GPS / Navigation Units

[iceman]

Hi all

I'm after your input and experience on GPS units. I guess I should clarify - i'm after the type that goes in the car, Navman, TomTom (that you can also carry around). Not a personal one for obtaining lat/long etc.

What's the difference between cheap ones and expensive ones? What features are different?

What are the good brands and what are the ones to stay away from and why?

What else do I need to know about them?

Thanks

[gbeal]

I use one every day, it has replaced my paper versions, just don't tell CAA.
In my other life, I use a goto mount, a CGE, and like most they require an accurate fix to work their best. There is a clip on unit for the CGE, but the simplest method for mew was to use my built in GPS in my phone and manually enter the lat and long.
Depends on what you want, and what you expect from them Mike.
Gary

[iceman]

I guess I should clarify - i'm after the type that goes in the car, Navman, TomTom (that you can also carry around). Not a personal one for obtaining lat/long etc.

I'll update my original post.

[I.C.D]

Mike,
I have a Mio 520 can’t fault it can be set to be used from Truck driving through to people walking around the streets of any town in Australia. I paid about $350 12 months ago .If you want any more info let know by the forum or ring me 0412998031

Ian .C

:thumbsup:

[DJDD]

I would say that about 50% of the drivers in our courier fleet (of 700 vehicles) that have GPS units have a Tom Tom of one sort or the other.

The Tom Tom XL is quite good with a larger screen than the Tom Tom One. I like these models over the higher Tom Tom's (720, 920) because the mount is part of the unit, which means it is easy to transfer between vehicles AND may reduce the chance of car break ins as thieves often see the mount on the window and think the GPS is still in the vehicle. Of course they have less features, for instance they do not have bluetooth, i think. I think the XL does have the link to traffic condition reports and can re-route if traffic is a problem.

The few drivers I talked to did not think much of the Navman.

of course, YMMV. (I am starting to like that saying...)


just my $1.20 worth.

cheers.

[acropolite]

I have a 2006 Garmin Streetpilot C320, the interface is simple and easy to use, so easy in fact that you could throw away the manual without ever reading it and still easily operate the unit.

I have also used a Mio which I found frustrating in comparison to the Garmin, the interface simply wasn't as easy to use. The Mio also had no capability to switch on and off with the ingnition whereas the Garmin does.
The Garmin displays a splash screen when you turn off the ignition giving you the option to keep running on batteries.

For me the fact that the Mio didn't follow the cars ignition status was a major annoyance, having to turn the unit on and off manually each time in the car was annoying (if you leave it on the inrternal battery goes flat.

The Mio did have speed zone alerts for school zones etc, but I found it to be inaccurate, often alerting when there were no speed zones nearby.

I don't know anything much about the TomTom units, however I've read that some have a user updateable map option, depending on how well it works that could be a real bonus, (my Garmin had some glaring inaccuracies and omissions in the supplied and subsequent update maps) as would be the traffic report update. (if it's available as a service in Oz).

It would also be worth asking the cost of map updates, for my unit the map updates are around US$140, basically unaffordable, so the user map update facility on the TomTom may be a bonus depending on what it actually allows you to do.

Readability is also an issue, check to see that the screen is useable in direct sunlight or at least partly shaded when sunlight is coming through the window.

I think that pretty well all the units are available with bluetooth at a premium price, personally if you are using the same car all the time I'd buy a cheaper GPS and buy a CD/Radio with bluetooth, I recently put a Sony CD/Radio with bluetooth in my work van for $270.

[erick]

Agreed. I tried to make up a shield for mine but discovered the real problem is driving towards the sun when everything illuminated inside the car (eg. your white shirt) is reflected in the screen.

Seems to me there are two issues - hardware and software. It seems to me that hardware comes with specific software, but you may be able to change to better software??

There is an Australian forum specifically on GPS units, as I recall. What I bought is considered somewhere close to trash, after I researched there! I bought an Aldi special (Tevion for $199). I'm happy with it except the rechargeable batteries are stuffed already (hardly hold charge) so I have to rely on car power - which is fine for me. (Aldi service guy said charge it properly!! I'd already done that with a 12V 23A power supply!) So many options I don't have time to learn. The software has some weird ideas on the best routes to places, but it has a lovely soothing voice that never chastises me for going against instructions - it just recalculates a new route.

