On the Cheap

[FlashDrive]

Has this ever happened to you .... I'll bet it has.

Lets say you bought an expensive Astro' item ... could be an eyepiece, maybe a top quality Scope, or similar ' top shelf ' brand of gear.

You might decide to sell for one reason or another within a reasonable time frame ... lets say ... within 6 months.

Your ( item ) or items still retain good resale value because of the quality , brand , and could be a sought after item on the second hand market for those who could not afford paying ' new price '.

So.... you find out the current new price so to get some sort of an idea what yours ' is truthfully ' worth. ( any reasonable person would agree to this line of approach to gauge a selling price ).

You have an item you bought new... $2000.00....you put it up for sale at $1500.00 ( a $500.00 saving on new price )...gear is as good as it was the day you bought it.... you've only had it a short time.

......then you get a message ... can I have it for a $1000.00...!!

Another example .....you sell an eyepiece....' top shelf ' to... but you get a message asking to have it ' way below' what it is considered a reasonable asking price.

Would any of you who had an $5000.00 Scope in excellent condition ... sell it off for $2,500.00 ..... I doubt it.... well I wouldn't think so...would you...?

People who send messages wanting ' top shelf ' gear .. or gear that is quite expensive.... and then ask if they can ( or offer ) a much lower price , I find is rather ' not in good taste ' .

They want the ' good gear ' without paying a good and fair price.

This old ' adage ' about... things are generally sold at half price holds some truth when selling ' generic ' items....I'll go along with that.

Finally ..... you've have a $80,000 Mercedes ... had it for 6 months .... in showroom condition, low klm's, full servicing ...still has dealership warranty.......your offered $40,000 ....would you sell it .....NOT ME.

I think I've made my point.....price can be negotiable ... but TO A POINT.

Flash .....

[BeanerSA]

I disagree. Almost no pre-owned items have good resale anymore. You choose to buy something new with your cash, you choose to take the massive depreciative hit when you walk out the door.

[acropolite]

I've also had the experience of being offered ridiculous amounts for sale items, I find it cheeky, but not really offensive, that's the nature of buy and sell.

Personally, I'd never offer an unrealistic amount, although I've seen items in the Icetrade offered at well under their realistic value, some way above their value sometimes even more expensive than current buy prices.

[FlashDrive]

Ahhhh, ( that's the difference between you and me ) .... I don't ' choose ' to take a massive hit on the value of my items.
You'll only end up broke if you do that enough times.

You'll end up with NOTHING.....

I doubt if anyone on this site is a ' charity ' and wants empty pockets....

Very poor business sense if you go down that road ....IMHO

Col....

[Kunama]

I agree with you completely Col. I don't look at IceInSpace as a business opportunity to scalp friends of their hard earned dollars.
As you know Col, I have spent an enormous amount of money here over the years, mostly because I prefer to buy something and 'see for myself' rather than rely on others to review things for me.

I have always paid a fair price, usually the full asking price+postage, as I see fellow IIS'ers as friends rather than business opportunities. I think there is a reasonable expectation within a community such as this that people interact in a fair way. Those that cannot perhaps should use eBay instead, where it is fully 'caveat emptor'.

So do I get pissed off when I get ridiculously low offers for items I have kept in immaculate condition ........... you betcha !!!! this ain't Gumtree ....

Some people fail to remember that by their low-ball offers they are also devaluing their own items....... I personally will not buy items from people who have tried to 'low-ball' me. Karma can be a *****.

[Kunama]

This statement could come back to haunt one, should one ever decide to sell one's astro inventory ;);) One can probably already guess what offers one would get.

[The Mekon]

Worse is when "wanted" ads are posted and the person wanting the item is not willing to pay the market price.
Perhaps we ought to have a special thread "Wanted to buy at 20% of market value"

[UniPol]

It's all to do with the WTP vs WTA theory.

[LewisM]

There is a used TSA-120 on a certain Australian astronomy trading website selling for SUBSTANTIALLY MORE than it costs new... now there is a bargain :) (yes, it includes SOME extras, but not $2000 worth!)

[casstony]

Want To Purchase VS Want To Annoy?

[FlashDrive]

:rofl::rofl::rofl: ... oh so very true ...

If there was a ' like ' button here, I would have ' hit ' it a thousand times.

Love your humor Tony....:D

Col.....

[Solanum]

I find this post somewhat offensive.

I made an offer of $120 (inc postage, which would be under $8, I checked) on an item that costs $209 new and, for all I know, could be ten years old as the age is not stated in your advert. However well looked after something is, it still ages I'm afraid (a downside of photosynthesis).

