M20 and M8 - reprocessed and reworked

[iceman]

Ok so why didn't you tell me the previous version was ghastly?

With some consultation from Jase, I've completely re-worked my M8/M20 image from the ground up - re-combined from the RAWs instead of converting to TIFs first, and no DDP was done in ImagesPlus.

Photoshop alone was used to process the image - and this time I went with a much more subtle frame of mind.. instead of being fascinated with the data from a modded 350D under dark skies and trying to extract every last pixel from the background noise, I've gone with the "less is more" approach.

Comparing the two images now, I can't believe I thought the other one looked good :rolleyes: I much prefer this one. I hope you do too?

Taken from SPSP16 with Chris Wakeman's modded 350D.

1200px wide version (http://www.iceinspace.com.au/mygallery/displayimage.php?pos=-686) (click to enlarge).

800px wide version attached.

Thanks to Jase for pointing me in the right direction.

[peter_4059]

Great image Mike. I didn't see the first version but this one is great.

[browndog]

Wow that is a great image. I think that it is much better than your previous attempt - especially when you view them side by side.

The combination of the modified DSLR and improved processing technique has resulted in a great image.

[Zuts]

Hi,

Is it raining on the Central Coast as well? :)

I think the less is more works well in this case. The nebulas stand out much more and are not dominated by the starry background.

Paul

[zipdrive]

Looking good Mike:thumbsup:

[winensky]

Ah that is lovely. I think we do get carried away with trying to get every last bit of light out of the data. This is a lovely balance of background stars and nebulae with a natural black background. Beautiful

[leon]

That has come up very well Mike, looks great, we don't tell people that there images are gastly, but some good advice is always handy.

Leon

[davewaldo]

WOW Mike, the difference is amazing! I love the smooth tonal qualities of this new image.

Very well done!

You say you only used Photoshop for adjustments... but I assume you used some other software for RAW stacking etc. Is this what you used Imagesplus for? Could you elaborate a little please?

Cheers,

Dave.

[Tamtarn]

Aha!!!!! Now your cooking Mike. :thumbsup:

As mentioned above. In early days of image processing we're all guilty of over doing it. It's great to receive some helpful hints to get you on the right track and Jase is "the man".

And your right when you look at your own image you think it looks great then when you reprocess it comes as a surprise to you of how much better the second try is. We've been through it ourselves. Processing is a never ending learning experience.

Now you have processed this great image so well we look forward to seeing you reprocess some of you previous images. ;)

[jase]

Well done Mike. Good to see you back on the straight and narrow.

After a combine function, always stretch the data hard. This allows you to ascertain the quality of the data and where the image will need work. A hard stretch will show noisy areas in which you can come back to address later in the routine. Once you've validated what needs to be done, start the process again, but don't stretch too hard initially. Progressively work the image over with levels, curves, log stretch, digital development or a non-linear tool of your choice. Be careful with automated non-linear stretch functions as they don't always take into consideration midpoints of multiple objects in a frame i.e. where the curve should tapper off. A DDP midpoint for one feature of an object may not stretch the other object hard enough if the dynamic range is vastly different. In these conditions, you can crop each object and DDP them separately to then later recombine them back into the final image. There is no right or wrong. With image processing, you are only limited by your imagination.

Keep up the good work. Look forward to seeing more. I think as you mentioned - "Less is more".:thumbsup:

[AlexN]

:eyepop:

[robgreaves]

Very nice shot Mike - one to be proud of.

A good illustration of what DSLR's are still capable of.

Regards,
Rob.

[Dennis]

Hi Mike

Whoops, must have missed the 1st one – was it that bad really? I just can’t imagine you producing less that really good work.

I love the 1200 pix image – it is a terrific portrait of these two outstanding Messier objects. The blue in the Triffid is every bit as nice as I have ever seen it represented – top job with the reprocess.

Good mentoring Jase - you're a valuable asset to the IIS Forum with the expertise, talent and generous help that you bring.

Cheers

Dennis

[Lester]

That is very nice Mike, one I could look at for a long time.

Yes all this processing is a learning curve and getting to know what each of us likes and dislikes. I now shudder when I look back at some of the Jupiter images I use to post on here.

