ED120 at 2 K from andrews

[seeker372011]

ED 120 from Andrews at $1999 for OTA..is this is a good price?
has anyone any experience with this scope?
Narayan

[Astrod00d]

Wonder how the ED120 compares to the ED127?

They've lowered the prices on the William Optics OTAs about 10% too.


Cheers,

Rob

[Starkler]

One user over on CN has done a side by side and says the ed120 has a snappier focus and less ca.

At 2k this scope is finally approaching the sort of price it should always have been, considering the ed100 is less than 1k.

[h0ughy]

wow this has only happened since the cheap "other'" chinese 127 scopes hit the market at a brilliant and cheap price

[chris lewis]

I think the ED120 is an excellent 'APO’ esp. when you take in cost / performance ratio and portability. I have had my Skwatcher Equinox ED120 2 months or so which I have mounted on a HEQ5. The more I use the scope the more impressed I am with it - esp. when it comes to CA and SA control – CA is absolutely minimal. Star tests appear perfect. There are there are no zonal errors. The image is flat and contrasty. Mine gives excellent planetary and lunar views. It also gives clearly superior planetary views then my now sold Celestron SE8i and also gives about 85-90% performance as my friend’s high end Televue 127 APO which cost over 3x times the price. It really adds to the ED100, which it replaced, which also being a great scope needed that extra inch [nearly!] to give the resolution and brightness needed to give detailed views. The ED120 gives 44% more light gathering power then the ED100. I had planned to get the non existent Meade 127 triplet and its interesting to see the reports of the Astro-Tech equivalent coming through - and as 'Starkler' above reports - both appear reasonably equal, the ED120 having better CA correction and sharpness while 127 triplet has better resolution and slightly better brightness. Personally I dislike CA so I am pleased with my decision with the Equinox ED120. The ED120 is highly recommended.

[seeker372011]

thanks Chris for an excellent review...I am not sure if what we have here is the Equinox though....think the Equinox has a Flourite lens?
I think this the standard or garden variety of ED 120 we are talking about?

Its called the ProED120:

http://www.andrewscom.com.au/site-section-10.htm

It doesnt seem to have the microfocuser either

[chris lewis]

Hi yes the Skywatcher ‘Equinox’ is the upmarket version of the Gold Pro. With black gloss paint, 2 speed focuser and improved assembly and finish. I got mine on special order from a South Island dealer here in N.Z who imported some. You are correct they are not available in Oz. However ‘Orion’ have just released there ‘EON’ APO line which are now available in Australia. The EON’s are basically identical to the Equinox’s and come in 72mm 80mm and 120mm sizes. All the Synta Doublets have the FPL-53 glass. [Except 72mm which has FPL-51 glass] They do not use pure Fluorite. FLP-53 has similar optical properties to Fluorite. Pure Fluorite glass is fragile. Actually - there was a unconfirmed rumour on the ‘Cloudy Nights’ forum that the ED120 uses a slightly different mating lens to improve CA – this however has never been confirmed. I wrote to the Synta distributors in Canada but never received a reply. The ED127 triplet uses FPL-51 glass which has an ‘inferior’ CA correction then FPL-53 [at the same F/L] but using the triplet design improves CA and SA. It is important to get the triplet design and finish exactly right or you will have aberrations. FPL-53 is about 3x times the price of FPL-51 glass. The Abbe number [which measures CA] of Fluorite is 95, FPL-53 is also most the same and FPL-51 is 81. FPL-51 still gives good CA correction - esp. for visual use. If you get the S.W. Gold Pro or Orion ED120 versions it is easy to upgrade to the GSO 2x speed focuser that is available at dealers like Andrews.The EON range is below:http://www.sirius-optics.com.au/index11.htm

[seeker372011]

Ouch

its 30 % more expensive

probably worth it ..but out of my range:(

[Ian Robinson]

Well , it does have FPL-53 glass in it.

If I remember correctly from when I was looking at APOs (ED and Flourite) , this glass is the bee's knees for colour correction.

The big question is - do they have telecompressor / field flattener lens for them and how they compare with others Flourite APOs in the same sizes for build quality and optical performance ?

[Stephen65]

Usually when people say fluorite lens or APO they usually mean a scope with one lens made of calcium fluoride crystal (CaF2) rather than one that uses a fluor-crown glass such as FPL-53 or FPL-51. CaF2 has the best properties for colour correction but is by far the most expensive.

[MortonH]

Bintel is selling the EON scopes for somewhat less than Sirius.

[seeker372011]

so after reading a bit more about these two offerings, i think there is some debate as to whether the Eon/Equinox 120 ED are optically the same as the ED120..mechanically of course the former are superior and have additional features-eg dual speed focuser and retractable dew cover..

I am also making the assumption that the Eon and the Equinox are one and the same-dont know if that is actually the case
i am not sure if anyone has an answer or specific information in this regard? if its optically the same I could put up with it not looking as good though the microfocuser is a very handy feature
narayayn

[anthony2302749]

They are the same! They are just re-badged as either Skywatcher Equinox or Orion Telescopes Eon and in Europe under another name. These scopes are just an up market version of the Gold ED120.

