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Bobbyoutback
08-10-2019, 01:04 PM
This hasn't happened in Australia yet but it's coming .

Lifted this of the net today .....

GOING OFF THE RAILS: Banks Charging To Hold Cash
So this is where negative rate policy starts to go off the rails, when people start calculating the cost of losing money on their deposits vs digging holes in the ground to store the cash. Berliner Volksbank, Germany’s 2nd biggest co-op bank is now putting on a .5% tax on any deposits north of 100,000 euros. They are now one of 34 German banks that are now charging customers in some fashion. Last Thursday Spar Nord Bank in Denmark said they are taxing retail customers .75% (the level of their central banks deposit rate) on deposits above 750k kroner which is a bit above $100,000. It’s time to buy stocks of those companies that make shovels…

:sadeyes:

chrisp9au
08-10-2019, 01:27 PM
I do so wish this was a problem I was going to have to deal with! :rolleyes:

leon
08-10-2019, 01:44 PM
Me to Chris, they will never get a cent out of me either.

Leon

gregbradley
08-10-2019, 01:46 PM
Don’t they have to have a certain deposits to loans ratio.
If they inhibit deposits they inhibit their ability to loan.
Greg

N1
08-10-2019, 01:49 PM
I suppose you could compete by charging half that fee for holding their cash. Minimum deposit 100k of course :D

JA
08-10-2019, 01:55 PM
And then they(?) will tell you, or better yet from their viewpoint, you will scream in disgust:

"Well there's a way out of all this we'll just go to digital currency for bank accounts and all forms of cash holdings. We don't need cash in today's modern age".

And then it's done, just the way they wanted in the first place. And then, you're ......

Best
JA

LewisM
08-10-2019, 02:29 PM
I've got all our savings in Gringot's Bank.

Peter Ward
08-10-2019, 02:50 PM
Our retirement portfolio simply won't hold much cash at all if they try that stunt here. (given the current rate of inflation our term deposits are effectively at zero now)

There are other asset classes...e.g. bullion, real estate. That will either appreciate or generate income.

Seriously...they must have a crack habit if they think you'd want to park money in a Bank account and be charged for doing so.

You'd literally be better off keeping it under the mattress.

Or perhaps buy shares in a Safe Manufacturer. :)

bojan
08-10-2019, 02:53 PM
I wonder if it is good idea to move the cash into Super ?

What is the cap?

sil
08-10-2019, 03:05 PM
Until the gov just declares cash not legal tender anymore sorta like India did with their high value banknotes (which IS something the Aussie government is interested in doing).

China has been counterfeiting bullion for years and India flooding markets with treated low grade stones as fake gems. I'd say invest in Paddles, considering the Creek everyone will soon be swimming in.

FlashDrive
08-10-2019, 04:28 PM
Then, I'll start charging them for using my money as ' loans ' to their other customers .... if only. :confused2:

julianh72
08-10-2019, 05:15 PM
There's an easy solution to this:

With interest rates going into negative territory, just borrow some money - the bank will pay you to borrow money, and with the negative interest earned on a loan, you can pay the interest owing on your deposit account!

:2thumbs:

AndyG
08-10-2019, 05:17 PM
Absolutely ridiculous Julian...
...


...It might just work :P

gary
08-10-2019, 05:59 PM
Hi Julian,

As you are probably aware, at least in the case of the widely publicized
negative interest rate load being offered by a large Danish bank, they
don't actually give you the interest directly back into your hand,
but every month your debt is reduced by more than the amount you pay.

Zuts
08-10-2019, 08:26 PM
Hi,

It's for deposits over 100,000. Some companies need to hold large amounts of cash. They can either pay the 0.5% or they can buy multiple safes in all their offices and hire people to guard them. Then they can pay an armoured car to drive the cash around to the places they need to pay.

