Sky and Space Magazine

[Sausageman]

Is anyone else having trouble with "Sky and Space magazine".

I have had heaps of trouble since I subscribed.
I got the first issue, then didn't get any for 4 months, finally contacted the Editor after sending many emails. now its june, and the last mag was for March/April.

Are they going bankrupt?

Mike

[johnno]

Hi Mike,
I am not a subscriber of this mag,they are too unreliable,but I do buy it when available.
Talking to the newsagent yesterday,he rang them and they said it should be in the Newsagents by next thursday,if thats any help to you.if you are a subscriber I would expect it soon.
Regards.John

[robin]

You beat me to it Mike.I have a subscription that an English friend bought me for christmas.You're right, the last issue was march/april. I had hoped that their 'new look' would mean reliability too but I'm just not seeing it happen.

[mch62]

Same problem hear Mike.
Had the same thing happen a few years back and never did get all my subscriptions for that year and now again.
A bit of a dodgy set up me thinks.

Mark

[Brendan]

this is a common problem mike, some of the journo's who contirbute to the mag lurk around here so no doubt your cries will be heard.

I think the S&S staff hold back issues if something exciting is going on in the Astronomy/space sciences world aka the relaunch of the shuttle missions. I would not be supprised at all if this was the reason for the delay.

I how ever do agree that the frequency of publication is very disapointing considering that up untill a few years ago there seemed to be few problems.:(

Dave if you are out there, might be an idea to bring this problem up at the next editorial meeting:confuse2:

[xstream]

Same problem here aswell Mike.

Everything was o/k up until they decided to change the publication....... since then....... you know what the answer is...... with that sort of service I'll never bother with the publication again....... endless emails and phone calls have been fruitless...... I'll just put it down to experience never mind about the money that went out the window...... Anyway good luck Mike, hope your out come is better than ours was. :(

[astroron]

For a long time the mag in Queensland has been known as" lost in space", for lack of being on time.astron

[ving]

hehe "lost in space" I like it! :)

[atalas]

Yeah they ripped me off 70.00 bucks once!on a subscription to southern Astronomy ,you know that other black and white mag they have.
Never even got one copy from them. I complained a couple of times
but never heard nothing back,so you now no what I think !
Now I don't know If I'm aloud to say this on the forum but hey thats life, I'm the one who got ripped off ! now that was about five years ago.


Louie:mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2:

[fringe_dweller]

I think it was some unhappy advertisers that first came up with that (cruel?) nickname - but in all fairness is/wasnt S&S always run on a shoe string budget? and in fact all the contributers do it for no payement fee? Thats what they have always said anyway. Although that is no excuse to ripp people off i guess?
Cheers
Fringey

[Sausageman]

I just sent an email to the "Sky and Space" Managing Editor.
I was so astounded by the number of replies to this thread that I sent him the thread address....

Maybe it will wake them up.

Mike

[mch62]

Did the same thing , no replys to 4 e-mails over 4weeks.

They do realise there is competition out there don't they.

It's a shame as i would like to support an Australian product but it looks like this is not to be the case.

[atalas]

Surprise surprise!

Louie :tasdevil:

[Gordon]

Hi all,

Well firsty I hate to say ITYS but I feel that I perhaps ruffled a few feathers some time back about this periodical (or non-periodical) but I am surprised a little by comments that it's sad because we love to support Australian pubications. We now have a reliable Australian publication called Australian Sky and telescope written by Australian authors, published and printed by and Australian company but with occassional articles (it seems) extracted from the U.S magazine. I was a little suspicious at first but on their record I don't see a problem with this at all. In the last few AS&T magazines I purchased from the news stand the content is very Australian and they have writers that actually do astronomy. I personally believe they are doing a marvellous job of bringing out a magazine on-time every month and the content is far more down to earth and practical.

Sure, I certainly like to support 100% Australian made product - but what is 100% Australian product anymore? I even bought **** Smith peanut butter for a while (yes, I love peanut butter sandwiches) but I have to say that Kraft make the best! Despite the U.S interest, it is still made in Australia.

