Stay-Safe committee hogwash...

[Peter Ward]

ABC news (Sydney) tonight ran a piece on motorised scooters for the edlerly.

Shock horror. 71 deaths in around the last decade have occured with an elderly driver at the throttle (yes, Virginia, around eight people a year die on motorised scooters in Australia)

Shock Horror x2.. Speed...yes a cracking 10km/hr....may have been a factor !!!!

(play down any other geriatric problems CHD, Stroke, respiratory disease, Diabeties etc. )

Who writes this brain-dead-drivel? Worse still, who actually believes it???

P.S.

In 2007 some 44 Australians died from falling out of bed. Perhaps they were beds... err...with wheels?

[Ian Robinson]

Some of those geriatrics really fly on their motorised chairs .... a lot faster than 10 km ph.

Nuff said , this thread is a bit too reactionary for me.

[Fossil]

This sort of brain-dead drivel is churned out by "experts" who are usually "qualified" and, unfortunately, are listened to by that other brain-dead group - politicians.
Once, holding a driver's licence was a privilege, and the holder usually took some pride in their ability to drive.
That was back when people were taught to drive, not taught how to get their licence.
It is indeed unfortunate that our politicians and judges/magistrates listen to these "experts" rather than listen to people who know what they are talking about.
As for scooters, they are a menace on our roads and, fortunately, natural selection will take care of most of them.

[Bassnut]

Im in this game. Liability is where its ALL at. Just a scratch on one of those elderly darlings and the Manufacturer, retailer and RTA/council gets there arse sued. We are catching up to a litigouse US type attitude, fast.

[stephenb]

I agree in part, Peter. I don't take much notice of these "column filler" stories from the newspaper.

However we do have several motorised scooter users in our town and they do not obey "courtesy rules" when it comes to keeping left on the foot path and "speeding" I have personally witnessed some questionable driving from these citizens in recent times, most of the behavour comes down to common courtesy and obeying simple road rules. Some here in our town cross against pedestrian lights, assuming that they have right of way and expect vehicles to stop for them. We have one particular gentleman who crosses at a cross-road intersection diagonally! from corner to corner, instead of crossing using two sets of ped lights, he uses one! I politely abused him once and he told me to go forth and multiply!!! Couldn't believe it!

[sheeny]

Typical sensationalist media.

What's something that we can use to shock the readers/viewers? Nice old people being killed by these evil machines... Perspective has no place in the media unfortunately.

Yep, scooters are so dangerous you are at greater risk staying in bed!

The swine flu is the flavour of the season, but how do swine flu mortality rates compare to the normal flu? How do they compare to the road toll, or workplace deaths?

Nah... it all just sensationalism to sell papers or keep you watching the box... Hell, some countries are governed this way!

I'm afraid I'm a crusty old cynic when it comes to the media (I have several years experience as a media officer! Spin??? Which way???:lol:), marketing and sales people.

Al.

[Enchilada]

Ian said;
"Some of those geriatrics really fly on their motorised chairs .... a lot faster than 10 km ph."

No electric wheelchair or scooters goes faster than 10 kph, or they have to be registered with State Governments as vehicles. Most wheelchairs are restricted to less than 8 kph - one I've measured is 7.2 kph as maximum.
Considering most people can run faster than this, running would be much more dangerous!
The problem is of course mass, via momentum, in hitting something. 150 to 300 kg at max speed is possibly dangerous. Most deaths actually occur when the wheelchair or scooters which are 'wrapped' or crushed by moving cars. :scared: - they don't stick to footpaths but drive down the roads. (You can be booked for DYI in any motorised devices.)

There is a push to registrar all wheelchairs and scooters for a few years now... no doubt do gooders continuing wanting a strong grip on society.. Mongrels IMO. :mad2:

[Waxing_Gibbous]

Actually, thats quite a LOT of people killed by something so slow.
I am trying to envisage a scenario were someone could be killed by one.
I suppose if the driver nodded-off and ran into traffic...
Or if the victim were themselves a bit aged and slow...
Drive-by shootings committed by pensioners, I have trouble believing.
A little more info on "how" would be interesting.
I've wanted a senior-scooter since I was 25. Mostly to get from the living room to the fridge.
Now with 65 a lot closer than 25, I may be able to justify one (though it'll have to be a 4X4 ). Rest assured I will bring the same responsible attitude to scooter-ing as I do to driving my sports car :D

[jjjnettie]

Before you know it, they'll be trying to take their scooters and wheelchairs off them, "For Their Own Good".
I'd like to immobilize them for just a week and see how they'd cope.

