NEW: Sky-Watcher Star Adventurer GTi

[AdamJL]

New mini EQ mount from Sky-Watcher.
5kg payload. Mount is 2.6kg. Counterweight is 2.2kg.

edit: cleaned up the thread with multiple YT reviews and links for purchase.

Video reviews:

Trevor Jones (AstroBackyard) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixtbnump-9I)
Nico Carver (Nebula Photos) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzmloQA-K7I)
Alyn Wallace (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_p5g-UvPZ0E) (this guy doesn't do deep sky as much, so a few things/comments were a bit basic)

Aussies:
Joel Stafford (The Tired Photographer) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xhy89P1-AAk)
Steven Morris (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HyQKXOk1Wcw) (and first light video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czGytWApguI), and using it with NINA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDgarniLdos)
Dylan O'Donnell (brief mention) (https://youtu.be/9obanV-fPYA?t=326)

And Official Sky-Watcher Australia video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YTz53zTAuXQ) (looks like Steven Morris got that job!)

$1,049 from your store of choice. $50 off RRP for now.

Sidereal (https://www.siderealtrading.com.au/product/sky-watcher-star-adventurer-gti-wifi-goto-mount/)
AstroAnarchy (http://www.astroanarchy.com.au/telescopes/StarAdventurer_GTi_Head.html)
Bintel (https://www.bintel.com.au/product/sky-watcher-star-adventurer-gti/])

edit: a few more stores, some a touch cheaper than the majors above:

Camera Warehouse ($1,048) (https://www.camera-warehouse.com.au/sky-watcher-star-adventurer-gti-wifi-mount)
Binocentral ($1,099.. i.e. no discount) (https://binocentral.com.au/star-adventurer-gti-goto-wifi-mount)
Diamonds Camera ($1,039, cheapest so far) (https://www.diamondscamera.com.au/sky-watcher-star-adventurer-gti?SearchID=193870&SearchPos=1)

[Startrek]

Looks like a winner to me, Synta will be getting flogged with orders from around the globe so expect long lead times if you want one
They’ve modeled the design from their extensive EQ range of mounts but in a miniature compact light weight portable version
I think it runs on A4 batteries in 2 cartridges but does it have a power port to run off a single larger battery ?
Just a lovely little mount !!!

[AdamJL]

Hi Martin

Yes, it can run from external 12V power. It has a 2.1mm 12V power port, hand controller port, autoguiding port, and USB-B port for PC access.

I think the 5kg weight limit could have been improved, but we'll see if it can be pushed further like the AZ-GTI can.

[JA]

Hi Adam,

I'd be curious to know your thoughts or any links etc, to how far the AZ-GTI can be pushed.

Best
JA

[AdamJL]

Hi JA

I've just been following the (very long!) thread on CN on the mount, and have seen a few people go over the 5kg limit with good results.

here's the thread:
https://www.cloudynights.com/topic/586532-new-skywatcher-az-gti-goto-wifi-mount/

Thing is, the AZ-GTI has a lot of variation from mount to mount so it's a bit of a lottery. You can "tune it" but that's no guarantee of success

[JA]

Thx Adam, I'll have a read.

Best
JA

EDIT: From CN thread for our reference here, some example payloads over 5kg limit...
- Used with a Tak 100 and other accessories at ~20% over payload limit , so ~6kg
- NP101IS, dovetails, diagonal, Telrad, and EP 14 lbs, so 6.3kg worked OK some vibration slewing
- "I had no problem using the AWB OneSky (15lbs / 6.8kg) to image M51 for 5 minutes."
- from <= page 30 in 130 page thread

[AdamJL]

Excellent. You really can push that little gem if you get a good copy. Not everyone gets good copies though!
It does give me confidence that I can use 5kg on this newer mount. The Mrs has given approval for it to be purchased :)

[AdamJL]

Pre-ordered. Let's see how this goes...

[Camelopardalis]

I don’t subscribe to the hyperbole from the YouTubers, but I’m curious as to how the mount differs from an AZ-GTi on a wedge.

The AZ-GTi can be quite an effective travel rig, mine seems to guide quite well, at least within my expectations.

For the extra $$ I’d hope the new mount has a more sophisticated drivetrain…

[AdamJL]

The AZ-GTI is a lottery in terms of being able to be used effectively as an EQ mount. There are some great samples out there and there are some not-so-great. This new mount also has a larger RA gear which should mean a sturdier travel through the cycle.

I like the size of the AZ-GTI to be honest, but also excited to be getting a proper mini EQ mount

[JA]

Here is a StarAdventurer GTi - Youtube review - from Highpoint Scientific... (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKmZVtXRXq0)

Best
JA

[Icearcher]

If the quality of the mount in the highpoint review carries over to the wider community then this is going to be one awesome bit of kit.

15 minutes guided exposures is amazing for such a cheap bit of kit.

Im even happier I place an order for one.

[AstroViking]

I think that if I was just starting out in this hobby, a mount like this is what I'd want. Light, simple to operate, can carry a reasonable payload and with go-to capability.

[Drac0]

Too true Steve - would have made the first real venture into astro a lot more enjoyable. :D

[djsmyth88]

Agreed, kind of surprised they didn't boost the payload capacity beyond the Star Adventurer - but looks like a great piece of kit nonetheless.

[Crater101]

As someone who has been a visual observer for a while, I've pre ordered on of these from Testar

https://www.testar.com.au/


to see how I go. Dipping my toe into the waters of astrophotogaphy after seeing much of the fine work on this site.


It DOES seem that there are good copies and bad copies, as far as production goes, from what I've read. I'll keep you posted.

[gregbradley]

That link shows all the Testar stocked products. Which one were you specifically referring to? The new Skywatcher Adventurer GTi?

Greg.

[gregbradley]

A Redcat 71 would be a good match for this mount. Also a William Optics 81mm would be good and a light ZWO or QHY camera.

Greg.

[JA]

Hi Greg,

In the Highpoint Scientific review I linked earlier it shows the StarAdverturer GTi mount used with a Redcat51 (250mm fL) and Apertura (430mm fL) scopes with a ZWO 294mm and achieving very good unguided and guided results considering those focal lengths equate to an equivalent field of view as that from ~470mm and 800mm focal lengths on Full-Frame. That equates to an image scale of 3.8 arcseconds/pixel (on the 250mm fL) and 2.2 arcseconds/pixel (on the 430mm fL), whilst still producing round stars for respectably long unguided and guided exposures. Very handy for such a mount for travel, etc..

I'm looking forward to getting one of these mounts. For me, compared with the SW AZ-GTi I've used, the best part is that everything on the StarAdverturer GTi is integrated and more robust: especially the integrated wedge with its fine latitude and altitude adjustments, counterbalance shaft, etc.

Best
JA

[AdamJL]

There are quite a few new portable mounts now. Obviously there are new and existing harmonic mounts. Very expensive, but very portable, and iOptron have recently joined the party.
SkyWatcher aren't anywhere near it I don't think, based off some comments on a recent podcast.

But there's also what appears to be competitor to the venerable SkyWatcher AZ-GTI from iOptron.

It's even lighter than the subject model of this thread, but carries the same capacity. Looks pretty interesting:

https://www.testar.com.au/collections/new-products/products/ioptron-skyhunter-az-goto-mount
https://www.testar.com.au/collections/new-products/products/ioptron-skyhunter-eq-az-goto-w-ipolar
https://www.testar.com.au/collections/new-products/products/ioptron-skyhunter-eq-az-goto-mount

[Crater101]

My apologies. :whistle: Yes, that's the one. Correct URL...


https://www.testar.com.au/products/skywatcher-star-adventurer-gti-wifi?_pos=3&_sid=54c7fa496&_ss=r


And yes, a Redcat 71 would be a good match. I have a 100mm f2.8 prime that I'm planning on using with a Canon 60D (modded) until I get used to using it, and then was considering one of the slightly smaller Redcat 51 or maybe a Zenithstar 61 scope.

[gregbradley]

Thanks Warren.

Sounds lime a good setup and would really be good for those who need to travel to a dark site.

Greg.

[SB]

... Looks like a nice setup. Very tempting! Would I buy it? Not sure as it only takes me 5 min max to put the EQ6-R and Esprit in the car (imaging train intact). I even use the EQ6-R for the FMA180!
Now if going overseas thats a different matter but there again it’s usually travel in the Northern Hemisphere summer where is doesn’t get dark!

It does open up other Imaging opportunities, however I feel personally that too many choices can sometimes dilute focus and expertise in core activities.

SB

[AdamJL]

The obvious flip side is if you go in their winter :thumbsup:
Now you're looking at a heck of a lot of integration time!

[JA]

I just saw an approximate 22 June 2022 availability for the StarAdventurer GTi on the SkyWatcher Australia website. My guess is that this probably relates to units already on order rather than for stock.

Image snipped below...