The only reason people buy second hand items is because the are cheaper than new items. Get over it, astro gear isn't an investment opportunity.

I'm currently selling some stuff, all of it in perfect condition and all at half-price or less, because I'd rather get rid of it and someone enjoy using than 'make money'. I wrote off the investment when I bought the items.

I will be selling my Dob with Argo Navis and will want more than half-price for that, but that was a rather larger investment and, even at more than half price, will still offer a substantial saving over buying the gear new.

Everard

[astroron]

I'm one of those people who just say No if they offer me a lower price than I want or consider it is worth.
Then just move right on along.
No worries.
Cheers:thumbsup:

[Kunama]

Retail value $8500 and unused, not too bad !
You could offer $5k and see what happens :D (the Devil made me suggest that... )

[OICURMT]

I don't think anyone disagrees with you on this... investments appreciate in value.

The fundamental issue is that items which are more along line of specialized gear tend to depreciate more slowly than a enmasse produced consumer items. Items in the "scientific" category probably even less, as the availability of second-hand items are much less than say a used car. Condition of the item is the most important thing for me... age, secondary, save coatings, which tend to age.

In reality, if we were to follow general accounting rules, all of our items would have a book value of ZERO in seven years...

On that note, would everyone please send me ALL of your Astrogear that is older than seven years. I'll pay the postage so you are not out anything.

Shipping address to follow... :P
OIC!

[OICURMT]

Perusing through your ads, I can tell you that if you sell something I'm after, I'll take it. Looks like your equipment is well kept and hey... you're LOCAL!

OIC!

[Solanum]

Actually 'scientific' gear is basically worthless the moment it's bought. I am a scientist by trade and work for a 'major Australian scientific agency' and sadly can assure you that is the case, or my funding applications could be a fair bit less!

[Solanum]

Looking at your list of gear and mine, it is very unlikely I'll ever be selling anything you want!!! :) Certainly am local though!

[FlashDrive]

Goodness me .... your name is not even mentioned in this thread..... whats your problem.
Give it a rest .... if you can't afford the asking price .... THEN GO WITHOUT.

... these are words that you sent to me in your message ..... and I quote

..' the pricier it is the higher proportion I would expect second hand.' ... you put yourself in now..!! ( TeleVue gear is not cheap ..... one only has to look at Bintel prices lately to know that )

Col....

[LewisM]

OK, but can I sell you the included TV EP's and Pelican case for $2000? :) you know you WANT them.

[sharkbite]

At the risk of copping flak for making light of this...


http://www.montypython.net/scripts/LOB-hagglescene.php


Precis: If you are haggling properly you should offer half as first bid....
(well for beards, anyway)

[rrussell1962]

I don't want to step on any toes here but I can see a difference between "Price X negotiable" and "Price X" meaning that is what I am willing to accept, take it or leave it. Having said that I have made an offer for something lower than the asking price, but messaged explaining my reasons and giving example of recent sales etc.

[N1]

I'm very conscious that good gear comes at a price, so I avoid ridiculous low-balling. Having said that - when I see litte interest from others in an item that is beyond much own reach but does interest me, I will give the seller a heads-up & let them know what my budget would allow. Do I know how bad they want to sell? Do I know whether they care what the item would fetch under "lab" market conditions that might never occur? Does anybody know how many others besides me even want the item once it's been up there and has met little or no interest? No, no and no. Too many factors at play here. So it's all about communication.

Sure, a figure I can offer for a given item might not necessarily be a good representation of what the item might fetch given enough time, or a big enough market, or enough appreciation for workmanship etc. Quite often, few or none of these conditions are present (the Australian/NZ astro market isn't exactly huge), and as a seller, I would appreciate hearing about any intrested buyers, even if what they are prepared to pay might seem low to some. I'd like to make that call myself rather than preclude offers from being made in the first place. What I do expect is that communication is polite and courteous.

[FlashDrive]

I had a gentleman offer a price on my JMI Focuser... nearly close to my asking price.

I considered this and ' met him half way ' in regards to his offer...I let it go for a reasonable reduction in price.... without me ' giving it away '

I'm happy and he is happy because he was given an opportunity to receive this item at a proper and fair price within my asking price.

And that is my whole point in this thread ......

Col.....

[N1]

Flash, BTW your avatar is the best I've seen in a long time! (And yes, this post is perhaps only slighly more relevant than what she is typing) :rofl:

[Solanum]

1) What I can and can't afford is irrelevant here, it is what I am prepared to pay (and what you are prepared to accept) that is important.

2) My point was that my offer was not derisory (I don't think anyone here would think it was), but that did not stop you making a public post on the matter as a direct result of my offer (irrespective of whether I was named or not).

3) I prefaced my offer with an acknowledgement that it was below your asking price and that you were unlikely to accept it if you could meet your asking price within a reasonable time frame. This was not trying to get something 'on the cheap' it was acknowledging that your valuation and mine differed.

4) Posting quotes from private messages is not very good form in my book, not that I have anything to hide, before I saw this post I thought we were having a good natured exchange.

As a result of all this I can assure you that I will never be interested in purchasing anything from you irrespective of the price. Sorry.

Everard

[FlashDrive]

Thanks N1 ... yes..I stumbled upon it recently and thought how funny it was.

Cheers ...Col.

[FlashDrive]

That's fine ...I'm OK with that ... I won't be affected one bit .
BTW ... your name was not even mentioned here ...and in general it was not even aimed at you....I had others who went in below you on price for the same items. ( that's what made me put ' pen to paper ' so to speak.
You have really jumped the gun on this one...... think before you speak .... and yes we were having a ' civil ' conversation via messages....
Let it go, because it appears you have got yourself all bitter and twisted over this..... no offense was ever intended toward you.

It's just a shame that you jumped in and took it upon yourself to be ' offended ' , and self inflicted at that..!!

Hope you have clear skies tonight.

Col....

[LewisM]

I'll offer you $120.05 for whatever it is Col ('cos I have NO CLUE what you are selling).

All joking aside, I have dealt a LOT with Col - usually driving down to either meet in person or drop money in a secure pre-arranged place for him. Never been an issue once, and we always came to a mutually agreeable price. If I didn't like the price (which was only once), I'll just say so and walk away from it.But then again, I am not much of haggler - I usually ask directly what someone is comfortable with, and we take it from there.

Our latest transactions were $2000 on a scope (Takahashi) and $150 on some parts - the price on the retail market for the parts alone that I bought was in excess of $450.

[brian nordstrom]

:question: I like Lewis here have got lots of gear ( I mean truck loads :lol:) of gear from Flash and the prices I payed were all mutually agreeable to us both , goods arrived in described condition in a timely manor , I for one wont hesitate to buy or sell to my old mate Colin :hi:in the future .

On a side note I have made probably over 200 transactions here at IIS classifieds and have only had one :eyepop: bad one , that was nothing to do with price /condition of said item but the buyer expected something to be thrown into the deal that was never discussed once in the transaction communications , then he had the cheek :shrug:to publically bag me in the threads here , I was shocked !!! , no PM or anything first , just wading in with all guns blazing , gladly the Mods did there usual top job in deleting the thread before I lost it with this strange guy ? .

ps. %99 of my astro gear is from IIS classifieds , a great tool , so thank you to all I have dealt with over the years , saved me a small fortune ;) .

Brian.

[OICURMT]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u75XQdTxZRc

[CockneyNutjob]

Lol, best thread I've seen for weeks!

[Zaps]

Seller goes high, buyer goes low.

[FlashDrive]

:lol:... that way.. buyer gets nothing...!! :D

Flash....;)

[barx1963]

Personally, it never bothers me if low balls a price at me, I've done the same thing if I cannot afford the price they are asking but it is a piece of gear that I would like. After all there is no such things a "proper and fair price", only prices that 2 people (ie the buyer and the seller) think they can accept.

If I have a piece of gear that I want to sell I will quite often advertise it at a deliberately high price, you never know there may be someone out there who is desperate for just that bit of gear. If I get no bites I can choose to cut the price or withdraw.

If I think my piece of gear is worth $600 and now one else is willing to pay that, then my opinion that $600 is a "proper and fair price" doesn't mean diddly squat, and if I am not prepared to sell it for less than that then I have no option but to not sell it. Getting upset about low ball offers is really a pointless exercise and a good way to damage relationships.

Malcolm

[FlashDrive]

Everything is for sale at a price ...I've even seen it myself.

Someone places an AD ... and says ... ' Price is Firm ' ....indicating that is what it will take to buy it.

Someone places an AD ..and says $ blah blah ... ONO ... indicating ' lets haggle ' if you want this item.

Offering ' low ball ' ( fully knowing ) that the offer is totally ridiculous is in my view ' bad taste ' and reeks of bad integrity of that person.

These individuals are only out to try and see if one is ' gullible ' to their antics and are at best, nothing but ' vultures ' looking for a quick score.

Read the words above ... ' fully knowing ' ...that's my point.

Cop it enough times and you get real sick of it.

Flash.....

[BPO]

There's not much point taking any of it personally. A guy recently offered me NZ$800 for a new mount (still sealed in the boxes) I was selling with an asking price of NZ$2,500! He told me "that's all it's worth" even though the after market accessories alone were worth more than his offer. I just laughed and saluted his cheek. :lol:

BTW, the mount sold to someone else for NZ$2,500...

[Kunama]

If I was selling something on ZeBay, Humtree or the local classifieds I too would have no problem with ridiculously low offers but when one sells within a small group, a club or a community such as this one expects a little more courtesy in such dealings.................. maybe the "One" is just old fashioned and not of this "me Me Me !!! generation"

"One" will continue to make fair offers to others within the community that is IIS. :hi:

[FlashDrive]

Spot on Matti .....:thumbsup:

[BPO]

It was via a local astro Yahoo! group.


Maybe, but I just view it in the spirit of "you'll never know if you don't try."

:)


Then again, maybe the guy genuinely believed his offer to be a fair one? Who knows. He wasn't successful this time, but maybe next time someone will bite.

;)

[Profiler]

I had an interesting experience - I received a lower offer which I decided to turn down and then got a hostile follow-up that my asking price was unreasonable - it was obvious I was dealing with a petulant type who was bitter he couldn't get things his way - a week later I was vindicated in my decision to turn down the offer as another member bought the item no questions/problem at my full asking price.

[Solanum]

You know, I was actually going to reply to this and apologise for jumping in with two feet.



And then I noticed that you had edited the message from this (as per my email notification):



I am sure you can argue that the disparity between the two responses and the obvious implications (my emphasis above) was not intended, but as we both know the majority of what was in the post that you started this thread with (including the example about half value) was in fact based on our private conversation, and the thread was posted immediately afterwards, so the initial response rings more true to me.

I did jump into this thread with two feet and I wish I hadn't, but I was actually somewhat upset (yes, upset, not "bitter and twisted") that you would have a cordial conversation with me privately and then use that same conversation to complain about people wasting your time with exploitative offers.

It may well be that you have had plenty of those (I see you have sold a lot of stuff, so I imagine that is so), but I do not see how you can class our own interaction in the same way (the details are here for anyone to see), which was honest, not unreasonable and in no way an attempt to get something "on the cheap".

At any rate, I have no intention of continuing this further and I apologise to the other readers for continuing such a petty spat, I should know better by my age! ;)

Everard

[FlashDrive]

You just don't get it ...do you.

You decided to ' CLAIM ' I was talking about you ( that's obvious ) .... so I stated that fact it wasn't .... you jumped right in and 'ASSUMED ' I was referring to you.
I will say it again ..... your name or any of our message conversation were NOT mentioned in this thread ANYWHERE......you decided to ' blabber ' on ( WITHOUT A CLEAR HEAD ) saying you were offended ..... why.....where did I implicate you in this thread

At the risk of bringing into play the other 2 members who ' low balled ' me ( even lower than you )...I was not about to drag them into this either... as this was why I started this thread.

and yes .... you were silly enough to jump in and ' identify ' yourself as one who offered me a low price ... but I kindly said no in our messages.

Your ASSUMPTIONS have only got you ' offside ' by your own consequences of ' reading ' into this thread that I was referring to you.

Think clearly before making any comments that show a lack of sense.

Accept that fact and move on..... because I am.

Mods ... you may lock this thread... I hope I have made myself clear enough...!!

[mr bruess]

I've also had the experience of being offered ridiculously low amounts for some of my items,and I find it a bit offensive,even angry sometimes but i end up ignoring those people.
There is always clowns who will give you low ball offers.

[tlgerdes]

I'll buy that for a dollar!

[CockneyNutjob]

A dollar! Don't be ridiculous, it clearly says $5, so I'll only drop to $3.

[casstony]

I've got $2 burning a hole in my pocket!

Does the mount come with that?

[OICURMT]

This thread has offcially reached its "use by" date...

[GrahamL]

three pages back for me ;)

[FlashDrive]

Yeah ... lets close this off Mod's.

Col....

[Eden]

Sorry Col, but I find this post to be 'not in good taste'.

I respect the fact that good quality astronomy gear retains a high proportion of it's retail value when looked after.

However, if someone makes you an offer on an item you're selling and you don't like it, politely decline and move on. That's all that needs to happen.

Taking offense to it and ranting about it on the forum is unproductive, whether you explicitly name the person(s) involved or not. You might argue that you weren't offended, but your choice of words here suggests otherwise.

[bobson]

Col,

You posted here "Private Message" there is a reason its called "Private"

I cant believe moderators allowed you to do that??

Good luck to you!