50% SHO + 50% HOO Tarantula

[Slawomir]

Hi all.

I think I finally got enough data to finish this photo.

Currently presenting a SHO version. Not entirely sure about the colours, so will certainly get back to this data at some point.

Circa 10 hours per filter (all 3nm Astrodons).

The image is here: http://www.astrobin.com/full/233037/G/
Full resolution for closer inspection: http://cdn.astrobin.com/images/thumbs/95f4f8610dfe09f8a30f0c1255b2be64.16 536x16536_q100_watermark_watermark_ opacity-3_watermark_position-6_watermark_text-Copyright%20Slawomir%20Lipinski.jpg


All comments will be highly valued.

Thank you for looking.
S.

P.S. My attempt at NGC 2070 from last year: http://www.astrobin.com/full/141358/F/

[strongmanmike]

Awesome! :eyepop: enjoyed that! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: (they are How good is that!? laughs)

The only thing I am thinking may make it look even better is if you can just get the stars to be more RGB'ish or even white'ish rather than red it would be good.

EDIT: Here Slaw, have one of these :prey2:

Mike

[RickS]

Very cool, Suavi! Straight 10s from me too :thumbsup:

If you do star removal for the colour data (and process luminance separately) you'll get clean white stars. You were planning RGB stars for this one anyway, weren't you?

Cheers,
Rick.

[multiweb]

That's good! Took me a few seconds to find the spider. Your best to date and one of the best NB shots I've seen of this area. Epic. :bowdown:

[Placidus]

Majestic.

[Atmos]

That looks absolutely spectacular!

[Slawomir]

Thank you Michael, Rick, Marc, Mike and Trish and Colin for your very kind feedback and comments. In terms of length of exposure, this is certainly my largest project to date :)

I have toned down star colour a bit (great suggestion!), but as Rick mentioned, eventually I would like to try adding RGB stars. Actually I found it quite tricky to create a perfect star mask that would cover all stars, plus I went wild with manipulating colour curves, that's probably why stars had strong colour :painting:

[IanP]

WOW! ... enjoyed that very much :thumbsup:

[rustigsmed]

Wow! Great spider suavi! Looking awesome!!

Russ

[Slawomir]

Glad you like it Ian :)



Thank you Russell :)

[alpal]

Hi Slawomir,
That is the wildest Tarantula I've ever seen.
I like the colours & everything about it.
Maybe you could add RGB stars but the picture stands as it is.
That would look nice if you made a large print & put it on the wall.

cheers
Allan

[prokyon]

Wow, what a stunning picture! Great work!! :thumbsup:

[Andy01]

Certainly has impact Slaw! Big & Bold for sure. :cool3:

I wonder though, is it just me or is the core is toned down too much as it's hard to guage where the light is coming from so it's looking a bit HDR as a result... and yes, as mentioned above those star colours need to be RGB imo.

Amazing details, clearly it's spider season atm :)

[Slawomir]

Glad you like it Allan. Yes, I went wild with this one LOL...and RGB stars will happen probably early next year.



Thank you Werner :)



Thanks Andy. My main goal was to show faint bits, so I struggled and partially failed to maintain 3D effect. I assure you though, no HDR has been applied in processing of this image :)

Edit: Following your advice I redid the luminance: http://cdn.astrobin.com/images/thumbs/a5ad08e40923ac389fef450095651f01.18 24x0_q100_watermark_watermark_opaci ty-3_watermark_position-6_watermark_text-Copyright%20Slawomir%20Lipinski.jpg

[Andy01]

That's so much better imo Slaw :thumbsup:
It's my understanding of a David Malin thing, "Respecting the Light" as he called it, when he addressed us at the CWAS Astrofest this year.
He was very specific about how the Tarantula looks, and the core should be bright.

Also, the colours are a lot more appealing to my eye in the new version as well - One for next year's Malin awards perhaps?

[strongmanmike]

Yeah hard to say which looks better really but I think I actually like the first version as it looks a tad more natural :shrug:

As for this whole "respecting the light" palava... I know what it's all about and the idea is sound in some respects but it's not gospel, just one blokes opinion really. Presenting the Tarantula with a blown out core just because David Malin seems to suggest that's how it should look is well just crazy in my opinion. There is detail to be seen in there, so lets see it :shrug:. As long as it doesn't look like there is a dark hole in the middle of the neb and you can pull it off as a graduated effect you can maintain the depth and see the detail, Steven Mohr's DM entry (https://www.flickr.com/photos/105968790@N03/15899760221/sizes/o/)is a classic example of perhaps the best rendition of the Tarantula going and it is not blown out. The same skill becomes useful with M42 as well.

