Update on Alex's fire situation

[glend]

If anyone is interested, I have contacted Alex via sms this morning to see how things have been going around Tabulum this past week. I am told that smoke has been the big problem at his place, as a respiratory issue for folks, especially the old ones. He has spent most of the past week in a wheelchair.
Alex cannot post his usual updates because he is serving out a ban, and I have no idea if he will return.

[casstony]

Hopefully Alex does return - he adds a bit of colour to the forum. (even if he's a little too colourful for the TOS at times :) )

[Startrek]

I was beginning to wonder if Alex was ok or not as we are so use to him posting on a regular basis
Hope he gets back on his feet soon and back into AP and posting
He is a wonderful character and has time for everyone

[Imme]

It would be a real shame for this forum if Alex didn't return.

He1 is one of the reason I come to visit.....I really enjoy his posts

[blink138]

what ban? an iis one??
lol he is rather colourful but he is always polite
pat

[Nikolas]

Pity about the ban hope he returns soon, as a moderator in another forum I can understand why bans occur, Good to hear Alex is not in imminent danger in the fires.

[mynameiscd]

Good to hear that Alex is ok.
Sorry to hear about the ban.
Alex has some of the best posts, some of the most colourful images, and always gives encouragement to beginners and the experienced.
I really hope he returns after the ban, he is one of the reasons I look forward to IIS but I know there are TOS rules.
Cheers
Andy

[Outcast]

Thanks Glen,

So good to hear that Alex is okay & hopefully not in any immediate danger..

Hope he does return to the forum; as others have said, whilst a colourful & candid character, he is full of inspiration & encouragement which I believe we have all benefitted from at some stage of our Astronomy journey

Cheers

[bojan]

Come back, Alex!
(BTW, I tried to contact him via forum email, but it seems this method doesn't work or he is not checking his emails).

[leon]

I haven't been posting much lately and am surprised to hear about a ban, :eyepop:he is so polite and a caring fellow.:)
hope we get him back soon.

Leon:thumbsup:

[RB]

There has been a lot going on behind the scenes that members don't get to see (obviously).

The TOS specifically states that "Religion" is to be avoided and not discussed.
Even some of you guys (bojan and others) have pointed this out to new members pushing their particular religious views lately.

I've publically & privately warned such individuals ('Blindman', et al) about continually breaking the TOS rules.

JohnF continually broke the TOS rules on religion and received a 2-month ban but unfortunately, I also had to give Alex the same ban because he too creates topics that take jabs at religious groups knowing full well that he's been warned many many times by Mike and the other moderators
He's received bans before so he of all people knows whats expected on here.

We can't have one set of rules for people that hold religious views while having another set of rules for non-believers and allowing them to post "anti-religious" views without allowing a rebuttle from believers due to the TOS rules.

Same goes for Anti-American (anti-Trump) setiments, Global Warming and the like, all of which are spelled out in the TOS for this very reason, we have members on here from America, we have members on here that hold religious views, we have members here that don't believe in Climate Change and Mike has specifically asked us to moderate on these topics accordingly.

It's not just a matter of being cordial and polite, it's a matter of not continually breaching the IIS TOS Rules even after being asked and then warned not to, many, many, times.

RB

[N1]

So we are free to discuss climatic changes on other planets but not our own. This is wrong. Astronomy is also about drawing conclusions from what we see elsewhere about the world we live on. I'd say most people on here don't believe in climate change, because there is nothing to be believed. There is evidence, and there is its interpretation. So maybe the TOS should allow certain things to be discussed, as long as the discussion is scientifically based. And by doing that, even those who disagree with a certain interpretation of the available evidence, get to say why they disagree. There is nothing wrong with that. The TOS should enable scientific discussion, not serve to appease those incapable of it.

[casstony]

While I agree that the suppression of climate change discussion is wrong and deniers are fools, the Mods have a difficult (though highly paid) job and I think we just have to go along with the TOS and whatever rulings the Mods make.

