Formula Boring

[AndrewJ]

Anyone noticed how boring the new F1 season appears to be????
Mercedes 1 @ 2 with 3rd place 30secs back with 10 laps to go!!!!
Half the field out and very little "racing"
I know F1 is supposed to be more about development than racing
but this has to be the worst race in ages????

Andrew

[FlashDrive]

I turned channels to watch Speed Week ... much better.
Top Fuel Dragsters and Bikes.
One blokes Supercharger Belt broke on a Dragster.... and didn't that pull him up quickly...and then the engine caught fire.

Col....

[04Stefan07]

Not sure what you are watching mate. Today's race was fantastic! In for an interesting season.

Had a good final last 2 corner grand stand ticket for 2 days.

Cheers,
Stefan.

[The Mekon]

Could not agree more Andrew. After just a few laps only 13 cars in the race and all spaced out. F1 holds no interest for me anymore aside from technical developments. The racing IS plain boring.

[BeanerSA]

Yeah, it wasn't bad for the first race of the season.



It's the first race of the season!

[04Stefan07]

That's right Paul it's only the first race!

Silly for users to say it's the worst race.

[ZeroID]

Much more fun watching Holden and Ford taxi racing, at least they bang into things. Lots more smoke and dust and general mayhem.
Formula has just become a car procession.

[glend]

Actually Formula E is much more interesting - they are all electric and the racing is a great development series and hopefully the future of racing. Formua 1 is just making money for Bernie and the drivers, and is so boring.

[AndrewJ]

Gday Stefan
Only 5 cars were on the lead lap at the end and the 5th car was 1-1/2 minutes behind. 3rd and 4th were 30 secs behind the leader.
Thats just a "My technology is better than yours" result.
It was a hi speed game of follow the leader, with very little "racing" to be seen.
For the last part of the TV coverage, they were only showing the battles for 7th vs 8th to try and get something exciting.
Sorry, but as i said, technologically brilliant by Mercedes, but not really racing.

Andrew

[04Stefan07]

Then 2000 - 2004 when Ferrari were dominant and 2010 - 2013 when Red Bull were dominant must have been boring years for you? (as they were in a league of their own!).

Since Mercedes won last year and they are looking great this year I guess it will yield the same result? Formula 1 is more about who the better team is, very different from the V8 Supercars or GP2 where all the cars are the same and it comes down to driver skill.

For any hardcore Formula 1 fans out there we still love the sport, regardless if there is one team who are winning by a mile.

Formula 1 is in my family's blood and been a big part of my life since I was a little kid so I think we see it from a very different perspective.

You either love Formula 1 or you don't.

Bring on Malaysia!

Cheers,
Stefan.

[JB80]

I think I agree, shame it's not as highly publicised but the racing is great. I hope it can grow and I think it will

[Ausrock]

I've watch F1 for longer than can remember and I agree, todays F1 race was pretty ordinary, but as has been pointed out there have been periods of years when similar situations have occurred. That said, I still I still find it more entertaining than our V8 Supercar races......Bathurst is the exception.

[CJ]

I doubt if anyone connected to Sauber found it boring. ;)

[AndrewJ]

Gday Stefan

They may have ended up being dominant, but the "racing" was much better and closer back then in most cases.
How many races then ended with only 5 cars on the lead lap and gaps like we saw yesterday???
I see on the news, some of the drivers even said it was boring and apologised???
Betcha they will be getting a "please explain" from Bernie today.

Andrew

[speach]

I would
be glad if it went from Melbourne. I use to love F1, but it seems to be same old same old every year. Red bull last year, and I wouldn't be surprised merc this year, As I said same old same old. The drivers have great skill in controlling those beast but there has been very little 'racing' in the last few years. It seems to be down to the design of the cars not the skill of the drivers in racing.

[The_bluester]

I have been an F1 fan for a long time but would have to admit that yesterday was certainly not among the most riveting races I have seen.

The problem as I see it is that Mercedes did a better job than anyone else in developing the new power plant and the rules cement that advantage for years to come. It is pretty much what you saw last time around with Honda, they were down on power compared to the rest and so were often relegated to a predictable also ran status as they just got eaten on the straights, and the rules meant then as now that it was very hard to make up the gap.

How depressing would it be to be in a race car, starting each race knowing before hand that all things being equal no matter what you did you would be watching a pair of silver rear wings drive off into the distance?