Be careful - you become so obedient that when she says "Turn right now", you say "yes Madam" and then have to struggle to stop yourself turning through the red light! ;)

[Clarry]

I have a Nokia 6110nav phone. It has built in GPS running on Route66 maps. If you're after portability it's hard to go past this combination. No need to carry a phone & a GPS unit around with you, it's all in one. Plus if you set it up right, it's totally free to run, unlike some mobile/GPS phones.

[iceman]

My blackberry has a whereis/google maps built in as well, but it only works in coverage areas and isn't very convenient for in the car.

Thanks for feedback so far.

[OneOfOne]

I bought my wife a TomTom OneXL for Christmas last year and we both use it heaps. We have seen some others in shops and find their screens cluttered or confusing. The TomTom was incredibly easy to use, we showed it to a couple of my relatives on Christmas day (in their 60's and 70's) and all of them were able to navigate to their homes or vacation spots without the manual and a small amount of guidance. The screen has no problems with reflections and takes perhaps a minute to get a fix after turning on. I don't think it has blue tooth, but I don't know if I care.

I use it all the time if I go to a school for an astronomy viewing and it is conforting to know that when I leave a school at night, in an area I have never been in in my life, that at least one of us knows the way home (this is applicable to all GPS units though). It has never got us lost, but sometimes will suggest a route that you would say "yeah, but I wouldn't go that way myself". I am sure it must get angry some times when I choose to ignore the directions and go my own way.

I would give our unit 9 out of 10. I think I paid about $350 at the time.

[Starkler]

I bought the aldi special (Tevion PWM3501) 2months ago for $139.

It works, is clearly audible, has fixed speed and red light camera locations and does everything I could ask of a basic unit.

For me this is a great value for money tool for navigating A-B for occasional use. If I needed a gps for everyday business use with multipoint routes then i would go for a more expensive one.

Point is you dont HAVE to spend 3,4 or $500 to get something that works.

[allan gould]

I bought a Binatone currently from BigW at $198 with 4.5" screen and its far better in daylight POI and other features than my old Navman unit. Even beeps when you come up to a redlight camera, school etc. Quite impressed and comes with all Australia maps.
Clear screen and easy touch navigation. Also has image and a text file viewer built in.

[gary]

Hi Mike,

As you have probably noticed, the car navigation market is evolving
rapidly with a proliferation of brand names and new models nearly
every year.

When you look at the hardware specs, often the various models
of a specific brand might use the same GPS chip (or perhaps one of a
couple of GSP chips) across the whole range. Sometimes there will
also be little difference in the CPU speed spec across the range.
So then one starts looking for the differences as the price spread
is quite large.

Screen size is one attribute. The cheaper units will have something like
3.5" screens whereas the top of the range models will have 4.3" screens
with 16:9 aspect ratios. May not seem like much difference, but, after
all, you are driving a motor car at the same time in often unfamiliar
locations, so the ability to glance up at the screen in a split second
like one would do when checking a speedometer is important. Bright
screens with anti-glare coatings are important when there is sun light
on the screen. Keep in mind that the screens are touch screens and
are thus also the keyboard. The larger they are, the more convenient
it is to type on, particularly when entering addresses. People with
larger hands should definitely think about the models with the larger screens.

There is usually a difference in the amount of FLASH memory each model has.
With memory, comes features. For example, the lowest end models may
only have sufficient FLASH to hold maps for Australia, which may be all
you are interested in. The higher end models have sufficient memory
to hold several maps at a time, for example, all of Australia plus all
of Western and Eastern Europe plus all of North America combined.

The manufacturers also tend to leverage all that memory with features.
Just as one can go and buy a laptop but find it is of little utility unless
you buy some additional applications software for it, the navigators
are usually more differentiated by their software features. For example,
though nearly all models will have speech output (e.g. turn left in
200 meters), the high-end models will have spoken street names
(e.g. turn left in 200 meters, Pittwater Road). Most units will also have
a POI (Point of Interest) database. The high end models will have larger
databases.

Other features, such as in-built MP3 players, hands-free BlueTooth connections
to your phone, FM output to the car car radio and more recently voice input
and driving lane assistance also differentiate the high end from the low end.

The mapping data for Australia tends to come from only one or two sources,
so most units have similar information in that regard.

So, what to look for?