[snowyskiesau]

Having been a moderator on a number of forums, I agree about the various no-go subjects mentioned here. Not so much from the view that they shouldn't be discussed at all but they are too far off topic (astronomy).



A reminder of the rules then a ban with the ban period increasing each time it is imposed seems fair.



Lots of other forums exist to air your religious, political or crackpot opinions :)

Hope Alex is safe. I went through bush-fires here in Tassie earlier in the year so can sympathise with his situation.

[JA]

Stay safe Alex.

Best
JA

[RB]

I'll put it to you this way:

Mike has invited us into his 'living room'.
We're welcome to discuss things and share our astro observations and photos.
He's asked us that while we're in his 'living room' that we not discuss religion, climate change, politics.
I think it's only polite that we respect that.
He has stated many times in the past, IIS is not a democracy, it's his forum.

If you find the need to express your views on those subjects please find another forum, social media, platform to take up your cause.
(I'm paraphrasing his words btw).

RB





Thank you, I appreciate people that understand what it's like to moderate a big forum such as ours.
Houghy, Al and myself have dedicated untold hours on here, since 2005, and we've seen many members come and go and I might add many good moderators come and go because of the pressure of this unpaid job.
We have families and family commitments too and we try our best to keep an even keel on IIS.
We can only offer our best, under these difficult circumstances.



Yep, stay safe Alex, good luck with your dad and the fires.
As I explained to Alex just before I banned him, I have both parents suffering from cancer and another relative in the hospital with a terminal illness.
And I have fires that are coming our way too and have to do prepair for the worst for my family.

RB

[Rainmaker]

For Alex, RB and others being impacted by these fires,
Hope you guys and your families stay safe and don't suffer any losses.

(To the moderators, my thanks for a job well done, helping these forums on an even keel is a challenging task, one I doubt I could keep up with.)

Stay safe and remember property is replaceable, people are not :thumbsup:

[RB]

Thanks Matt.

RB
:thumbsup:

[TheCrazedLog]

Rarely do I post here and even more rarely in such a thread, but this statement was just too good and too on the money to not acknowledge. :thumbsup:

[leee]

Alex - is why I continue to Visit this site. :sadeyes:

[multiweb]

Stay safe Andrew. :thumbsup:



He can hear you. He just can't answer back.

[Sunfish]

Some people are rascals it is true. And some like Alex are do it with style and humour and some great wild images. Let’s hope a ban is a feather in his cap and the current adversity in the fire country is another journey.

Perhaps we have an unrecognised alcove in the living room, a section called rants where non-science and stirrers of all kinds flourish on the margin. The TOS works at many levels.

[AndyG]

+1 This. Rants 'n Bants are a necessity in life. Well said Ray

[Nikolas]

In the motorcycle forum I moderate in we created a "war room" where people were given special privileges to access and nut out their differences without any moderation, it was a total flop because they were more polite in there and ended up abandoning it. As a moderator it's amusing to see how people online interact. It takes all people doesn't it? (2 months is harsh imho but them's the rules)

[Starlite]

Ahhhh.. now I understand why Lewis is AWOL for 2 or 3 months at a time. :rofl:

[N1]

Sorry, I didn't realise I was in somebody's non-democratic living room.

All the best to Alex and others affected by the fires.

[GrahamL]

Seen a bit over the last 10 + years visiting this site .


I think the TOS are pretty much were they need to be for a site of this size, Self moderation isn't that hard .. No political and religious themes .
If your post gets removed because you have drifted into a grey area so be it I have had a couple over the years .



IF you continually ignore warnings to stop and i bet thats the real cause of people getting bans and we dont see that happening again so be it .


Alex has likely been to the naughty corner more than anyone but not without reason .


Please continue keep it tidy Andrew and others you all do a great Job:thumbsup:

[glend]

When I started this thread it was simply to update folks on Alex's situation. It was not intended to challenge status quo Terms of Service or provoke debate on that, their application/moderation, or more general Editorial policy.

