New lazer laws

[danielsun]

Just got off the phone to Roger from Bintel and he has informed me that Bintel at this stage have put a hold on selling lazer pointers due to anything over 1mw is considered illegal!!
Roger has been in discussion with the police and apparently astronomical associations and clubs should be receiving notice about this sometime soon to allow only members to be able to purchase lazer pointers through their associations.

[Ric]

Hi Daniel, considering the time we live in I suppose it had to happen.

I'm always cautious not to use mine towards the south west as that points over the landing approach for Canberra airport.

The last thing I want is for some armed response unit to be kicking my door down thinking I'm a terrorist cell or something. :lol:

Cheers

[erick]

I've lodged my application for Police approval to possess and use a laser pointer. Had a call seeking a more detailed explanation of the use I plan to put it to. I wrote a treatise on pointing telescopes and indicating targets in the sky to the public and sent it in. Now I wait.

ps. I've started to look at the cheapest safes in Bunnings - yes, to store a 5mW laser pointer.

[bizarro]

Anyone know the NSW position on laser pointers?

[ballaratdragons]

Onya Daniel :thumbsup:

That would be a good outcome if they made green lasers permissable for Amatuer Astronomers and not the general public.

That may also mean that Amateurs wanting to purchase one may have to join a Club! And not every Amateur wants to be in a club.

Good on you Roger for getting into the talks with Police. It has been an unknown law thing for too long. We may be breaking the law and not know it. This will hopefully sort it out.

[casstony]

A safe or fire resistant box is also handy for storage of essential documents in the event of a house fire, so you'll get dual use out of it.

[danielsun]

Hi bizarro, at this stage it seems to be only Victoria though there was mention that other states may follow suit .

[danielsun]

Hopefully soon you will get a letter Ken, i am very interested in what exactly will be outlined in the notice for members to be able to own a lazer, weather we must sit a test or not and storage requirements.

[anthony2302749]

Hi all

Just to clean up some lose ends. It was the Victorian Police that approach BINTEL in regards to selling green laser points. In short, BINTEL Melbourne must be license to import and sell lasers in Victoria (paperwork pending). BINTEL can only sell green laser points to customers who have a valid license obtained from the Victorian Police.

As for astronomical societies, the society has to apply for an exemption from the law (something to do with the Victorian Governor) so that its members can process and use green laser pointer as part of their hobby, so this means that BINTEL can only sell laser points to a customer who has a valid membership to a society.

Currently to the best of my knowledge no society has exemption, but I do believe the Astronomical Society of Victoria is in the process of seeking exemption for its members but this will take time.

Anthony

P.S. We where aware that the Victorian Police were interested in the procession of and sale of green laser pointer in Victorian due to a previous discuss on IIS regarding a member buying a laser from E-Bay.

[GeoffW1]

Yours, and also that of anyone related to you in any way, as it seems to be just now. I just don't know if I want to be protected that much....:(

[OneOfOne]

I was wondering what must have "kicked it off". Funny how some crim can shoot inocent people in the city...nothing happens about guns. A cyclist kills a person and gets a "failing to stop at a red light" fine. But buy a laser pointer off EBay and all hell breaks loose!

[asterisk]

I first heard this on the news this morning:

Laser beam 'targeted Qantas pilot'

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2007/08/09/2000254.htm

I don't think that this will be too helpful for future non-intervention by governments.

[Ingo]

It's legal to own any laser pointer, and use it inside your property, no matter what power.

It is illegal to point it in airspace above 4.99mW in the USA, and I guess, 0.99mW in Australia. But as long as you keep safe and don't fool around with airplanes, you shouldn't have any problems.

[RB]

Laws vary from state to state here in Australia let along country to country !

We have much tighter gun laws here in Australia, are you willing to make the same statement about those too?

I think it's best that each person with a laser pointer should find out exactly where they stand in relation to their local laws.

[Ingo]

Guns are different than lasers. I don't see your point.

[RB]

My point is that you made a general statement saying:

This may be the case in the U.S (where you live) but each country has different laws governing these products, just like there's differing gun laws between countries.

To post a generalised statement saying you can use any laser "no matter what power as long as you don't point it at a plane" is apparently contrary to what Australian law says regarding these lasers.

Since this discussion is dealing with an Australian distributor I think this point needed to be emphasised and corrected !

[OneOfOne]

One problem is that any ol' hick can obtain a laser (even in Victoria) and point it at a plane, either deliberately or by accident, and those who have a valid reason for having one (us) stand to suffer the consequences! Even though all that happened was that a pilot was dazzled, he is unlikely to point the plane into the ground. The "worst" conceivable outcome is that someone is blinded.

People can obtain a gun, illegally or not, and shoot someone (or many people) and nothing seems to happen to the gun owners in general. They can continue to use their guns the same as they did the day before. The "worst" conceivable outcome is mass murder, let alone blindness.

It seems to me that the consequences we stand to suffer are disproportional to the illegal act performed...point a laser at the wrong thing and they consider taking them off everyone who has them. Kill someone and you can still keep your gun!

[Sgtfretsurfer]

wow, i wish id known some of this stuff about a year ago. i bought a 35mw green laser from 'wicked lasers', which got into the country as the company imported it as a 'pen light'. I loved it, and went crazy! i used it everywhere just for fun, totally naive to the fact that it was illegal. It got stolen from the back of my car like alot of my other gear a little while back, which cut me deep. But on the upside, i dont have to worry about being caught with an illegal laser!

[Louwai]

Eric, I'll be very interested to hear your outcome. If it's favourable, also would greatly appreciate a copy of your testimony for similar use.

Regarding a Safe, through my import buisness I have a good contact with a security manufacturing co. in Shanghai. They make both keyed & Finger Print Recognition safes. A good friend of mine is the sales mgr & I'm sure I couild get a reasonable deal if we had some interest fo a few orders.

Bryan

[OneOfOne]

I also made a point of saying that I would be using it for public viewings, which I do, for showing various objects. I didn't need to offer any further information, although this was a couple of years ago now. I think mine runs out next year.

[Nevyn]

Well I've been looking at getting myself a laser pointer for awhile now so I can show my kids what they are looking at through the scope. After tonights news I think things are going to only get harder to own one!

http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?rn=248153&cl=3674871&ch=885604&src=y7news

[vindictive666]

just heard the story on the tv flaming idiot i say

[OneOfOne]

I just watched the news clip and the lasers they used for the story are of course MUCH more powerful than any of us would be likely to ever use. I wonder if the lasers used by the offenders are of this type or the more typical 5-30mW that we would use?

As for the potential 2 years sentence...go for it! I would prefer it if the sentence could be placed on any offender over the age of 12 (old enough to know better), and a thousand dollar fine would be a good addition too. As for people dropping rocks on cars (not quite a fair comparison) I would fire a rock at 100kph at them and see how they like it!

[erick]

I've been thinking about this after reading the news clip (below). If a plane is targeted and the police find you out observing with a laser in your possession (appropriately approved, licenced etc.) how are they going to prove it was you without witnesses, photographs etc., given there is no physical evidence like bullets, fired weapons etc? However, the opposite also applies - if they haven't located anyone else, you would be a suspect and may well have great difficulty getting yourself out of that!

This is all so sad and annoying. I cannot get over the mentality or lack of it that would allow someone to point a laser beam at a plane!

Govt to get tough on lasers targeting planes

The Civil Aviation Safety Authority (CASA) says the Federal Government is developing legislation that will include a two-year jail sentence for anyone convicted of shining laser beams at planes.
So far this year there have been around 80 cases of lasers being directed at planes across the country, with two incidents reported in Sydney last week.
CASA spokesman Peter Gibson says the lasers can be used from up to five kilometres away and it can be difficult to catch offenders, but tough new laws are about to be introduced.
"There is legislation on the way which will be Commonwealth legislation, so we would be able to apply it everywhere," he said.
"There will be up to a two-year jail penalty as well as fines, so that's on its way. They are also state offences under current state legislation."

[IanL]

I remember a story in the local rag back in Scotland where a police officer conducting speed traps in the remote highlands of Scotland pointed a laser speed gun at a passing military jet on exercise. The police officers radar gun suddenly stopped working.

Cutting it short he headed back to the local police office only to be asked in to the office by his boss to explain what he had been doing as he received a call from the local military police saying that if the plane had been fully loaded with weapons he would be dead.

The plane locked onto his laser or radar from the gun and sent a jamming signal to it which broke it. But worse of all he was told that the plane weapon systems went into automatic mode and if it had been fully loaded it would have dropped a bomb on him and the pilot would not be able to stop it.:eyepop:

[tornado33]

Andrews Communications still sell them, up to 20 mw
http://www.andrewscom.com.au/site-content-section-10-andrews.htm

[jane68]

Hello from the north east of england! The ban is in place here yet, I have a 50 mw laser and use it VERY carefully. I have a feeling the ban on lasers is also to do with what they ATTRACT. Im not an official astronomer, just love looking up in general awe, and since I used the laser I've seen incredible things! You's lot MUST have seen something between you.

Jane

[renormalised]

You wouldn't be allowed to have a 50mW laser out here. Too powerful and some idiots think it's funny to shine the light into people's eyes, planes etc.

Most sold here are fairly weak 5-20mW.

We just use them for general pointing and as a finder on our telescopes.

[AdrianF]

I have both a 10mW and a 50mW green laser and have been too worried to use them. I dont live under the air corridor but the Airport is only 3k as the crow flies or laser fires.
I didnt realise how bright they would be.

Adrian

[[1ponders]]

Nothing wrong with using them Adrian. Here in qld at least. As long as they are only used for their original purpose, as a pointer. Just don't point them low to the horizon and in the general direction of the airport.
:)

[erick]

For info - renewal of my Victorian Permit is coming up. I enquired and have been told:-

"Please be advised that all applications for a Chief Commissioner's
Approval Permit, as well as import permits to import weapons are
currently on hold due to the new legislation being implemented in August
2010. Upon implementation of the amendments to the legislation this office
will then be sending all renewals for approvals to individuals and
businesses who hold a CCP Approval."

I wonder what is in the new legislation :confused2:

[AdrianF]

Part of my concern is I live in an area of "oldies" and I don't want to worry them too much. They are already worried when both my wife and I fire up the bikes and put our leather jackets on.

Adrian

[OneOfOne]

I received a letter a couple of weeks ago from Victoria Police indicating the penalties for selling restricted items to people under the age of 18 or without holding an appropriate liscence. I suggest that most of the changes "should" be concerning other items, such as guns, knives and other martial arts weapons. I know which I would rather....have someone threaten to attack you with a laser pointer or a gun/knife! Hopefully the legislation does not loose sight of the "real items" that it is meant to control and restrict. Having a pointer directed at you face at point blank range may dazzle you, having a gun pointed at you will more than dazzle!

[erick]

Yep, got that letter, Trevor. Maybe that is the change to which they are referring.

[marki]

I have a 5mw green laser which is only ever used to point out objects when I run astronomy nights at the college I teach at. I am always extremely careful when I use it and would hate to lose it as a teaching tool. There are laws governing their use in WA but these do not seem to be enforced to any degree. I would like to see a licensing system here where users get proper training before being granted permission to buy and operate a laser. Like guns they should require a specific reason for use and there capacity limited (5mw is plenty for my purposes I have found). As for idiots who point them at aircraft and cars etc, throw the book at them.

Mark

[Jen]

:screwy: well i tried to do the right thing and went to the Police Station about owning a 5mw green laser pointer and he said if im not using it in a public place then that is fine i dont need a permit :rolleyes: and he sent me off on my merry way :D