I have several friends who were also bitten badly by S&S subscriptions but who knows? Another issue may yet still appear in the mailbox.

[h0ughy]

I'll jump to their defence :fight:

They were going backwards, so they do what most companies do trying to save their bacon and investment, they restructured!

Now then add to that the fact that they were always very late with issues, they tried to get that back on track and fill the mag with good content for the issues that did end up going to print. The S&T issues are at least 70% US content, therefore it is very easy for them to get the remaining 30% content up and running for each month. I am not bagging S&T, they do a great job and it is a pleasure to read, but S&S have to go the whole 9 yards and get the entire content out. But we are really great aussies by following the great tradition of tall poppy cutting and whining that a few magazines got lost ;) as this also happened to me. However just give them a go, if they fold what will you have to whine about then! :juggle:

[atalas]

When someone robs me Houghy, they don't get another go at It!

Louie :mad2:

[mch62]

""Had the same thing happen a few years back and never did get all my subscriptions for that year and now again""


As I said i did give them another go and this is the second time I just stopped getting the publications and no responce. :bashcomp:

Don't get me wrong , I enojoy the S&S actually even more than my issues of S&T but if it's not here to read , then it ain't no good to me.
Not to mention no replies to e-mails or phone calls.

[h0ughy]

Louie
true, and I don't condone it either , but when someone change a business name the old one simply dissappears. Along with our money.

[atalas]

Well Houghy I would like and make their teeth dissapear!

Louie :rofl:

[h0ughy]

Louie,

are you a magician, I've never seen disappearing teeth before! :D On a more serious note, I subscribed for 2 years, seemed cheaper, but i had 2 issues of the quarterly mag owing to me, and I was credited some issues to the "new" sky and space. i can't really whinge too much, they have printed a picture of mine :o

[fringe_dweller]

Houghy, I feel the same, they were also nice enough to print a couple of our pics on two occassions - even if :( they :( *sniffle* didnt :sad: put my name on my shot :sad: of comet WM1 linear that appeared in the comet section in the same issue we won our second readers pic of the month (we only entered twice) - I'll get over over it one day I'm sure - and move on. LOL!
Fringey

[Rodstar]

Reading this thread as a lawyer, I would suggest if you have missed out on your subscriptions repeatedly, you could threaten a local court claim against them for breach of contract. Maybe if a few people wrote together to that effect, you might get some back issues in lieu to resolve outstanding grievances. You have up to 6 years from the time you paid your money to take action.

I would be happy to co-ordinate such a letter if those interested want to PM me with specific details of the periods you subscribed for, and what you missed out on. In you PM, please advise how many issues you missed out, and what you would be prepared to accept by way of past editions in lieu to resolve outstanding issues.

Noting HOughy all of your well made points about not being too negative about these things, it is simply unacceptable as a modern business practice not to respond to phone calls and emails. That is the sort of thing that DOES lead to a company closing.

They do not have my sympathy simply because they do it on a voluntary basis (if that is true). It is not as if they are running a charity for destitute people, or something, and there is another Australian astronomy mag, so it is not as if they are filling a void or something.

I subscribed earlier this year and had a good response initially....I am, like the rest of you, now getting a bit impatient for the May/ June edition. I would have thought that unless they get their act together in the next couple of weeks that it will good-bye and good riddance to their publication. A great pity because the March/ April edition was absolutely stunning.

[Sausageman]

hOughy,
There is no defense to not fulfilling a contract.
If you pay for something and it is not delivered, then it is breach of contract in any State in Australia.
Whether they are Australian owned or not.
They still owe me 2 editions of the magazine.
It took me 4 months to get a delivery of some dvd's I ordered, I sent them many emails but they didn't answer any of them.
Do you know what they said? The magazine had them advertised as CD's, so they waited until I contacted them to see if I wanted dvd's instead.
I had to phone Sydney, long distance, at my cost, to get something done. That is not the way business is done.
They dont read thier emails,
It's lucky they are still in business.
I for one will never subscribe again, or buy anything from them.
Mike

[h0ughy]

:scared3:

OK Rod and Mike

I give up,
I tried and failed to support them, lucky this isn't my dayjob eh Rod!

