What scope do I get ... The "It depends what you want to look at" reply...

[g__day]

I see this a bit here, someone asks a basic question, usually about what their first or second telescope should be and inevitably a good samaritan throws out the "well it depends on what you want to look at reply". but then often waits for the uninformed newcomer to say something other than stars and stuff, or timidly ask "Er, well what's out there to choose from?".

I thought maybe we could expand on all that. If folk realised there are specific things to look at, and that some scope perform on these better than others they could judge what to buy for themselves.

For instance a list that says, key things to look at include:

1. Sun - through very special scopes or with special Sun filters
2. Planets - although only Jupiter, Saturn and Mars (and our moon) are likely to resolve surface detail and give you a wow factor
3. Open nebulae, emission nebulae, galactic clusters

Cause here's where advice become more helpful.

If you want to see a bright cluster of stars like the Plediades or M7 a short tube good quality refractor like an ED80 will be excellent

If you want to resolve planets surface detail, a large apperature, good skies and fairly high magnification will be appericated - so a 8" or larger Dob, or newtonian or a smaller SCT or MAK will be choice two.

If you want to observer faint objects with alot of detail - like the Omega Cluster - then both aperature and steadiness of mount will be important, as will contrast. A motorised sturdy mount will make any seeing more observable, but then you have to weight light gathering (aperature) vs contrast achieved (telescope design eg. refractor vs larger newtonian, SCT, DOB or MAK).

Astro imaging - then the above but now add you're goin to be spending as much if not more on your mount (possibly 2:1) ratio as your optical tube and then added to this is PC, imaging software, auto-guiders and expensive CCDs or cameras or video gear.

What would be the views of the community on the ideal advice on educating a new user what there was to choose seeing from and which scope will achieve this best?

[Lee]

I think most newcomers at the "which scope" stage will say "stars and stuff" when asked!
A real factor in the early scope decision should be the size of the scope - even after using an 8" for a year, I was still taken aback when seeing a 12" Dob for the first time.

[mick pinner]

in the past the usual response to the what scope does a newbie buy was buy a dob and this response was reinforced over and over again.
now let me say before dob owners jump on me that l have nothing against dobs from what l gather by the talk and obviously the posted photos taken through these scopes that they are optically dollar per inch of aperture quite good.
in more than a few cases the newbie dob owner deceides that he or she wants to try this astrophotography thing only to be then informed that apart from a few bright objects this is practically impossible with the scope they have.
my point is that a newbie needs more information when asking the inevitable telescope question, if a few of you think it may help l will do an article covering some basic and affordable entry level scopes say up to $8000 listing they're ability to view particular objects and the suitability of each scope and mount for astrophotography.
l am by no means an expert on astronomical equipment but a simple guide may help some of the new members narrow down their requirments before asking more specific questions.

[janoskiss]

I don't think there is much point asking a first scope buyer what they want to look at. But there is for a second, third scope buyer with some observing experience.

[Lee]

If you want to get into astrophotography - then the initial cost of a Dob will soon pale into insignificance anyway!
I still vote for a Dob for a first timer.

[iceman]

It would be great, Mick.

The question needs to be asked of newbies "what do you want to look at", but as it's been pointed, they don't usually know.. or, they think they just want to "observe", but shortly into the hobby they decide they want to do astrophotography. That's a whole nother ball game.

The best advice we can usually give is to get to a local starparty or observing group, and look through some scopes before making the decision. When they see the size of a dob, or what's involved in setting up an SCT, and the views through both, they can make a more informed decision.

It's true there's a dob brigade that recommends them to newbies, but to my mind, they are still without a doubt the best value for money when it comes to entry level aperture, affordability, size and convenience. The 8" dob is just an awesome starter scope - as long as you don't want to do astrophotography with it a month later :)

[ving]

yup a sticky article on what scope to buy (considering budget) would be great :)

[mickoking]

I concur :thumbsup:

[g__day]

Mick,

I reckon that's a great offer, as this sort of article is sorely needed. As folk mentioned there are two discrete levels of experience to cater for here 1) folk totally new to astronomy and 2) those planning their second, third or fourth scope.

For the first time buyers their desires and budgets probably can be satisfied by large binoculars, and/or either say a 8”+ Dob’s or a 8” Netwonian on a sturdy equatorial mount. You can probably get quite an outcome on a budget certainly not exceeding say $1,500. But regardless you need to know what you can look at, consider your budget, calibre and location of preferred viewing site and hence travel, set-up and breakdown times. In this price range and likely level of experience one may say astro-imaging is right out. Personally I’d agree that large binoculars and a stand, plus visits to star parties are a great way to start.

Now to the second category I mentioned. As an example my optical tube journey has gone 3” refractor -> bino’s 7 * 50, 10 * 50, 15 * 70 and 20 * 80s, then a 6” Newtonian, followed by a 5” Mak on equ3-2, to which I added motors, then moved this OTA onto a CG5- gotomount. Next I added a second hand 80mm Megrez in piggyback configuration, and just last week I ordered a C9.25 CF XLT OTA to replace the 5” MAK which has been brilliant up to now. Now that’s a financial walk covering 35+ years, with most of the purchase steps happening in the last 18 months. And its nowhere near finished. The next major upgrade in say 18 months will likely be a mount in the $5,000 -> $7,500 range (Takashi, Vixen Atlux (yes), Losmandy G11 with Gemini or Celestron CGE), then add a high-end CCD or Digital camera. Now if I go any further well then you’re into the financial realms of guys like strongmanmike. I guess at this point you're pondering 6” apo’s and/or 12" + RC's sitting nicely on a Software Bisque Paramount ME or atsrophysics or giant Meade or mountain Instruments type high end mount; leaving little change from $18,000. I ponder if you’re thinking of a $30+ K set-up, maybe you’d be better to timeshare on a automated remote site with some mates…

So there is definitely need for a guide for folk considering their second, third, fourth scope. People hoping from the $300, to the $1,500 to the $3,000 probably aren’t too hard to advise. People getting ready to enter the $5,000 - $7,500 range for the first time have a lot to consider. For these folk the choices appear complex.

[janoskiss]

If someone has that much cash to put into a scope, then :P to them. Let them figure it out for themselves or they can pay someone to do it! :rofl:

[ving]

here here steve :lol:

by that stage they probably know enough about scopes to make up thier own mind anyhow :)

i think this needs to be targeted at beginners.

[Starkler]

Me too !

Even a raw newbie who "thinks" they want to jump straight into astrophotography may very well change their mind when they find out what is involved to do it well.


An 8 to 10 inch dob gives enough aperture to be satisfying and is cheap enough to not hurt too much if they subsequently find they arent really that interested or want to try another scope later. A $6000 sct is another story and probably much harder to recover costs on.

[jjjnettie]

No matter what scope is bought by the Newbie, it will be useless to them unless they take the time to do a bit of reading and learn the basics first.

[Shawn]

Something I put together


http://www.ravenshoe.net/olinksFrameset-1.htm.

Good advice

[Shawn]

Thats the One Mike

Use others first, personally I looked at all sorts before I decided to go the whole hog, not everyones cup of tea tho, It calls for significant input, sometimes I wish I could throw the dob in the car go somewhere,

Horses for courses..

S

[g__day]

That's a pretty good overview of how telescopes work. The only negative is it only very lightly covers what different types of objects there are to see though! A few pictures of what the various objects look like, and there relative numbers, before the mention of what scope goes best with viewing what objects might be a great addition.

Some other suggestions for your site:

1. Its been well proven that white font on black background is alot harder for the human eye / brain to read than the reverse. Also maybe add a few paragraph breaks.

2. All your telescope links point to the same webpage, so maybe only 1 is needed

3. The font on the telescope optics link is a bit too small

Finally a definition of what there is to view will help deciding on what scope is most useful, and the section on mounts could be expanded.

Its a very good start.

PS

When folk retire - if they're not into expensive sports or shares or travel or if they simply have a winfall of cash then they might just wnat to splurge. More money then sense as my grandma used to say - but perhaps they know that and wish to rapidly gain knowledge to focus their budgeted spend before their wife appropriates it on a fur coat or a hairdo or expensive painting etc :)

[Shawn]

Good Idea. Thanks g_day

["O"]

Hi,

Here is a view from a complete newbie.

I didn't find any problem searching the net for info on how a scope works and what to look for in a scope and which type is best suited for what I want to look at.

I've attended night viewing and looked at different scope and have an idea of what I would like.

But then, I find advice on specific model hard to come by. The above statement is exactly what I find most useful. "ED80".

May be if there is a listing of a few generally accepted/popular models for each type of a scope ( Dob/refractor/Mak/SCT), it would give a newbie some idea.

Thanks,
"O"

[[1ponders]]

You can always throw you Dobbie onto an EQ mount if you want to move into astrophotography. ;)