Best
JA

[AdamJL]

That's right, JA.. at least based off the details provided to me by Bintel who said the 23rd for my order.
Initially it was June 6, but that date has slipped across the country.

[Spaceman_Brown]

Adam, did you pre-order in the first lot of GTI's through Bintel? I thought I remember their website saying that the first batch were due in late May back when the mount was first announced.

[AdamJL]

Hi Matt. That's right, I did it almost day 1.

The date has shifted around a fair bit. Hoping the 23rd is still on track!
Some people in the US have been told 2023 at the earliest. I'll be cancelling my order if that happens.

[Spaceman_Brown]

Hmm, that's a concern. I'll probably do the same if it's delayed that long and order an iOptron Skyhunter instead.

I'm chasing a super lightweight, fully automated rig that I can set up on my roof for a night's imaging and control remotely because it's the only spot on my property that's clear of the trees. This little mount would be a great solution. I haven't been brave enough to haul up my AZ-EQ6 and set it up on the roof tiles haha

[alan meehan]

Just ordered mine from Bintel on backorder looking forward to this little mount ,will be putting on a w/o 90 weighed in at 4kg plus guide scope dslr all up 5.1kg .i need something like this because my AZ-EQ6 stays in the observatory and because of back problems i cannot lift very much cannot wait to give this a go

[Spaceman_Brown]

Do you think it will balance that 5.1kg rig with the included 2.2kg counterweight?
I noticed a few photos shown the the Skywatcher what's up webcast https://youtu.be/rUY29PJSitE where a few rigs that I guestimated to be around 5kg and they were all balanced with EQ6R counterweights. However, those rigs looked to have quite a high center of gravity. I'm sure it wouldn't be a problem if you rigged everything nice and low

[Crater101]

2023? The last I heard they were due late June / early July, the original shipments having been moved back from early June.



Testar has them listed as "available soon."
https://www.testar.com.au/products/skywatcher-star-adventurer-gti-wifi?_pos=3&_sid=2ebf32aa3&_ss=r


Bintel says July 2022
https://www.bintel.com.au/product/sky-watcher-star-adventurer-gti/


OzScopes page says late July
https://www.ozscopes.com.au/skywatcher-star-adventurer-gti-wifi-goto-mount.html


Adelaide Optical says "coming soon"
https://adelaideoptical.net.au/product/skywatcher-star-adventurer-gti-wifi-mount


Sirius Optics doesn't have any listed
https://www.sirius-optics.com.au/catalogsearch/result/?cat=0&q=star+adventurer


...and Andrewscom, like others, has them listed as "coming soon."
http://www.andrewscom.com.au/optical-telescopes
(Scroll down about 3/4 of the way to the bottom)


Like yourselves, if the shipping time runs into next year, I'll certainly be looking to cancel, and I appreciate the heads-up.

[JA]

Hi Matt,
I think you should be OK balancing your ~5kg payload using the standard counterweight based on looking at a Steven Morris (Hello Steve) YouTube video, which shows him demonstrating a balanced ~3.6kg load (SW Evolux 62ed, Nikon Z7 with Nikon battery grip) with the standard 2.3kg counterweight HALF WAY along the counterweight shaft. Extrapolating from there, if the counterweight was moved to the extreme end of the shaft I'd expect no problem in dealing with a 5kg payload with a similarly low centre of mass.

If your situation becomes marginal for balance you could consider locating any guide scope, if it's a mini type, to below the main scope possibly attached to the underside of a longish dovetail bar. Also ensure the counterweight shaft uses the lower of the two counterweight shaft mounting screw holes.

Best
JA

[AdamJL]

Bintel now advise that shipping will be in August....

tempted to cancel the order, save a few pennies, and get a ZWO AM5 instead.

[JA]

Hold your nerve Adam.
It is but a moment in history or another $3400 for the AM5:D

Best
JA

[AdamJL]

haha, I've the patience of a teenager, JA :lol:
But you're totally right, of course. I'll keep waiting.

[Crater101]

I hope this isn't going to be one of those instances where in August, it's announced that shipping will be in September. And so on... :shrug:

[alan meehan]

Bintel now says july,on track

[AdamJL]

That's been there for a while. They haven't updated their site (in fact, the July date was for the second batch of orders.. first one was sold out and was supposedly for June)

Bintel emailed the people in the first batch of pre-orders yesterday saying August, so the July date will be pushed back for others.

[Crater101]

Folks;


Just as a quick follow up to this...


I pre-ordered mine through Testar, and the other day I enquired via email as to arrival dates. They got back to me pretty quickly and while they didn't specify a date, they did state that the Star Adventurer is expected for delivery late this month.


EDIT: I spoke with imprecision...late July is when the company will take delivery, so shipping to customers may be a little longer.



Cheers.

[alan meehan]

Late july it is then ,just got to wait ,i wanted to take it up to QLD for astrofest
maybe not

[Hoges]

First batch arrived at Testar: https://www.facebook.com/groups/229519518411077/?multi_permalinks=779532286743128%2 C778299236866433%2C776991156997241% 2C778258970203793%2C778114013551622 ¬if_id=1657362657836530¬if_t=group_ activity&ref=notif (https://www.facebook.com/groups/229519518411077/?multi_permalinks=779532286743128%2 C778299236866433%2C776991156997241% 2C778258970203793%2C778114013551622&notif_id=1657362657836530&notif_t=group_activity&ref=notif)

[AdamJL]

coool :) hopefully will get mine in a few days.

[alan meehan]

Bintel says next couple days hopefully

[AdamJL]

Just got a call from Bintel, mine is ready for collection. Won’t be able to until Monday but if you’ve ordered as part of the first batch you should be getting yours soon

[AstroViking]

I am looking forward to hearing what you have to say about the GTi, Adam. Hopefully it's as good as the preview / beta-release reviewers said it is.

[JA]

Apparently mine has just arrived at Siderial Trading. Now to brave the traffic across town.

Best
JA

[Crater101]

Just got an e-mail from Testar to say mine is on the way. I'll keep you posted...





So say all of us! Here's hoping it lives up to the promises.

[AdamJL]

JA could be numero uno :)
We're all expecting a detailed unboxing video and breakdown posted to YouTube by morning :rofl:

[AdamJL]

Can't wait to use it, Steve! I also hope it's a good unit and fills the requirements and expectations I have from it.
I'll likely not have proper shooting time with it until the end of next week, weather permitting, but will give it a dry setup run in the house and see what it can do.

[JA]

Sorry Adam, I picked it up yesterday and opened the box in the car on the way home :D

It looks and feels like a great unit and happily now replaces my excellent, but now sold SW AZ-gti for the main reason of the integrated wedge and it's fine screw drive altitude adjustment (exactly what I wanted). It will make a good travel mount and also possibly, if it works out, a car mounted mount, but that's another story.

I plan to use it on a manfrotto tripod I have once I've made up an adaptor base.

Best
JA

[Hoges]

What sort of adapter does it need? I'm planning on putting mine on a Slik AMT tripod that has a 3/8 thread sticking up out of it. Does it need an upright 'post' for the azimuth adjustment?

[JA]

Hi John,

It doesn't really need an adapter, as the tripod's centre vertical shaft has a 3/8inch thread male stud that would screw straight in to the base of the Star Adventurer GTi, but the male 3/8 thread on most tripods is typically only about 10mm long tops and also uses some grub screws. I'd prefer not to secure the mount in that way and instead have removed the tripod's centre column to reveal an approx 25mm diameter through hole about 50mm long, for which I will make a base/bushing with a 3/8 centre clearance hole and will use a 3/8 bolt to pull down the mount on to the tripod the same way as a typical NEQ6 or HEQ5 would do.



Good question - Fortunately it doesn't. It's part of the Star Adventurer GTi's base azimuth mechanism, but also the way I'm doing it, my bush/adapter base and tripod will also give me a VERY coarse lockable azimuth adjustment as well.

Best
JA

[AdamJL]

Okay, very first impressions. I've yet to connect it all and see how it performs, but I've just put the following onto the mount:



Scope: Askar FRA400

Camera: 2600MC

Guide: WO Uniguide 32 + 290MM Mini

Focus: ZWO EAF

Compute: ASI Air Plus

Tripod: Gitzo GT5541LS



All up the scope setup weighs just about 5kg (slightly under) so we'll see how performance goes.



I gave my dad two "spare" PrimaLuceLab vixen bars the other day, not remembering I needed one of them. Luckily I have a few backups, so the setup is currently using the default ASKAR one, but I feel this one is too short. I'll pick up a longer PLL vixen bar soon.



Build quality: what you'd expect from a mount in this price range. The plastic cover at the back for the polar scope is really rather rubbish and is held in with two clips that wobble about a lot. I'm hoping some genius 3D printer comes up with a better solution for this. I like the chunkiness of the dials for the Altitude adjustment. The Azimuth bolts feel a little tight, but also a bit too small. The dials for locking the wedge in place are nice and clamp the altitude in well.