I request that members here respect the original intent of the OP and not drag this thread into lockdown territory.
Thanks
Glen

[ChrisV]

All the best Alex. Hope you are getting through the forest okay.
Chris

[phomer]

Andrew,


I rarely if ever post anything other than astronomy related material but was interested to learn that global warming is a banned subject. I would have expected that science in general would not be something that a forum such as this would have an issue with.


As always I respect peoples right to have beliefs that may differ significantly from my own views and it could be argued that science in itself is a belief system. The significant difference from other belief systems is that it is prepared to modify those beliefs when tested.


So, my question is how does the line between what is acceptable and not get drawn? Is it based on posts that get out of hand, where they get personal or derogatory or are there some other criteria?


Paul

[Allan_L]

Hi Andrew,

Thanks to you, Mike and the other mods for this website. Great Job! :thumbsup:

But Mainly, and in keeping with the OP,
Hope all is well up there for you and family (on the Mountain).
I guess you are probably busy preparing for a worst case scenario with the fire still approaching.
We are getting burnt leaves and debris even here. Scary stuff.
I can't imagine how you could prepare for something like this with your business and livestock on the line.

I just hope it burns itself out before it reaches any more rural communities.
:help:
Best wishes for good luck and keep safe

[RB]

Thanks Graham and Allan and everyone for your support.

Preparing for the worst Allan.
We're going to evacuate some of the family members.
I'm moving what belongings we can off the property today.
Had a meeting with the RFS yesterday and the situation is extreme.
I've been through two major bushfires including the 1994 one up here, I know what's coming.

If I'm not online for the next week or so you'll understand why.

Hope everyone stays alert and stays safe with these fires, don't leave things to the last minute.

I'm also thinking about Alex and his dad.

RB

[sharpiel]

Hi Andrew. Hope all is going to be ok.

I'm not too far from you so plans being prepared also.

[astroron]

HI Andrew,I hope all goes well with you and your family.
Best of luck Mate.
Cheers:thumbsup:

[atkinsonr]

Thanks Glen, I was also concerned about Alex and everyone else who has been in the fire zones. It's so early in the summer I fear we've got more tough days ahead.

Would suggest that climate could and should be discussed without politics, religion or blame. It's a scientific topic after all.

[SimmoW]

Yes thinking of Alex and hope he returns and sees all of our messages. Hes a great character and hilarious, yes one of the few reasons I return to the site. Just wish we didn't have to do it all in Mike's living room. Dont even know the bloke.

It's a bit like being invited to Beijing, then finding some of your friends have disappeared....😂

[casstony]

It always was a scientific topic, until powerful vested interests transformed it into a political topic with the aim of suppressing discussion and it worked - too bad for us.

[JA]

Stay safe RB, Alex and others that may be affected. I hope there's rain / a change of weather and that the fires somehow bypass you all and burn-out safely.

Best
JA

[netwolf]

Hey Alex Andrew and all of u affected by fires stay safe, thoughts and prayers for you and for rain.

[leee]

Alex. You are why I visit, and enjoy -- this site.

[sharpiel]

I’ve breached the TOS in the past. It was put to me this way (paraphrased) “There are other sites on the very wide web to discuss those topics. Mike doesn’t want them here. If you don’t want to fit in then go visit one of those other sites.”

It was explained to me that it also generates a lot of extra un-needed work for the mods dealing with the behind the scenes complaints that contentious subjects generate. Not all grievances are aired publicly and not all members, I gather, are comfortable with direct forum interaction on subjects they find distasteful. They direct their complaints privately to the mods. Which in turn requires the mods to read all posts and respond in private as well as direct forum intervention. In a forum with a large membership, contentious issues generate a lot of complaints.

Once I understood all the above I agreed. If you don’t like these rules go elsewhere where you find a better fit for your need to discuss those subjects excluded by the IIS TOS. In other words FIFO.

It’s about respecting the broader community of users and the architects and providers of the site.

If you’re offended by this forum not being a democracy then go find one.

Just my rambling thoughts....

In the words of Kent Brockman “I for one welcome our Moderator Overlords!”