Mike

[Slawomir]

Thank you Michael and Andy for your suggestions and feedback. I think I need to leave it for a week or two and get back to it to see destination more clearly :)

Anyway, here are the versions I have constructed so far:

The original with whiter stars: http://www.astrobin.com/full/233037/B/

Brighter version: http://www.astrobin.com/full/233037/C/

Going blue...:http://www.astrobin.com/full/233037/D/

And the last one: http://www.astrobin.com/full/233037/E/

Thank you for looking :hi:

[Atmos]

Prefer the original over the brighter but I don't mind the blue :)

[gregbradley]

Some interesting colour schemes there Slawomir but I do prefer the original. It has more colour depth, punch and contrast.

One there almost looks like a polarised image.

Greg.

[Andy01]

Mike, Slaw - David was directing his comments about "respecting the light" specifically to that image of Steve's by example, which in his opinion, was not bright enough in the core to show where the light was coming from.
He then showed us what he though it should look like!

Subjective? Yes.
Authoritative? Definitely.
Offensive? Probably! :shrug:

I still prefer version two ;)

[Bassnut]

Wow, thats excellent Slaw, its a "messy" area hard to look right, the colour balance is well done and appropriate.

[Slawomir]

Thank you all very much for your comments and feedback, I mean it.

I could not rest until I was not relatively satisfied with the image, so I took on-board all advices, blended them and also followed my gut feeling limited by my skills in using software, but eventually I arrived approximately where I wanted to. RGB stars will follow one day.

Thank you again for your patience, we are up to version F :lol:

Large version: http://www.astrobin.com/full/233037/F/
Full resolution: http://cdn.astrobin.com/images/thumbs/65927e8ad6deee6eaa8cecbbbe9176d4.16 536x16536_q100_watermark_watermark_ opacity-3_watermark_position-6_watermark_text-Copyright%20Slawomir%20Lipinski.jpg

Sincerely
S.

I think my next project will be of a DSO with less wild dynamic range...

[Atmos]

Very punchy👍

[TR]

This respecting the light is a ridiculous statement and extraordinarily dated. We have instruments and techniques that allow us to see into these areas. While walking in a forest, our eyes can see the bright areas and dim areas of that scene. To capture this requires a different approach, and allows our display devices which have limited dynamic range to render that wonderful scene for us to enjoy…

Painting images whenever wacky colour is - yeah, respecting the light I guess... Continually pulling that term out of the air is so grating and hypocritical. Processing our images is simply not respecting the light. We change it. Supress noise, enhance structure, we process the image. I am happy not to respect the light, and enjoy trying to dig out details like many Astro photographers. The idea of just stopping at a saturated blown image is ridiculous. Really, who wants to look at an image that has blown highlights? We don’t do this for terrestrial images.

Paul’s latest image of NGC 1097 is a failure according to this wacky criteria. Sorry Paul, I really enjoyed looking at the details you managed to extract in the core, but it broke the cardinal rule. You tried to make an interesting image, and you simply did not respect the light. In fact, Paul’s previous award by all rights should be a failure according to this construct. Yet, somehow it won. Again, I enjoyed looking at what Paul was trying to accomplish. He was trying to reveal structures. Allowing us to see the faint, and the bright stuff at the same time. Adding a bit of punch to an image. It’s amazing how this rule or statement is simply pulled out of one’s favoured or unfavoured orifice when it suits. Just be honest.

Stepping off my soap box now.

Terry

Not respecting the light…..

[Andy01]

Forgive me Slaw, but rather than continue to hack your thread, I've started a new one on the topic of "Respecting the Light" here...

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/showthread.php?p=1220628#post122062 8

Keep the passionate debate going there folks :)

[strongmanmike]

Great stuff Suavi that's the name of the game, you go at it as much as you like, good to see people enjoying this wonderfully eclectic hobby of ours, it is a very cool looking piece of work...but not sure which one I like best now :question: :thumbsup:

... and Terry, you make perfect sense :)

"pulled out of ones favoured or unfavoured orifice" really?...very poetic :)

Mike

[Stevec35]

A very well executed shot Slawomir! Almost too much detail there to get your head around.