I do agree that it is no way to operate a business,
I do agree they are not the only astro mag in australia,
I do agree it is far too long between issues,
I do agree it is bad practice to tick off your clients,
and it is unprofessional not to return emails.

:bowdown:

[fringe_dweller]

OK I am going to stick my neck way out for the chop again! As much as I have LOVED S&S over the years (when it all worked that is) and i feel very sorry for and grateful to all the innocent and wonderful contributers over the years. I will say what i have said privately for years. - And that is not including the many (it seems) complaints of subscribers being abused financially and the complaints I have heard over the years from certain advertisers (which i think should be treated like royalty and gods as the probably pay a lot of the bills). Even tho I am an astro mag junkie (I even buy the Canadian magazine occassionly!) and will buy just about every magazine going- and my house fills up with astro mags - much to my partners puzzlement.
And that is I think that even tho staff at S&S have probably worked very hard and unrewarded? and filled a huge void in maybe a tough enviroment just so the ungrateful readers can have something to read in bed?
I think the constant isitgonnacomeout/orisntit? over the last 10 years may have been been harmful to the morale (if such a thing exists) of Australian Amateur Astronomers and may have been off putting to newbies? who bought magazines with star charts and viewing guides two months out of date. Which is quite obvious to all i guess, not least to staff and contributors who probably worked their butts off for little or no reward.
In conclusion I would like to make it clear I am personally VERY, VERY grateful that knight in white shining armour has come to the rescue (AS&T) and I look forward to AS&T having a very long and prosperous future in Oz/NZ :) - i also hope that S&S also continues and find a way to resolve the issues that stop them from being relevant. if i know amateur skywatchers a little, they will buy as many local mags that get put in front of them anyway. Plenty of room?. In the meantime i am really loving getting an excellent good old fashioned hard copy regularly (and a month in advance as should be the way!) to read before i go to sleep - beats staring at a monitor 24 hours a day. Way to go AS&T!

[Sausageman]

All I want is for them to extend my subscription time to cover the now 3 missed editions of the magazine. I count the May/June edition as now missed as it did not arrive to cover any of May's astronomical events.
I for one would be willing to engage in a class action against S&S.
Mike

[Sausageman]

I will also reply in defense of S&S. partially.
If I had only bought the mag from newsagents, I wouldn't have a problem.

But because I subscribed to the magazine, they took my money real quick, and didn't deliver on the contract, they are in breach of contract. They owe me.
Although it's only a small amount of money involved, I have missed out on many stellar events and people advertising in the magazine have also paid money for nothing.

Therefore I can't condone the attitude or the business ethics of S&S.

Mike

[johnno]

Hi All,

I feel very sorry for the people who have subscribed to this mag,and havent got it.
I also feel very sorry for the Advertisers,as one told me the other day,it was costing him well in excess of 1k$,per page for an ad,and he is really ticked off,and will not advertise with them again.(dont know if he was reimbursed or not,but I know what my guess is)
This is a real pity as it was a really good mag,I hope they can sort out their problems,and get back on track,I will still buy the Mag,But as before, only from Newsagents.
Regards.John

[xstream]

Thanks for the offer Rod,
Personally I don't care anymore after all the phone calls and emails Anna has made to them, and on the rare occasions she actually spoke to someone whose promises were allways unfulfilled. I wont repeat what they can do with their Mag for fear of being censored. They may keep the cost of the three issues we never received, but I declare I'll never recommend anyone subscribe or purchase this Mag as long as it is in print.
I just hope someone from S&S is reading these posts. I'd be interested to see what pitiful excuse they would reply with.

