EQ6 pro Mount Black or White

[TrevorW]

A price from a popular online store in OZ

EQ6MNT-SKY (Black) Full Go-To, 13, 436 objects, M, NGC, IC, Computer compatible,
auto-guider compatible, SS tripod, stepper motors $2285AUD

EQ6 PRO Mount AS ABOVE in White $2285AUD

Paid $1495 for mine this year before the $ drop well its now worth $800 more than I paid for it.

:thumbsup:

[AdrianF]

makes you wonder how some retailers justify their prices. Probably old stock got before the dollar took a nose dive. I am happy I bought mine a few months ago aswell.

Adrian

[wasyoungonce]

To be fair with the Aussie dollar at $.68c to the $USD, the difference is 1.47.

1.47 x $1495 = $2197 (Aust)

It's just hard to swallow isn't it. I was waiting for the Australian $ to crack parity with the USD before buying some stuff from OS......Guess I'll be waiting for awhile.:mad2:

What irks me is that the US economy is in a worse state than ours, the downturn is greater there yet out dollar is hit harder.

I suspect the USD will be falling sometime soon.

[BC]

Yes, some folks like yourselves won at the shopping game. I procrastinated too long.

On the Black vs White question; can someone explain the difference between a black EQ6 with 'synscan' and a white EQ6 with 'skyscan'? :shrug:

Thanks,
Bruce

[TrevorW]

Ones white and ones black (same price):shrug:

[Merlin66]

I notice in the new Skywatcher adverts over here in the UK, they show a white EQ6 but with the motor/ drive assembly in black?? These are certainly a different basic design from the original HEQ5Pro/ EQ6.
Anyone have any info/ comment???

[JohnH]

It is called "flight to safety" ie the o/s investors see USD=safe, AUD = Pacific Peso.

Unfair it is but it is how the world views the AU economy, motly harmless amounting as it does to only a few (2%?) of global GDP iirc. Most of the action is USD/Euro/Yen, I cannot see the AUD getting anywhere near the USD for a few years, better to plan on 70-80c.

[Max Vondel]

I don't understand your question sorry. Are you concerned about a change in price due to the poor U$-AU$ exchange rate ? Or is it a colour matching problem. If so black looks cooler but white is better in the dark !!!
:whistle:

[Terry B]

Still seems pretty cheap here
http://www.telescopeshop.com.au/Telescope_mounts_and_tripods/Skywatcher_Go_To_Mounts/#35087

[AlexN]

I am stoked i stretched my budget at the time and got the EQ6 for $1495 even at $2100, its still the best value for money on the market, but at 1495 its ridiculously good value...

[TrevorW]

thats interesting he's selling an EQ6 cheaper than a HEQ5

Wonder ???

[AlexN]

Hes selling the EQ6 Pro at only ~$40 more than an EQ5 goto (not HEQ5)

Maybe they are one of the only dealers around who believe that if they bought it before the price rise, they should sell it as such.

[DJDD]

that is the store from which i just bought my EQ6Pro and ED80 Pro.

great service. Greg, from the store, said there were only two mounts left and i bought one of those. I cannot verify that but since nearly every oher store in Oz has run out or is selling at the new price it is probably true...

similarly for the ED80 Pro.

[Astro78]

Uhm the White one is likely to use 3 times more CO2 emissions be warned :P

[deadsimple]

Oh that makes me want to cry. I bought the non-GOTO for $1300 all up a few weeks ago, couldn't find a better price at the time - guess I didn't look hard enough.

I guess I'll wait until I need guiding and get the $1k GOTO upgrade kit. 2/3 of the price of the mount itself. Sigh :/

[Terry B]

Don't bother with the goto. I never use mine. Just buy an EQDIR (http://www.store.shoestringastronomy.com/products_eq.htm) for US$39 and use EQMOD with a notebook. It's less fiddly and probably more accurate at 1/20th the price.

[AlexN]

yeah... EQMOD is where its at... Had I known I could buy the EQ6 + EQMOD and forgo the extra expense, I'd have been on it like flies on... you know what.. :)

I've not used my hand controller in weeks...