Firstly, when comparing brands, quickly check the basics first. Try and
find out from the specs what GPS chipset is employed (typically something
like a SIRF III) and what type of processor it has (typically something like
a 400MHz ARM). For the "no name" brands I wouldn't be surprised if they
have cut costs by employing less expensive and lower performance chipsets.
Even some of the better known brands have switched to cheaper, lower
performance chipsets in their entry level models to compete with the generics.
For the better known brands, often it may only be the entry level model that
acts as a "lost leader" and then when you check the other models in the range
the CPU spec and GPS spec is the same across the board.
A couple of years back, I read a review of various brands in motoring
article and what can go wrong with the really cheap ones is that they do
not have sufficient performance to be effective. When you start the car
and the unit switches on, you want a quick time to fix the GPS signal.
You then want real-time computing performance so that when the voice
says "turn left in 200 meters", you were warned 200 meters before you got to
the turn, not 200 meters after you passed the turn.

Similarly, when you compute a route, you want it to happen quickly. A top
of the range unit can, say, compute a route from an arbitrary street in inner
Sydney to Cable Beach in Broome in under ten seconds. Where the processing
speed becomes really important is when you need to re-route in real time.
For example, you are driving in a busy city with lots of traffic and are
about to make the suggested turn but the road is blocked by roadworks,
so you keep driving past the turn. The ability for the unit to recompute a new
course in just a couple of seconds without any intervention will then allow
you to gracefully recover.

At first when most of us buy these devices, we think in terms of "I just
need something with some maps that I can enter an address into and
it will show me on a screen how to get there".

Upon using them for a while, you begin to appreciate other features above
and beyond these basic requirements.

For example, the device must have some form of spoken output (most do).
Many provide multiple natural voices and the ones with spoken street names
multiple synthesized voices. A good unit should be able to get you there
with minimal reference to the screen. For example, many will give other
cues, such as "go left on the roundabout, second exit" or "stay in the
right lane" that are invaluable in the real world.

The depth and breadth of the POI data in a unit can transform its utility.
Once you learn how to use it, the navigator transforms into a Swiss Army
Knife. For example, I've been in rental cars driving back to airports in
several Australian cities and in the U.S and I want to know "when will
I get to the airport" (I don't want to miss the plane nor do I want to get
back absurdly early) and where is the closest petrol station to the airport
so I can refuel the car? The units with richer POI databases will not just have
the airport, they will have data for the car rental return car park. So you
firstly enter your destination as the car park. You then think, "I have to
refuel", so you then type a request "find alternative route, via POI,
near destination, category petrol station". Voila! It now computes a route
for you that will take you to a petrol station close to the airport. You then
look at your estimated arrival time and then think, "Hmmm, I am going
to be there hours early and waiting at the airport is boring. I'd rather have
a cup of coffee near the beach for an hour rather than sit in the airport cafe".
So you then request, "find POI, nearest to airport, category beach."
It routes you to the beach nearest where you will eventually want to be.
Looks good, so you select it as the new destination. You then enter a new
route as a "POI, category cafe, near destination" and it finds you a cafe at the
beach. Once at the cafe you can then request it again to send you to the
airport via the closet petrol station (might be a different petrol station this time).
You can even tell it when you want to be at the airport and it will show you when you
need to leave. If all this sounds contrived, it isn't and I have done exactly
this type of thing on several occasions.

I've been across town at a location and then find I need, say, a hardware strore.
A POI where you can find the nearest hardware store is then invaluable. Many units
allow you to also enter your own POI. If you have a family in the car on
holidays and want to know when the next rest stop or motel is, it can be invaluable.

I've been using a Tom Tom 910 for the past 19 months and driven with it
in NSW, Vic, SA and QLD and found it to be superb. I also make good use
of its 15GB hard disk by having loaded all my favourite MP3's for those long
trips.

One of the reasons I picked this brand was that they also provided good
optional purchase map coverage of North America and Europe and I would
definitely take it with me on the next trip to those continents. I used a Garmin
unit in California which was also very nice and had a live traffic feature that
was amazing. I haven't checked whether live traffic reporting is up and going
in Sydney yet (units such as the higher end Tom Tom's have the hooks
there). In California, the first time the unit warned me that there was roadwork
ahead and "did I want it to compute an alternative" really caught me by
surprise. At another point on an LA freeway, it reported and showed "heavy
traffic warnings" and all I can say is they must have a lot of people
monitoring a lot of traffic cameras and typing-in like crazy to broadcast the
telemetry, because it was spot-on.

