Quality brand 10" dobs $299 brand new!

[Gargoyle_Steve]

There is already a thread about this in the "Equipment Discussion" area but I thought this may have big impact for someone just looking at buying their first scope, so I've written this for the beginners here. I've tried to include some helpful information but if anything here is unclear please ask questions and we'll do our best to explain.

Andrew's Communications, one of the dealers that many of us (myself included) have purchased scopes and/or accessories from, have some almost unbelievable prices on the GSO brand of Dobs at present.
(add postage costs to all these costs of course)

You can get a 6" dob starting at $249 - great price, but not "news"...

You can get an 8" dob starting at $299, even better price, also not news...

You can get a 10" dob starting at $299!!!!! DEFINITELY NEWS!!

Refer to this page on their website, scroll down to the dobs (about 1/3 of the way down).

http://www.andrewscom.com.au/site-section-10.htm

10" dob with Rack & Pinion Focuser, 8x50 straight-through finder and 2 eyepieces ... $299

10" dob with Crayford focuser (better than Rack & Pinion), 8x50 right angle finder, mirror cooling fan, and 2 eyepieces ... $399

10" dob with 10:1 Crayford focuser (much better fine focus control), 8x50 right angle finder, mirror cooling fan, and 5 eyepieces ... $499

(12" dob with Crayford for $599 !!!!)

I have no affiliation with GSO scopes, Andrews Comms (apart from being an occasional customer) nor any other personal interest in these other than the burning desire to buy another dob!!!!! :lol:

Exactly 2 years ago this week, when I bought my 10" dob from Andrews, I paid either $649 or $699 (memory fades...) for the Crayford version which was a great price even then! You can now get it for $399. Cripes! :P

If I was a newbie again now I'd possibly buy the "$299" version, then buy the separate 10:1 Crayford focuser for $119 (further down, same page) and mount it up myself (4 small screws), price $418.

(For the $499 you get the right angle finder instead, and the fan, plus 3 extra eyepieces, which is a brilliant deal, however for $418 you can still have a great scope package if money is tight.)

The 10:1 Crayford focuser (if you buy it separately) is only made to fit on an 8" scope, so the curvature machined into it's base is "too curved" to fit "flat" on a 10" or 12" tube, however I had one mounted on my 10" ok. It screwed on securely with the top and bottom edges tight against the tube, and I used some blutack to "fill" the curve gap and prevent any stray light getting in sidewise.

If you buy the scope with the 10:1 already fitted it fits the scope body precisely!

I hope someone finds this useful.... Cheers!

[CoombellKid]

Certainly some great deals there, it's a credit to Lee. Yup you could pay
more from the other Sydney retailer. But what you get extra I dont believe
it's worth it. To pay an extra <$200.00 more for someone to look down it
and say yup thats a mirror and it doesn't have scratches... and oh yeah
here are some more cheap and crappy EP's and a bunch of colour filters
(you'll use about, once) to make you feel better.

On ya Lee

regards,CS

[Argonavis]

It is hard to believe that the price difference between a 6 inch, 8 inch and a 10 inch is so small. Traditionally the cost of the mirror was the most expensive part of the scope. Now it seems that GSO can churn out 6, 8 or 10 inch optics for much the same price.

The prices for these are truly amazing.

[Gargoyle_Steve]

I'm assuming that these amazing prices on the 10" dobs are somehow a "stock issue" or an importing "numbers game", as opposed to a reflection on the actual manufacturing cost. Keep in mind that the $249 6" comes with a R&P focuser, compare that with $399 for a 10" with Crayford.
:eyepop:

I must admit I'm stuffed if I know how Lee can sell them at that price, I'm just mighty pleased to hear he is.

These prices almost certainly won't last, the stock definitely won't so for anyone considering this I'd grab the phone number off the website (they don't do internet trade or list an email address) and ring them at opening time tomorrow morning!

I just wish I had a few hundred bucks spare on my credit card right now, I'd have a set of 10" binoculars quicker than you could say "collimate"!

(... but no, I had to be sensible and have my brake pads replaced, discs machined, LPG convertor replaced, engine tuned, etc, etc. See what you get for doing the right thing??)

:P

[PhilW]

This is an excellent idea. I made my binoscope from recycled GSO 10" dob bits. The mirrors were almost identical focal lengths. But I paid $400 for the second mirror on its own. So with this deal, you could get both donor dobs for $600.

