New EQ5/SynScan Mount...SUCCESS!!!!!

[dugnsuz]

Hi All,
After doing the usual heap of google research I decided to try out the new Skywatcher EQ5 mount with SkyScan GoTo for use with my ED80.
An Adelaide dealer had one for $1100 which was about the best price I had seen. I thought that the EQ5 would be an adequately stable enough platform for basic astrophotography and perfect for visual work.
For your $1K you get an EQ5 with integrated motors and SkyScan controller.
I've included some pics for the curious!
The assembled mount is rock solid with the ED80 - and I'm sure it would be good for scopes up to the weight of an 8" Newt.
Motors seem solid, not too noisy and slewing at 800x will impress the wife and kids! (Got to justify the expense somehow:D)
The motor control box located on one of the tripod legs is secure as is the handset holder - I didn't like the look of the mount from web pics, but the whole setup is pretty robust in the flesh thankfully.

I've not had a good night's observation with it yet as we now come to the problems!!!!!
Everything has teething troubles I guess, but goto scopes seem to be the worst!

1. Powering the scope - scope comes sans power supply but with the standard car cig' lighter lead. My little 12V 300mA power supply powered the handset but not the motors:doh:, I purchased (after an IIS search) a 12V 5A power supply ($30 @ Jaycar...other stores are available!!) to provide the motors with enough juice. This will go through batteries very quickly I reckon! Problem No. 1 solved.:D

2. Couldn't adjust latitude past ~40degs. Had to remove a bar on the mount head to allow further travel. See pic 3 - 2 bolts remain where bar was!
Problem 2 solved but the manual and docs available dont mention this bar at all - hope the mount doesn't suffer because of this modification! Loses the Azimuth control screw!!!!!
But there seems no other way to adjust Latitude for southern locales!!!:shrug:

3. Circular Latitude adjustment scale fell off!!!!!:scared: If only Synta's glue was sticky as their grease!! Before it fell off I noticed that the 90deg marker was positioned at roughly 11 o'clock as in the pic 7. I tried to put it back in the same position, but now I'm not too sure if my Latitude adjustment is accurate:shrug: Any ideas. Problem 3 - ongoing!! Probably doesn't matter too much as I think I got decent polar alignment via the included polar scope.

4. GoTo!!! (Get Tae... as we say in Scotland) Punched in all the required lat/long, time, daylight savings, time zone info on the handset. Went into alignment mode - picked Antares easy eh!? Telescope slewed towards the ground..."alignment successful":shrug::shrug::shrug:.
Since this happened I've googled the problem and read a very recent IIS thread on the same problem and tried the fix supplied by Skywatcher support. Looked like it may have worked - but not perfect, steep learning curve this GoTo out of the box!!
http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=22111
Also as stated on this thread, Skywatcher provide conflicting timezone information. You enter a numeric value for your timezone at setup.
according to the supplied documentation with the scope SA should be +9, the downloadable pdf on the Skywatcher support website has SA as -9.
I have punched in +9 on my handset is it -9? anyone know?
I discovered this fact this morning so I haven't had the chance to experiment.
IIS member koala had similar problems and needed a replacement handset in this thread...
http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=23224
... I hope I'm not in the same boat! Perhaps we have a case of successful northern hemisphere sales without the required adaptation of the product for a southern audience!?

Summary...
I think once the problems are ironed out, and they will be - such is the nature of this hobby, that this will be a mount which will serve the amateur astro community well. The mount is priced at a point attractive to the amateur who is getting serious about the hobby - considering imaging etc etc. But, the experience so far suggests it is not "plug n' play", it may not perform as ads suggest straight out of the box, and the novice may be disappointed and frustrated initially.
I don't consider myself a novice now, but when the scope tells me the Lagoon Nebula is located within my shed I sure feel like one:P

All the best and any ideas, tips, tricks greatfully received.
Cheers
Doug:thumbsup:

[dugnsuz]

bump - I need help!!:lol:

[Astroman]

I havent seen a mount set up like that... If you set SA as -9 you are still going to be out unless you can adjust the 30minutes... I have heard if you set you time to UTC and run at 0Z it works just as well. What version Handset? Wonder if the Controller is compatible with EQMOD... hrmmm got me thinking now...