All in all I think you will find most companies would pay the 0.5%

Cheers
Paul

xelasnave
08-10-2019, 08:32 PM
What should we expect when money is not tied to gold...I know I am old fashion but printing what you want (Governments) is wrong.
I could not believe when a certain head dude in a certain important bank in a certain other country said...There is no problem with cash we can just print more... Anyways we are doomed..it boils down to this...too many peoe with too much money...fix it..how...spiral the economy into depression...make money valuable again for those that have any left so they can buy the assets of those who simply could not survive.
This is a big problem for me...I have been avoiding action but Gary's news tells me I must act...I have found water profitable...maybe more dams...gold...I bet this is a ploy to get folk to buy gold...mmm. No interest let's buy gold...It's a game...let's follow the money..who is benefiting from this...it's hard to tell...a collapse is the only way a select few can benefit...I can see it now...pension funds etc life savings ..gone...where ..to who...do what they do and all will be ok.
Alex

When has this happened before in history?
What happened?
I am very concerned ..there must be a way to take advantage...borrowing??? Well if you do interest rates will go back up no doubt.
This must have ramifications on share prices..which ones...where is value... It's the end of the world I can feel it.
Alex

If capital is valueless one could think labour should be more valuable but who can pay? There is only one answer...ww3.
Alex

Dennis
08-10-2019, 08:49 PM
The last time I looked at this, once you reach 65, you cannot make super contributions without meeting the ‘work test’ (need to work for a minimum of 40 hours in any 30 consecutive day period to make voluntary contributions to your super account).

However, the government announced before the May 2019 budget that the ‘work test’ in superannuation will no longer apply between the ages of 65 and 67 from 1st July 2020. This legislation has not yet been passed.

If you meet all the conditions, I understand this will allow you to make non-concessional contributions of up to three times the normal annual cap (currently $100,000), so the bring-forward amount is $100,000 x 3 = $300,000.

However, things may have changed...:)

Cheers

Dennis

GrahamL
08-10-2019, 09:04 PM
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/aug/16/six-ways-to-bring-the-american-dream-back-from-the-dead


Well its not australia but some of the points made do sit well with whats going on here , I cant see an easy fix and have thought that for a few years now .
We see infastructure investment as roads and solar panels never education and no student debt , tax loopholes for property investment debt and institutional money is so ingrained now it cant ever change

while this stuff is differant in a way from the US its a part of a bigger picture thats essentially the same ?

xelasnave
08-10-2019, 09:10 PM
Buy baked beans in cans.
Start a vegie garden, get some chooks and dig a well. Look at history this is a very very very bad sign. When money is worthless..and that is what this tells us...civilizations collapse...baked beans in cans may not seem stupid advice in six months from now.
I am planting vegies, getting some chooks and some goats and some shotguns.

Alex



Think it through.
They have more money than can be used.
That is the problem.
Alex

Think about this....
You can become a millionaire by riding a skate board...cage fights now offer million dollar prizes..even moto cross has million dollar events...something is wrong. Too much money.
Alex

Peter Ward
08-10-2019, 09:47 PM
What? End of the world as we know it? Zombie apocalypse in the New Year? :rofl:

I predict the NYE fireworks will still go off, and if interest rates fall to zip
assets will become quite expensive...except maybe tinned beans, still likely to be $1.00 a can in Aldi.

As for eating baked beans with shotgun at the ready in the bomb shelter....could be risky :lol:

Bobbyoutback
08-10-2019, 09:52 PM
Notice less & less people use cash even for small transactions .
Now it's tap your card for just about everything .

We are all heading deeper into the cashless society , is this a good thing ?
No it isn't ! It's horrible when you think about it .

The next thing to happen is new issued printed paper/plastic money will have a Use by Date on it ! yep '' spend it before it becomes worthless .
Those who still hold old money will get some great deals until they run out .


Bobby :(

xelasnave
08-10-2019, 09:53 PM
Now don't come in with that calm rational approach when I am presenting "the sky is falling".
We are doomed...
I know you are concerned..cutting your links with petrol and indeed the "power" company.
Honestly do you have chooks or not?
Alex



I suggest ..buy silver and gold.
Alex

Peter Ward
08-10-2019, 10:10 PM
I'm certainly not concerned about any impending social cataclysm.

Yes, I have an EV and PV's as I know climate change is real, so do my bit there (plus save on power/transport). As for chooks.....nup. Not really fond of mung beans either.

The simple fix is raise real wages.

But we get the politicians we deserve. Real fiscal and social change is unlikely until we see a French style "Vive la révolution!"

Bobbyoutback
08-10-2019, 10:29 PM
What a good idea :thumbsup:

Also I have been buying up baked beans & tins of sardines .
Not just any sardines ' my favorite eating ones are Brisling sardines :)
The brisling is only found in the icy water of the Northern Hemisphere .

Have Fun
Bobby .

xelasnave
08-10-2019, 10:34 PM
Well we don't want revolution. It's so predictable...but you have to love the reign of terror aspect...the futile attempt to change human behaviour via fear...does that work?
I am not really concerned about the wages of workers or the fact we have politicians who are reflections of the idiots that vote them in..I just want to know should I buy baked beans or chooks.

