Bloody Robbery

[leon]

Hi Guys.

Well bad luck has struck us again, well my wife Alice to be precise.
While checking her credit card balance which was basically debt free, she nearly suffered a heart attack when she was confronted with spending by a third party to the tune of nearly 10,000 dollars. :eyepop:

Yes I kid you not some scum bag has some how got hold of her personal details and racked up this amount on some London based gambling site called Betfair. :mad2: :mad2:

We were stunned, and contacted the bank immediately who of coarse canceled the card.but it may be to late. :shrug:

We are usually so careful, so how do these scum bags do this blatent robbery, :mad2: just thought i would let it be known, it seems that it matters not how careful one is there are always some people ready to rip you off.

Leon :sadeyes:

[manny]

Sorry to hear that Leon
How can someone be so callous and brazen to do such a dispicable act.?
hope you don't end up having to bear the costs for the scumbag and the banks find the bast*** responsible.

best of luck to you & Alice

Manny

[GeoffW1]

Hi,

Needless to say, you should not have to wind up paying this. Take it to the banking ombudsman if necessary.

Keep us informed if you wish, it is a problem potentially common to us all.

Cheers

[sheeny]

Leon, mate... I've been through this not long ago:

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=37584&highlight=fraud

Have a look at what I did - I managed to get the bulk of it back. I hope you and Alice can do the same!

Actually re-reading the attached thread doesn't tell you much.:rolleyes: I tracked down the credit transfer company that the money was transferred through (the company that made the debit on my account) and advised them I had not authorised the debit and wanted it refunded. Had that not worked, I presumably still had some recourse through my credit union...:shrug:

Scumbags!

Al.

[telecasterguru]

Leon,
Sorry to hear about the theft of your hard earned.
The banks really have to sort this out.
If they provide a service they have to control access. I am just going to go and check my accounts.
I hope every thing works out OK.

Frank

[jjjnettie]

That's shocking news Leon.
It's just not fair.

[leon]

Thanks Guys, I have to admit that the bank was very helpful, and it was immediately forwarded to the fraud squad by the bank.

They informed us that they would check it out and if it was a scam that was already operating they would be able to track it down in time, it could take weeks, but it is a good chance that we will not lose out.

It just pisses me off that people do this sort of thing to others.

Thanks for your concern and comments.;)

leon :thumbsup:

[dpastern]

This is why using a credit card is so dangerous. As an example, you go to a nice restaurant and they swipe your card. Who's to say staff aren't taking note of your card details? All you need is the card no, name, expiry date & safety number. Who's to say that they're not videoing you enter in the pin number etc? Who's to say that they're not making a copy of the magnetic stripe? Who's to say that they're not on selling the card details to these mongrels, so they can make a buck?

Leon - if you didn't give out the card details, then surely someone had to have. I'd be checking where you've used that credit card in the recent past - chances are one of those has on sold your details.

If you are using a credit card online, make sure that the page is secure (it'll show https in the address bar instead of http, and there's usually a pad lock as well).

I hope it all works out for you. Personally, I don't think the bank has a legal chance to stand on to make you pay for it. If they cannot prove that you didn't take adequate steps to protect your card details, then I do not believe that you can legally be held liable. I would strongly advise you to both notify the police, and also to see a lawyer. Good luck.

Dave

[Jen]

:eyepop: oh no Leon hope you get all your money back :doh:
And hope they catch the culprits :mad2:

[manny]

I just got informed by my wife that you can protect yourself from this type of fraud. Apparently you can ask your credit card issuer to flag your card for any irregular transactions,or spending big dollars in places that are not usally frequented by the card holders or not normal spending patterns or an unsally big ticket item is purchased they decline the transaction and have you contact the issuer to verify authenticity .
Apparently it happened to Wanda whilst giving the card a workout buying baby gear clothes prams cots etc etc. As this was not her usall spending pattern they declined her credit.It caused her some embarrasement but mostly thought someone had gained access to her credit card.
phoned the bank they established she was the rightful owner of card and explained that because the spending was erractic and not her normal usage they stopped all transaction as a safety measure.Caused a bit of inconvenience but at least gave her peace of mind should the card be be used fraudulently.
hope this helps someone

Cheers
Manny

[Ric]

I'm really sorry to hear about that Leon. I hope it all works out for you and Alice.

That is the problem with cards these days, everyone want's you to use them for everything but the security is still not there to protect us.

I have a card and for this very reason I keep only a small amount on it. the bank is always sending me letters asking if I would like to increase my credit limit, I just say thanks but no thanks.