The RA lock as well seems great, but I don't like the entire Dec plate or the Dec lock, which you can see in an image below (RA lock at the bottom). I hope this top plate can be replaced with a more robust vixen clamp. The entire scope is held in with one screw and it doesn't even look nylon tipped so expect some scuffing to your vixen bar over time.

There's a lot of plastic about, but not where it counts which is the important thing.



Mounting it to a photographic tripod is easy as it uses the larger 3/8 photographic standard, but be sure the top plate is wide enough to accept the mount. I've got two tripods that could do it, but my third wouldn't be able to take it.



Here are some images.

[AdamJL]

Connected it up, and having some troubles figuring out the home position via the ASI Air. This is more likely to do with me never having used the ASI Air before, so will take some learning. I'm guessing a plate solve will fix it easily. If we get some clear skies tonight, I'll try a couple of hours of imaging and see how it goes.

[Crater101]

Have just collected mine and am leafing through the manual, with the unit on the table beside me, to make sure I know where everything is.


Agree with comments about the polar scope cover - I don't think those clips are going to last very long, and I'd happily take a 3D printed update. :D Also agree about the entire scope being held in with the one screw, although I guess that's one way to make sure the unit doesn't get overloaded.


And a good point on the top plate of the tripod too. I've got a solid old photographic Velbon that should do the job nicely, but most of the others may not make the grade, despite being more modern.


Looking forward to hearing what everyone thinks, mostly because this is my first foray into anything other than visual observing.

[Hoges]

re the top plate of the tripod, mine is around 50mm in diameter but I can adjust the length of the 3/8th bolt sticking out of it - is that likely to work? I also have the tripod from a Vixen Porta 2 if needed. Was expecting mine today but looks like tomorrow.

[AdamJL]

hmm, not sure I'd recommend that, John (if I understand you correctly).
It would mean you're putting the entire mount weight on a single point.. that's point loading and you're going to not only put a lot of pressure on that point, but you're going to introduce a fair bit of resonance with any vibration.

[Hoges]

This is a pic of the tripod without the usual head on.....

[AdamJL]

yeah that seems a little risky to point load on that.

Maybe you can have something made up to fit that, but if possible, try and use a tripod with a bigger base.

That said, I would advise to rather use that tripod without raising the 3/8 screw. Even if the mount doesn't cover the entire base, if it's sitting flush with part of it, that's a lot better than balancing on a screw.

[AdamJL]

Had a "test" tonight in Sydney. No pictures, I just wanted to see how it went.
Basically a fail, but that's down to me not knowing how to use the ASI Air :)

I'm all learned up now though, but will have to try again another night. That said, the mount performed fine for the bits that I figured out in time. I noticed that the power cables I used were rubbish and it was disconnecting all the time. Now at home indoors and I've switched over to other cables and everything is great.

I have lots of power cables but some of the best are the ones from Pegasus Astro. You get them with some of their gear or you can buy them from Sidereal.

side note: any store reading this - a great little business idea for you would be to do custom data and power cables for astro. Cable management is important!

[Hoges]

Cheers Adam. Yes, I'd definitely make sure it screwed down tight onto the base plate - which is around 50mm. There is currently a Manfrotto fluid head (the base of which does overhang the tripod mounting plate) with an ED80 on it - which it seems to handle well and is solid.

[AdamJL]

Do any new owners notice any backlash in RA?
Tighten up the RA screw and with the counterweight bar attached, give it a wiggle side to side. I'm noticing almost half a cm of back and forth... yikes.

[AdamJL]

Also be keen to hear how stiff the RA axis is as well. Since I got it, it's been fairly tight and I thought that was odd, but maybe something inside is too tight and it's induced backlash.

I'll probably be taking it back to Bintel tomorrow, and see how we go.

[AdamJL]

Here's a link to a video on my OneDrive showing the backlash.

https://1drv.ms/u/s!Ak9Pmua24KTPk7UYKYEWxUzLZnPCDQ?e= 0Rr0Lm

[JA]

Hi Adam,
Sorry to hear of your issue. I just checked and I don't have any RA backlash. Without going crazily tight, are you sure that your RA clutch screw is tightened enough? Does the amount of backlash you notice change with differing RA clutch screw tightness?

Best
JA

[AdamJL]

Hi JA

I've tried it a few times at different "tightness" settings on the RA.
The backlash doesn't go away, and the stiffness in RA goes from "locked" (when tightened fully as expected) to "put some effort into it" (when the RA lock is loosened completely).

Think I've got a dud. Will be going back to Bintel at lunch time and see what happens.

Unfortunately it looks as if this is going to be similar to the AZ-GTI in that tuning out backlash requires almost dismantling the mount. It's not easy to do like on the EQ6-R.

[alan meehan]

Well i just spoke to Bintel and mine has not arrived it will be in the next delivery next month sometime damn,i was hoping to take it to qld with me but looks not ,good luck guys who got it keep up the reports

[Hoges]

Unpacked mine this arvo. Sits nicely on the Vixen tripod but a little wobbly on the photo tripod. Clutches seem ok with no obvious play when locked. Balances ok with the ED80 - which I'll use visually and use the Z61/fma 180 for AP. First attempt at controlling with the ipad/synscan pro app seemed to go without a hitch and Sky Safari also picked up the scope and slewed it around (in my lounge room). Then I shut it down, attached the Asi Air Plus via a usb b cable with Eqmod selected - no problem that also worked. Chuck the polar scope eyepiece protector in a drawer as your going to keep knocking it off - it's pretty crappy. The battery cover is a little dodgy too - takes a little persuasion to line up the screw that holds it closed. When slewing, the sound is not exactly confidence inspiring! Brings to mind a tiny coffee grinder....hmmmmmm. I'll get out tommorrow evening and put the camera on for a session and see how it guides and whether I can get 3 minute unguided subs or not.

[AdamJL]

haha you're not wrong about that sound, it's quite rubbish.
Good luck with your tests tomorrow, hope it goes well!

[AstroViking]

Hey Adam,

Well, that's disappointing. You would expect that SW would have their quality control sorted out by now.

Cheers,
V

[AdamJL]

Hi Steve

Not great on Sky Watcher's part, but that said, Bintel have got a replacement ready so I'll be picking it up tomorrow.

I know you guys read this, Bintel, so thanks for the quick turn around :)

[netwolf]

for those thar have it would a qhy polemaster fit were the polarscope is?

[Crater101]

Finally set mine up today, just with a Canon 6D and a 100mm lens. Balanced OK, clutches seem fine, but in opposition to play, everything seems very tight with my unit (with the possible exception of the screw that holds the battery cover on, which falls out every time I try to make any adjustment to it).


It moves / slews OK, but the sound it makes when doing so...I get the impression there's very little tolerance in the gears or not enough lubricant. The motor just seems to be pushing against something, and yes, I've checked to make sure nothing is overtightened or jammed where it shouldn't be.


I'm going to give it a few more "dry runs" to maybe try and work the grease through a little more. I'll keep you posted.

[AdamJL]

No unfortunately not. You would need to something like this, but that doesn't align the mount, just the scope
https://www.testar.com.au/collections/qhy-polemaster/products/polemaster-dovetail-bars



Agreed on both the tightness and the sound. It's not the nicest sounding machine out there, and I find it's much tighter than I was expecting.

[Hoges]

Just gave mine a session with the Z61 and Askar fma180 doing the guiding. Ran 10 x 5 minute subs and all seemed pretty good. Guiding ranged between .75" and 1.4" with a few spikes to 2 or 3" - could have been the odd light breeze but the subs looked fine. Did a few 60s unguided shots - a couple were fine and a couple were not. One 120s unguided which looked perfectly fine before I packed it in. The Z61/fma 180 combo tipped the scales at a little under 4kg with cameras attached and were just a little heavier than the counter weight at full extension, so an extra kg on the counter weight bar would be handy though the imbalance was very minor.


All was controlled with the Asi Air plus with usb b cable / eqmod selected in the app. Polar alignment and plate solving went without a hitch.


So far, so good...... will post the pic a little later.

[Hoges]

10x5 min subs of the Lobster Nebula....

[AdamJL]

Nice John. Any link to a bigger image?

Also, a user over at Cloudy Nights reports his unit has some RA backlash after a few slews (didn't have it before). Same thing happened with mine.

https://www.cloudynights.com/topic/808906-star-adventurer-gti/?p=12027741

For those that have now used theirs testing or out in the field, check your backlash in RA.

[Hoges]

Link to a bigger image I put on the Testar FB site here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/229519518411077 I'm about to head up to QLD via some nice darks skies around Broken Hill/Bourke/Charleville so should be able to give it quite a few nights useage over the next month.

[AdamJL]

what DC power cables are you all using? I've noticed that the DC and USB cables I've switched to interfere with the Dec axis turning as they bump into my EAF.

Anyone using right angled cables, and if so, where did you get them from?