[Enchilada]

The ABC referred article is at;
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/08/10/2651426.htm

(Note the very first statement "Mobility scooter drivers have been warned to be extremely careful when using their vehicles." is wrong. They are not vehicles unless they are faster than 10 kpm. (None go this fast by law.)

Also the article says they are being killed on roads.

Those who ride in such devices should actually all be driving on the blasted footpath!

[dpastern]

I think some of the factors will not necessarily be the fault of the scooter owners, but drivers on the roads etc. It's reasonably common to see drivers ONLY stop at zebra crossings at the very last moment. The old saying of never cross until you make eye contact with the driver seems to not be commonly adhered to today, especially with so many idiots on the roads.

Also, since scooters are primarily owned by older people, or semi disabled people, one has to question their ability, even at 10km/h, to control a scooter. The designs have several issues - very high centre of gravity being the main one. Another one is that they have no real safety capsule for the riders.

I'd like to see the percentage of users, vs deaths - it's probably still lowish, and probably matches the percentages for the same age brackets driver cars.

I agree that the media sensationalises, it's how they sell and make money. Swine flu, terrorism are 2 topics that come to mind that are sensationalised very heavily, but in reality, pose little threat to the ordinary populace. It doesn't help that most of the "aussie" media is owned by US moguls, and pushes US interests. Hell, our goddamn TV stations push US crap, not that I watch TV.

It's all about money. And power.

Dave

[Waxing_Gibbous]

I've just realised...
Is anyone else not struck by the irony (read "mortally terrified"), that this anti-safety council thread was started by someone who appears to be a commercial airline pilot:eyepop:

[dpastern]

Pilots train pretty damn hard to get where they are, especially commercial pilots. I think Peter is not so much knocking saftey, but knocking some idiocy and sensationalism in reporting.

Dave

[Peter Ward]

Just remember...as was promoted by the QLD RTA....every kilometer over is a killer! ;) ...these senior rev-heads were probably doing...12km/hr..maybe even 13 km/hr when they met their maker....what the Kenworth Truck was doing is simply not relevant.

[Peter Ward]

:doh:

Bugger. I keep forgetting speed kills!

Anyone got a 'wiz wheel' to tell me how fast Mach 0.86 is again? :)

[Waxing_Gibbous]

I'm just NEVER flying again:lol:

[Peter Ward]

Too right! I have the same thought mid pacific, 3.30am, stareing at dials
(OK, these days, LCD's ) with another 4 hours to ETA!! Bugger! Bugger !

BTW.... IMHO... the stay-safe council are indeed a pack of drongos.

[marc4darkskies]

Peter, surely you realise this kind of reporting is government sponsored to warm us up for some new, much needed safety legislation!? Ah yes, I see it now - we'll get those lovely old folks to wear helmets and seatbelts, license them (red 'P' limited to 5kph, green 'P' to 7kph), enforce a zero blood alcohol limit, have anti-hoon legislation (any old person caught dragging or doing doughnuts will have their scooter crushed) and finally put airbags in that form an inflatable cocoon around the driver so that in the event of a mishap they simply bounce around for a little while (visualise the mars lander system used for the rovers). :)

By the time you're hooning around in your scooter (with a yellow badge & black stallion on the bonnet), it will be a much safer proposition!

Cheers, Marcus

[marki]

Don't laugh about silly politicians, they will do anything to be seen backing a "good cause". I remember some fool british MP demanding the use of airbags on motor bikes in the UK . They were to be set off automatically if the lean angle exceeded 10 degrees or something similar:D.

If the oldies have to wear helmets do they get GT stripes on them :)

Mark

[Peter Ward]

Yeah Yeah....but as a priority...what are we going to do about the 44 odd Aussies...over 5x the number of hooning scooter fatalities... who kill themselves.. each year... falling out of bed.

Full face helmet on after brushing? (dental care is important too...) :)

[marki]

Seat belts or would that be bed belts :P. It will be on the next election promise list.

Mark

[marc4darkskies]

You've heard of pool fences ... how about bed fences??!!