[deadsimple]

You're referring to the Syntrek version, right? The Basic EQ6 is different: no guiding port, no serial connection ... only an RJ11 connection for the simple black LCD-less hand-controller it comes with.

Look at these pics: Image#1 (http://homepage.powerup.com.au/%7Eboldajis/images/eq6_main.jpg) , Image#2 (http://homepage.powerup.com.au/%7Eboldajis/images/eq6_cont.jpg)

I don't think the EQDIR/EQMOD mods will work on it, which is a shame because I assumed it would when I went and bought the mount.

[BC]

Excellent question deadsimple; indeed a fundamental question for the many people who consider going down this path. I was hoping one of the many EQ6 experts would jump in, so I’m giving it a bump

Bruce

[Terry B]

I'm not sure. This is different to mine. Depends if the motors are capable of high speed slewing.

[deadsimple]

They aren't unfortunately, from what I can tell.

I wish someone sold a cheaper half-upgrade kit: motor/motherboard-only but no GOTO hand-controller.

It just blows my mind how much the GOTO upgrade costs!

[bojan]

I bought mine in Feb this year, just before huge price drop (I could have had Skyscan for what I paid for basic one, if only I had waited 2 weeks, and that was $1500). And somehow I am not entirely sure Bintel guys were not aware of that coming price drop.. anyway, this is in the past now.

However, I did Darren's mod, it cost me ~$30 and now I have GoTo (slow.. but OK for short jumps, and it works nicely with CdC, without ASCOM platform) via RS232, and it will be possible to replace motors with different ones (faster and with higher torque) in the future, if need arises.. because the gearbox ratio is a parameter in processor memory, configurable via serial port. The only issue that I know of with current firmware version is lack of acceleration, so it may not be a very good idea to try with faster slews before this is sorted out. But, source code is made available, so... :-)
For details, have a look at http://projects.gbdt.com.au/eq6-1/

I did not use the second PCB, nor I added additional cover, I mounted D15 connector for serial and/or paralel guider cotrol interface at the left of the metal cover between edge and other connectors.

It is possible to buy motors with gearboxes as an upgrade, but it costs simply too much.. I mean, such stepper motor is $30 max, and additional flange and gear can be found at some places for another 30.. this is $100 maximum.
And upgrade costs $1000.... incredible.... Why? I know the answer but I do not want to be banned from this forum for using bad language :-)

[bojan]

Another note on upgrade:

You need two steppers, two gears (12 teeth, same modulus as used in the mount) or two pairs of timing belt & pulleys (https://sdp-si.com/eStore/) and PC running Bartels' software (http://www.bbastrodesigns.com/BBAstroDesigns.html).
$100 max or less if I find suitable motors on some crapyard (Old floppy drives a good source for them) .. This is my plan for the near future. I intend to use existing driver electronics, so I will remove the processor from PC board and interface directly to LPT port of the laptop.

[deadsimple]

Wow, you have really come in and saved the day! That's exactly the kind of information I was looking for but couldn't put the right search terms together in Google to cut through the Syntrek-only mods. Luckily I've got a solid background in electronics and AVR programming, so this project is perfect :)

Clean design, great source code. Even has information about the one-way communication between the hand-controller and the mount, something I've been unsuccessfully trying to figure out.

I don't suppose you could elaborate on this a little? I'm having trouble picturing it.

I wish I knew even the smallest bit about motors and gears, otherwise I'd be all over a stepper upgrade in an instant. So seriously, the $1000 GOTO upgrade is really 5x as expensive as it needs to be? I was under the impression they were especially heavy-duty to be able to handle such a load, but I guess the counter-weights are taking care of that.

[Bob Jones]

Hi all
I placed an order for a EQ6Pro with them yesterday. They are based in WA. The Sky-Watcher advert in the latest edition of Aust Sky&Space does not show them as an authorised dealer! Fingers crossed that they stick to this price and that I dont get a lemon.

I would appreciate any advice or suggestions on how to mount a 80mm Orion EON and a 150mm Intes Mak side by side. I have ADM rings and a
rail for the Orion and the Intes also has rings attached.