Also, I've set up the new mount, and because the RA on this one is a lot less tight than the last one, I can now see that the counterweight provided is going to be insufficient. So I'll likely order the pier extension for this and add a second counterweight I have lying about (without the pier extension, the counterweight bumps into the tripod leg)

[JA]

Hi John,

That's a great result:thumbsup: Especially so because of the image scale (2-3 arcsec/pixel) and the 5 minute exposures, not to mention how light the thing is for that performance!

Best
JA

[Hoges]

What about using the other counter weight hole for extra clearance? My DC cables are the ZWO supplied ones with the ASI air plus (hooked to a 12ah lithium) and some decent usb b type 3 cables from Scorptec for the cameras.

[AdamJL]

Good idea, John. I've switched to the secondary counter-weight hole for now and have the necessary clearance. For the cables, I've ordered some right angle adapters for USB and Power so they should come next week. In the meanwhile I'm just going to slew around a bit at home and see how the mount handles it.

One guy on Cloudy Nights had the same issue as me on the RA. He found that you could adjust a screw that's under the patent pending sticker, but that the RA backlash came back the next day.
Note that many mounts appear to be okay out of the box, but might start getting backlash very quickly after only a single night's use.

[Hoges]

As my counter weight was 'just/almost' heavy enough for the Z61/fma 180 - I thought I might extend it just a little so I grabbed a 12mm x 50mm ss bolt from the hardware store. This allows me to slide the weight a little further down, or add some heavy washers underneath the weight. Found a nice wide 4mm thick nylon washer to act as the stopper.

[Crater101]

I'm starting to notice a little of this creeping in. I'm hoping that - as opposed to the tightness - the unit is just starting to loosen up a little, and things will even out. At the moment things seem to be going from one extreme to the other.





This seems to be the situation I'm experiencing.



I should point out that thus far, I've just been using the batteries to see how the unit goes "as is" and to determine the portability issues (i.e., do I need to take a power supply each time I want to use it). I'll be connecting to a power supply tonight to see how things go.

[JA]

Hi Warren,

Based on the older, but similar payload AZ-GTi, I think you could expect something in the range of 10 to 20 hours use depending on how much tracking versus slewing you do and the capacity of your AA batteries. (This is based on reasonable* use and a battery capacity of something in the 2 to 3Ah range and a current draw** of 150mA tracking & 500mA slewing). It is also consistent with an earlier review I saw of the Star Adverturer GTi which suggested 2 (full?) nights of use were achieved.

*Reasonable is not 100% slewing:D
** From user test of the AZ-GTi on CN

Best
JA

[AdamJL]

If it's genuine backlash, it won't improve and isn't the mount loosening up. But if it's just getting a bit loose, that's good, because I know how tight that RA axis can be at the beginning (I couldn't even reliably balance the mount on my first copy)

[Crater101]

Mate, I know. Part of me is whistling in the dark, so to speak. I have a HEQ5 Pro (Dual) that was...lets say firm when I first used it, and it needed a bit of use to (I think) get the lubricants moving around a bit. It's fine now.



I take your point about the 10 to 20 hours, I'm expecting somewhere in the 12 to 15 hours range as where I live it tends to be a bit chillier than the city and that can drain the batteries of things a bit quicker. If I get between 12 to 15 hours of use I'll be content - if it loosens up a little more.


Looking like a cloudy night here, so I'll give it a little bit of a workout with just a camera and lens and see how it goes. I'll let you know... :prey:

[AdamJL]

I'm noticing a little bit of RA backlash creeping into my mount. I've had it set to track at Sidereal for a few hours now. It's not as major as before but I can see it. I'm going to stop it in about and hour, and then run it overnight and see what it's like in the morning. If it's worse, it's going back to Bintel and I'm going to save for the AM5.

[Crater101]

Do let us know how it all goes...hope you get a good result.


Having only a limited amount of knowledge of such things - the HEQ5 is the only other powered mount I own - I can confidently say that while the "tightness" of the unit has improved, it's done so at the cost of introducing a slowly increasing amount of RA backlash, with seemingly a little more becoming evident each time it gets used.


I powered the unit for about two hours the other night with a standard Canon 6D & 100mm lens. Power came from a Bluetti EB55 unit, and I was careful not to let cords get in the way. The power supply did seem to improve slewing a bit, however that RA backlash seemed to increase just a little as well.


If I had to guess - and that's all I'm doing -I'd say that working the factory lubricants through the unit to loosen it up has also somehow increased the RA backlash. I emphasise that's just a hunch. I'm not certain what they lubricants these ship with or how much is in there.


I'm going to set it up with a slightly heavier lens this evening, not for capture purposes but to see how it performs under a slightly increased load, probably a 70-200 f2.8L and a 1.4x extender. I'll let you know how it goes...:rolleyes:


I realise a few others are having similar issues. I'm curious as to what sort of load (weight wise) people are putting on the mount and if that relates to any performance issues. There shouldn't be any correlation within the tolerances of the unit, but if anyone has any information, I'd be interested to hear it.

[AdamJL]

Hi Warren

My battery ran out during the night so I'm running more tests again today. So far, the wiggle hasn't become worse. I'll take a video and post it later and you can see what sort of wiggle I'm working with.

In terms of weight, my setup is 4.93kg, so I'm under the official limit. Might be able to save a few hundred grams by moving the ASI Air Plus onto the tripod but I don't think that's necessary.

[Crater101]

I set the unit to track Saturn two nights ago, while I was observing through a refractor nearby (side issue: I never get tired of looking at the planets) and I don't think things have deteriorated with mine either, although there's no real sign of improvement. It seemed to perform just a little bit better with a little more load on it, although this may be bias on my part. More testing is needed in this area.

I did hear the unit make an odd noise on two occasions. The first time I thought it might have been just the unit making some minor adjustment to the temperature - it was a cold evening - but then I heard it again much later. Still not 100% certain what it was, a sort of wet clicking noise. My initial thought was some of the lubricants has thickened a little in the cold (about 2 degrees centigrade) and were becoming "tacky" if I can describe it in that manner, but I'm not sure.
It's raining here as I type, so I'm going to go right over the unit this evening and make sure everything is where it needs to be. Then I'm going to give it a real workout.

I must admit my hopes of this being a decent unit are fading.

[AstroViking]

Reading all your reports of the problems with the new GTi makes me feel sad - I had been hoping the new unit would be a good starting point for people just getting into astronomy / astrophotography.

What is Sky Watcher's track record like? Do they actively upgrade / refine their equipment over time?

Cheers,
V

[Crater101]

Taking the first steps into astrophotography was why I first considered the unit. I've been a visual observer for years, largely of the moon and planets, and I've been seriously impressed by some of the deep sky astrophotography that I've seen (photography has been a hobby for years too - my wife says I have an obsession with lenses) and decided that I'd dip my toe into the deep, dark, still waters of astrophotography with the GTi.


I have to say that thus far, I'm less than impressed. I can see the potential of the unit, but I think that the one I have is going to be going back to Skywatcher. I don't know a great deal about their track record in upgrading or retrofitting equipment, but I can't imagine that it would be something that happens regularly. Oddly enough, both of my scopes & mounts - EQ3-2 & HEQ5 - are Skywatcher, and they're fine.


My feeling is that the GTi has been pushed into production a little quickly to meet consumer demand, and as a result some of the production hasn't been given the quality control it might. I'm sure that there are folks out there with units that perform well straight out of the box - but mine doesn't appear to be one of them.

[AdamJL]

https://1drv.ms/v/s!...QlIcQA?e=frB6N7

https://1drv.ms/v/s!...VmkjVQ?e=FEfyB5

Two videos showing the RA wobble I'm having. Anyone else getting this? It's not as bad as before, that's a blessing.

[Crater101]

Mate, that first video didn't present at all for me. I'm getting something of that wobble, but as I mentioned previously, things seem to be reducing a bit. I think. I'm using tent pegs to secure the tripod that the GTi is sitting on as I want to eliminate any possible extraneous sources of movement.

It's a cold night where I am, predicted to get down to minus 4 :eek: but the skies are clear and there's no wind. I'm setting up the Star Adventurer next to the 150 Mak-Cas, and while I do some observing it's going to go through it's paces with a modded Canon 60D and a 100mm f2.8L lens. It's going to get a full workout for about two to three hours, and not to put too fine a point on it, this is the last chance it's going to get before I send it back. If it doesn't do any good, I'll have had enough. I'll let you know how it goes.

[Crater101]

OK, the verdict from last night...


The GTi was setup adjacent to the 'scope I was observing through. Tent pegs were used to anchor the tripod it was on to the ground after the tripod was levelled, and the level was checked again after the unit was fitted. All good. None of the tripod legs were extended, and there was no wind. I was careful to balance everything.


Both the scope mount and the GTi drew their power from the same source, in this case a Bluetti EB55, which also powered a laptop and a dew heater. No issues there, plenty of power and no appreciable depletion of the power source over three hours.