Here's another thought: get one, toss out the tube & the base in the next hard rubbish collection, and turn the optics into an ultra-compact travel scope. :D

Phil

[jjjnettie]

You beat me to it Steve.
10" Binoscope.....Hmmm
How badly do I need that concrete slab for the dome?

[Satchmo]

Thats a complete cynical misreperesentation of what Bintel do. These scopes often come out of the crate way out of whack. Bintel have very experienced guy on staff to collimate and check each instrument and make what ever adjustments and minor mods to make sure the intrsument functions properly.

There are thousands upon thousands of Chinese Dobs purchased in the Australian market. A large number are owned by people who will never have contact with other astronomers or frequent forums. From the sample I have encountered by chance some of them have both mirrors way out of whack and will probably never give good images, as the owners will never bother to olearn how to collimate them properly.. A scope check before sale is the only chance many of these instruments may have to deliver what they are capable of . I think its a fantastic service.

[Ian Robinson]

Perhaps they are so cheap because they have superbasic mirror cells (made from particle board) , have only cheap and nasty particle board in the rockerbox and base (these are flat packs aren't they) rather than bathroom , laundry and kitchen grade moisture resistant MDF, and maybe the glass is just soda glass and unannealed.

10" binos , if you can get two mirrors with exactly the same focal length would be a great project , and cheap based on the prices bandied about.

I wonder how good the figures on the mirrors are ? 1/2wave maybe ?? 1/4 wave ?? , 1/8 wave ?? There is no mention .

[JethroB76]

Are you saying that they are cheaper because they are inferior to the scopes normally stocked by Andrews, Bintel et al...particle board mirror cells?

[ausastronomer]

These are GSO dobs which are rated at 1/12th wave PV surface, which is 1/6th wave at the wavefront. Of course those figures actually tell you very little about the quality of the mirror. However, I have looked through a few dozen and own one myself. Optically they are quite good and some are excellent. But as Mark says sometimes they need some "fine tuning" to deliver the images they are capable of, which is often beyond an inexperienced observer. They are certainly not junk and better telescopes than what $2,000 would buy you 10 years ago and that was a dayyam lot of money back then. They have a very good cast aluminium mirror cell.

Cheers,
John B

[Ian Robinson]

Well , if that is right , beats me how they can be so cheap , GSO must be using very cheap labour or someone is selling at a loss.

I'm guessing he brought a container full of them into Australia and hopes to flood the local market with them.

At that kind of price , any local mirror manufacturers have no hope of surviving.

[Satchmo]

* There are still people out there who have a lot of respect for what a premium 10" Newtonian is capable of and want to build up a superb telescope with custom selected parts and not a 'lucky dip' cheap mirror with no optical guarantee. This end of the market has been and will always be there so long as there are people who care most about quality than cheap price.

* Any local manufacturer depending on their survival for 10" mirrors would have to be just plain stupid... cheap 10" is now entry level aperture and in huge demand in disposable society. To try and compete in any way at that price point with masses of optical workers in China getting payed $1 an hour to rub mediochre quality glass, would be equally stupid.

[Ian Robinson]

I happen to think quality optics , and the best quality gear I can lay my hands on is worth having , even if it costs me more.

Buying cheap astro and photo gear , is in my opinion a false economy.

[seeker372011]

Yikes

and to think what I paid for a 10 inch dob only what seems to be a short time ago

but notwithstanding that its all good.

10 inch dob at this price-surely should bring more people into the hobby

[Satchmo]

Agreed. The local mirror `industry' ( and it is hardly big enough to call an industry ) has always been based on supplying larger apertures and relatively unaffected by the poliferation of budget dobs. I've always seen budget medium aperture dobs as a great start to a hobby which will lead some towards building or buying much larger telescopes.

[Ian Robinson]

Certainly better than the junk that Tasco puts out there. Unfortunately , Tasco junk is everywhere .

[prova]

Tasco as in the Skywatcher range?

[ausastronomer]

That hasn't always been the case. Historically going back to the 1970's, 80's and up to the mid 90's, "SOME" Tasco products were very good indeed. Quite a few of their refractors, binoculars and riflescopes were made by Towa Optical in Japan and Vixen Optical in Japan. The products from those manufacturers are first rate. Of course they also distributed products from other manufacturers during those years which were not first rate and ultimately led to TASCO earning a sometimes less than favourable reputation amongst consumers. If you know what you're looking for, you can actually find a TASCO bargain on the 2nd hand market and get a very good product.

Cheers,
John B

[Gargoyle_Steve]

Given the questions raised re build quality of these GSO dobs I'll also point out that the Andrew's site also now specifies that as of sales from 1/4/08 onwards ALL GSO dobs are covered by a 3 year, factory backed warranty.