[Sausageman]

Fringe dweller,

I think the problem lies with the staff, Some of them are as mad as us on Astronomy, but others are not, especially the sales staff.
When I phoned up I got an answer, probably in India, from the accent. The guy was as helpful as a council inspector.
We live and learn, don't we?
Mike

[Sausageman]

Wow Xstream.
You have obviously had more probs than me!
But i tried the email thing, what a waste of time that was....
It actually took an email to the editor to fix things.
But that didn't last either.
I am still 3 mag's short of my subscription.
Mike

[xstream]

Not so much me Mike, but my wife, she subscribed but that's beside the point.
In todays age there is no excuse for it. I make no apologies for what I have said. To run a business like that is just not on today, if we did that where I work we wouldn't last 5 minutes and lastly to ignore emails is just the height of rudeness.
Boy this thread is making my blood boil again (calm down John it's not good for your Hypertension)

[Rodstar]

John (Xstream), I can just imagine a therapist sitting back, listening to this, and asking, "And how does that make you feel?"

Sounds like we could all do with 1 hour on a therapist's couch!
:scared3:

[h0ughy]

and that includes reading the latest issue of s&s :D

[beren]

Ive enjoyed the the latest issues of Sky and Space and ill be greedy and say i hope the mag survives even though its starting to look dicey , the prevous editions highlighted new equipment and news as reasons for delay for release but now thats starting to wear thin .As a non-subscriber ill take it as it comes but for those who have subscribed its got to be down right annoying , AS&t is moving along very nicely.

[Brendan]

mike, i too subscribe to the mag, apparently they are extending subscriptions for those clients who missed out on issues last year.

I don't know if they would accept your claim that the May/June edition was "missed" simply because it did not arrive in May. Maybe Rod can advise on that point of law.

I too also find the lack of response to communication frustrating, like louie i was a subscriber to the now defuncted Southern Astronomy, I actually rang the shop and supposedly had the balance of that subscription transfered to the new sky and space.

I guess we shall just wait and see what happens next.

[mch62]

Finally got through and had an interesting conversation with Lyle Rumble the managing editor from S&S .

I suggested to him very nicely to check his e-mails and reply to them re missing issues and made a point that this STD conversation cost the amount of an issue . :poke:

Any way to cut a very long story short (this guy should be a politician) there restructuring???? and are aware of the problem da de da de da de da and we have been in business for 17 years da de da de da we will be extending your subscription for the 2 issues missing and the latest May/June is not far off and so on and so on.
I did make the point not to bother with May/June as the charts and info will be out of date now.

I suggest don't bother with e-mails and spend the cost of a subscription and phone him and voice your feelings , if you can get through.

02 93693344

Now we wait and see.

On a positive note , and I did let him know , I like the magazine and enjoy the articals but it would be nice to have it to read.

Mark

[fringe_dweller]

Mike, Maybe those sales staff are too busy dreaming of working for an Ozzie 'money spinner' popular mag like something along the lines of "Babes & Cars" Maybe if there was more centrespreads of Lovely young ladies draped on the bonnets of hot cars - Sky and Space wouldnt be in this position? Maybe something along the lines of beren's amusing avatars? :)
Did you mention councils!!! ....count to ten fringey, count to ten and breathe deeply - whew - web rage containment successful!

Can I bore the s**t out you all a bit more? :) with one of my crazy old crusty crackpot theories? I have heard the comment put forward about the level of Australian NZ content in AS&T - That also occurred to me when i first read the AS&T - (incidently I thought the timing was funny - coincided with the FTA with the US that lowered/relaxed legally required OZ content levels and allowed more OS control in Oz based media... hhmmm? not complaining! just making an observation!) I would say this - considering that S&S comes out at best maybe 4 - 5 times a year and AS&T comes out 11 times a year - if you multiply the Oz/NZ content of say *minimum*? 30% - 40% in AS&T by 11x - that is equal to the Oz content a year we now get from S&S! :D ( but i would think that the local adds make up 50% of any mag - and i actually love the adds of course - helps me keep with developments -so in theory a lot more than 30% - plus readers pics thats another chunk - and now so many more local pic takers will get to be showcased more often :) it all good :)

Cheers
Fringey
fully paid up card carrying member of the chattering classes!