Anyway let us know how you go with the time, might as well eliminate one thing at a time.

[dugnsuz]

Andrew,
SynScan Version 3.10.
Controller only seems to allow +/- 00 to 09 to be inputed, no 30min increments.
I'll try -9 tonight, see if I can maybe locate M31 under my car...
Cheers
Doug:thumbsup:

[mill]

The latitude adjustment is an easy fix.
If you level the scope with an bubble level and then glue it back on with some synta's glue it will be fairly accurate.

[dugnsuz]

thanks mill,
But once levelled, should the 90 degree mark be located/glued back at 12 o clock? As it was offset at about 11 o'clock when bought the mount - I can't recall ever paying much attention to the orientation of this scale before!!!:shrug:
Cheers
Doug:thumbsup:

[mill]

Ill have a look on mine now.

[mick pinner]

hi Doug, sorry to hear of the dramas, not wanting to hang it on the new toy and l will probably get bagged by some for this but take the piece of rubbish back.
sure you can probably fix the problems in time but why should you? in all seriousness we will keep getting fed second rate equipment by the suppliers if we don't speak up and demand better.
l know this is no help directly but it may be in the long run, good luck with it.

[ballaratdragons]

Doug, don't worry too much about the scale, as you will find you probably won't use it. You line SCP up with the polar scope anyway. So the scale isn't needed.

I read about the time problem in Cloudy Nights. Many complaints about the lack of 0.5 hour.
The Americans couldn't work out a fix for it, so I thought about it and used my Ozzy enginuity, and told them to put the actual time in half an hour out :P

They tried it and said it worked :)

It also has Autoguiding! Very good. :thumbsup:

[mill]

Had a look and the zero mark is level with the first straight part under the latitude adjustment scale.

[dugnsuz]

THANKS FOR THAT MILL,
THIS MOUNT MUST'VE SLIPPED THROUGH THE STRINGENT SYNTA QC DEPARTMENT:lol:
CHEERS
DOUG:thumbsup:

[dugnsuz]

YOU'RE A HARD MAN MICK!!;)

AT THIS PRICE POINT I KNOW I'VE GOT TO "WORK" WITH THE MOUNT TO GET ABOVE AVERAGE PERFORMANCE - EXPECTED IT.
I'M QUITE IMPRESSED WITH THE STABILITY, BUT I'M ONLY CARRYING AN ED80 AFTER ALL.
AS FOR THE GOTO, WELL IF I CAN'T SORT IT THEN IT WILL BE GOING BACK!:mad2:
CHEERS
DOUG:thumbsup:

[mill]

Huh? i didn't know Synta had an QC department :scared2::jawdrop:

[dugnsuz]

KEN, YOU'RE A GENIUS!:rofl:
I'LL TRY THAT...
DOUG

[dugnsuz]

I THINK IT'S US!!!!!:sadeyes:

[mill]

Mick is right about the complaining.
The more complaints the manufacturer gets the better he knows what has gone wrong in the production process.
And yes we are the final quality control.
Imagine from an manufacturing point of view: you want to bring out the perfect mount.
First each and every part has to be checked for the tolerances, if it is not good enough it has to be hand filed or sandpapered.
Once that is perfect then the mount has to be tested for at least an year under viewing conditions and disassembled everytime when something isn't right.
If and if they make the mount perfect, lets say an eq5 they have to slap an pricetag on it of $4000 at least to get the cost out of making the mounts but then again the next mount has to be hand made too so the price is going to be astronomically high and i am not even talking about an goto mount.
I just wonder what an losmandy mount would cost (they already have good QC).
So i do understand the manufacturers and you do get what you pay for.
But as everything in life, mistakes are beeing made every second.