[Octane]

I see that the majority of the posters in this thread are against the sensationalising, or even portrayal of this story on TV.

Rest assured, however, that there is some semblance of truth to their story. When I used to take the bus to Macquarie University, I saw one elderly dude on his scooter in the bus lane on the M7. Not just once.

My $0.02.

Regards,
Humayun

[Peter Ward]

Aye carrumba. The scooter is not the problem.

That's what Darwin Awards are for.

Sadly the gene pool is probably contaminated already :)

[Peter Ward]

Humm. Bondage? Nah...better not go there...

[Peter Ward]

Trawling the ABS death data for 2007...52 Australians died due "forces of nature"

Scooters from space?

[Enchilada]

:lol::lol::lol:

[renormalised]

hahahaha...sounds like a skit from a Goodies episode:eyepop::P:P:D:D

Or something a politician might dream up:P:D

[Waxing_Gibbous]

This brings to mind to the late '70s when they first introduced 1.5ltr bottles of Coke/Pepsi etc.
Reportedly the (then) glass bottles were over-pressurised. Some exploded (allegedly) killing 3 people in the first year, before switching to plastic.
I wish ill on no-one, but really, if you are killed by an exploding pop bottle or seniour-scooter, don't you think your time was already up and this was the universe's last-ditch effort to get rid of you?

[Ian Robinson]

So many responses in this thread .... everyone must be bored out of their brains tonight ....

That includes me .... VideoEzy was my saviour tonight .

[Ian Robinson]

Oops !

[Enchilada]

Ian

You missed the great cyborg sci-fi 11.40 movie on SBS One, "Natural City", which is a Blade Runner like movie with heaps of brilliant effects. Made in South Korea in 2003. Nearly better than anything from the Video-Ezy etc. It is similarly based on the matrix and the William Gibson Cyberpunk books. The first ten minutes are the most chilling of a possible future for humankind. Scary!

Also on tonight was the English sequel to Life on Mars, Ashes to Ashes, with the very leggy Keeley Hawes. Interesting Series I.e. http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3269/2353368892_0679004139.jpg?
http://www.filmjackets.com/TV_JACKETS/ashestoashes/ashes_to_ashes-drake-004.jpg

[Alchemy]

about typical for what passes as news these days.... drivel
churn out stories with as little real intelligent consideration ... no in depth journalism these days, just a quick headline, and a bit of spin. best described as cheap gossip. cant say i watch the news, hear 2 mins on the radio on the way to work thats enough. so unless someone drops a nuke or something like the twin towers, im not missing much.

[Ian Robinson]

Bummer !!!

I wasn't interested in last night's 4Corners topic , and now Spooks is finished , so I grabbed 3 new releases SG1 Son's of the Ring, a Chinese movie (3 Brothers) - a real slice and dicer and a horror (about humanoid creatures who were attacking and eating people in a small town , something to do with Sloppy Seconds (it was crap and only thing it had going for it were the nearly naked bikey chicks near the end .... too bad VideoEzy no longer has Swap a Flop)).

Didn't think there'd be anything interesting on SBS last night.

[Screwdriverone]

Hmmmm, TECHNICALLY, if they fell out of bed, they are no longer within the vehicle and therefore these should be considered PEDESTRIAN DEATHS???!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eyepop:

Where is Harold Scruby from the PCA when you need him?

I agree, some mindless beat up to make someone feel like they are busy or important, no doubt.

Chris

[tlgerdes]

Of topic......but dont think this is so silly, I have a scar on my chin where i was hit by an exploding 750ml coke bottle in 1987. Hot day, condensation, slippery hand, top half of bottle sheared of when colliding with ground, 3hrs in casualty, felt like a boxers uppercut. The cut was the the force of the bottle hitting me, not anything to do with sharp glass.

[scopemankit]

If they fall out of bed they're flying!

Some people have nothing better to do than report these staggering stats, what a life!

[GrahamL]

Well I'm not sure Geezer scooters arn't going to be the next scourge on society as a whole .

Approaching a roundabout last week I spotted an old boy fresh out of the RSL , straight out from the curb , smoked up the car on the other side of the road and just kept comeing, I stopped on the roundabout
thinking maybe he might stop at the middle (shelter) ,nope kept going and gave me the forks on the way past.