My general advice. Look first for a unit that has good basic specs
on the GPS chipset and CPU used. Play with the interfaces in the store on
the display stands. I found this was a key point in my final decision. Though
you may not need bells and whistles such as MP3 players (you might already
have an iPod) and BlueTooth connect, think carefully about the utility of
good POI databases (updates for safety cameras and audio warnings of same
might save you some money one day!).

Having driven with paper maps between my knees in North
America, Europe, Australia, Asia and Africa and being a better than
average navigator with a reasonably good sense of direction most of the time,
I've got by a long time without needing GPS assistance. However, the traffic
in some parts of the world can be very unforgiving just from a driving
aspect so there can be little or no chance to pause and reference the
map or directory, particularly at night in a busy city. Though they will
not get it right every time, GPS navigators can take a lot of sting out
of navigating in these demanding and in some parts of the world, potentially
dangerous, conditions. The ability of the navigator to then allow you to
graciously recover from a missed turn, even through your own misjudgment,
can be a real relief. In fact, knowing that you can "drive at will" in some
unfamiliar city or town and that the unit will constantly vector you back
to where your final destination, can allow you to feel more reassured
and relaxed that it is impossible to get lost.

Knowing your estimated arrival time at a glance on the screen is also
something you really learn to appreciate. When combined with a POI
database that includes phone numbers and a BlueTooth connection, the
ability to quickly phone that destination motel ahead with just a few of touches
of the screen to tell them that you are running late and to tell them exactly
when you will arrive can make life just that little more convenient and it
is at that point you learn to appreciate that these devices can go beyond
one's initial minimal requirements of simply having some maps and the ability to
direct you to a destination.

Best Regards

Gary

[iceman]

Wow Gary, what a superb wealth of information that post was!

Thanks heaps, it has definitely helped me greatly.

[gary]

Thanks Mike,

You are most welcome.

One of the other attributes I like about them is that they can also act as a real-time
"poor man's" Over The Horizon RADAR Head Up Display (HUD).

For example, late at night driving on unfamiliar winding mountain roads in rural
California, I found myself referencing the navigator screen in the corner of
my eye as the road twisted and turned before me. Often you then
gain preemptive knowledge that the next up and coming corner is a hair
pin and correct your speed and line accordingly. It doesn't act as a replacement
for advisory signs or driving prudence and common sense, but can act as
an additional aid. Likewise, on the Great Ocean Road this year or even
on the road going to Lostock, it is nice to have that "over the horizon RADAR"
sense of a bend that you are about to take. :)

Best Regards

Gary

[erick]

Agreed, thanks Gary.

Yes for bigger cities with peak hour (++!) traffic and roadworks, live traffic reporting and being taken into account by the unit in calculating routing, would be very useful. All mine does is "shortest", "fastest", "toll-free" etc. I think you have to get into mid-range and up for this live traffic feature?

[gary]

Hi Eric,

The stumbling block here in Australia for live traffic reporting would undoubtedly
be regulatory and the massive investment in infrastructure and human resource
required. It is similar to cable pay TV here. The entrants into those markets
even in the two largest Australian cities found it tough going simply because of
recouping the massive costs of infrastructure rollout.

I would image the economics of live traffic reporting would confine it to
Sydney, Melbourne and possibly Brisbane. These cities aren't the size of Tokyo's
or London's or LA's, but then again, I would personally prefer they weren't.
There is a kind of irony in that to afford live traffic reporting you need to grow
your cities population to the point that there are enough subscribers, at which
point all those people have brought about the traffic jams and the demand
for live traffic reporting. :)

Best Regards

Gary

[erick]

Probably standard option in all, but mine offers 2D (helicopter) or 3D (truck driver!) views. Love the 3D view and being able to adjust the extent of the view and having it auto-adjusting depending on speed. Speed up, display widens appropriately, slow down and it shrinks.

Day and nightime views:- I'm often on the road at sunrise and sunset and it clicks over precisely on the local sunrise/sunset times! Also it will click to nighttime view if it believes that you have entered a significant tunnel. And even though it loses the satellite signal, it predicts your path through the tunnel based on constant speed (= your entry speed) until it regains signal. Haven't stopped in a tunnel yet to see what it does when it thinks it should be finding the satellites again!

And I like the way it doesn't know which way you are pointing unless it can detect how you have moved recently - drive under a substantial bridge structure with multiple exit options (like a freeway flyover/interchange) and the display can spin 360 deg trying to work out what has happened!

Fun with technology. Wish it would watch the road for me while I'm watching it! :scared:

[Clarry]

Problem there is you're paying for internet connection as you use it plus I think there are no turn by turn commands, (could be wrong there). As stated earlier my Nokia is a fully functional GPS unit with voice, POI and absolutely free to use.

[jjjnettie]

I'm pretty sure this unit is on special this week for $139. I very nearly bought one.

[Starkler]

JJJ you do know that ALDI has a 60 day return policy dont you?

You have up to 60 days to play with it and return it for any reason if you decide not to keep it.
Just have to keep all the original packaging and not damage it.

Cant lose :thumbsup:

[erick]

I think that one has a smaller screen.

[mozzie]

hi mike fust my 2 bobs worth i bought my tom tom xl for the flood work in newcastle in the middle of last year got me to all the door steps of all jobs they are pretty accurate they also get me to star parties useing the lat-longs they also have a where am i know and it tells you the position nearest street and lat-long also i bought the xl model because the screen is wider and when you are programing directions your fingers dont seem to hit the other touch buttons as much my mate has the smaller tom tom and you seem to always touch the other letters makes it a little harder to programme them

[jjjnettie]

I'll have to check it out.
So can you use them stand alone, or do they have to be fitted?
Just that my little red wagon won't be with me for much longer and I don't want the bother of fitting it, then having to remove it virtually straight away.

[erick]

Nope, You stick a supplied suction cup holder on the windscreen. Done! (Then it falls off! OK, push on harder and turn the lock knob again - then it stays on!) Done, unless you want to power/charge - then you plug the power cable into it and your ciggie lighter. Recommended that you do put it on power each time. As I mentioned my Tevion batteries are somewhat shot - and I couldn't be bothered trying to get it replaced/repaired.

Now remove it when you park the car else someone breaks your window to steal it! Also remove the holder when you park or someone breaks your window to look into your glovebox for the GPS! And don't leave an obvious mark(s) where the suction cup sits on the windscreen else or (repeat after me) someone breaks your window to.... etc. Or so it is reported! The latest quick money spinner for thieves.

[xelasnave]

I want one...what is the safest way to break a car window???

I have been thinking of one for two weeks so it was good to see Mike rise this... my speedo is cactaz showing the little daewoo doing 200 clicks down my dirt road... I understand they show your speed??? and where speed cameras are... got one ticket because of the speedo playing up and I figured fixing the speedo would probably be more expensive than a gps..

Man I would have loved one when I first started in Real Estate..it was so embarrassing taking folk out to see houses and having to stop and read the street directory..."Look when we find it I am sure you will love it"....sort of took the sting out of the sales presentation.

alex

[gary]

Indeed, most have a user definable status display and you can select items
such as speed, distance to destination, time to destination, etc. on the main display
alongside the map at the same time.



There are also those people who will be hesitant to stop and ask someone
for directions. Though I doubt there is any definitive scientific study, I know
some claim it is a gender specific trait. :whistle:

When friends or relatives visit from out of town over Christmas, it can also be
handy to lend them a unit so they can find their own way around town.

Best Regards

Gary

[mdgodf]

I found these people realy helpfull: http://www.gpsoz.com.au/index.htm they are in Mona Vale in Sydney. I bought a magellan crossover GPS as it's good for bushwalking to.

[norm]

Good question Mike.

I was looking for one as well, and the choice is almost as bad as picking a point and shoot camera.

I didn't want to go low end, but at the other spectrum I didn't want to fork out $650+. For my money I was looking at the TomTom G0720. Unfortunately there is now a GO730 for about the same price, trying to work out the difference. They were retailing 4 weeks ago for $600, but I've seen them as low as $480 now.:)

I'd be interested to know what you get in the end.

Cheers, Norm

[mrsnipey]

I have a HTC Touch Diamond. It's a PDA, GPS device and a phone all in one. I've got TOMTOM installed on it and got the Clint Eastwood voices for it.
Works fantastic but the only drawback is that the screen isn't as big as the GPS devices coming out now. A 7" screen would be very nice especially on sunny days when it gets a bit hard to see the screen.

[erick]

"In 300 metres you will have reached your destination, well that's if you feel lucky. Well, do you feel lucky, punk? !!!" :scared:

[Zuts]

:rofl::rofl: