Galaxy Chain across Grus & Pisces Austrinus

[strongmanmike]

This is the second of the images I did from Wiruna last weekend.

This wonderful curved galaxy chain is seldom imaged, usually being overlooked for the nearby and more famous Grus Quartet.

This image frames the 9 brightest members of the group but there are quite a few more galaxies in there plus hundreds of faint distant backgroud galaxies fill the field too.

The largest and brightest member of the group is the elliptical IC 1459 at 4.9' X 3.5' and mag 11 while the beautifully intricate and almost face on spiral IC 7418 is smaller at 3.75' X 2.6' and shining more faintly at mag 12.

If you have broadband, have a good swim around the full size full res image because amongst the many tiny distant galaxies in the field there are at least half a dozen faint oval shapped galaxies of various sizes in the background that appear to be dwarf galaxies and look to be associated with the main cluster..?

NB there are a couple of internal reflections caused by the optical system that you may notice, the most notable is upper right corner. I get these sometimes, depending on the field and location of any out of field stars, not exactly sure what is causing them....?

40% sized image (1.5meg):
http://www.pbase.com/strongmanmike2002/image/101494112/original

100% full frame, full resolution image (12meg):
http://www.pbase.com/strongmanmike2002/image/101494231/original

Hope you enjoy :)

Mike

[iceman]

Needs something?

[citivolus]

Getting errors that I must log in to view those pages.

Regards,
Eric

[strongmanmike]

Oooops sorry, try again, I have now removed the public viewing bar :P

Mike

[Starkler]

Top stuff Mike!

Btw, whats that arc at the top right of the 40% pic?

[strongmanmike]

Cheers, I love galaxy clusters and chains

They are internal reflections who's origin is still a bit of a mystery. They most likely come from the 4" field flattener and produced by out of field starlight? They do not appear in all images but can be anoying at times :mad2:

Mike

[jase]

Excellent Mike. I think the composition is bold as I have no idea what you were trying to make a feature. No feature galaxy is true center, so I assume you were trying to fit as many galaxies into the FOV. Looked the optical configuration FOV in TheSky. I don't think you could have framed it any other way to maximise the quantity of galaxies. Personally, I think you've got to alter your routine to incorporate a little noise control. This would certain take your output quality to the next level and yes, you can still use noise control techniques without destroying your background faint fuzzes. Seriously, don't know what's holding you back.:shrug: Shame about the internal reflection too. If you're keen, you can chase it PS, but it will take. Again, thanks for the swim around. Certainly a pleasure to see the details on display. Well done.

[strongmanmike]

Thanks Jase.... I accept your considered comments buuuut....

The thing is, I guess we just have to agree that we see imaging and image processing from slightly different perspectives. I am not a noise-aphobe, I would rather have some natural acceptrable noise in my image than to try layer masking on top of layer masking on top of layer masking with the end result being an image with obvious varying levels of bluring and resolution across the frame, which is what happens in the vast majority of images that use these techniques to handle noise.

As I have said MANY times before, it is not ALL about the intricacies and percieved need for perfection of the image processing or the absolute artistic quality of the subject matter that is the total motivation for every image. I could go on but I think I am hitting a brick wall..?

Just enjoy a rarely imaged group of galaxies sharing the sky with countless faint background galaxies all with different morphologies - beautiful in my opinion :)

Thanks again

Mike

[jase]

No problems Mike. We can agree to disagree. Clearly, we all have different motivations which makes every image unique and inspiring in their own way. Providing you don't associate noise control with ultra smooth backgrounds as this is an extreme and unnatural form in which I agree is also not appealing. Again, thanks for sharing this wonderful view.

[Garyh]

Nice!
I like Galaxy clusters! :thumbsup:
The more fuzzies the better!
Can I ask the co-ordinates for the center of your FOV?
I would love to give this a go!
cheers Gary

[strongmanmike]

I love'em too Gary, there is something magical about seeing thousands of galaxies in a field, it really exemplifies the vastness of our heavens I guess?

If you centre on IC 1459 on the very border of Grus you will be just about there :thumbsup:

Mike

[Peter Ward]

...gotta say it doesn't have a wow factor for me....but...

...top shelf imaging gear in skilled hands clearly shows.

[strongmanmike]

Cheers Peter

You are quite right, galaxy clusters over such a large area won't have the pure visual punch that a good nebula, close-up grand design galaxy or colourful planetary image might have.

None the less I was quite happy with this image in the end (particularly given the internal reflection issues it had) and as usual found the plethora and variety of galaxies strewn across the FOV really facinating.

Mike

[peeb61]

Absolutely awesome Mike...just love it!

Paul

[gregbradley]

Wonderful image Mike. How do you find out about these obscure objects?

As far as the reflection goes, are there any bright shiny metal parts you can blacken with a felt pen - like edges of adapter?

Hopefully it would be that simple.

