Thinking seriously about a DMK

[matt]

OK...

So all the talk lately about folks taking the DMK plunge has got me thinking seriously about joining the 21AF04 brigade.

My astro pooter is a Dell Inspiron 6000.

There's no firewire port but it does have USB2.

What extras will I need to buy that are not included in the box with the DMK ?

Look what you've done to me, Ponders!!!!:lol:

[[1ponders]]

:lol:

Do you have a PCMCIA port on your laptop?

[iceman]

How big is your harddrive?

Do you have an external USB2 drive?

You'll need the adapters (1.25") and a belkin firewire powered hub.

[matt]

Yep... although I don't know what PCMCIA actually stands for:lol:



60Gig HDD

Er... I think the USB2 drive is internal???? Bit confused about that one:shrug:

We have USB2 ports

[bird]

You sure it doesn't have a firewire port? Lots of reviews of the 6000 on the net seem to think is does...

cheers, Bird

[iceman]

You'll definitely need a firewire powered hub - that powers the camera. Approx $85.

And because you don't have a firewire port, you'll need to get a PCMCIA card which gives you a firewire port. They're on ebay for like $20.

The USB2 external drive I referred to is an external hard drive. 60gig won't be enough (long term) for capture + processing + storage of all your astronomical goodies.
You can get a 300gig external USB HDD for around $200. I capture directly to my external drive.

[iceman]

Then of course you need a filter wheel (manual one for $200-$300), and Astronomiks RGB Type II filters ($350+).

It all adds up, so make sure you budget for it.

[bird]

Matt, I got my firewire hub from SI computers in Fyshwick, cost me about $25 :-)

Bird

[iceman]

haha nice price.

The belkin one has 6 ports, 4 firewire and 2 USB2 (I think). You could probably get a cheaper one as Bird suggested. As long as it powers the camera, and transfers data to the PCMCIA card, that's all that matters.

[[1ponders]]

Neither do I :P but you will need one of these;

[matt]

Hmmmm.

Think I'll hold off on the purchase of filter wheel and filters for a short time, while I practice shooting in monochrome:)

Thanks guys.

Plenty to think about.

Bird - is there any easy way to check my laptop to see if indeed it is firewire capable? Any system check I can run?

I'll need you to provide me with the steps to reach the info.

Thanks again folks

[iceman]

Yeh mono is fine for a while - my first Jupiter shots with the DMK were in Mono, and mono on the moon is well... normal :)

[Dennis]

Matt

Single Click the green “Start” button
Select “Control Panel”
Double Click “System”
Select the “Hardware” Tab
Click the “Device Manager” Button

This will open the “Device Manager” Window which provides a list of all the devices in your computer. If you have Firewire (IEEE1394) it should appear somewhere in the list.

Cheers

Dennis

[bird]

Matt, if you have a firewire port then it will be located somewhere on your laptop. Look for a small 4-pin mini socket, maybe on the left side of the laptop (thats where mine is, a dell inspiron 8500). It might be marked "1394".

It looks kinda like a mini-usb port, but it's not quite the same shape.

Bird

[matt]

Dennis

Here's what I get when I follow that sequence.

Does it look good for me?

[matt]

Hooooooooorayyyyyyyyyyyy!!!!!!

Yes. There's one of those at the side of my pooter.

I was looking for the firewire symbol and not the "1394"

So, what does this mean?:lol:

[[1ponders]]

Is it a small port or a large port Matt? (4pin or 6pin)

[matt]

4-pin, Paul

[[1ponders]]

You will definately need a powered hub then. The camera doesn't have a seperate power supply so needs a 6 pin to power the camera.

[matt]

But at least I don't need at PCMCIA card... right?

[[1ponders]]

Not at this stage, but you never know :P :lol:

They're not expensive anyway, $25 will get you one.

I tried to run the camera off mine, it has a seperate power adapter, but it still wasn't enough. I got the powered hub, np. Didn't even need to power the PCMCIA card. So with a bit of luck your 4 pin to a 6 pin into a powered hub will be fine.

Also there is no cable that comes with the camera, though the one that comes with the hub should do it. It's only about 2 meters long though. I went for a 5 meter cable ($25) to go to the camera from the hub. You will also need a 4-6 pin cable to go from laptop to hub.

[matt]

Cripes.

That's confusing.

By the looks of what you've just written all I'll need to buy (apart from the camera and what comes with it) is a hub and a couple of cables?

Have I boiled that down correctly?

Got a phone number for Matt Lovell?:lol:

Cheers

[bird]

Matt, you'll need the same gear as me:

- A powered firewire hub (cheap from a computer store or the computer markets)

- a firewire cable 4-pin to 6-pin to run from the laptop to this hub. I buy mine at the computer markets, cost about $10. make this nice and long, say 5m.

- a firewire cable 6-pin to 6-pin to run from the hub to the camera. Also buy from the computer markets. If you mount the firewire hub on the scope then this can be a short cable, < 1m.

- a 12v plugpack to run the firewire hub (if it doesn't come supplied).