[dugnsuz]

I suppose forums like this (and mainly Cloudy Nights) are one way for the user's experiences good and bad to filter back to the manufacturers.
I've been into this hobby since the early '90s and I've owned my fair share of gear and agree you get what you pay for, and sometimes you don't! Sometimes expectations exceed reality. Don't want to incur the wrath of the TV devotees, but I've always thought the price tag too high for the experience at the eyepiece...there I said it!!!!:P
But as a non-novice, I know that a bit of tinkering and modification is often required at the price point of a mount like this. Might not be the way it should be, but it sure is the way it is!
The novice may not realise this and become disillusioned with their purchase and perhaps the hobby.
For the novice, paying $1K for a mount alone - they might expect it to perform out of the box and would rightly expect to GET what they are paying for!
All the best
Doug:thumbsup:

[Tamtarn]

Doug

Just my opinion, but I would get the dealer to contact the Skywatcher distributer in Aus. ( Tasco ) and make sure they supplied you with a unit to your satisfaction.

Tasco seem to be quite reasonable people to deal with and I'm sure they would correct this matter. I would contact Ian James at Tasco on 02 9938 3244 and explain your problems to him.

Our first GoTo was a Meade ETX and we experienced several problems with this unit. After many contacts with Meade and Bintel,the unit was eventually replaced and the new unit worked as it should.

As I said above just my opinion, but I'm sure many others would agree.

Hope it all gets sorted out for you.

David

[monoxide]

Hi Doug,
with my HEQ5 Pro i've been using +9 for the timezone and i haven't noticed anything odd.
sometimes the initial alignment star will send the scope slewing off into all sorts of strange directions but if i notice that happening i cancel the slew by pressing any button then manually slewing to it. After a 3 star alignment though all the go-to's put objects dead centre in the ep so no complaints there. (i use my recticle ep for star alignments too)

[dugnsuz]

Hi Tj,
the scope was doing that crazy slewing all last night - I got on IIS and found a recent relevant thread with a similar fix to what you said. Tried that...wasn't perfect but after using a 1-star alignment: Antares the scope found Jupiter roughly! I had had a gutfull by then so I called it quits. But I think that may be the right track I'll try again tonight hopefully!
Next - assess the tracking!! God I hope that's OK!!!!:lol:
Cheers
Doug:thumbsup:

[dugnsuz]

Hi David,
I picked it up on Friday night and didn't really try it out until last night.
The mount itself is sturdy enough for the scope and then some.
It's just this damn GoTo!!!!!
I'm seeing that others have had similar problems and have triumphed, so I'm hopeful too. Hope I don't have to go back to the dealer though - I hate that!!!:lol:
Cheers
Doug:thumbsup:

PS Thanks for the contact number just in case

[dugnsuz]

BIG SIGH OF RELIEF FROM ME!!!
GOT THE GOTO TO "GO TO"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:party: (LOVE THAT DANCING BANANA)

GATHER ROUND, SO THAT I MAY TELL YE THE SECRET OF THE GOTO...

1. POLAR ALIGN AS BEST YOU CAN.
2. ENTER LAT/LONG, TIME ETC AS REQUIRED
3. DO 3 STAR ALIGNMENT. PICK 1st STAR - IF SCOPE POINTS TOWARDS GROUND OR DOES SOME SIMILAR CRAZINESS DONT WORRY. WHEN CRAZY SLEW HAS FINISHED, USE DIRECTIONAL ARROWS ON HANDSET AND FAST TRACK RATE (eg. 9) TO CENTRE ON THE STAR PICKED AS ALIGNMENT STAR. WHEN HAPPY PRESS ENTER. REPEAT PROCESS FOR 2nd AND 3rd STARS - WHEN COMPLETE DISPLAY WILL SAY "ALIGNMENT SUCCESSFUL".
4. PARK SCOPE - NOT TOO SURE IF THIS IS NECESSARY BUT I DID IT!
5. PICK OBJECT - GOTO SHOULD WORK...IT DID FOR ME! OBJECTS CENTRED IN 40X EP EVERY TIME...FANTASTIC! VIVA GOTO:)