When I bought my first GSO dob 2 years ago I think it had a 12 month warranty. (My 12" GSO was purchased 2nd hand so no warranty, but I never looked like needing it on either of them.)

[AstralTraveller]

Cheap labor is exactly it. Years ago Japan had lots of cheap unskilled labor. Then they had cheap skilled labor. Now they have expensive skilled labor. Fair enough.

China is following suit. They now have cheap skilled labor. We should enjoy it while we can. Eventually we will have to pay what the products are worth.

Some may say buying gear at these 'underrate' prices is exploitation and I can see their point. However if the scopes didn't sell the workers would lose any bargaining power they have and so never progress. There should be a better way but, alas, not in the word we live in.

[KG8]

What is the point of collimating a scope to perfection if your going to sell it to someone who will never do it again anyway? Or who will have to drag it back in and pay up $$$ for a simple task they should have learnt to perform themselves. If someone buys a reflector and doesn't read the directions, doesn't bother to learn how to collimate, they deserve poor views IMO. With the money they save buying from Andrews' they could afford a lazer collimation tool. It's not exactly rocket science.

[Satchmo]

Congratulations you are the winner of the most ****** comment of the week :)

[matt]

:lol:

[Gargoyle_Steve]

Who the heck said they not going to learn to collimate?? Or be willing to pay to have it done for them??
Are you implying that only people who pay more fora scope will learn to collimate it?

I agree with Mark - very "silly" comment indeed!
(pardon my poetic license for misquoting you Mark)

And yes at the price of laser (spelt with an 's' you may note) collimators at Andrews, 'they' probably will buy one too.
:lol:

[ausastronomer]

For someone that doesn't know how to properly collimate a newtonian reflector, the laser collimator of itself, is a completely useless device, so they may as well save that money also. Reading the directions wont help a lot either because you don't learn how to properly collimate a fast newtonian over the phone, or reading books :)

The sad thing is everyone wants to phone Bintel and get all the right technical advice for free and then buy the equipment from Lee Andrews because it is cheaper. Notwithstanding that Lee Andrews is unable to provide the same level of technical advise and expertise, as is available from Bintel.

It's the same scenario as buying your new surround sound system from Harvey Lee Retail. You bought it there because you saved $50 over the price available from Len Wallis Audio. When you can't hook it up and have wires everywhere and no one at Harvey Lee (where you bought it) can tell you how to hook it up, you then phone Len Wallis audio and ask how to hook it up and expect that service for free. I am just wondering how places like Len Wallis Audio and Bintel are supposed to survive when all they sell is "free advise", because of all the tight arses in the world. We are then left with an oversupply of retailers who know nothing about the products which they sell and merely offer a service redistributing cardboard boxes.

Cheers,
John B

[CoombellKid]

I find your statement rather bazaar.... why would you do that? and if it that
comes from Bintel, then I would say it's sour grapes. Certainly you could
never sudstantiate that statement, I know I've had dealing with Bintel from
almost the start of my hobby (mind you there was a break with dealing with
them for a couple of years due to a particular old lady at Bintel, maybe why
they loose customers and not only price). I have to ask my mate who worked
for several years with Len Wallis Audio, never heard him meantion that
scenario, but he will be up here this weekend so I'll ask him.

regards,CS

[ausastronomer]

Rob,

Why I would do it is because it's a statement of fact. I have no association with Bintel in any way. I buy very little from them as I don't buy much gear these days; and what I do buy they don't sell. It would be over three years since I purchased something at Bintel. Nor do I phone them for advice because I have no need for that either. I do occasionally phone Don Whiteman for a chat or call in and see Don and Michael. I respect the service they provide to the astronomy community and more importantly the time they spend offering assistance to beginners, who need the advice. Whilst I appreciate your comments regarding said woman (who I avoid any form of communication with), you will not find two more helpfull people amongst the astronomy community than two of the other Bintel employees, namely Don Whiteman and Michael Chaytor. They are both very experienced astronomers and qualified telescope technicians, both having trained with the large US telescope manufacturers. Lee Andrews on the other hand has qualifications in radio communication, is a fairly inactive astronomer and is fairly inexperienced with a lot of the technical aspects of observing equipment, although to the uninformed he sounds like he knows what he is talking about. To the informed it's obvious where his limitations lie.