Am I on the right track with this bracket?http://www.admaccessories.com/ADM%20Products/LSBS.htm

Bob Jones
:help:

[bojan]

Yes those upgrades are unreasonably too expensive...
There is no need for really heavy duty motors here because we are dealing with quite a lot of reduction from the motor axle to hour axle.. and your scope is supposed to be balanced anyway.. so middle-torque NEMA17 motor (which is used in Synscan) is quite OK. The only reason for using higher torque (from what is really necessary) is to prevent motor from skipping steps... so the accuracy of GoTo is preserved (otherwise processor thinks the telescope is aimed there and it is not so in reality because motor may have skipped couple of steps, or even stalled. If there are no encoders or any other means of feedback, processor does not know if motor actually moved or not).

Bert (Avandonk) has Bartelized EQ6, he is using 200-steppers and 4:1 (or a bit higher, I am not sure) timing belt pulley reduction (external) for driving worm.

Hey, if you are "per tu" with embedded software, you may put Darren's and your heads together to come up with implemented acceleration in his firmware... then we can have something better than Skyscan for a fraction of cost :P

As far as gears are concerned, there should not be a problem, apart from currently weak AU$.

[bojan]

I will post a picture later today, I do not have it here at work.

BTW, there is a very good group on yahoo: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/EQ6/
You can find a lot of information there, including all sorts of modifications and obtained results...

[Terry B]

I bought mine from these guys last year and the service was good. It was $2000 at that time (and this was a very good price). I ordered the non pro EQ6 but an EQ6pro turned up. They were more expensive at the time and I was pretty chuffed.

[AlexN]

Bob Jones: The ADM LSBS is not compatible with the EQ6 Pro. You'll need the VSBS (In the "V series dovetail" section of the site)

Otherwise, the more stable (and much more expensive) Is to get the LSBS, and the EQG SAD. the EQG SAD replaces the standard head of the EQ6 mount to the Losmandy style plate, which is more stable, and better for larger setups....

Im in the process of saving towards the complete upgrade, however its something like $450 USD for everything I need to convert to the losmandy style setup..

For your 150 intes mak + EON80 the vixen (V) series will be fine... Mine has worked well with my C11 + guide scope, however I'd just feel better with the bigger losmandy style setup for such a big scope...

[Terry B]

This is how I did mine
http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=50218&d=1226917912
The attachment is from here http://www.starstuff.com.au/

[bojan]

Here it is the image...
The reason I used D15 was, I wanted to avoid any problems with wrong cables attached.. and only 2 wires are actually RS232, the rest are 5V logic inputs/outputs from processor, so I am using here my own custom cables for RS232 and/or parallel control from whatever guider.
Also I did not want to have any un-necessary protrusions on the front plate.

[Bob Jones]

Thanks Terry and Alex.

I can report that Telescopeshop.com.au is a trading name of NVT WA who are an authorised Sky-Watcher dealer. My EQ6 Pro is being despatched today. Greg from NVT said the $1495 price will be going up tonight. He did not say how much.

Bob J

:lol::lol::lol:

[DJDD]

good one, Bob.:thumbsup:

I ordered mine the other day from there and hoped it would be here in Melbourne before the weekend. no luck. oh well, hopefully before next weekend! :)

[deadsimple]

I'll have to do quite a bit of research into motors though. But I wouldn't mind adding/contributing to the code to extend functionality later on when I understand the hardware and software better.

Thanks for that, that makes things much clearer. I'll have to see what level of modification I wish to perform. At the moment I'm considering doing away with the serial DB9/15 connector altogether and going the USB approach:

http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8531

But it's a little more costly, so I might just end up sticking with the standard DB9 + max232 + 1uF cap approach.

Anyway thanks so much for your advice, I really appreciate it! I don't feel so bad anymore for missing out on a cheap EQ6 Pro, as I get to tinker and learn the hardware better this way :)

[wasyoungonce]

That is a Silicon Labs USB (CP2102) to serial bridge aka the same item used on Gotonova system.

It was used to change the Gotostar from serial communications to USB communications and it does not do that well. There have been lots of teething troubles with users and firmware embedded in the CP2102.