[astroron]

Mark Lyle Rumble has been saying that for the last God knows how many years, I gave up subscribing to S/S many years ago.
John Naly from AS&T was the editor and co founder of S/S and he left to go to go to the other mag.
I think you all should save your phone money and typing fingers and just get AS&T, at least it comes out on time, and as time goes by it will get more Aussie and Kiwi stuff to fill our reading pleasure, as well you can get most of the stuff that you get in the mags on the internet. astroron

[Moonman]

:poke: I managed to get an extension on my subsription due to the folding of the Southern Astronomy Magazine which I also paid a subscription for. I learned after a few goes that it is pointless emailing S&S (absolutely and always no response). I resorted to a telephone conversation which did the trick. I'm not so sure now but reading this lot makes me think I was extremely lucky that this worked.

Anyway I love the Mag. and I have been wondering when the next edition is going to appear in my letterbox. Hopefully worth the wait.

[Sausageman]

WOW. Have I hit a sore nerve or what?

I honestly didn't expect this many replies to my original post.

I was in Sydney today 9th June, and visited a good newsagent, still no issue of S&S.
I bought AS & T instead. It was a good read on the flight back to Brisbane.

To be honest, what use is a May/June edition of what is happening in the astronomy circle that doesn't appear on time? To me is is a total waste of money, it's like buying a month old newspaper.

I think we should end this thread, it has only served to get people annoyed again, and has obviously done no good, we have not heard from S&S.

Mike

[h0ughy]

your ok mike, just don't mention the war !!!!!(aka fawlty towers :rofl: )

[Moonman]

In the past they have actually skipped and issue and gone straight to the period in which it is issued so if there is a holdup we may see a June/July or July/August Issue. Who knows because they will never respond if asked so this will always be speculation untill it happens.

Kind regards and best wishes to all at Sky and Space. :rofl:

[beren]

looks like your right Michael on their site in the subscription section they have July /august as next issue

http://www.skyandspace.com.au/cache/header-40public__0-0.html?cache=no

[Rodstar]

I'm not rushing to fill in the 3 year subscription.

[h0ughy]

why not ROD? What more could you do but play a guessing game, what month will I receive my mag. 36 months for 18 issues. ;) :zzz2: that could mean 6 years before you get them allllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll llllllllllllllllll

[Rodstar]

Houghy, I guess a three year subscription could be looked upon as a Life Subscription?!

[jdb]

Dear Astronomy Enthusiast

INTRODUCTION
The ‘New’ SKY & SPACE Magazine has certainly come a
long way since the re-launch of our publication. We
are now in the process of moving to the magazine’s
next big stage of development.

FORTHCOMING ISSUE
We currently have a 'New' SKY & SPACE Magazine in
production and this issue will be released early
July. In due course, full details of all future
publishing dates will be announced.

Our last issue was Mar/Apr 05. Subscribers have had
their subscription period extended to make up for
the missing May/Jun issue.

OVERVIEW OF EXPANSION PLANS
The Company has recently been restructured with a
new equity partner.

Additional funding is being arranged to carry out
activities such as: the acquisition of new graphic
design equipment, new systems and procedures for a
more-efficient magazine production, newsstand
distribution into key overseas markets, the
refurbishment and restocking of our retail shop, the
launch of the ‘SKY & SPACE News Update Email
Service’ together with various new services and
initiatives that will soon be announced.

OUR THANKS TO EVERYONE
We thank all our supporters – friends, staff, editors,
writers, astrophotographers, advertisers, readers,
subscribers, suppliers, the media and many other
people who have all expressed a keen determination
to see that a 100% locally-produced, high-quality
magazine continues to provide a much-needed service
for the Australian & New Zealand astronomical and
space science communities.

If you wish to forward this announcement to any
other people then please feel free to do so.

*********************************** ****
FULL DETAILS OF OUR PLANS CAN
BE SEEN IN THE ATTACHED PDF
*********************************** ****
Clear Southern Skies

The 'New' SKY & SPACE team

[Rodstar]

JDB, I find your "reply" entirely unsatisfactory. I respectfully suggest that you re-read this thread, and actually respond to the issues raised. No amount of puffery about a restructure addresses the abject failure to provide what you are contracted to provide.

[mick pinner]

l was under the impression ( maybe misguided ) that this restructuring was done when the new staff took over from the old regime, why does reorganizing the distribution procedures stop the publication of the very thing you want to distribute? The magazine is surely at the heart of the whole operation and with the lack of astronomical publications generally, one would think that keeping the existing readers happy would be paramount not to mention those of us that subscribe and spend our money in advance.

[mick pinner]

ps. l agree 100% Rod.

[acropolite]

Rodstar Said


I have to agree. There's no excuse for not answering emails.

[astroron]

As I have said in one of my other posts they have been coming out with the same old excuses for the last 18 years, every excuse in the book has been given, I will only believe what they say when the put more than two issues out ontime, (pigs might fly)
astroron

[Sausageman]

What a cheery condescending post by S&S, it's as if nothing is wrong, so perhaps they haven't taken in what has been expressed here, or don't care about us.

Perhaps it would be prudent to inform subscribers, that delays in publications will occur, "BEFOREHAND", giving an explaination and telling us that we won't lose any issues.
An apology certainly wouldn't go amiss, even if too late. I didn't see one in the "post".

Mike

[castor]

Although I am not a subscriber to S&S, I regularly buy this magazine off the shelf.

Over the last few years since I have been involved in this hobby, S&S should be congratulated for including a considerable number of interesting, insightful, and informative articles.

However, in my experience, the tardiness of publication and the number of issues that seems to have gone missing has remained an issue that has yet to be addressed. When this magazine was published once every two months, it usually did not go on sale until the middle of the second month for which it was to have been issued.

Since "new management" took over this magazine there have been some very good expanded editions and even the odd time where the publication was released on schedule. However, missing an issue has happened regularly. This is not the first time. AS&T this year has come out spotlessly on time and if S&S even hopes to compete with them on a par, much improvement in their publication administration is warranted.

Australia needs an astronomy magazine that is independently published by Australians with relevant material, and one that is released on a REGULAR BASIS. Canada and Britain have both been able to achieve this. I thought that your change in management was meant as one of its goals to fix up this issue, and you clearly seem to have failed utterly.

**collapses into a black hole**

[xstream]

I don't believe it........How long can they keep fobbing everything off with the same old story? As Ron said after 18 years it's starting to wear thin.
As far as I'm concerned they no longer have any credibility at all.
Maybe this could be a challenge for AS&T and make their Aus. Mag 100% Australian content, the opportunity is there for the taking.

[Brendan]

I have to agree with rod, the reply in this post certainly by its self dose not address the issues raised . How ever i did read the attached pdf.

it addressed some issues but i wonder if its a case of running befor walking?

changes made to improve readability :bashcomp:

[h0ughy]

Yes I have heard most of the :poke: reasons given many times before. I have every issue, and most of the other quarterly mag as well, but I must say, as a business you need to get the product out there, and if you have'nt got enought then bung it in the next issue, but send it out on time regardless. Why you could even call the leftout articles, new bumper edition special features for the next issue. But just do it. I am ashamed to say that they have lost my support as they have not proven that they can stay in the race. I agree with Rod on every point.

[rmcpb]

I don't even look for this mag any more and if I see it I don't think I would bother buying it. The only effect of that is to draw out the pain, if we don't support it at all at least we all know where we stand. Sky & Telescope is at least regular. RIP Sky & Space.

[mick pinner]

l wonder what the buisnesses who advertise in S & S think about all this, surely they pay in advance.

[rowena]

at least we got a response!....

did anyone read the attached PDF?? some interesting bits in there...
i.e.couldnt access design equipment due to fire/flooding...