[Garyh]

Now thats really nicely done Mike!
Can`t fault it at all...
Verrry nice!
cheers Gary

[marc4darkskies]

Fantastic Mike! Colours are spot on. Definitely some wow factor there too! Good job! :thumbsup:

Cheers, Marcus

[Matty P]

Mike your image made my drool all over the keyboard. :lol:

Amazing detail and clarity and when compared to your last attempt, this one came out on top.

Great work. :thumbsup:

[rogerg]

Very nice image Mike. Nice and crisp, lots of extending nebulosity. Nice colour contrast too. I don't remember the other version, but this one's very good :thumbsup:

[bluescope]

Full size version looks great Mike, nice and smooth image.

:thumbsup:

[RB]

Ah that's much better Mike !

It does take a bit of time and practice to settle into a processing routine and also to be flexible enough to adapt new techniques too.

Jase is spot on with his advice (surprise surprise), you can gauge a lot by an initial hard stretch to see what sort of data you have to play with.

Great work.

[Alchemy]

yep a better image, the highlights arent blown out and better detail too.

a satisfied imager .:)

[Prickly]

Stunning Mike,

Worth framing and sticking on the wall!

Cheers
David

[iceman]

Sorry for the late replies, just realised I hadn't replied.


Thanks Peter - the first version is next to the reprocessed one here in the Nebulas gallery (http://www.iceinspace.com.au/mygallery/thumbnails.php?album=44).


Many thanks - this has definitely made me want a modded DSLR even more :)


Thanks Paul, and yes it was raining for 2 weeks so nothing else to do but go over old data :)


Thanks mate :thumbsup:


Many thanks Matt. A fresh set of eyes and a break from the image can really help put it in perspective.


Thanks Leon - the advice given, and received on IceInspace is what makes this community what it is. People are always happy to share their experiences and expertise to help others benefit and produce better images.


Thanks for your comments, Dave. You're right - I used ImagesPlus for RAW conversion, alignment (translate/rotate) and stacking (adaptive add). Everything else was done in Photoshop.
If you'd like any further elaboration please let me know!


Thanks Barb/Dave. You're definitely right there - the combination of dark skies and the modded camera made it very easy to over-process :) The NGC2070 image was processed after this one, using techniques I gained with this image as a guide. I'm going to go back to the ETA data and re-do it from scratch as well - I was never quite happy with it so hopefully I will be next time :)


Thanks Jase, and thanks again for your direction with this image. Processing is definitely an art form and there's so many ways to do it right, and an equal number of ways (if not more) to do it wrong.
The experimentation is all part of eliminating the possibilities until you find a workflow you're happy with.


:thanks:


Many thanks Rob - and you're right. DSLR's are an excellent imaging tool for relatively quick and inexpensive, but beautiful images. They have their limitations, but there's always a trade-off and the DSLR is perfect for me at the moment.


Thanks Dennis, and Jase is definitely 'top shelf' material - i've lost count of the number of people he's helped with his advice and perfectly pointed criticisms.


Thanks Lester, much appreciated. And you're right about the processing.. sharper is not always better. It's so easy to overdo it.


Thanks Gary, yours and Eric's DSLR images (among others) are an inspiration to me.


Thanks Marcus, nice to meet you at SPSP! Shame we didn't get to chat.


Cheers Matty.


Thanks roger - I definitely prefer the way the nebulosity is in contrast to the background in this version. In the previous version I was too focused on bringing out the faint stuff which washed out the already bright stuff.
Always a balancing act. There's definitely more depth in this version.


Many thanks for your comment.


Thanks RB - good advice about the initial hard stretch.


Thanks Clive, i'm much more satisfied with this one :)


Thanks David - I'll have to work on my wife for that one. :lol:

Many thanks everyone for your uplifting comments.

[renormalised]

Mike, that's as good as any professional piccie of the two nebs I've seen.

Damn fine work....and great advice, jase.

[jase]

I note much kudos in this thread and appreciate the kind comments. It is with gratification that I can share and learn information with others. I extend my gratitude to Mike and the moderators who continue to maintain a friendly environment delivering a rich knowledge base to assist the astro community (both local and international). Their efforts are what makes these forums truly unique compared to others. Keep up the good work.:thumbsup:

[Phil]

Hi Mike missed this no. Looks very sharp and colour is very nice. All up stunning photo.
Phil