ALTHOUGH, I NOTED THAT WHEN THE SCOPE CROSSED THE ZENITH TO LOCATE AN OBJECT FROM THE TOUR LIST THE GOTO FUNCTION STUFFED UP AND I HAD TO REALIGN.:shrug:

I CAN GO TO BED A BIT HAPPIER TONIGHT!:D
GOING BACK OUTSIDE TO CHECK ON THE TRACKING NOW:prey:

DOUG

[dugnsuz]

WOULD YOU ADAM N' EVE IT, IT'S CLOUDED OVER!!:mad2:

[rumples riot]

I got the very first V3 controller in Australia 2 years ago and it was junk and it sounds like it is still junk. The person to speak to is Ian James from Tasco. They import these mounts from Synta. He is a good guy and will do what he can to help.

The error is in the HC not the mount. The mounts are fine, it is the HC that cannot work consistently. I found that some nights this worked well and other nights it was just terrible no matter which way you used it. I recommend you send the HC back and get a new one. Keep doing this until you get a good one.

BTW Doug, it is shouting when you use upper case all the time. :-)

[dugnsuz]

SORRY PAUL, USED TO PLAY BASS IN A METAL BAND!!:D

There,that's better. I don't fancy going through this laboured alignment every time, so I'll give the Tasco guy a call if this persists.
Cheers
Doug:thumbsup:

[Tamtarn]

Doug. Our mount goes straight to first star without any craziness. (first time every time).

Just for your info.

David

[dugnsuz]

Cheers David,
This handset gets one last chance then...:bashcomp:
Cheers
Doug:thumbsup:

[Tamtarn]

Doug, did you try as per Andrew's quote above.

What would happen if you set time as +10 and then deducted 30minutes of your local time. - Just a Thought.

David

[dugnsuz]

Cloudy tonight!
I will try that suggestion David.
Last night, the initial slewing wasn't as crazy as the first night's attempts.
When scope was asked to go to Antares it went to the correct general area which might suggest that the time fix might be the way to go.
I'll post results when I try this.
Cheers
Doug

[Terry B]

For what it is worth I bought an EQ6pro recently with the same hand controller.
I felt the quality control is very good. I haven't fiddled with any of the mounts settings and I certainly don't need to pull it apart and fix gear meshing etc.
I do a pretty good polar align using the polar scope and start it up with the time set from my mobile phone. I usually use alpha centaurus as my first alignment star and it is usually in a low power field. The next 2 stars are always in the low power field. There is none of this aiming to the ground that you describe. I read in another thread about a hand controller being set for the northern hemisphere. Maybe this is the problem.

[dugnsuz]

Thanks Terry,
Good to see that your experience is a happy one with the mount.
The scope aimed towards ground on the first night I tried it. Since then (after implementing the fix posted above) it slews in roughly the right direction of the alignment star chosen. Makes me think that the problem could be the 30 min difference...We'll see!!
I've followed the other SynScan threads with interest too.
Cheers
Doug

[dugnsuz]

Hi All,

Well, got the thing working perfectly by using +8 with my current time!!
Tried +9 and +10 with +/- 30 minutes and the slewing was way off.
But, +8 nailed all the alignment stars - put them all in the finder scope field.
So I'm happy but confused...is this an Adelaide thing being 30 mins out of whack!! Or is the hand controller stuffed!?
Anyway imaging M17 now so I'm smiling!:party:
Doug:thumbsup:

[ballaratdragons]

That's totally weird Doug.

If anything, it should be dead accurate by setting your time half an hour out!

Strange. :shrug:

[Tamtarn]

That's great Doug. Whatever works go for it. :thumbsup:

David

[dugnsuz]

Exactly Ken - makes me think Hand Controller is stuffed, but in a good way!!!
I couldn't believe it when as my last resort I punched in +8 as the time zone and the thing worked perfectly!!