Be careful when buying firewire cables, a lot of the cables on the market are heavy-duty (thick) cables and this is bad for astronomy use. I found a stall at the computer markets in canberra that sells thin black firewire cables, definitely you want to use these ones otherwise you'll tie yourself in knots if you buy the heavy duty cables.

cheers, Bird

[[1ponders]]

That and a C thread to 1.25" adapter. (Steve at myastroshop has them.)

List
Camera (Duhh:P )
Powered firewire hub (6-6pin cable that comes with it will be fine to run to the camera)
4-6pin firewire cable to run from laptop to hub
C/CS to 1.25" adapter (Myastroshop (http://www.myastroshop.com.au/products/details.asp?id=MAS-278))

should just about cover it.

[iceman]

My hub runs off 240v!


Good tip, thanks!

The thick ones I have are a pain in the cold, as they tend not to flex and bend very well.

[bird]

Matt, another possibility for adapters is Steve Mogg, who lives here in Canberra (in Tuggeranong): webcaddy.com.au

cheers, Bird

[matt]

I was gonna ask about that 12v powerpack thingy too, Mike.

Will I need to buy a separate 240v power supply/cable/thing to power the hub or does it come with it?

Doesn't the camera and/or the hub draw power from the lappy?

[RB]

Mike the 240v gets converted to 12v in the plug pack.

[iceman]

The hub I got comes with the power cable and 240v plug.


Not with a 4-pin plug. If you had a 6-pin plug (in your lappy) then you wouldn't need the hub.

[iceman]

Man it gets confusing real quick.. a simple question turns into 20 posts very quickly :) I think I might write a "how-to" on buying a DMK.. that is, what you need, where from, etc.

Would be a good resource for those wanting to upgrade from the ToUcam.

I could get input from Dennis, Robert, Paul, Matt etc to take into account the various laptops and other different scenarios.

[matt]

So... what good is a lappy with a 4-pin:(:sadeyes:

[iceman]

Different firewire devices would get their power from a battery or have their own power supply. This DMK camera does not.

[matt]

That, sir ... is a cracka of an idea...

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

[iceman]

Won't be until February, though... :astron: :bashcomp:

[[1ponders]]

Oh and when you get the 1.25" adapter you better get a C/CS to "T" adapter as well if you decide to go for an ATiK filter wheel. It has a "T" thread to connect to.

[matt]

Is cool.

I have enough of a shopping list now to move forward on this if I want.

Thanks to everyone for your great help and advice.

Mike, that "How To" will be a great addition to the IIS resources:thumbsup:

[matt]

Bird (or Mike, or Paul etc)

Ignoring price and length (they come in various lengths) would these be the sort of firewire cables you'd recommend?

http://www.streetwise.com.au/product_info.php?products_id=4115

[[1ponders]]

That's the same one that comes with the Belkin hub. Pretty thick but does the job .

[matt]

Paul. Your earlier post says a 6-6pin comes with the hub. My link is to the 4-6pin, which should be the only additional firewire cable I need to buy?

As long as it allows 400Mbps that should be fine. That's as fast as the hub can transfer the data

[[1ponders]]

Should be Matt.

[matt]

Cool

Oh dear. This is looking better by the hour:scared:

[bird]

Matt, I'd advise against buying cables sight unseen. You really don't want the thick cables, and it's impossible to tell just looking at a picture to tell them apart.

I'd strongly advise that you go to the computer markets one weekend and buy them there. The light duty firewire cables are about the same thickness as a mouse cable, much more user friendly than the heavy duty cables. Plus they're cheaper too :-)

cheers, Bird

[matt]

I understand what you're saying Anthony, but how bad can they be when they're designed to transfer data at the optimum speed of the hub and when the additional cable's the same as the one which comes with the hub except it has one 4-pin end?

But I'll take your suggestion re: the markets on board

[[1ponders]]

What is the problem with the thick cable bird? These are the only ones I've managed to get here.

[bird]

I have a box full of firewire cables now, after spending the last couple of years collecting them and using them... they all "work" ok, ie they all transfer data, but there's a world of difference in how easy to use they are.

All the heavy duty cables are now sitting at the bottom of the box, I doubt I'll ever use them again.

The thin cables are so much nicer to use, you should try and get them rather than the thick cables.

The ultimate 6pin-6pin firewire cable is sold at Mac stores, it's a lovely thin white cable. I just wish Apple made longer 4-to-6 versions of it. I use one of these cables to connect the finderscope camera to the hub, but it's ideal for connecting the DMK to the hub. Not sure if you can still find these, and they cost an arm and a leg (typical Apple stuff!).

cheers, Bird

[[1ponders]]

I'll have a look around. You don't know off hand of any online stores that sell them?

[bird]

Paul, I bought this one locally from PCTech, I doubt they have an online presence. Shouldn't be too hard to find though, I sort of remember that it was for an ipod, but I might be wrong.

Bird

[bird]

If you google for "thin white apple firewire cable" then I think you'll find it.

[[1ponders]]

Cheer bird. I found some at lindy.com.au though at 19.95 for a 3m length and then 12.95 for postage I think I'll try to find it locally first. :P Man that is steep postage for a small item.