strange problem with internet into the observatory

[Somnium]

i am down at my observatory for the week and started to notice the internet was a little flaky. it stopped working so i bypassed the switch and went right from the wall mount port to the computer which seemed to work, albeit with difficulty connecting. i swapped out the switch which didnt make a difference, changed the cables, no luck and figured it must be an issue between the wall mount on the observatory and the wall mount in the house. i took off the plates only to have water drip out of the CAT6 cable. not water around it, water had some how gotten within the cable, moved up to the end through capillary action and out. i left it overnight and there was a nice little puddle where the cable was resting. it is the strangest thing, there must be water in the conduit and it is soaking through the protective cover.

anyway it is an interesting problem to have and i am trying to restore internet connectivity to the switch before i go home tomorrow, otherwise i cant operate the obs ...

how do others get internet to their observatories, i am thinking a 4G router but i am not sure how reliable they are ...

[Somnium]

has anyone used ethernet over power? how good is it?

[Atmos]

A 4G single should work fine and without issues, wouldn't go doing any big downloads though :P

[Somnium]

yeah, but i already have internet in the home so that would be another cost and also the 4g access here is notoriously dodgy ... i might try powerline ethernet or whatever it is called. not sure if the range will be good enough but it is worth a go. if anyone has any experience with it i would love to hear from you.

the only other option i could think of is leaving it connected directly to the dodgy leaking cable and then getting a usb to ethernet connection to connect my IP power board to. those are the only 2 things that need to be on the network

[PCH]

My lad set up ethernet over power here at our house while he lived here and it worked fine. It was across two circuits too, - meaning that the front half of our house (where the hub is) is on a different circuit to his room at the back of the house.

Now that he's shacked up with his floozy, he uses it there too and has no issues or complaints.

I've haven't used it myself, but it didn't look hard to set up at all.

All you need are the two (or more) powered things that you stick into the power outlets, plug your cat 5 RJ45 connector into that and whammo!

His units were quite costly IIRC, but are probs cheaper now.

[Somnium]

Thanks Paul , I have 24 hours to get a solution, I don't want to miss out on the week of good weather that is apparently coming up . I will give it a go and report back

[pluto]

I use the ethernet over powerline things at home and they work ok. They are rated to 500Mbps but I actually only get about 40Mbps, still plenty fast enough for my crappy internet anyway...

I use these ones: https://www.jbhifi.com.au/computers-tablets/networking/d-link/d-link-powerline-av500-passthrough-network-starter-kit/579107/

[julianh72]

I have used the Jaycar Power Line Ethernet Adaptors (Cat.No: YN8352), and they work fine, with coverage across our whole house. The specs say they are good for 300 metres, but our house isn't quite big enough to test it out!

Note however - our house is on 3-phase power, and they only work reliably when both adaptors are on the same phase.

[GUS.K]

Long term, best to replace the standard Cat 6 cable with external Gel filled Cat 6 Cable to avoid future water ingress issues. The outer jacket insulation on standard indoor Cat 6 is pourous and is not designed to be run external or underground in conduits.

[Somnium]

Purchased, connected and working. I was worried that it wouldn't work given that the obs is on a different circuit breaker but it seems fine. I will probably do a more perm fix to the cat6 but that will require a serious undertaking.

[silv]

water IN a cable, enough to form a puddle?
where is that cable exactly, just out of interest? in the wall? in a channel along the wall?
for the water to seep into the cable, it must come from somewhere. are you not concerned that there is a bigger problem hiding somewhere?

[Somnium]

yeah i am concerned about it. i am almost certain that water has gotten into the conduit and it is being drawn up by the capillary action to the end . the cable goes almost directly from the wall plate into the ground and then up to the house.

[issdaol]

How far is the obs away from the house?

If it's only a few hundred meters it's very easy to do a pretty secure bridged wireless connection.

[Somnium]

it is only 20 mtrs but the powerline ethernet seems to be working really well

[Bart]

I'm seriously intrigued by these ethernet over power devices. Are they wireless to pick up signal to transfer? Can some one give me a brief "why is it so"?

[Somnium]

Essentially they use the power lines in your house as a network cable, really interesting stuff. You plug one in a power point near the router and plug a cable from the router to the plug then another at the end you want the Internet and it just works ... Witch craft

[The_bluester]

I tried a pair once between our house and shed but the distance claims are more than a little optimistic. Our link was maybe 70M by wire length and it would just barely hang together and the throughput was rubbish. I had the same problem with WiFi links using various different bits of gear. Throughput was so patchy that I could not reliably play music from a server in the house and an IP phone system kept falling over.

I put in a conduit between house and shed late last year and temporarily used CAT5 cable which has kept the network going and made it reliable but it is not outdoor rated so eventually it is likely to do something similar with moisture. I plan to replace it with a fibre link, but I have to finish a room build in the house and move our networking rack before I am going to do that.

I am thinking about just using a normal singlemode patch cord to a through connector at both ends, they are cheap as chips and if a mouse eats it or it gets damaged then it is also cheap as chips to replace. And if 10Gig connection speed gains any value it will just be a matter of replacing a $30 format converter at both ends.

[silv]

- ah, and probably unprotected by an extra pipe around it?

glad that Ethernet over power works! Madchic!

[Bart]

Thanks. Interesting stuff! :)

[issdaol]

Wireless technology has come a long way.......If you just go into the shops and by the standard WIFI router then you will have spotty connection, although some of them are pretty good nowadays.

However there are other WIFI options and antennas that essentially just act as a wireless bridge between 2 normal wireless basestations that will give a very good reliable signal over several hundred meters without needing to spend ridiculous amounts of money.

[Shano592]

Interesting... so these should then work with dedicated IP phones then, no?

I am thinking of the inevitable loss of the copper lines at work to the NBN...

[Shano592]

Aidan, is the Cat6 in Class12 or above conduit?

I believe that this is a minimum standard for moisture blocking. A sparky can tell me otherwise.

I wonder if it is a condensation issue.

Aaaaaand the segue...

On a side note. We were having all sorts of grief at home with the Telstra line. A month ago, the techie admitted to finding a fault in the pit, and that all was good...

First internet, then dial tone dropped off, and 2 weeks later a new techie is out. He did his test probe thing, and determined that the issue was in the pit. Imagine my surprise.

I wandered down to the road with him, and the little black thing that holds the lines, was completely underwater. The entire pit was full to the top. "No problem," he says. "This thing is waterproof, as long as the last guy sealed it properly."

He unscrewed it, and about a litre of water fell into his lap. "There's your problem," I said, as I walked off.

They still haven't offered any compensation for the downtime.

Now that the NBN is available. I think I'll make a move away from the big T-urkey.

[The_bluester]

Working in the comms industry I would say that trying to keep water out of conduits is a fairly fruitless exercise particularly if there are any pits involved, they may as well be connected to the stormwater system!

I have not looked recently but I imagine mine is full of water by now. I put in a P2 pit where my conduit ends at my shed so that when I finally build my obs I can extend the conduit out to it from the pit and have a ready built comms pipe to extend the fibre through. Along with a separate power conduit to extend 240V out there too. If the pit and some of the conduit is not full of water by now with the rain we have had I will be very surprised. I will just have to do what the Telco workers all do. Pump it out and get on with it.

[Somnium]

It is in the Bunnings class conduit ... So no idea



That is probably true , the powerline network is actually working really well so I might just stick with it