In regard to the Hi Fi analogy it's a known fact amongst the high end retailers of not just Hi Fi gear but a lot of other products as well, that a large number of consumers phone the high end store for advice and source the product from the bulk retailer. Ask your mate at Len Wallis, ask Steve Neill at Eastwood Hi Fi, ask whoever you like. Several high end Hi Fi stores have closed their doors in recent years for this very reason.

Cheers,
John B

[berg meister]

Well....I have ordered the 8" with Crayford focuser from Bintel....Michael was helpful, explanatory, and from all I can see so far, I have not gone wrong buying the 8" for $429. Maybe a little more than others in price....but this could also be a start of a great thing so for the dollars extra I am happy to also consider I may be able to purchase again and also seek advice from them in the future. I am new to this hobby for having decent gear....to-date been using a 3" refractor. Some good advice / opinion stated earlier in this thread...useful for folk like me. BT202 is on order, should arrive in about two to three weeks.....quite happy.

[CoombellKid]

Statement of balony if you ask me, you got any evidence to support your
statement? Sure there are people of like Don and Michael who have amassed
techical knowledge and maybe very approachable, but so is Lee, the boys
at Star Optics, and I've always found Ron at Sirius to be very approachable.
It all very well to state as fact with no way of sudstantiate it is more
stretching the truth than any merit in it. So we'll agree to disagree so this
doesn't turn into some slanging match.

Sure I will ask him, actually I just copied paste your message about it in an
email to him. You may very well be right, but I have never heard him mention
lossing money or offering out technical info at a loss.

regards

Rob

[Satchmo]

Having worked in the shop at Astro Optical years ago, and years in cottage industry optics, I can vouch for Austronomers scenario. Its incredible the number of people who will take your time to get a lengthy lesson in optics knowing full well they are just gaining confidence to go and buy a cheaper product somewhere else. Sometimes its just to save $50.:(

[CoombellKid]

Mark,

Sure I wouldn't want to deny your experience. But to imply people buying
from Lee are ringing Bintel for technical assistance then heading back
to Lee just doesn't add up. And I feel a slight on Lee's reputation to imply
so.

btw, if I had a choice between something massed produced and one
of your works of art, at $50 difference... it's a certain which way I'd
be going.

regards,CS

[Satchmo]

CS regards the $50 difference I wasn't referring to my optics , but my experience at Astro Optical.

All this fuss about 10" Dob prices is a little perplexing.
As far as I can tell there is only $100 price differnce between the only comparable models ( Super Deluxe 10" ) between the shops and Bintel are doing a great job offering a checked and collimated scope for just $100 more.

Amateurs today who are used to these cheap mass produced Dobs don't know how lucky they are. In 1987, I designed the first commercial production Dobsonian available in Australia, using all Astro Optical manuafctured parts ( see attached pic) . The 10" F6 had a full thickness mirror, metal tube , and a heavy particle board veneered Dob mount. The focussers were nowhere near as good as modern Crayfords. ( I believe Tornado33 still uses one of these AOS tubes on a Samson mount.)

They cost $1600 with one eyepiece and the tube took 2 people to lift safely and the mount was very heavy. In todays money thats probably $3000 or more ! Sure the optics and tube were superb but you didn't have a choice if you wanted something more budget. ( At the time a 4" F10 Vixen Newt on Super Polaris mount was $795 and a 6" F5 Newt on SP mount was $1350 ! ) Thats all in 1987 dollars !

These 10" Dobs still sold like hot cakes. From memory about 100 or so in 1987 which was double the sales of the traditional EQ mount and a saving of $600 or so over an equatorial. People were attracted by the simplicity of the Dob mount though many had not even heard of or seen one.

In the light of what was available 20 years ago , the current finger pointing over whether a $300 or $500 10" Dob is or isn't a `rip-off ' is just plain comical to me .

[Kokatha man]

After the stick I've been giving John in another thread I thought I'd wholeheartedly support some of his comments I've just noted here....!

Back in 1970 (that's almost 40 years ago!) an acquaintence brough a 4.5" Tasco newt on EQ around for me to collimate: I suppose he'd heard that I was the only person he knew at all who had some experience with these things.....

He left it with me and never came back, and being the magpie I am I've carted it around (sometimes very unceremoniously) through the intervening decades.

And want to know what? It's dusty and dirty (plastic shopping bags as dust covers that have long disintergrated etc) and full of spider webs, but when I dragged it out of my junk shed the other day and pushed away the cobwebs there, shining still with no visible deterioration on it, was the primary at the end of the tube! The secondary looks almost as well-preserved. I'll clean it up and check it out someday soon, but I do remember that when I collimated it all those decades ago, its performance, even with the .965 Huygens (and about his era in optical advancement) was actually quite staisfying indeed! And I had a reasonable scope at the time (home made from an Astro-optical supplied 8" primary) to do some basic quantifying from.