Temperature was very cold - about -2 by the time I called it a night. The HEQ5 with a Skywatcher 150 Mak-Cassegrain and the GTi were both tracking Saturn. The GTi had a standard Canon 6D with a 70-200 f2.8L and 1.4x extender on it, as much to put a bit more weight on it as anything else. I wasn't going for fine shots, rather putting the unit through it's paces.


The result...Well, it didn't get any worse. Oddly though, it seems to perform better with a slightly heavier load. I don't have a small 'scope that would fit, but I'm wondering if anyone out there has been using a GTi with something like a Williams Optics Z 61, or something in that size range, and what their experience is with it. But I digress.


I say again that this is my first foray into astrophotography, and while I'm not intimately familiar with a lot of the advanced concepts, I've done a bit of reading - books, forums, magazines, published research - and having seen what the GTi produced as opposed to what can be done with other star trackers - I'm making sure I compare everything at the same level - the GTi falls short.


I'll be ringing the supplier on Monday, I think, and asking some questions about returns. As far as my own experience has been, the unit hasn't lived up to expectations.

[AdamJL]

Yep same here. I’ll post some pictures later but I had RA RMS into the hundreds at one point haha.
It’s going back to Bintel. What a shame.

[AdamJL]

Sorry, do you mean it didn’t play?
I might upload a few videos to YouTube later instead

[AdamJL]

here's a folder with various videos, screenshots (of poor guiding performance) and some sample images from last night.

https://onedrive.live.com/?cid=cfa4e0b6e69a4f4f&id=CFA4E0B6E69A4F4F%21318103&authkey=%21ADXYVm0gaQ%5FsN3Y

[JA]

Hi Adam,
In the subsequent pages of the CN thread that you linked to earlier there is evidence to suggest that the RA backlash experienced is due to a clamping screw that can untighten somewhat with use and can be remedied with a spring washer or serrated lock washer.

Best
JA

[Crater101]

Gudday Adam;


Not just didn't play, all I got was a blank page.


I did see the ones in the folder. You seem to have had similar issues to me, although mine has tended to make a wet sticking noise which I've associated with thick (and possibly unevenly distributed) lubricants.


JA, you intrique me. I may have to investigate this further. My thanks.

[AdamJL]

Hi JA

Cheers mate. I'm actively involved in that thread (user Wow! is me :)). Rob posted some great advice for fiddling with the mount and getting the RA to play nicer.

I don't know if that would have helped me though. On Friday night, when I clicked return to home, only the Dec axis moved the first time. I managed to get the RA to return home with a subsequent command (after gently tapping the counterweight shaft!) but that just told me it was time to let the mount go. I don't like having to tweak something that's brand new.

To that end... I've gone and returned it to Bintel and (uh oh), put my name down for the AM5. I know, it's a lot more money, but the Mrs was supportive (I'm suspicious!) and it's getting some great real world reviews.



That's interesting. No idea why it didn't play!

Good luck getting your issues fixed. That thread on CN is very helpful; Rob is tweaking with his mount a fair bit so you might get some help from him as well.
His setup is very light weight too.

[Crater101]

I'm going to have a good read of it and take a considered approach to trying to save the GTi, but I'm not going to spend a massive amount of time and effort on it given what I've already experienced. The AM5 looks good to me, but I don't know if I'd be able to appease Frankenwife enough to justify the additional expenditure. :D

[alan meehan]

Well i found out tonight why the cover over the polar scope at the back keeps falling off poor design when the battery holders are in place the locks on the cover do not lock in remove the battery holders and it locks in perfectly

[Hoges]

Things haven't quite gone to plan astronomically speaking with my trip north so far with about 4 failed attempts at some photography due to lights/trees, clouds and dew. But I did get a few hours at Esk under some moonlight present. The Gti is performing pretty well although I do notice regular pulses in Dec not having any effect as the guiding drifts off to 2 or 3 seconds then suddenly 'un sticks' and gets better. RA guiding seems pretty good. I align with the ASI air plus so I'm not sure why the Dec would wander off so much. Link to photo of the Dragons of Ara with the Zenithstar 61/294mc pro guided with the fma180/120mm. I took 13, 5 minute exposures - half of which where nice and sharp, a few not quite but passable for me and three that I threw out. So this shot is 10 x 5minute shots with the L enhance filter in place. https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=2183625241837257&set=gm.794105168619173 I haven't noticed any play or backlash creeping in yet.

[Crater101]

It sounds to me like you may have gotten one of the better copies, although I had similar "sticking" issues and noise. Do keep us posted on how it all goes.

[Crater101]

I noted that too, and found that I had considerable difficulty on removing the battery holders with the polar scope cover in place. With the polar scope cover firmly in place, I had difficulty getting the battery holders into place correctly. :shrug:

[Icearcher]

Hi All

I received mine during the week and Im happy with it so far, theres no play in either axis that I can find and Iv had it running for about 10 hours so far just inside for testing and playing around.

Its a little noisy but nothing to really complain about, its dead silent when tracking and only really gets a bit loud when pushed around at max speed.

Iv got it connected to my laptop and stellarium has no issues giving it goto commands.

It balances just fine, my payload is a little over 3.5kg.

Once this cloud clears Ill get out to test the guiding.

Pic attached of the setup at present.

[Crater101]

Nice setup. It sounds like you got one of the good copies. Half your luck! I look forward to seeing what you can achieve with it. :)



Cheers!

[Icearcher]

Managed to test out the guiding performance last night when there was a little break in the weather.

My polar alignment was out by about 16 arc seconds.

Looks like its going to be a rock solid little mount, I'm very happy with it so far.

[NeilW]

Hi all,
I'm trying to connect the GTi via USB cable to my laptop running NINA. I've installed all the SynScan and ASCOM software. It appears it will only connect in NINA once the SynScan app has connected. NINA is recognising the mount, but using the arrow controls, the mount will only move north, not south, and east, not west (I can control it in every direction using the hand controller, so the mount is capable of moving).

Any suggestions?

Cheers.

[Crater101]

I did remember watching a YouTube video in relation to something similar. It might have been by High Point Scientific, but I can't remember. Apparently you have to start the software running in a particular sequence, or there are bugs, and the order in the sequence in which the synscan app is connected apparently makes a difference.


Try this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_p5g-UvPZ0E


or this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKmZVtXRXq0


Both have some tips in this regard. Sorry I couldn't be of more assistance.

[AdamJL]

Have you installed EQMod or GreenSwampServer?

[NeilW]

Hi all,

Thanks for the suggestions. I have EQMOD installed...I normally run an HEQ5.

But I think I have found the culprit. I originally downloaded and used the latest SynScan Pro for Windows Version 2.0.11. I deleted that and tried the older version 1.19.20 and everything seems to be working well now.

It irks me a bit that it will only connect by initially connecting with the SynScan app and not directly via ASCOM/EQMOD, but there you go.

[Rod-AR127]

Ok, I'm getting very close to buying my first go-to mount and for the ease of learning I've decided to popular, hopefully we'll supported Star Adventure GTi is the right tool for the job.
While it won't support my AR127 achro, l can have my ED72 mounted on it in go-to mode and point me in the right direction for my AR127 on the mandraulic exos 2 mount.

So, what should l be concerned about?
I have read this thread and CN threads, will re-read them all again.
The general just l am getting is there are Monday mounts and Friday mounts. Typically I'd like a Wednesday morning mount not assembled before or after a big weekend by the SW factory worker. Seems there have been some good mounts sold and some sloppy mounts sold.
Being in Perth and having to have it sent from Sydney most likely, l don't want to be disappointed by excess backlash or the like.
I may even ask the retailer to take it out and test it, would save a lot of heartache.
Any thoughts or suggestions on my choice?
Rod.

[AdamJL]

Hi Rod

I'll just wish you a hearty good luck! Good reviews of this mount have been fairly rare, but I'm also cognizant of the fact that forums are usually a place to give bad reviews more than good ones.

That said, from my own experience owning two dud copies, you're rolling the dice, and I only hope you get a good copy.
If you don't, there are a few fixes that have been tried by others (like painters tape around one of the internal screws) that seem to fix it. Also adding spring washers.

Whatever happens, I wish you the best of luck!

[Hoges]

Going on my copy, think I'd say this - for visual use, go for it. A great little lightweight goto mount that's a snap to carry around and has excellent connectivity for things like sky safari on the ipad. For astrophotography..... I'm not super convinced. Some of my guiding graphs have been pretty dubious and there's been a few subs thrown out. For AP, I don't think I would buy it again - not for a 'scope, but with a dslr and lens I would. I think I'd look into a few (albeit more expensive) alternatives. The main issue with mine is when guiding, the dec seems to wander off and doesn't respond to the guiding commands for a minute or two.....and then it will. By that time I'm 2 or 3" off in my guiding - I'm hoping something's a little 'sticky' or needs to wear in - either way, it's not super confidence inspiring QC.