Another solution is a mask over your camera. Apogee made a mask for the U16M and it is a thin, matt black aluminium sheet that had 2 small holes in it and fitted in front of the shutter. It works well with this sort of problem.

It may possibly be reflections from bright metal bits in the CCD chamber and the mask will also help with that.

You can make one out of black cardboard from a newsagent.

Greg.

[Gama]

I agree with you Mike, its not all processing and what was missed or what you should or shouldnt have done, but that you produced a stunning image and decided to shared it.
So thanks, i enjoyed it and found it very well made.
Bottom line its here for enjoyment, not judgement.

Its good to see the scope is able to get such good resolution from only 6" of glass. I would have expected this from a more dedicated optical configuration.

Theo

[astroron]

I thought the image was fantastic, I only wish that I could see such detail in my 16".
I love visual observing,but I also love a well taken image.
Well done and thanks.
Ron

[tornado33]

I went straight for the 12 meg version.Lovely huge field. The galaxy IC5269B looks exactly like NGC253.
The whole image would make a great lesson on galaxy morphology, as theres a lot of differing types there.
Well done Mike, thanks for sharing it.
Scott

[strongmanmike]

Thanks Paul, glad you liked it, did you download the full res version :scared:



Thanks for the ideas Greg. This light rays issue is not an isolated incident, it occurs in a few of my images. It is generally not too much of an issue (one of my DM awarded images had one in it even :D) and mostly I can live with it fine but sometimes, like in this image, I would rather they weren't there. If I could eliminate it or even reduce the frequency it would be great.

Bert (Avandonk) over on the SCP group has shown me the exact stars responsible and all three are quite a way outside the chip area so your idea that it may be refections of the inside of the camera near the chip sounds feasible?

I don't quite understand what you are getting at re the Apogee mask, could you email me to discuss? cheers Mike m.sidonio@bigpond.com



Cheers Theo

Aaaah yes.. a number of lovely people (and they are) are way too hyper analyitical of images, to the point where they are only looking at an image for it's imperfections and contest winning potential, or lack there of :rolleyes:. A nice image is sometimes just that...a nice image, a minor flaw that is really of no consequence to anyone, other than someone with OCD, can be glossed over without fear of having missed giving that all impotant advice :whistle: This doesn't mean that people can't pass on tips here and there of course but let the pontificating, over the top, analytical hubris go I say :einstein::atom::poke: it's ok to just enjoy an image without feeling the compulsion to offer advice all the time, my mother and sister do this all the time, well intentioned but it really :driving: me mad :lol:

Yes the AP152EDF continues to amaze me with the clarity of image it can produce and I have been using it now for nearly 3 years :eyepop: :thumbsup:



Cheers Ron

Unfortunately imaging has taken my fancy for the last couple of years and sadly I do all too little observing these days. I used to at least look through the big scopes at SPSP but this year I didn't even do that!..prefering instead to hang around with those, autoguiding, amplifyer glow infested, image downloading, noise making digital wine drinking binned FREAKS :scared:

[strongmanmike]

No worries Scott, gald you had fun in the 12meg version :thumbsup:.

I agree with you on the galaxy morphology almost every galaxy type is in there - grand spiral, barred spiral, star burst, edge on spiral, irregular and dwarf (I think?)

Mike

[marc4darkskies]

Pumping them out there Mike - Very nice indeed! :thumbsup::thumbsup: I love the subject matter and would like to do some myself soon after I get some of the loud & wide nebula stuff out of my system for a while (if that's possible).

BTW, my view is that striving for "perfection" in many ways is not seeing the forest for the trees. I see the forest in your image Mike!!! :) ;)

Buuut (:D) IM(Very)HO a little less noise would make a difference in the full res image (where you invite us to look at the trees) but understand the difficulty in doing so when there's a preponderance of dark background. Yes, alas, I am a bit of a noise-a-phobe. But hey, I guess my forest is a pure pine plantation ... no oaks or eucalypts messing things up :D :P.

Thus ends my painfully long & cliched analogy :lol:

Visit Wiruna again soon so we see some more!

Cheers, Marcus

[strongmanmike]

Thanks Marcus, I love analogies :thumbsup: and I am glad you liked my forest :D

I am at a loss though as to why the modest background noise vsisible in the full frame full res version is such a bother? I guess I don't have anything to compare to as I don't usually see full size, full res images posted really. In the smaller 1.5meg version I offered to everyone as well, the background looks pretty well silky smooth on my monitor, in fact Fabio Cavicchio of Astroart used these exact words marvelling at it.. so go figure :shrug:

At the end of the day "I" don't like the artificially smoothed images that have become so popular and even these are very rarely displayed at full frame full res. When they are many of them clearly show the artifacts of the smoothing process and particularly how the smoothness varies across the image, so which is worse..?

Luckily many have found my two latest images enjoyable not for there processing perfection (or lack of) but the many other aspects of the image that make it a rare representation of a small piece of our less imaged and much more beautiful southern skies :thumbsup:

thanks again mate

Mike