So as John said, not all Tasco's are rubbish!

Cheers, Darryl.

[cahullian]

I have a cheap 8" dob from Andrews and I have had people who make mirrors have a look at mine and they have said to me, "for $300 bux you have a great little mirror there" these things may be mass produced, but they are also aimed at novice astronomers. Colimation isn't hard to learn and if people don't want to learn how to do it they are only going to be interested in this hobby for a very short time. When I first started looking into buying a telescope (for my son, who has no interest in astronomy any more) I asked a lot of questions and done a fair amount of research to find what scope would suit best. Nearly everyone I have talked to involved with Astromomy also researched a fair bit at first. When I phoned Lee he informed me that the scope would need collimating and that I would need to learn how to do it if I wanted to get the best out of the scope. Bintel told me that they checked their scopes and that I would also have to learn how to collimate the scope. Not much difference in info there! To be honest though I bought from Andrews because it was within my budget at that time and the price of the same scope at Bintel was outside said budget. I have bought various things from both companies and have found both fantastic to deal with. All in all anything that gets people into the hobby with a scope that will blow them away (and these will) is always a good thing.

Gazz

[Kokatha man]

Hear, hear Gazz, I heartily agree with your sentiments: but you still haven't told me what you think about Uranus - from the "Pluto demotion thread....?

Regards, Darryl.

[CoombellKid]

Maybe ok if your picking it up from the shop. But once freighted
what's the point, more than likely you will probably have to do it
again. I learnt how to collimate by internet how to's, yahoo
groups...etc...etc... it really isn't that hard, it just might take
a little practice... more for some.



You could say the same about mobile phones... and many other
products. I think it is ok to finger point in this, for some people
$100 is a lot of money or the difference in blowing their budget.
You very well may of paid a lot more $20 years ago. But your
comparing the world today with a world 20 years ago and we're
talking about a scope from the same manufacturer.

regards,CS

[CoombellKid]

I second what Darryl said, except the bit about Uranus and Pluto

regards,CS

[gman]

Being a beginner at Astronomy and having this year purchased from multiple suppliers, both low and high cost items, I think that my opinion is going to be mainstream.

If you want to see what is available for your budget, you go to the shops that are the industry benchmark and then compare them with what else is available. (you would be crazy if you didn't shop around)
As far as bleeding someone for knowledge, I don't/didn't have to.
The good members at IIS offer all their experiences and knowledge for free and without favour.

Somewhere between 5 to 10+ years ago, I would have agreed with John but now days there is just so much information available freely that you can access in your own time on the net, you don't need to call anyone on the phone for the same.

As for my purchases, I purchased the low priced item where I could get it the cheapest where quality was not an issue.
As for the high priced item, my criteria was:-
I wanted to have access to the store
To be able to pickup the item myself
Put a face to the name (a bit old school)

Who I chose in the end was mainly from word of mouth from other purchasers offering their experiences.

I also very much believe that spending the extra bucks for an experienced person to ensure that I get the most from the scope from day one is value adding and will help me get what I want out of this hobby from the start
This also should keep me in the hobby and hopefully for the store bring me back as a return customer.

My 2 cents worth any way

[CoombellKid]

Grant,

That's great for you as I mentioned earlier the service is ok if you pick up
from the store get a chance to chat to an expert. But for me @ 750kms
from the nearest Bintel store. I aint going to be driving to Sydney just
to meet someone and learn something I can learn here, that's old school
too and I'm not having a go at you. But I guess it just the way with rural
folk, we learn how to fix things because we usually have to. When I moved
back to the bush I knew nothing about fixing cars, I've now become my
own machanic (Choice!!! it's an expence I can do without).

Glad to hear you are enjoying your scope and hobby.

regards,CS

[mrsnipey]

Just my 2c.
I wouldn't ring one company for advice and purchase off another.
That's why I joined IIS. I don't use the companies for information.

I would however shop around for the best price on an item
that I've done the research on myself.

Buying out of 'loyalty' all the time would mean I had an unlimited budget (which I don't). Extra $ on one item could mean not being able to buy another item, or not purchasing it at all.