[bojan]

Yep, this is the way.. low limit.

But, as someone said before, it is basically bank's fault.
I just wander how recent pin number usage instead of signature is safe..
Ah, where are the good old days when only cash was considered as an instrument of payment.. :sadeyes:

[Barrykgerdes]

I Had this happen to me 18 months ago. The card had something like $10000 worth of arline tickets bought in Malaysia. It was discovered the same day and the card was cancelled and the bank gave me a new card.

I went through the transactions with the bank and we listed all the frauds and they were imediately reversed. This is were some trouble started. At the end of the month I got my new statement $30000 in credit (bad luck I could not withdraw it). It eventually got sorted out but I ended up with 30000 loyalty points for all the transactions (worth $200 in vouchers).

I don't know where the fraudsters got the card number because I don't use the card on line or buying anything except at normally reliable outlets.

Barry

[bojan]

That was where they got the card details.
You need only one crook somewhere, at petrol station or wherever and here you go.
I remember a story (on IIS?) where someone paid for Kodak CCD chip and there in Rochester was this janitor who was checking transactions somehow in his spare time.. There was tens of thousand US$ theft that followed.. Eventually they caught him. But the problem was then, he spend all the money.. and the system that allowed the theft (bank) tried to wash their hands of any responsibility by imposing loads or paperwork required to repay the damage to users of the system (who are paying fees to them)..

[dpastern]

Yes, this is the issue, and it's something I stated in my earlier post. This is where nearly all credit card details are being leaked.

A small limit is the way to go. The thing that angers me is that these banks have insurance against this type of thing, yet they'd rather screw the customer than help them. There's a reason why Australia is noted as having the worst banking system in the world. Oh, and we have the highest credit card debt in the world too. Very scary.

Dave

[BerrieK]

Aah bugger Leon, sorry to hear about your and Alice's incident. I hope you are able to get it all sorted without too much grief. Rotten dirty cheats :mad2: :mad2: they make me angry.

Kerrie

[Barrykgerdes]

What I mean by reliable outlets does not include petrol stations, supermarkets, restruants etc.

Barry

[Spanrz]

My cousin apparently got caught as well, up to a $5,000 sum.
Some person in Sweden just made out with $5,000 on his card....The person was probably just hungry for IKEA stuff... Dunno??

Not sure where they got his numbers from, whether it be by electronic bank scams or not.
Of if some bank/database got hacked into?

Worrying.



+1
I wish it was that simple anymore, I'm a cash man too.

My father found out the hard way, you can't get along without a credit card in life anymore.
He tried to hire a rental car with just cash. They wouldn't do it unless he had car number.

[TrevorW]

Sorry to hear about this Leon

I make it a habit of

a) keeping my credit card cleared
b) limiting the limit
c) checking my bank accounts daily on line

Banks should be responsible for fraud and online sites should not accept credit cards unless the user can provide all details including three digit code and at least one other security check which can be confirmed by bank

[bloodhound31]

I just paid off my credit card, chopped it up and rang the bank to close it down. I hate credit cards.

Leon, I'm very sorry to hear about bad things happening to good people. I pray you and Alice get this sorted out with the least of fuss mate.

Baz.

[mithrandir]

I've had cards replaced twice because of fraud. The first one was in the account database of a US firm and the thief was caught by the FBI when he tried to sell the database.

The second I think got skimmed when I was in Prague, and several months later around $AU1500 was changed against it in Sweden. That took a few weeks and some paperwork to sort.

Then a few weeks ago my account got flagged by the unusual transaction monitor. The bank tried SMS, calling my mobile, calling the office, and emailing me on the two addresses they have. All sorted out in minutes.

Hope yours doesn't cause you too much grief.

And no matter what people say about the Australian banks, I'd rather deal with them than any others I've used over the years.

[mswhin63]

There was a report here in WA of a card skimming devices installed on ATM's It is happening nationally as well, Organised crime.

It is possible that is how it happened. They found that covering you hand over the numberpad stops these scams from working as they use a mini wireless camera to look at the PIN number during the transaction.

Other ways is retailer with card skimming machines. Don't lose sight of the card and look carefully at the machine to see if there is no extra wires or attachment to the machine. Especially when the operator takes the card below the level of the table out of sight.

Sorry this doesn't help you Leon. Maybe for the furture, cards no-a-days are still important transaction otherwise we might end up with more smash and grabs.