My advice...stay away from that. Serial com's are easy and a neat standard to stay with.

Maybe Rajiva's EQ6 mod is a better way or Autostar mod:

http://eq6.update.rajiva.de/eq6/update/

http://www.personal.psu.edu/staff/g/a/gag1/aseq6/aseq6.htm

[deadsimple]

What kind of problems? I've been using the CP2103 (very similar chip) heavily for many projects where I'm using my laptop and don't have a regular serial port. I've never had any problems with it, even when pushing it up to a bitrate of 500kbps, not a single corrupted bit after megabytes of transferred data!

In fact I'm using it for my Toucam LX mod without issues, and hence didn't expect the CP2102 to be much different? If I were to put a DB9 connector in, I'd still be using a USB-serial adapter in the link anyway as I can't drag my desktop PC outside every time I need a serial port.

But hey if it's really that bad then I'll just stick to the CP2103 :)

Thanks for the other two links, I'll check them out.

[wasyoungonce]

If you are capable of doing your own firmware then you'll have no trouble. The trouble iOptron had was: data rate troubles, conversion between formats; trouble selecting ports when using CP2102; ASCOM drive interface coms trouble.

But that said if you experience in writing firmware and drivers it wouldn't be any trouble for you. You could probably use iOptron's firmware/drivers for your project.:lol:

[deadsimple]

I'm not sure what you mean. You plug a USB cable from the PC to a CP2102 board, install the manufacturer's (SiLab's) drivers for the CP2102 chip and away you go - treating the USB link as a regular COM port.

The programs that use the port are none the wiser about USB being involved. They don't have to configure it, change its firmware nor have their own custom drivers. It's one of the easiest and transparent comms links you could ever set up.

I'm not sure the iOptron drivers/firmware will be of any use as I don't actually have any of their hardware or hand-controllers to run it on.

Sounds like the problems you're hearing about might have more to do with the rest of the mount hardware rather than the CP2102? For example, if you have a microcontroller behind it that doesn't have a good serial-friendly crystal value (i.e. divisible to a baud rate), then there can be error thresholds involved at specific baud rates.

[bojan]

Rajiva's mod is almost identical in both hardware and functionality to Darren's solution, but (much more) expensive, being a commercial product. (Apparently, Darren's mod was done earlier, or about the same time)
It is for those people who do not have enough skills to do some basic soldering and/or do not have friends who can help them :-)

[wasyoungonce]

I think that iOptron had problems with some of the serial commands (they were using) not being understood by the SIL labs CP2102. I'm unsure if they fixed it with firmware to the CP2102 or the handset...probably the handset.

I thought Rajiva's mod had better features aka faster slew rates..microstepping...I could be wrong...it's been awhile since I looked at it.

[deadsimple]

I can assure you that the CP210x chips don't understand nor care about any of the data bytes going through the channel. They are just simple serial bridges: byte in, byte out - each byte is just like any other byte from its point of view, hence it should never freeze up on specific data. So no reason to avoid the chips, just sounds like a bug on the iOptron side.

I'll just leave it there is not much more point in discussing this specific issue :)



That is indeed crazily expensive. Looking at probably $250 minimum (after delivery) just for a kit of parts and board! Wow, no offense to them but they should get employment at the mount's manufacturer with that mentality :P

[bojan]

I agree.

But, luckily, there are fine people out there with different mentality. like Darren, like Mel Bartels.. I only wish there are more of them around :-) And I wish the general amateur community is less supportive of those "enterpreneurs"
Because, really, we are amateurs.. Do we really HAVE to have better (and more expensive) equipment than professionals? And then take pretty pictures only?
I always wanted to do more with less money.. It is easy to simply go and spend M$ and then what?
On the other side, a friend of mine is involved in real work, with minimal equipment: Canon 400D and 180mm lens (probably on EQ6 :-) ). With this basic setup, he managed to detect and confirm the transit of exoplanet across its star, more details here: http://brucegary.net/AXA/XO4/xo4.htm
I found this website most inspiring. Persistence and know-how.. the true values.