What it puts me in mind of is the last Bathurst 24 hour race where the 427 Monaros were the only cars that were allowed to be built to that particular spec, they just cruised around at the front of the field and if a safety car brought the rest back up to them (Assuming they had not put a lap on them already, which they had done to most of the field by about a quarter race time) they thumped along for a few laps until everyone else was out of sight again and the turned the wick back down. As a racing fan I find it less than enthralling to think of a full season of that ahead in F1.


I did not find the Ferrari or RBR dominated years particularly riveting either.

[Exfso]

Apparently Red Bull are reall Plssed off with Renault, at present their power plants are 100hp down on the Mercs, which is near double what the diff was last season. I know that they are having mapping issues, but I find it hard to believe that the difference is purely in the mapping. As for reliability, that is really bad news. Riciardo down an engine in the first 5 laps of FP1, only 3 left for the remaining 19 races, I don't think so:eyepop: they are in more crud than the first settlers at present, only marginally better than McLaren.

Update: Just read that the possibility even exists that Red Bull could pull out of F1 altogether if something is not done about the Engine Regs. Article here for information:

http://en.espnf1.com/redbull/motorsport/story/194819.html

[barx1963]

Why are we surprised that cars going in circles is not riveting viewing??
Sorry, I struggle to think of a less interesting sporting event than an F1 race, except any other form of motorsport :D

Malcolm

[glend]

Did anyone else notice the dry ice blowers used in the garage to cool the hot brakes? I'd like to get my hands on one of those for a camera cooler. I can't find anything on the net about them.

[torana68]

a lot of people think the same of astronomy, due to knowing nothing about it and never having tried it :)

[barx1963]

True, but I don't watch people doing astronomy and not many people get to try F1!!:P

Malcolm

[torana68]

so try Formula Ford , you can do a drive day, try a hillclimb, you might like it.
Other than the business before the Court that race was as exciting as watching someone doing Astronomy. Im not sure it will get better till things within F1 change.

[clive milne]

Check out Formula E.
They have put all the practice sessions, qualifying and races online,
free, on demand, via youtube in high definition, with a total of 20 seconds of advertising per event.
The wheel to wheel racing is in a different league
(better) than F1.

To be fair however, there are some areas where formula 1 is more impressive than formula E...
The raw power can be felt as a visceral auditory experience.
They are much faster and have a longer range.
There is kudos and glamour (Formula E use tents for pit garages for example)

Come to think of it... by the above metric, I should just go and watch A330's take off from Perth airport. They tick all the same boxes but are slightly more exciting, in as much as the the finishing order is not quite as predictable.

[clive milne]

On a slightly serious note....
I have been a passionate fan of F1 for close on 30 years.
The last year or two however has left me feeling cold towards it.
I could handle Schumacher (unsporting little pratt that he was) winning ad-nausium, or Vettel (with his galling sense of entitlement) being gifted championships beyond his ability. But there is something particularly unwholesome about the current state of affairs in F1. Speaking from the perspective of a Lewis Hamilton fan, I am not pleased at hollow and contrived the competition has become.
When Red Bull were dominating, was there so much as a month that went by without the rules being changed for the purpose of reigning in Adrian Newey's technical brilliance?
Now we have a situation where one technology supplier (Mercedes) has a technical advantage and the rules have been structured to the effect of preventing the competition from addressing the deficit over a period of years. Could you imagine what would have happened to F1 if the rules pertaining to aero had allowed a team to put cars on the grid with a blown or double diffuser and no-one else was allowed to adjust their cars to catch up? Well, the Mercedes engine is a bigger advantage than that.
It is farcical, and boring.
It certainly isn't racing, and I am not sure I can be bothered waiting another year or two for the rest of the grid to be given permission to compete.

[The_bluester]

I am in much the same position. It does stand out that in recent years rules were changed in season to reign in advantages that some teams had created, often more than once. As things stand the rules look like cementing a daylight gap between one engine supplier and the others for a period of years.

I am no great fan of "Parity" formulas but some element of Mario Kart style "Rubber banding" where the ones with the biggest disadvantage are given opportunity to catch up a bit needs to exist. Who apart from Mercedes fans would want to watch three, four, five years of the rules ensuring that Mercedes romp off into the distance and a minor scuffle breaks out half a lap behind them to see who gets to stand on the bottom step of the podium?

Quite apart from hoping to see an Australian lift the big cup, I did not find much sport in the RBR dominance, and even that was patchy. It was pretty obvious that the car was aerodynamically brilliant over a period of years, but very sensitive to disturbed airflow so if you were not out the front romping away you had no huge advantage over the next comers. Just look at the couple of times Vettel was not in his customary "out in the clear" position and looked like he was sulking in the mid field, unable to get up to cars he would normally be streaking away from.

