anatomy....right pain. It's in the hip pocket where you'll be feeling it!!!!:P:D

[bojan]

I think there is not much benefit in taking that many shots.. from my experience, 10-20 is more than enough to (almost) remove the sensor noise. Especially if you are close to the city. The same number of darks should be adequate.

The real improvement (in terms of the number of objects recorded) will be imaging from the dark site and with longer exposures (and this will depend on the tracking performance of your mount).

EDIT:
Keep in mind that the shutter has a finite life time, ~30-50.000 shots.. Mine went faulty after 3500 only and that set me back by $250 (normally this is $500, I was lucky because people from Canon service were very kind to me !!)

EDIT2:
I am using Digital Photo Professional for curves and background light pollution removal (this came with my Canon) and it is more than adequate.

[Octane]

I might be wrong, but, unless you have a tracking mount, taking 100 exposures and stacking them will cause you to have field rotation.

Regards,
Humayun

[bojan]

Not really.
DSS takes care of this automatically.

[bojan]

To give you an example, have a look at those two images. The second one is made from RAW file, the first one is a stack from 15 exposures, 45 sec (on eq mount) with 135mm lens (Tair-11A), stacked in DSS and processed with DPP.
The LP in Melbourne is pretty terrible, as it is visible on the unprocessed image.
If you are interested in how exactly the image is processed, I can post my method, it is pretty straight forward.

EDIT:
I played a bit with DPP on your image, the result is also here. Not much better than what you have done... I only managed to stretch it a bit more, but the colour balance is similar

[Hagar]

Ten or 20 are more than adequate with such short exposures but the real impact will be made by taking flats and using them in your calibration process..

The pain you are experiencing is probably a stab wound from wife of girl friend.:whistle:
If you give up astrophotography you will feel a warming hand on your head and a voice echoing "Good boy". :lol::rofl::lol:

[Mike21]

Well done Mitchell. Are you the guy who built the one sided Dob?

What's DSS Bojan. How can I use it to take care of field rotation due to a slow RA drive on an EQ5? Hopefully it is a moot point because I'll have a HEQ6P before Christmas.

[bojan]

DSS is Deep Sky Stacker .. and it is freeware. Sorry for not having been more clear :shrug:

It can be downloaded here:
http://deepskystacker.free.fr/english/index.html

It will rotate images to be stacked as required, however individual images should be free from field rotation effects..

[Lumen Miner]

Nope not mine, I know the one you mean though.

[Lumen Miner]

Yup my images were not too good, very light polluted. you can barly see the milky way in them, basically black....... I'm not shooting in RAW yet either, just JPEG.... I will try soon though.

Yes, I would appreciate hearing your method... I am not one, to turn down free knowledge... Thanks..

[DavidU]

I would like to read Bojan's methods as well.

[bojan]

Well, your image is quite good, considering from where it was taken :-)

The method I developed to remove LP background is illustrated below: they are all screenshots from Digital Photo Professional Tool Palette, that I am sure came with your Canon.

1) After opening stacked image from DSS (in Tiff format, darks and flats are applied as well as part of DSS processing), you have the histogram looking like (1).

2) In RGB tab, you form the curve like it is shown on image 2, by clicking and dragging the curve to the desired position. I usually start with lower left side and add 2 or 3 points more.

3) Adjust the individual thresholds for each colour channel (by right-clicking and dragging the left-most edge of the histogram frame in appropriate tab), such that the histograms for colours are more or less aligned, like shown on 3 for Red.
For images from light polluted sites, you will have to do it for Red and Green only.. the Blue one will usually remain as it was. The result is shown on image 4.

4) Then, go back to RGB tab and adjust thresholds as shown on 6.

5) repeat the procedure once more from 3), until you have histogram as shown on image 6.

6) Finally adjust upper threshold like shown on 7.

And this is it.. 5 minutes of work or even less (not counting here the time for stacking, this may take longer, depending on number of images and the speed of your computer). All done without additional expensive software, not a single additional cent spent.. (you should already have DPP, since it comes with each Canon DSLR). You can upgrade it on Canon official site to the latest version for free.
The method also works for dark sites, but then you may have to play with Blue channel as well, and the first RGB curve may not need to be so "curvy".. because there will be much less LP background.

[Lumen Miner]

[QUOTE=bojan;478944]Well, your image is quite good, considering from where it was taken :-)

The method I developed to remove LP background is illustrated below:


WoW!! I will try this exact method tonight. I want to capture a few more frames and try again.


Thanks for the effort in the post with pictures especially.... That should almost be its own topic, great for all us learning.

[bojan]

You are most welcome :thumbsup:
I am always glad to help, especially when my advice does not have any hidden costs attached :P
We should always try to use what we have... and usually it is almost always possible to obtain decent results :)

[spacezebra]

This is magnificant Mitchell!

Cheers Petra d.

[Lumen Miner]

Your advice may not have any hidden costs attached, but it is worth more than money can buy....

I just hit the Crux up, 22 x 20 seconds exposures. I took 22 x 20 second dark frames with the cap on...
I'll follow your steps and see how I go....

I am humbled by your help. I know you are extremley knowledgable and really do appreciate you taking your own time to analyse my work and assist...

I only hope one day, if I listen and learn what i'm told, then perhaps I could potentially help others in the future.

Thankyou.

Edit~ If your advice goes to plan (as I know it will), may I please start a thread in the beginners forum on how to adjust background, for beginners that is... I would like to directly copy your text and photos, if I may that is.
I feel it should be easily accesible as I believe this is a vital step between "pointing and shooting" the sky and actually aquiring an adequate non-flushed out with light photo.

[Lumen Miner]

I think "magnificant" may be pushing it... ;) I appreciate your comment ALOT!

Like you would have read, this is my first effort, I am quite over-whelmed by the responces here. So many expert astronomers / astrophotographers. I really wasn't expecting more than one or two comments saying "It's alright, but needs work."

Edit~ Can anyone explain in laymans terms, how to multi quote?? I have tried and tried but still can't work it out.... I feel like I am abusing this forums by doing so many double posts... sorry, my manners are horrible.

[Octane]

To quote posts, click the +" button underneath the posts, that you want to quote, then hit Add Reply down the bottom left.

Regards,
Humayun

[MrB]

Hi Mitchell,
The button to the right of 'Quote' that looks like +" will select the first posts to be quoted, then for the last of the posts you want to quote, hit the 'Quote' button and all will be quoted.

If you want to split-up a quote, you will need to start using BB Codes (http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/misc.php?do=bbcode), like

Simon

[Lumen Miner]

Thanks guys, I so should not be on the internet!! I think I could very possibly be, one of those "Internet, pain the butts". :whistle:

[bojan]

Be my guest, mate, no worries..
We are all amateurs here and sharing of information is a prerogative, IMHO....

[Poita]

If you are using nebulosity, you can adjust the hue and saturation in there as well.

[Octane]

Holy thread necro, Batman!

I haven't seen the OP around here for years. :S

H

[Ross G]

A great start Mitchell.

Good luck.

Ross.