Should I buy rental properties given that maybe no one can afford the rent or should I save the cash and hire mercenaries and go for total control.

Save the planet...mmm...let humans run their course just like rabbits who eat themselves out of house and home and just start the wheel of evolution spinning ...

I passed a road crew today..twenty men on site..what were they doing..one man was mowing the grass..that says something...you need twenty men to cut grass on a public road..but look at the money ..mortgages paid, rent paid, baked beans purchased...one wonders how the system works.

All I worry about is the value of my bank shares...I don't care if I have to pay them to hold my cash just so long as they run the bank at a profit.

I counted my trees...I have over ten thousand now...I think I should be paid for all the carbon I manage...it is shameful the way folk just cut them down for money...I looked out this morning and realised I give a home for so many creatures humans ignore...I don't care if it collapses or not. Maybe there are too many humans maybe not enough who can rise above superstition...it is what it is...I study history and I guess it worries me that things are so good..that is not the way of it.
Alex



I also stock sardines. Rice is good also. Northern hemisphere sardines ..not good..the North is polluted with nuclear waste. I recommend krill from Antarctica.
I wonder..can you eat grass..If cooked maybe.
Do you know how to make your own gunpowder..a must...
The only hope is to build more pyramids...burns up cash and keeps people working.
Alex

Bobbyoutback
08-10-2019, 11:22 PM
Hello Alex , I don't know how to make gunpowder .
Why would building more pyramids be better then chook yards :confused2:
Check these chook pens ---- https://www.mychickencoop.com.au/chook-pen-for-sale

Thanks for the Laughs
Bobby . :lol:

Outcast
08-10-2019, 11:23 PM
Banks have been charging us for the privilege of holding our money for us for decades now... it's just been in the form of various fees & charges. Don't keep enough in your account = fee, use someone else's ATM = fee, use EFTPOS = fee, exceed max transactions = fee, want a debit card = fee, over the counter transaction = fee...

Count up your fees vs the paultry amount of interest you receive... you've been paying for years!!

xelasnave
08-10-2019, 11:37 PM
Check out various South USA approaches. Double car ports with manure for potassium nitrate...not sure how to get sulphur but probably via fools Gold... charcoal I think I have it worked out.
Building pyramids is what the market economy is all about.
You need to create wealth but destroy it so there is a need to create more wealth. A market economy needs to grow and it can only grow if you trim it...you must trim the money
That's why we have a concern at the moment...too much money..it needs to be trimmed...pyramids are good...needless bridges...consider Japan's problem..they build bridges..not because they need ridges but because they need pyramids...the end result is not the goal..it is the building and destruction of money that is required.

That why war is such a good thing ..limitless production but nothing to show for it..so work must continue..profit must continue
Sounds crazy..well yes..but that is the best humans can manage.
Hopefully in the future we can reach the sophistication of ants....
Alex

SimmoW
09-10-2019, 09:02 AM
Yeah sadly a war is probably the best solution, but a good genuine solid one, of the WW brand, one that culls the population down by 50% or so. Someone asked me what the solution to global warming is. It's not fiddling around the edges or granting every driver a $150k electric car produced from fossil fuel sources manufacturers stuffed with rare metals in the electronics. There are just too many ants on the mound.

Negative interest on all your cash? That's an admirable first world problem. That'll be the last of your concerns in 5yrs. Good basic healthcare, becoming less available because all the workers are fed up with having to travel 2 hours from their dormitory suburbs, that'll be a real pain.

Gotta go now, I must tend to my sheep...

Peter Ward
10-10-2019, 12:10 PM
I was going to let this go through to the keeper, but....

A war to cull 50% the population? Really?

SO will you be the first to stick you head up from the trenches anytime soon? How about your Mum, Dad, Significant other? Which half do you want gone?

My mother fled from both the Nazi's and Russians. My ex-Royal Navy father had nothing good to say about it. I was very glad to see the asinine Vietnam war conscription end before I turned 18.

War is never a good solution.

Comments like yours clearly shows dim witted ignorance to what goes on when states sponsor mass killings.

FlashDrive
10-10-2019, 12:35 PM
Me to ...I was getting close ( 17 ) to that age .... !!

Col...

xelasnave
10-10-2019, 01:19 PM
It was my fault for raising it Peter.
I apologise for putting bad thoughts out there.
Alex