[seeker372011]

Ok that's settled then....Andrews site says the ED120 has an Fl-53 element; the Equinox has an FL-53 element...as Chris also says any discussion on differences between these are unsubstantiated.....so I should get an ED 120 and see if I can upgrade the focuser..and who cares about a retactable dewshield and the colour of the scope....and it also means that I should be off the "waiting with bated breath list" for the 127 mm :)

see it wasnt all that hard :)

[dugnsuz]

Just to clarify - are we saying that an ED80 (Pro or otherwise) has FPL-53 glass as standard??
And, if so the Equinox/Eon (unless you want the reduction in FL, lovely cosmetics and nice focuser) isn't worth the extra cash!!??
I can buy an ED80 and focuser upgrade for $100+ less than the cost of an Eon 80mm scope and essentially have the same scope - is that right?
Doug

[bluescope]

How can these guys be doing such low prices.

Andrews : ProMak180 ota $999 - Bintel : ProMak180 ota $2,195

Andrews : ProED120 ota $1,999 - Bintel : ProED120 ota $4,695

It seems a bit strange, less than half price, what's it about ..... I know the scopes may be cheaper at other than Bintel, this is just a simple comparison.

Don't get me wrong it's great as long as it's kosha ! BTW the pic of proed120 at bintel shows a retractable dew shield !

:shrug:

:thumbsup:

[Zuts]

I think they just dont update the prices. For example a Promak 150 OTA is 895 AUD, but a Promak 150 + HEQ5 is 3,145 AUD. Under mounts a HEQ5 is 1,095 AUD. So even on Bintels own site there is a 1,200 AUD price diferential on the same item.

Basically, if you are looking to buy a scope you should ring around :)

EDIT, My only concern with Bintel is that the shop is only about a kilometer from where i live :scared:

Paul

[bluescope]

Even then Andrews have the promak150 ota at $599 ....

I think Bintel need to get their act together as regards their own pricing in their catalogue.

I still think I'll wait and see if Houghy's new non badged 127mm triplet apo is what it seems to be. It's very interesting times right now ay !


:thumbsup:

[Zuts]

Hi,

I wasn't commenting on the price, for all i know the promak 150 is cheaper at Bintel, simply that the catalogue contains errors and that it pays to ring around.

Yes, it is very interesting. looking at Bintels own prices it appears that they have come down by over 1,000 AUD very recently; and that can only be good for everyone.

Cheers
Paul

[bluescope]

Agreed Paul ! I was just continueing on from my previous comment. It's time customers got a break ay !

:)

[anj026]

It is interesting watching the prices get lower on these new scopes.

The new Equinox and Eon 80mm scopes are shorter focal length (f6.25, 500mm) than the "old" ED80 (f7.5, 600mm).

I think the 100mm and 120mm versions share the same focal length of 900mm as the older versions.

[chris lewis]

Q. "Just to clarify - are we saying that an ED80 (Pro or otherwise) has FPL-53 glass as standard??"

A. Yes the same FPL-53 glass.

Q. "And, if so the Equinox/Eon (unless you want the reduction in FL, lovely cosmetics and nice focuser) isn't worth the extra cash!!??
I can buy an ED80 and focuser upgrade for $100+ less than the cost of an Eon 80mm scope and essentially have the same scope - is that right?"

A. Basically yes. The shorter F/L 6.25 EON / Equinox is produced with A.P. in mind as opposed to the ‘normal’ F/L 7.5 on the Orion ED80 / Skywatcher Pro versions with the single speed focuser. Get a 'normal' ED80 7.5 and a GSO 2 speed focuser and away you go.
However, while you will still get the same FPL-53 optics and a lightly longer F/L. [Same F/L in the ED120 Versions].The EON's and Equinox’s do have a marked improvement with there assembly and finish, they have the retractable CNC aluminium dew shield, the standard 2 speed rotatable Crayford focuser, the high black gloss finish, 2x tube rings, Vixen type dovetail and aluminium case.
Ultimately it comes adown to how important the ‘extras’ are to you versus the cash difference when you upgrade with the 2 speed focuser.

[dugnsuz]

Many Thanks Chris,
One more Q!!!
Would the slightly longer FL of a "standard" ED80 help in reducing CA a bit more?
Cheers
Doug:thumbsup:

[chris lewis]

I would be speculating. However from some reviews I have read there does appear to be a small increase in CA in the shorter F/L 6.25 versions. Light physics would also indicate the longer F/L will produce less CA - even if it is incremental.
One caveat I should say it that whilst they have the ‘same optics’ i.e. FPL-53 glass there obviously is a difference in the lens making process so as to produce a faster F/L.

Here is a quote from an Equinox ED80 owner:

“Maybe I can help out a bit here. I've had my Equinox 80 for about 1 year. I have taken many wide field images with it, and basically these images are very good with sharp stars, and no residual colour. But that's lower power wide field views. Using a very bright star at high power will some some colour and a bit of a purple haze around the star. But, that's to be expected with the F 6.2 ratio. The 6mm SPL eyepiece does not show any lateral colour that I have detected. When used with the Equinox on the full moon, there is a yellow line on the brighter limb, but none on the opposite side. Sky background is very dark, as are the shadows in craters, etc. No colour on the face of the moon.”

And another quote

“I have one, and love it. It's FPL-53 glass, fantastic colour correction, I understand that it has the same optics as the Orion/SkyWatcher ED80 though it's slightly faster at f/6.25 (vs. f/7.5)”.

There is a link below to the full forum discussion on C.N.s

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/2229385/Main/2220861

[seeker372011]

an update:
Bintel told me today they are expecting the first shipment of EON120 EDs on June 8

Andrews has -BTW-sold out the last ED 120 they had in stock today

its all happening
narayan

[TrevorW]

More likely due to the excellent exchange rates we are now being charged somewhat more realistic prices otherwise for the additional freight charges a lot of their customers would be buying direct from overseas.