Regardless of the fact that Mercedes did an undeniably brilliant job of the power unit and did a better job than the others over the break on updates something needs to change when even a decades long die hard like me can't be bothered staying up to watch.

[Exfso]

As the link in my previous post states, there is a possibility that Red Bull will pull out of F1 and this decision could be made as early as the northern summer. If this happened, F1 would really be in the crap as they require, I think a minimum of 16 cars to form a F1 grid. If Red Bull pulls out that is 4 less, as Toro Rosso is part of Red Bull. Mr Ecclestone could find his castle falling down big time. In any case I believe that 2 teams less as would be the case if RB leaves, would be the end of F1. I cannot see Sauber and FI being able to keep afloat either, they are really teetering as it stands now.
Yes people are saying that it is just RB and sour grapes, but when they were at the top of their game, it was not due to engines, it was due to a magical chassis and being able to come up with changes that stretched the regs. Others soon followed or F1 banned the changes. In either case other teams were able to make changes to catch up or the whole change was banned. It was then up to the other teams to catch up with RB and their innovations. But as it stands. it is purely an engine issue, that sees MB so clear. They obviously have a great chassis as well. All things being equal power wise, a lot of the other teams would would be much closer to the front. It is obvious that Ferrari have improved their power unit and so it should considering the backing it has. But in a 58 lap race they were still 37 secs from the nearest MB, that does no enhance the viewing in my opinion. The racing mid field was far better to watch.
I am not mentioning drivers here, because in my opinion, the grid has at least 4 world champions in various cars, so they are all pretty well equal in their ability to pilot a F1 car around the circuits. Yes some are bettere than others, but most definitely not by the times that are showing up. F1 has always had its share of "mobile chicanes" who are in it purely because they have come up with funding and their abilities are not up to scratch, or F1 teams who are really struggling cannot afford to pay what the high end drivers are demanding. (I believe Vettel is getting a Million per race, with probably bonuses for wins and podiums)

In my opinion F1 has lost the plot and unless they allow teams to improve their power units instead of this Bloody ridiculous token scheme they have come up with, it will rapidly decline to the point that it will cease to exist.

Another interesting article: http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/194903.html

[AndrewJ]

I recon it would be more fun to put all the F1 drivers into "Aussie Racing cars" and see how they go. Be fun to see em going 4 wide round some of the bends :-)

Andrew

[The_bluester]

Actually, having watched the ARC wasps going around Albert Park a few years back that would be great to see.

When a grizzly old race driver (Brad Jones from memory and only a couple of years back) drives one and simply states when he gets out "I HAVE to have one of these" and promptly back it up by buying one I think it says it all.

[Steffen]

I don't understand this sort of whinging, especially after just one race. Mercedes made their investment, put in the research and hard work, and came up with a brilliant car – why should they not be allowed to reap the fruits of their labour? Are you advocation Formula Mediocre? If anything makes a field like this boring then it's the other teams with their sub-par cars. They're the ones that need to get their act together.

As for the gloom and doom prediction for the F1, this situation has existed before, remember for example the years when Schumacher in his Ferrari was simply unstoppable. Other teams eventually caught up, and the field became more even again. The same will happen here.

But this whole notion that Mercedes ought be chastised for making the Formula 1 boring by having a better car is pure nonsense.

I wonder whether this thread would exist if Ricciardo was driving a Mercedes...

Cheers
Steffen.

[04Stefan07]

Well said mate I totally agree with you.

This was the point I was trying to make earlier. Just look at the dominance of Ferrari and Red Bull in recent years. It's up to the other teams to get their act together. You should have seen what Toto Wolffe said about the other teams and he was 100% correct.

This is what Formula 1 is all about. It seems people have forgotten what F1 really is. If they want to see close racing then they should go watch Touring Cars or GP2.

Also good point about Ricciardo. This thread wouldn't have existed if he was driving for Mercedes. I don't like how the media put so much pressure on Australian drivers especially the supporters. There was a social pole that said Ricciardo had a 20% chance of winning the race haha. Clearly people have no clue on what's going and have no passion but that's a whole other discussion.

Cheers,
Stefan.

[The_bluester]

I disagree to a point.

Saying "Make your car faster" is simplistic in the extreme. Mercedes the constructor have done a great job on their car, if it was a complete pig that only worked in a straight line then they would likely not dominate, but it is far easier to make a fast car faster than a slow car fast, just look at McLaren over the last couple of years.

What I have a problem with in a "Just get on with it" sentiment is that the engine advantage is written into the rules, with the limited development rules and eventual almost complete freeze of engines in a couple of years time it is very unlikely that the others will catch up.

When it was a minor disadvantage as Renault historically had in the later years of the V8 engines, an otherwise great car could overcome it. The RBR cars tended to get eaten on straights but carried such corner speed that they were still competitive over a lap at most tracks. Make the deficit into the now rumored 100hp and they may as well be driving around with a spark plug disconnected, and the rules mean it will probably stay that way for years.

The in season rule changes to clip the wings of RBR, Ferrari and others over the years are pretty well documented, why is this any different?

All in all I dislike parity categories (I have not watched Bathurst in 20 years) but the prospect of spending the next couple of years seeing two silver cars romping away out the front and lapping everyone up to about fifth place does not thrill me and make me want to stay up late to watch.

[yoda776]

Personally, I think watching a formula one race where two cars are so far out in front they can have a pit stop, take a whiz and get back in the car and still be out in front is boring. It would be great if the cars were all the same and it was down to team strategies and driver skill. Not saying the drivers do not have the skills, but you have some great drivers here where their cars just pale in comparison.

It al,Ost seems like Sebastian Vettel moved from red bull at the right time when Ferrari are picking up, but even their car is no match for the leaders.

Add the fact what was it ... 11 cars bombed out for one reason or the other and it was a particularly inspiring race. Not sure I have seen more retirements other than Monaco where you practically had enough cars for podium spots!

Mind you I am more so not happy about the fact half the races are on free to air anyway and pay tv for the others. :mad2:

[AndrewJ]

Gday Matt

I gotta disagree there.
F1 is much more of a development class, and there are plenty of other classes that use more "identical" cars.
I think the problem currently comes from the rules not allowing teams to catch up as required due to trying to keep costs down.

Andrew

[Exfso]

They certainly are not having much luck keeping teams afloat, Marussia gone, Caterham gone, both Force India and Sauber in financial difficulties. It appears as though the teams that have the biggest financial background are most definitely at the top of the ladder here and those who are falling by the wayside are those who cannot afford the inherant costs of running a F1 team. Obviously Mercedes and Ferrari have huge financial reserves, even Williams were at one stage rumoured to have a few financial woes. Red Bull are backed by a billionaire of course, having said that I believe that Renault do not have the type of automotive resources that both Merc and Ferrari have. Their (renault), engines have always been lacking the grunt, but their cars made up for it with the damn fine aero and package setups. This was shown in the season 2013 when the Renault engined cars were something in the order of 20kph slower in the speed traps compared to the other engine manufacturers cars. But they handled like they were on rails and this enabled them to overcome the power difference. Not so now, F1 have hamstrung any stretching of the regs, which by the way all teams did. And now it is almost purely revolving around engine development, here money speaks. The brilliant Adrian Newey has decided that F1 are making it all to hard for intuitive designers to do their thing and that is why he has stepped back from F1.

Just my 2 bob's worth:shrug:

[The_bluester]

It really does seem that money talks. About the only time which has looked like an exception has not really even been that much of an exception.

When Brawn hit the scene as a "New" team they had a rocketship of a car with a good engine (Mercedes, installed at the 11th hour when the team was "Saved" but in reality most of the car development had been done before Honda pulled the pin on F1. Would the car have walked away with the title that year with Honda power, who knows.

(They were down the pecking order engines wise and then as now the rules pretty much meant they would stay there, part of the reason I suspect they pulled the pin, who as a manufacturer would want to remain if all you could see was a continuing disadvantage)

[Kal]

Exactly how I feel, although 25 year fan watching almost every race, and supporting the Aussie racers Webber and now Ricciardo instead of Hamilton :)

The regulation changes really seem to restrict other teams from catching up through the season, so if round 1 was boring, the rest of the season will be as well. The only thing that will keep it barely interesting is if Rosberg and Hamilton get stuck into a good fight again.

[clive milne]

It would seem that the Mercedes F1 & Australian cricket team swapped mojos this weekend.

[The_bluester]

Dunno, after a long time paying we cancelled a Foxtel sub about two years ago due to it having become acres of advertising supported dross, no way on earth we will be handing over $600 per year to see the F1 races that Ten have handed over to Foxtel.

Between that master stroke and the likely silver streak of another year or two (Yesterdays result notwithstanding) I might just go see some real racing and watch some Formula Ford