Steve

[AG Hybrid]

That's brilliant! You should be very proud of your work.

[vlazg]

Stunning image Slawomir, something to aim for

[Slawomir]

Thanks Colin, it certainly turned out a bit different :)



Thanks Mike, yeah...I think I am becoming increasingly addicted to this hobby... :lol:



I know what you mean Steve! But my goal was to show as much as possible with my 4" doublet. Glad you like it though :)



Thanks Adrian! Pride however, is a ticket to the dark side of the force...;)




Thank you George, happy that you like it.

[Paul Haese]

An interesting interpretation Slawomir of the data. Not sure I like the flat look to the core but it's your image. Interesting colours too. I am still collecting data on my image of the same target.

Terry I wonder why you singled out my images in particular to jump on your soap box? Why not select one of you Mikes, or Marcus's, or Peter Ward's or one the other overall winners. Whilst you have a point, your statements are erroneous too. When looking up towards the bright light in a forest your eyes adjust to reduce the inflow of light but they still show the bright areas and the darks ones too. They don't show everything with the same level of illumination. I think some here actually don't know what David Malin has meant by his comments regarding "respecting the light". Light areas should be light and dark areas should look dark. In each area David does not mean blown or totally dark and it makes sense. David is talking about light and shadow in photography. The light is coming from a bright light source in most of these areas and those stars illuminate the immediate areas and behind those immediate gas and dust areas there is sometimes shadows cast. This is in essence light and shadow. All the detail will look flat if all the image has the same level of illumination. I would recommend a long detailed discussion with David to get a better understanding of his views. I found my particular conversation with him in 2012 rather interesting.

[topheart]

Interesting image and interesting discussion.

Thanks,
Tim

[Slawomir]

Thank you Paul and Tim.

Honestly, overall I prefer my bicolour version of the Tarantula before I added S2 data to it: http://www.astrobin.com/full/232152/B/?real=&mod=


And I totally agree, in my limited understanding, with what Paul wrote about shadows and light. IMO it adds mysticism and meaning to images.



EDIT: I went for a walk pondering how can I show all three channels in the photo without making it look so wild, and it hit me - try blending bi-colour version (which is more pleasantly balanced) with the wild tri-colour version!

Here is the result: http://www.astrobin.com/full/233037/G/
Full resolution: http://cdn.astrobin.com/images/thumbs/95f4f8610dfe09f8a30f0c1255b2be64.16 536x16536_q100_watermark_watermark_ opacity-3_watermark_position-6_watermark_text-Copyright%20Slawomir%20Lipinski.jpg

So I have got some colour in the core, stars are whitish, faint stuff shows up and there is some degree of respect to the light :)

Thank you all from the bottom of my heart for your feedback and patience - I would not be able to compose this final version without your encouragement and feedback :hi:

[Andy01]

My last twopence worth on this version - if you turn an image (any image) upside down look to where your eye goes first.

It should be going to the hero portion of the image. If it's not then maybe it needs to be lighter there (or other areas darker) to direct the eye to that Hero portion first.

Have fun Slaw, loving your persistance with this :)

[strongmanmike]

Ah huh...first signs of imaging insanity creeping in, watch out :lol:


What ever you do Slaw, please keep smiling and stay happy, this whole game can become too serious and consuming pretty easily :scared: we must always remember we are not running nations here...just making crazy coloured wall art :P :thumbsup:

Mike

[Slawomir]

Thank you Andy and Mike for your comments.

I am satisfied with this version of the Tarantula and already started thinking of my next project, but probably will start working on it after the NYE.

I will leave this photo as is. RGB stars are not necessary IMO, as the image is quite colourful and I actually like whitish stars in this one.

So it's time to dust my fishing gear and to do some damage to local fishing stocks :lol:

:fishing:

[Shiraz]

what a tour-de-force - lovely work and pushing the boundaries of what is possible. well done.

[Slawomir]

Thank you Ray :hi:

I certainly pushed my personal boundaries with this project :lol:

[LucasB]

Beautiful version of the Tarantula Slawomir! You have really excelled with thus image.
Lucas

[Slawomir]

Thank you Lucas :)