[Icearcher]

Im going to buck the trend and say that mine has been perfect so far and I cant think of a single complaint.

Admittedly, Iv only had it out and testing a half dozen times but in these tests, Iv found that guiding has been great and Iv been able to capture 20 min subs of the tarantula nebular with clean round stars.

My setup is a SW 72ed with .85 field flattener and a canon 600d, guiding is handled by a SW 50mm finder with a asi 120mc. All up, it weighs in at about 3.6kg and the counter weight is at the end of the bar.

At first, mine was quite stiff in both axes but after a few hours of play it freed up quite a bit and still seems to be improving, there is no backlash to be found.

I really really really hope that I have a normal copy and not a golden sample.

[AdamJL]

20min subs? Yeah you won the lotto

[Rod-AR127]

I must not read the IIS classifieds, I must not read the IIS classifieds, I must not read the IIS classifieds, I just bought a Star Adventure GTi from Bintel and it is going to be powered up and tested before sending to Perth to avoid disappointment (isn't it Earl) ;)
I'm sure it will be fine and going to teach me so much.

[alan meehan]

Well mine is going back to Bintel too much backlash and i must say Bintel where very good about it ,hope they can fix or replace it and the weather clears

[AdamJL]

Sorry to hear that, Alan. You're not the first, nor will be the last person to receive a dodgy copy of this mount. Either the QC is non-existent, or the design is bad. Either way, just like the AZ-GTI, you have to hope for a good copy of this mount, but they seem few and far between.
At least with the AZ-GTI you know what you're getting yourself into; it's not aimed at the sort of accuracy a dedicated GEM is geared towards. This SA-GTI is just a lemon.

[Rod-AR127]

Always disappointing to receive faulty stuff, with the QC on this particular item known to be somewhat lacking I'm surprised retailers don't check before they send or better still, check all their stock and return deficient ones. I have been told mine has been powered up and checked ok, l hold some hope of it being a good one.
Very excited to expand my astro horizons, dreading what she will say when it turns up and finds out how much it cost. :sadeyes:

[Crater101]

I certainly wish you all the best with your copy mate, mine was something of a let down. Some folks have reported minor issues that have been able to be user rectified, mine wasn't one of those.


Tell the wife it's an asset :D and is going to provide a better return than an evening at the pub betting on the greyhounds / horses.

[Rod-AR127]

It arrived, just in time for me to hide it and go to work.
I checked l had batteries before leaving and bought the manual to work.

[Rod-AR127]

Let the fun begin..... not fun yet believe me.
Using an android phone l only have the choice of one App version which is version 2.0.12. Like Neil in the previous posts, l can only move north and east. Glad l read all the forums, think l need to change the baad or find out how to downgrade app.

It's late, I'm tired and looks like I'm sleeping with the dog despite earning over $2k in overtime in 4 shifts to pay for it.
Clear skies, clean dogs.

[Rod-AR127]

One hour later.
Gave up going to bed, can't get it too move at all.
What a PITA!
Revisit when awake.

[Rod-AR127]

Uninstalled App, reinstalled X2
Releases clutches and set to home position.
Chose go-to star and it moved both axis.
Set to hibernate at home position and it returned to home position.
Arrows to move manually didn't do anything.

Then suddenly they did. Increased the slewing speed, yup, works.

Zero backlash anywhere without any load, now to get out the OTA and DSLR.

It's cloudy, the Mrs has calmed down (we are trying to smash the mortgage down).
Dog needs a bath.
Clear skies please.

Appears to be working fine, no backlash anywhere, l did ask Bintel to take it out and test before sending it to me and yes the packing had been opened. Haven't had a close look for where that screw is supposed to be hiding that sometimes needs plumbers tape, don't need to yet, everything is working and as you can probably tell I'm one happy camper.

[AdamJL]

Nice one, Rod! Hope it continues to work for you.

[carlstronomy]

Took ownership of my GTI last week, eventually the skies cleared here in Brisbane for me to have my first test with this mount. I have purchased this mount for the Evolux 62ED when I go camping. I must say so far very impressed. Did a two star alignment after a very basic pointing the mount at 169 and setting the 27.5 degrees. Stars came into view real quick minor adjustment and alignment went well. Accidently kicked the tripod and could not get it work anymore. Reset the mount position and alignment was going very wrong. Noticed a button that said reset alignment data. Did another alignment and every was perfect again. You can align only once, even if you turn off the mount so always reset alignment data :) Held Jupiter in the eyepiece for 1 hour no movement then used the goto for a couple of clusters and they were in the eyepiece instantly. Can not wait to try some photography on this mount. :thumbsup:

[Rod-AR127]

Only gripe so far is the tripod that was recommended and advertised along side the SA GTi by Bintel. A Benro Mach 3.
It's a camera/general purpose tripod and does not allow the mount to be aligned with one of the legs.
So where l would normally place my tripod on the marks on my pavers and have the South leg line up with SCP, l have had to put more marks on the pavers and the whole set up just looks asquew, to my eyes anyway. It is possible to shave off a small plastic tab on an insert that stops the tripod head rotating, but that could allow the insert to fall out, however unlikely that is.
The thread in the bottom of the mount, being aluminium cast, is not the strongest so be carefully not to overtighten the mount on to any tripod.

[carlstronomy]

Rod, I did not purchase mine through Bintel. My package came with the Sky-Watcher Star Adventurer GTI steel tripod. It is a proper telescope mount and very easy to setup correctly. I would be asking Bintel why they are recommending an after market tripod when there is an OEM one to go along with the unit.

Carl

[Rod-AR127]

The SW tripod is currently out of stock, at least with Bintel.

Sounds like I'll be chatting with them soon as if the SW tripod is an astronomical one. Lessons learnt by a newbie.

Edit. Been thinking about this all evening between stations, an EQ mount really is designed to be put on a flat surface and have a bolt threaded into it from below, just like the SW tripod. Then the mount can be orientated to any position. Plus the mount and tripod are both stationary and the fixing bolt goes in straight every time.

Oh well, l had a win with the mount, l lost out with the tripod but I'm sure it will be rectified fairly.

2nd edit, a few hours later. I've had a good look at the SW SA GTi tripod online and l feel like a complete goose accepting the one l got. To excited about the mount and didn't pay enough attention to the tripod.

For those about to follow in my footsteps, get an astronomical tripod.

[carlstronomy]

Rod,
Do not worry too much, we have all learnt a little along the way in the same way with this hobby :D

I think we put a lot of trust in our reputable retailers here is AU, but it does not always work out. Looks like they purchased a lot of mounts and forgot all about the tripods when they placed their order. They still want to move those mounts so recommended what looks to be the next best thing they stock. A shame really because from what I have seen it does not look like it would be up to the job.

For anyone looking for these Astro Anarchy in Brisbane is selling mount and tripod as a kit and also selling them as individual items. :thumbsup:

[Crater101]

While I still had my underwhelming GTi, I used an older Gitzo aluminium tripod, and got around that issue by fitting it with a panoramic head

https://www.camerapro.com.au/7843-gitzo-head-panoramic.html
which had it's own bubble level. I attached the GTi to the panoramic head firmly, and then just rotated the head.
Just a thought.

[Rod-AR127]

The tripod l received is already in transit back to retailer at their expense. Can't complain about their returns process that's for sure. Purchasing experience tarnished but nothing lost and no reason to complain. We're only human after all.
I have a SW SA tripod enroute already, about $50 cheaper incl postage from Melbourne. I bought it from OzScopes.
There are (at least) two tripods currently being advertised for the SA GTi, the difference being one has a very open head shaped like a newt spider, the other the same as in the SW manual. I got the latter. Both have the same correct fixing method.
I guess it's Big Bertha the 127 achro until then, can't wait to have them both out side by side using the goto and 72ED as a finder for the 127mm. While l observe with the 127 the SA will be snapping subs.
Glad to get that sorted.

Clear Skies. Not here in Perth.

[alan meehan]

Well the mount came back from bintel and i set it up balanced the scope its only a skywatcher ed80 and went for a 1 star allighment and it shuddered and jammed going back again iam not impressed with this mount at all.The tripod i brought with it is great a good little proper tripod but thats it ,iam thinking of of going for the ioptron maybe that would be better iam so dissappionted in this mount

[Crater101]

My own issues with the Star Adventurer GTi have been well documented here, and I won't go over them again. One thing I did send with the return e-mail was a picture I took through the polarscope. No matter how I adjusted the illumination through the Synscan app, how I rotated the mount, or how much light was on the other side of the scope (and yes, I tested this in daylight as well...) all I ever got was an eye watering pink smear when the polar scope illumination was on, as the attached image shows. Lines, blurring, the works. There were no visible obstructions in the tube, and in daylight, the polarscope was reasonably clear (about what I'd expect, anyway) but switching on the illumination was meaningless.


That, with the other issues documented on this thread, has soured me on the product. I understand that several people have good copies of this mount, and I wish them the best, but I wouldn't buy another star tracker from Skywatcher.

[Rod-AR127]

That reminds me, the polar scope.
Isn't it meant to rotate so l can line up Octans with the diagram on the polar scope lens?
No mention in the manual of loosening hex screws but I'm guessing l need to loosen the three hex screws located on the barrel of the polar scope in order to rotate it.

As for illuminating the reticle, useless when you're trying to find mag 5-6 stars in a light polluted city.
I can only recognise Octans through my 10x50 binos.

[AdamJL]

Sorry to hear that Alan. I know it doesn't help, but you're in the same company as many of us who have experienced an inferior product with this mount.

If you're thinking about the iOptron Skyhunter, be careful of that as well. From reading a thread on Cloudy Nights, it too has some awful problems that users are encountering.

It's very sad that these companies are using us to test their products. There are too many flaws on them. I would suggest holding out for either generation 2 of these mounts, or saving a bit more for a different mount that is either proven or one of the newer strain-wave ones which are performing excellently in the hands of users.

[alan meehan]

yes i have read the reviews on the ioptron not good as well ,i have been advised that skywatcher are replacing my mount hope the next one is better

[Rod-AR127]

That is good news. Bloody inconvenient but at least you get a chance of having a working one.
I can't wait to get my rig all going when the tripod arrives.

[carlstronomy]

I have realised my mount is the new model that hopefully has less of the first version issues. The skies here in Brisbane have not been kind for me to trial as yet, I will let you know how the mount performs when I go to a dark spot to enable me to use the polar scope and try some unguided shots :)

[Rod-AR127]

It took five days from ordering my SW tripod for my new SA GTi to get it from Melbourne to Perth, where it has sat for the past four days undelivered.
Grrrrrrrr......
If l get it by Friday in l will have 27 days to learn how to polar align and take Astro pics before l reach Bortle 2 skies in Victoria.
Now the bearded, kakhi wearing Koala stuffers have started burning off in the hills around Perth, crap visibility.

[alan meehan]

Sorry to hear that Rod nothing like trying to get out under the stars and its full of smoke,Finally got my new replacement mount the weathers rubbish but i have set up it inside and no backlash and was running smoothly for several hours so iam happy when will we ever get clear skies

[Rod-AR127]

Finally.
Received my SW tripod for my new SA GTi.
Postie comes to the door and points at the cloudy sky,
I let the dog out, not sure if there is going to be a law suit yet.:rofl:

Had to put a few washers under the mount bolt on the unbranded "SW" trippd to stop the mount from swivelling.

All set up in the backyard, 26° tomorrow but rain on Wednesday and its already cloudy.

Tripod is very light and, stable.
Tripod to mount surface area is identical so 100% coverage and maximum stability.
I'll be testing at every opportunity and experimenting with dslr settings for my before mentioned trip to Ruffy,Victoria, to visit family, first time in three years.
I've already checked the position of the Andromeda galaxy, plus ensured access to the top of the hill on the adjacent property. Might have to chase a few lambs to say thanks. Counting sheep is tiring work.

[Rod-AR127]

Had a quick observe last night, plonked the whole set up down on my marks on the pavers, looked in the 30mmEP and there was Octans, yay.
Had another look tonight, no such luck.
Just been playing with the 3 star alignment and seeing how accurate it is slewing around the sky. Hard to see anything but the brighter object with LP from the city, moon and my Mrs sewing room. Going to have to set up in a different part of the yard.

Now, question for this evening.
When performing a 3 star alignment, mount slews to the first object and asks you "manually centre" the object.
Does this mean.....
a. Using the screw adjusters on the mount for Dec and RA?
b. Using the arrows on the keypad in the app?
c. By loosening the clutches?
I've been doing (a).

[Hoges]

I'd be taking a guess - so I'm interested in knowing whether I've got this right also as I've been using the Asi Air plus with mine:


A 3 star alignment is for the goto so you'd need to use the arrows on the keypad.



a: would be for a Polar Alignment


c: would only work if the mount had built in encoders - like the AZeq6 where you can loosen the clutches and manually slew around and the mount still knows where it is. Don't think this would work with the Gti.

[carlstronomy]

Rod you need to use Option B - adjusting the actual mount will not allow the alignment to work. The mount takes into account the error from the manual adjustments you make to work out where you actually are and calibrates the goto. Once you set your dec close and point the mount south with the screws (a), then carry out this alignment method which will work fine for visual. Do not adjust screws for the alignment routine as it is purely for goto calibration.:thumbsup:

Use the keypad to bring the star into the centre of the view through your telescope when asked.

Once the first is completed you move on to the next and then the next.

It is very accurate, I have done this the other week and had great results shooting around looking for objects.

My only issue is polar alignment to be able to get images. I can not see any stars in that area due to living north of the city of Brisbane :(

I have always used drift alignment for my observatory setup. I am thus an Octans rookie. I went out west to a dark sky and could not even find it with Bino's :lol:

Hopefully next time

[Rod-AR127]

Hugely successful evening!
Amazing what a few less beers can achieve. :D
Three star alignment using 2" 30mm EP and then 1.25" 15mm EP, star centred, onto the next star.
Works a treat, great viewing here tonight as well before Mr Moon rises.
Slewed to everything on the "Tonight's Best" list in the app using only a GSO 1.25" 15mm Supervier 68°FOV EP and went spot on to everything not obscured by trees or buildings.
I saw a different nebulosity on every nebula, so it wasn't just a smudge on a lens :thumbsup:
Have to get up before 5am so l had to pack it away by 9pm.
It's doing what l bought it for, can't wait to put the 127mm next to it a get some great views.
I even saw Octans the other night which gives me hope for photography.
Thankyou gents.
R.

[dikman]

Reading this thread got me all fired up and then unsure.:lol: After reading through this and the Cloudy Nights thread I wasn't sure about buying this mount. I've always said it's never a good idea to buy something new when it first comes out, better to wait and see what problems there are. Checking locally I see that the EQM35 is only $300 more, and appears to be a proven design? It comes with a tripod, which I don't want, but may be a better option.

Looks like I need to read some reviews.

[carlstronomy]

Richard, always do your research and make sure what ever mount you purchase fits your requirements. I purchased this mount purely for when we go camping so I can have a little fun. For my purpose it checked all the boxes.

1. Mount is light and small
2. The mount is perfect for my travel scope, an Evolux 62ED
2. Tripod is light and sturdy
3. Everything packs away without taking up too much room in the camper trailer
4. Mount runs using AA batteries
5. Is a full EQ mount for imaging if I feel the need

When checking the reviews be sure to compare apples with apples. The new model appears to have a lot of improvements on the first edition and I am personally happy with my purchase. It certainly has limitations and you should ensure it will work for you.

Carl

[Rod-AR127]

I bought the SA GTi mostly because it's the, or close to the, cheapest GOTO mount available.
I only do visual astronomy, l do have a dslr and field flatner for when l want to learn AP.
The GTi helps me learn the sky easier and aids in pointing my 127 refractor in the right general direction for a closer look at stuff.
Runs of batteries for camping, portable etc.
I nearly bought a bigger GOTO mount but I'd need an expensive power source and it would be less portable, every kg matters.

[dikman]

Carl, I wasn't aware Skywatcher had made any improvements, other than a firmware upgrade, as it hasn't really been out that long? It should, however, be more than adequate for my needs as I've realised that in my situation I don't need a heavy mount.
Rod, the price is certainly attractive, for a go-to equ. mount, but then so is the EQ35 at not a lot more, if the price differential was greater then the decision would be easier.
I'm trying to figure out what the differences are, operationally, between the two, what makes one a better mount than the other. One comes with a tripod, which is irrelevant to me, and one comes with a control handset, probably not necessary but nice to have. Payload appears to be the most significant difference?

This is making my brains hurt........

[Rod-AR127]

I have never used or even seen a 35M GOTO mount but you'd be safe to say it's as good if not better than the SA GTi.
So the difference is..... 10kg vs 5kg payload.
Batteries powered for take anywhere or a $10 power supply vs a $10 power supply or those power banks are in the hundreds of dollars if you want to take it anywhere.

I've done my fair share of boating, camping, motorbike camping and the later especially always requires a compromise between practicality, function and ability.
The 35 has the ability, the GTi has the practicality.
The 35 could just handle my 127 frac for visual at 9kg but l wanted practicality and l wanted it now.

I could have got the 35 and saved up for a power bank very easily but for my frac or a future OTA l think EQ6 size will be better and I'll wait a few years before l go there. I see a roof top observatory set up in my future house when we down size.

Choose your own compromise, good luck and enjoy the buying experience.

[dikman]

Rod, are you using the 127 frac on the GTi? As for a powerbank, I have the Celestron that came with my 6SE, so that's not an issue (plus a couple of smaller ones I made from spare 18650 cells).

Motorbike camping, yep, done a bit of that but it came to a halt with the arrival of bloody covid. I still managed to take unnecessary stuff on a bike!:rolleyes:

Edit:6 hrs. later. The rain that was coming slipped away so I got out the bike and went to the city to have an actual look at the mounts. Dumb idjit, I should have just called them instead! 1 GTi in stock (in carton), then it's backorder, no EQ35's in stock, due late November but unsure if there will be a price-rise (if I place an order now it will be at the current price).

I hate making decisions when under pressure.

[Rod-AR127]

No the 117 is on a Bresser Exos2 mount. No motors.
I have both set up side by side and point the 127 in the same direction os the ED72 on the GOTO.

If l had a power bank l would get the EQ35, without a second thought. If you ride a motor bike you're smart enough to do a hyper tune on one If needed to make it extra smooth.

[carlstronomy]

Rod and Richard, I am not up to speed on all the tech jargon and different mounts but the EQ35 is only 5.5kg when used as equatorial mount. It goes up to 10kg if you use it in single RA mode, not sure what this actually means but possibly should be looked into. Apparently the 10kg ability is not available out of the box and requires you to purchase Star Adventurer accessories. It looks like a very old designed mount with drive motor boxes etc hanging off the side using wires, seems a strange mount for 2022.:shrug:

Carl

[dikman]

Carl, everything I've found indicates a 10kg payload, I tried to download the manual to have a look but without success (something strange about their downloads). You're right in that it is an "old design" which I guess they tried to modernise to get more life out of the design. It is somewhat unique in that you can remove the Dec part of the mounting, attach a camera fitting, mount a camera and use it for basic tracking. Perhaps that's what it's referring to?

My normal thinking is to spend a bit more and get something bigger when buying something, which in this case would be an eq5 or 6, but then I start thinking that I'm getting away from the original idea and go full circle back to getting a lighter mount.:shrug:

Given that these things (GTi) are in short supply, and I've found one, part of me thinks it's just meant to be so buy it!:D

[carlstronomy]

Richard, I see what you mean. The Skywatcher site states 22lb. Below is the link to the shop I purchase my GTi from for the EQM35. Notice the 5.5kg limit in EQ mode and the image bottom left saying you can go to 10kg with mods. Very strange and confusing.

http://www.astroanarchy.com.au/Mounts/Saxon_EQ35_GoTo.html

I also found this review stating 10kg for visual and 6.5kg for photography in light weight mode.

https://www.skyatnightmagazine.com/reviews/mounts/sky-watcher-eqm-35-pro-go-to-mount/#:~:text=Payload,for%20imaging%20in %20lightweight%20mode.

The more you read the more confusing it becomes :D

I just found another site stating 10kg for visual and 7kg for photography.

Here is the manual, last page stated 10kg payload for both manual and electric versions.

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0080/7095/5123/files/EQM-35_manual.pdf

[Rod-AR127]

Neptune would not show up in synscan app, regardless of magnitude settings on or off, or set to 20 lol.
Would not show up by search either.
Saturn and Jupiter only listed at first, followed later by Uranus when it broke the horizon.
But no Neptune.
Any thoughts on why?

[dikman]

Carl, makes you wonder just how the staff would explain it to someone. And makes me wonder how competent they are if no-one queried what they wrote.

[Rod-AR127]

Carl, check the classifieds.
I know what I'd be doing.

[dikman]

Yes, I saw that ad, a great deal but too far away from me and shipping would be an issue. Pity. After sleeping (!) on it I just rang the Optical store in town and got them to hold the one they've got for me.

Edit: 3 hrs. later. Picked it up (it reminded me why I don't like going into Adelaide) and spent some time installing various bits of software so I could make it move. One of my Android tablets is apparently too old to install the app but the other one is fine. I'll probably be using a laptop with it so that doesn't matter. I have two tripods to use, the Manfrotto was the obvious choice just to get it mounted on something for now. It's a reasonably stable mount, as long as there's no wind, but I'll have to machine a better fitting baseplate for it. The other one is a Meade Field Tripod, massive overkill for this size mount but again I need to machine up an adaptor for it.

It's a bit noisy at times, but hey, it's got motors and gears so it's to be expected. I mounted my 102mm frac on it for now, to give it some weight, and it balanced easily (about 3 kgs). There's minimal discernable backlash for now, I expect it will loosen a bit with more use, and while it feels slightly stiff to move with the clutches released that will probably improve a little. I'll take the covers off later to see what sort of grease is in there and if it's a bit thick I'll replace it with something better. It looks like rain for the next few days so plenty of time to tinker with it.:D Lots of options in the menus too.
I like it!! Oh, and the guy said they have several on backorder but they have no idea when they'll get any, or how many.

[carlstronomy]

Richard,
Congratulations on your purchase, I hope you enjoy the mount. Yes it is a little noisier than my EQ6 but it certainly is not in the same price range. When you are out at night it does not seem too bad. Looks good with your tube on it. I should post an image of mine with the Evolux, it looks mean ;)

Both the computer control and phone control are good, I have connected it with Cartes du Ciel which worked great. I am going to purchase SharpCap Pro so I can plate solve the SCP.

Brisbane weather is going to be bad for the next couple of weeks so not too much I can do for now :mad2:

[AdamJL]

You can do it for free with NINA :)

[dikman]

Thanks Carl, I'm feeling very happy about it, no regrets. I have quite a bit of work ahead of me, making suitable tripod adaptors, I'd like to get it working with Stellarium and also try out the Snap port connection to control the DSLR shutter, it might save buying an intervalometer.
Lots of fun ahead.

[Rod-AR127]

Well done on the purchase Richard.
Hope you get many many nights enjoyment out of it.
I'm loving mine.

[carlstronomy]

Adam,
Thanks mate, time to download and play during the wet weather :)
I like free very much, but more importantly I love the removed reliance on one spot of sky.:thumbsup:

Carl

[dikman]

Thanks Rod. NINA, I've seen it mentioned a bit, is this something else I need to get? This tracking, guiding, astrophotography go-to stuff is a whole new rabbit-hole I appear to have gone down.:rofl:

[Rod-AR127]

Yep, me too, l know nothing.
I'm just going to do visual observing g, maybe use my DSLR with a lens and muck about taking pictures of the moon or very wide field.
Saving for a guide camera now, or should l say, waiting for the Mrs to forget the last $2k of astro stuff.

[dikman]

I fitted the mount to the Meade tripod and discovered I couldn't fit the counterweight due to the rather large baseplate that the Meade has! I shifted the weight bar to the upper position on the mount (clever design) and it was fine - but when I fitted the scope to check at extreme positions it might hit the legs, depending how it's configured. Bugger.
Now I'll have to make a short (4") riser for it.

[dikman]

I forgot to mention my solution to the polar cap falling off, just apply a bit of heat (NOT too much) to the inside of the two locking tabs and bend them out slightly. This makes them springier and they should grip better.

[carlstronomy]

I actually contacted SkyWatcher about that very issue and that was what the assistant said they did, but they also stated in the same sentence they would not recommend doing this. Typical response from a manufacturer, I have just left mine off for the moment. It does fit good until you use batteries in the mount, the clips actually fowl on the battery packs.

Quote: "Personally (and I am not saying to do this!), with mine I slightly warmed up the clip "arms" on the cap and bent them out a tiny bit so that they hold, and that has worked perfectly."

[carlstronomy]

Clear skies in Brisbane tonight :eyepop:

Did the learning curve on NINA the other day in partial clear skies and was ready to hit the ground running tonight. Picked a clear part of the sky and carried out the polar alignment routine. Went very well indeed, I was very happy with the procedure for my first time. Carried out the following star tests on completion with no guiding

60 second sub round stars
120 second sub round stars
180 second sub not bad not really usable
240 second sub for not being guided and only my first attempt only a little worse than 180 second subs

For a travel mount when camping I think I am going to be extremely happy with this GTi.

If anyone is interested I can post some subs here.

One thing I noticed with NINA polar alignment, ever time you went to a different part of the sky and ran it again then it would ask you to change the mount position. Not by much but I found my tracking was best from my first setup and got worse after a secondary adjustment in another part of the sky. Obviously do it once and leave it :P

[dikman]

Well done, I'm still battling my way through NINA (it would probably help if I knew what I was doing!:lol:).
Polar alignment, did you use the plate-solving add-on?

[carlstronomy]

Yes, I download the 3 point polar alignment plugin and its required extra's. When using this there are two extremely critical settings.

1. Ensure the pixel size is set to your camera.
2. Ensure the focal length and ratio is set to your scope including any alterations a reducer/flattener will create if you are using one.

I missed setting both correctly the other day during my learning curve and the plate solve could not be carried out. Once set correctly last night the plate solve was almost immediate.

[dikman]

Thanks Carl, I'll add those two settings to the (long) list of things to check! It's still raining/drizzly, my gear is set up in the lounge so I'll have another play later.