[mozzie]

sorry to hear this leon it will work its way around with the banks and be sorted out
but with other posts weve had about thieft and the likes these scumbags are usually sitting around with time on there hand because these scumbags dont work they dont do anythink there just scum hope they read this forum and come looking for me ill give these scumbags what for oh thats right theyll have to steal a computer scumbags
mozzie

[astronut]

Sorry Leon, that this has been visited on you.
If I posted what I thought should be done to people like this, I would be banned from IIS.
They're nothing, but low scum.:mad2::mad2:

[spacezebra]

Hi Leon

I hope they catch the culpits. You have done all the right things, just a matter of waiting now.

Cheers Petra d.

[scopemankit]

Sorry to hear about this Leon. I hope you and the bank sort out the loss.

[byronpaul]

Leon,

shocking stuff !!!!!

Hope everything works out for you and your wife.

Regards,
Paul

[leon]

Your all good friends and I appreciate your concern and best wishes. ;)

Alice also visited the police today, and although they really can't do much at least they are aware of the situation.

It is expected, we hope that the bank will come through, but it is a waiting game, for how long we don't know, but we will wait. :shrug:

Many thanks again.

Leon :thumbsup:

[Robh]

Leon,

This is a fault in the security system around card usage in general. As such, you should not be penalised. Institutions need to get smarter and they need to tighten up security around credit card usage.
Maybe something like a security token used by my credit union to generate a one-time password for internet access could be expanded into general use. For a credit transaction in person, you would require a credit card+one-time password on all transactions. The same for any internet credit transaction; you need the credit card number and one time password. Each time you use the card the password would change automatically. The transaction would not be processed unless the payee verifies the password to the card-holder's institution. The only way they could use your card is if they steal both your card or card number and the security token.

All the best, Rob.

[leinad]

I hope the bank resolves the issue for you Leon. :(


Whatever new security the banks tell you will enforce better security; never trust it, and never believe it.

I once was asked by a friend of a friend who worked for Citibank whom was completing a survey for the company if we'd be interested or would accept fingerprint identity as a form of account security... I didn't know whether to scream in agony, or ask them politely how would I get my identity back. :doh:

Maybe quantum entanglement mechanics/procedures will be the ultimate security used in the future ?

[AstralTraveller]

I saw this thread just after I read an email from our security section. It seems a card skimmer and camera was found on one of our ATMs in the food hall. I don't know how much money they thought they would get off a bunch of students but I suppose enough to make it worthwhile - if they don't get caught, which they haven't yet. So it looks like it's 'hand over the keypad while entering the pin' from now on.

Amazing how much trouble a few **** can cause for the rest of us.

[dugnsuz]

Just caught up with this thread - Shocking news.

Hope these crooks leave a trail of virtual crumbs leading straight back to them and you guys don't end up out of pocket or inconvenienced any more than you have been.

Certainly doesn't inspire any confidence in our so-called secure ways of transacting whether online or in the real world!
All the best and good luck.
Doug

[Zaps]

Man, bad news, but I'm sure you'll get it sorted out okay in the end.

Not everybody can or will live without a credit card, but it's great if you can do it.

[pgc hunter]

Whatever happens, don't you dare pay a cent to anybody, bank or what/whoever, because NONE of this is your fault so you should not have to victimised even further coughing up dough because of some lamo low life.

[dpastern]

Agreed.

Dave

[leon]

Thanks guys, yea, we are working through it with the bank and the Fraud Squad is now also involved, as they are with many other cases of this sort of thing.

It is expected that it will be sorted, but will take some time i expect, thanks for your concerns and comments.

Leon

[Omaroo]

That's really crappy luck Leon. It happened to me and I now don't run a credit card now - at all - just debit. That's my choice though, and it doesn't suit everyone obviously.

Are the bank honoring your credit limit (pre-theft) until it's sorted, or are you at their mercy?

[leon]

Crappy is right Chris, at this stage there is no action with the card at all, and thats ok we don't really need it at this point.

The card is actually Alice's, she got it through the bank when we had our small business up and running, and since that has closed she just keep it with this high limit on it.

Probably not a good idea when one thinks about it, :doh: I think once this is sorted she might just chop it up. ;)

Leon :thumbsup:

[ving]

man there are some scum out there leon! that sucks big time... i hope the bank sort it out for you. i had something similar once, but jumped on it before anything bad could happen...

i find the best way to handle it now is to have a low limit and keep the card maxed out so no one can use it. LOL...


scum are everywhere kyou turn tho. i just moved house on saturday and we got a visit from teh "welcoming commitee" last night some time. someone broke into cheryls car and pinched the stereo. *******s!
WELCOME TO THE NEIGHBOURHOOD!

lucky it was just a cheapie.