[astroron]

Rowena as I have said they have used every excuse in the book over the last 18 years. astroron

[jdb]

Thanks R...!The next issue will be available soon (in the mail to subscribers)...:2thumbs:

Could everyone who has expressed a concern here pm me their details and I will endeavour to look into it for you. :bashcomp:

Cheers and clear skies,
jdb.

[Sausageman]

I think, the problem is money.

In order to put items into the magazine, they have to pay royalties to the writers, so to keep costs down they miss an issue or two or three per year.
Maybe there are not enough advertisers to pay the wages of the staff and the royalties. maybe the cost of advertising is too low.
Normaly ads cover all the costs of production and make the profits.

Will we see an issue with nothing but adverts in it?

This mag needs an enema of biblical proportions to make it viable.

Mike

[Sausageman]

Maybe the wages of the staff are way too high!
Mike

[ballaratdragons]

jdb has come back and posted again after reading the rest of the posts (even including the mention of no apology)

and still he hasn't use the 'S' word or the 'A' word.

'Sorry' or We 'Apologise' for any inconvenience.

That is tasteless to me (especially after it was mentioned there was no apology). I won't be buying their rag!! Goodbye S&S.

[ausastronomer]

jdb

As Ron said, you,ve been saying that for 18 years. You indicate the next issue will be released in early July, I'll bet its not.

I have been buying this magazine whenever it is available, which recently has been very irregularly, off the newstsands since 1991. I have by choice not subscribed to the magazine for the simple reason you have no idea when the next issue is going to be available.

Someone else asked the question what do the magazines advertisers think ? Let me tell you from speaking to a lot of them, they are suitably unimpressed.

Aust Sky and Telescope may not be 100% local content but at least its produced on a regular timely basis, which is what advertisers and readers and subscribers want. I can see Aus Sky and Tel's circulation growing at a rapid rate and also the % of local contribution increasing and also the support of local advertisers as at least suppliers ads get into readers hands.

Please note that my criticism is in no way directed at the quality of the magazine. I think its a great magazine with excellent content. I wouldn't have continued to buy it for 14 years if it wasn't a great product. My criticism is solely related to the spasmodic and untimely publication of the magazine.

IMO its move over Sky and Space, Aus Sky and Tel is coming through, unless you people pull your finger out and pull it out very quickly.

CS-John B

[ballaratdragons]

Oops! I think you meant to say Aust Sky & Telescope.

[jdb]

Thanks ausastronomer,

You'll be delighted to know that the next issue should be available this week.

As always, we appreciate all your comments. :thumbsup:

jdb.

[xstream]

I don't believe the gall of jdb, still nothing.
I wouldn't care if it was the last astronomy mag. ever, it certainly wont be going on my coffee table.

[atalas]

Well John, seems "sorry is the hardest word" pride has destroyed many a great men!


Louie :evil2:

[xstream]

You're not wrong there Louie!

[Sausageman]

JDB,
If I were you I would be :ashamed: of how you have treated we :astron: .
There are alot of :mad: people out there, you should be :scared2: that we will abandon your mag.
Your mag is getting:bashcomp: here, yet you still make out that you are :innocent:
Are you :confused: or just :stupid:
Why not :bowdown: and admit that you have treated us badly.
Mike

[h0ughy]

come on guys, can't you see the humour in jdb's post. take a long hard look at the cover on the right in the middle. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[atalas]

Hahaha :rofl: I see It ! and yes you will go out with a bang.



Louie :bashcomp:

[h0ughy]

are you callen me a dinosaur Louie :fight:

[atalas]

Only the bottom half David ! :rofl:

Louie :D

[ballaratdragons]

A Prophetic front cover!

How clever of them to write about their own demise.

[h0ughy]

Oh so cruel :rofl:

[jdb]

As I said in a previous post, pm me your individual concerns and I will look into it. TO this point, no one has pm me...this gives me the impression that there are no legitimate complaints - if you are upset with the irregularity of the magazine - this has been explained and no subscriber has lost an issue. If you have any other gripes, as I said, pm me and I will look into it.

We are sorry for any problems that you may have encountered, it is not our intention to upset people.

I am also sorry for the hostility that some of you are displaying towards the magazine - if you have unresolved issues, pm me and I will look into it for you.

In the last couple of years we have had some major incidents (not excuses) - fire, flood, serious illnesses with key staff, major capital developments in our area which have seriously effected access to the shop, key staff moving on - 'basically', for a small community-based business, things that would have stopped many other companies dead in their tracks. I am not trying to make excuses - we know that we have to get the magazine out on time - we are just asking that you at least understand our circumstances.

As far as your humour regarding our fate is concerned - very clever...!...but, we are still here after 17 years and all of the above, and strengthening our commitment to you.

[iceman]

I've stayed out of this thread so far and don't intend to get involved in it deeply as it's obviously a touchy issue for many people.

While I'm also a subscriber and wish the magazine came out more regularly, I can understand that the problems experienced by S&S would impact a regular release schedule.

I'm not intending to take sides, just please remember to be polite to each other and let's not degenerate into an area we don't want to see the forum go.

[Brendan]

Well said Ice,

Fair is Fair guys JDB has at least tried to respond to the concerns raised in this thread,
recovery of missed issues and regularity of publication.

If no one wants to open a personal dialoge with them over specific issues then stop the gripping and get on with the observing.
**********
To JDB,
on behalf of those of us here @ ice in space with cooler heads i would like to apologise for the behaviour of the few. I look forward to seeing my next subscription issue in my mail box in the near future and the continued improvments to this home grown publication. :thumbsup:

[Sausageman]

You are right of course Iceman,

I apologise for my remarks to you JDB.

I have now read the words that I was looking for. Thankyou JDB.
For me now the matter is closed.

I started this thread, can one of you moderators please close it?
I think enough has been said.

Mike

[jdb]

lol Mike B, I just re-read your opening 'stanza'...I hope we have addressed your concerns.

Glad you like the cover - we are featuring Asteroids, Meteors, Comets and the Deep Impact mission in this issue, from a range of authors which makes for some fascinating reading - along with all our regular sections.

We hope you all enjoy it and welcome feedback.

Cheers and clear skies,
jdb

[johnno]

Hi All,
JDB,
I congratulate you for your patience and perserverence,I know you have copped a fair bit of flak,and have taken it in your stride,while trying to explain the magazines position.
I,and I am sure many others here, appreciate your efforts to maintain a dialogue with your readers.
I have only been involved in the hobby for a couple of years,and buying the magazine for about 12 months.
I must say,I have enjoyed every issue,including this one,and hope the previous problems with getting the magazine out on time are now resolved.
All the Best.
Regards.John

[rumples riot]

JDB, just get the mag out on time and try to build on doing that each time it is due and treat it as one step at a time.

For me personally, I just want to see the next issue. I know and understand your circumstances quite well. I run my own business and I know how my clients can get some times. Sometimes they can be quite unreasonable and this makes life very hard especially when circumstances beyond our control prohibit your imput.

Large companies have more resources and staff to deal with the odd hiccup. From what you have said, you don't have the major backup that larger Mags have. Still I am prepared to stick by your mag, because it is Aussie and not 30%.

So just get the mag out and I am sure that the ill feeling will disappear with time.

Look forward to the next issue.

[Dennis]

Congratulations to everyone involved, for steering what appeared to be a deteriorating situation into one with a more reconciliatory and positive outcome, in spite of the deep feelings and challenging, but equally valid views, that gave rise to the thread.

A big well done folks!!!

[ving]

gee gone quiet here after this thread was posted to...

thanks for popping in jdb. tho I dont subscribe, S&S is a good mag that i read every so often. keep up the hard work.

gee I missed quite a thread didnt I?

[Mick]

S&S is a good read and value for money IMHO; I have been buying it for years from the newsstand and will continue to do so. Who knows one day I may be a subscriber.