Having said that, quite often I have refused to purchase items off cheaper
companies purely because of their bad service and the problems that usually
follow. (Not talking Astro items here)

With regards to Collimation: I just assumed it was a way of life with Dobs and taught myself. And I find "Andy's Shotglass" tutorials confusing. :shrug:
It only takes two minutes to collimate my 12" dob and I don't even think about it anymore. (Bob's Knobs + laser collimator = :thumbsup:)

[Bloodbean]

Just checked the Andrews website this morning and I no longer see the Limited model 10" GSO dobsonian listed, cheapest is the $399 Deluxe Crayford version which I have my eye on as from what I understand the R&P focuser isn't very good. Shame about the shipping to NZ though :( around $230AU!

Troy

[Argonavis]

I consider it false economy to purchase anything from a "carton dispenser". This is the term used by Mark Sutching many years ago to describe the trend towards retailers who merely import telescopes and binoculars in cartons and on-sell them at a slim margin.

If you open the carton and find that there is only trash in there, then you have done your money. The quality at the bottom end of the market can vary widely, and warranties are only good if they are honoured. I know - I have been there. It really is "buyer beware". You pay for what you get, and no more.

I have had many dealing with BinTel over the years and they have all been positive. Excellent level of customer service. I don't know the level of collimation, checking and callibration that they do, but I gain the impression that they do bother to check the item, rather than just onsell whatever.

It can be very dissappointing to spend many hundreds of $ only to find that you have ended up with something that is useless.

I would recommend that people stick with reputable dealers.

[Gargoyle_Steve]

My brother Don took possession of the 10" Super Deluxe version from Andrew's just yesterday, and due to work commitments I haven't had time to do a full collimation on it right from basics, nor had the chance to look at a star.
However from a quick check yesterday afternoon with a combination Sighting/Cheshire tube the secondary position looks pretty well right, and a spot test with my laser collimator gave me a red dot on the inner edge of the primary's centre ring, and a return target dot positioned approx 5 mm off dead centre. A minute later both were dead on of course.
:thumbsup:

Not bad considering it was sold by a "carton dispenser" and then travelled a thousand km's or so via truck!

[Starkler]

I think "carton dispensers" are great if you know exactly what you want and don't have a need for store advice nor a desire to pay $$ for a retailers brand label stuck onto the goods.

However for a beginner who doesnt have access to a friend who knows their stuff I would recommend they buy from a dealer with expertise.

[Argonavis]

I suggest that you get more than just a sticker on the side. I don't know or 100% certain but I would suggest that you get some level of quality control on the product.

What you DON'T get is zero customer service and dishonest business practices.

I notice that you have an SDM there, must be something to do with exceptional quality and superlative customer service. From someone who strives for a flawless reputation and satisfied customers.

The market for astronomical telescopes and binoculars is fairly thin, and having a low level of care (reflected in the prices) does not reflect well on the amateur community who support less than desirable retailers.

[Starkler]

I think its a long bow to draw to associate dishonesty as an attribute inherent to "carton dispensers" over anyone else. Retailers are not necessarily always honest in any case. . I have purchased a number of items from a well known "carton dispenser" without any issues whatsoever. It suits me because I know exactly the item I want and why so I see no need in paying for overheads that I don't need.



Quite right and I have no hesitation in sending anyone seeking a large truss dob Peter Reads way, but Peter isn't dealing in mass produced goods which are well known in the astro community either.

[acropolite]

I'd just like to add my 2 bob's worth to the carton debate. I just bought a 200mm Newt OTA from Andrews, on request they inspected the OTA before shipping, I really don't need any more than that, collimation before freighting to Tas would be a total waste of time and effort, the price was very good and the product arrived in the pristine condition I expected. An added bonus, the mirror was already centre spotted. :thumbsup:

[Gargoyle_Steve]

Glad to see you've grabbed a dob to add to your collection Phil. ;)

Someone tried to tell me once that down there in Taswegia you blokes would have trouble with dobs because the OTA wouldn't sit right on it's bearings and would try to fall off sideways - seeing as you're too far underneath the curve of the earth ....
:lol:

[acropolite]

Not a dob, it's a 200mm OTA with dovetail and rings, I am going to make a dob base for it though. No problems with the OTA's falling over down here, although our crooked State Premier has succombed to that phenomena and fallen over. :lol:

[Louwai]

I have never purchased from either Bintel or Andrews, but from info I've seen on here (IIS), & also having seen items purchased by friends, I believe they both sell GSO dobs.
The Bintel / GSO dob having a "Bintel" sticker / brand on it.
I haven't seen a dob from Andrews so can't comment there regarding branding.

[JethroB76]

Was that the best front page story to wake up to or what:party2: