Watanabe blade.

[clive milne]

Every now and then you come across something so good it redefines your view on a subject.
Watanabe knives fit that description imho.

I have been using Wustoff Classics for the last 20 years and have maintained the edges with an edge pro sharpener, so that is a reasonable benchmark for comparison.

The Wustoff is to Watanabe what a Volkswagon is to an Aston Martin. The Wustoff is typical of high end German kitchen knives... heavy forged blades made from stainless steel with a fairly obtuse angle. There is no point decreasing the cutting edge angle or sharpening to a scalpel edge because the steel (with a rockwell hardness number of 56-58) simply isn't hard enough.
The pro series Watanabe blades are hand made by a sixth generation blade smith from a family heritage dating back to the age of the Samuri. The blades are a sandwich of Hitachi YSS (Yasuki specialty steel) encased in a stainless sheath. The cutting edge has a rockwell hardness number of 65-66, meaning it about 4x the hardness of your best German kitchen knives.

I can tell you that if you start with an equal level of sharpness, then after a period of use long enough to reduce the Wustoff to little better than a butter knife, the Watanabe is still sharp enough to shave your arm hair.

The best bit is that because you are buying direcrtly from the blade smith, they are no more expensive than Henkells, Global, Wustoff et al, priced at your local kitchen warehouse. http://www.kitchen-knife.jp/pro/petite.htm

[Baddad]

Wow!:)

I found the Wustoff to be the best since 1973. Only the Felix (Soligen)was equal. I hand sharpen our knives and I have a bald spot on my left wrist where I test the sharpness.
Several other knives have been okay but nothing compares to the Felix and Wustoff.

I must try this brand you have introduced. I use several different methods to sharpen. everything from stones of varying grits to diamond stones and Japanese soft wet stones.

I began to notice new Japanese knives some 10 years ago. I never did much research on those. Now I feel I need to.

Cheers and thanks Clive:):)

[LewisM]

I was a chef for 8 years to help pay for myflying training. I used Wustoff Trident exclusively, shunning the Globals, Mundials and Victorinox.

I still have my 30 cm Wustoff. GREAT knife, holds an edge well.

I bought a Japanese Santoku style 3 years ago - I paid all of $5 for it, on MAJOR discount, and I thought it must be crap, but what the hell. Well, it not only holds a razor sharp edge longer than any other knife I have ever used, but it requires sharpening maybe once a month, on a steel only. I was that impressed I bought 3 more, which are still in their cases!!! Wife won't touch them - she's scared of them! (another excuse she stays out of the kitchen :) )

I have tried some of the exotic Japanese crafted knives, and they are simply divine - no pressure required, maximum control, perfect balance. Cost keeps me away for now, but they are around the same cost as my Wustoff Chef knife.

[clive milne]

Hey, no problem.
It sounds like you are very skilled at sharpening by hand.... way better than me at least. I never bothered to learn. I just use an edge pro professional sharpener.
http://www.edgeproinc.com/About-Us.html
It is an exceptional tool even in unskilled hands such as mine. It allows you to polish with ultra fine diamond loaded strops at perfectly consistent edge angles without rolling the edge at all. To be honest, I have never bothered to take any one of my blades to the last degree with this machine. .. you can get an edge that is scary dangerous just with the fine hones.
Fwiw) the following link is a treasure trove of good info for anyone considering buying a top quality knife:
http://www.zknives.com/knives/kitchen/ktknv/indexjpn.shtml

best
c

[clive milne]

Fwiw) if you are going to buy a Watanabe, be aware that only his pro-line and custom knives are made by him... his standard range is contracted out to other manufacturers. They are still very good but not hand made classics.

[omegacrux]

Nice knives
I use a Lansky sharpener on my Tasco World Class 440 vanadium , my word does it come up sharp it will shave dry !
I like a good knife

David

[LewisM]

Me too David.

I had a custom made folder in my flight bag many years ago. I got comfortable and perhaps lazy around the place, so I left the bag in the car. 6 months no issues... then one night some little cretin smashed the rear quarter, got in, took the bag and my jerry can (empty, so stick that up ya!).

I eventualy got EVERYTHING back - license, log books etc, except the flight bag itself and the knife.

That knife was simply incredible.

These days of course you wouldn't be allowed out on the tarmac with one, but...

[alocky]

Definite glad you posted that Clive! I'm ordering the 6" now. I'm fed up with sharpening the Mundial every week.
Cheers,
Andrew

[LewisM]

Mundials are considered cheap chef starter knives - good choice to ditch it! I HATED using them when I had to - not well made,off balance etc and dull quickly. I hate the solid Globals even more - never could get a decent edge on one except with a diamond steel.

Honestly, Japanese knives are incredible. I don't need a big one any more, but the medium Santoku's are just what I need. I even carve roasts with one, and they have NO issues crushing through bone (for a thin blade, that's impressive!) I have never used a knife so easy for fine julienne in my life - absolute breeze, no slip-cleaving etc.

[clive milne]

I have owned a Lansky for near on 15 years now and just recently upgraded to an edgepro. I found the Lansky clamp uncomfortable in the hands after a while. Another issue with the Lansky is that the cutting angle is not consistent across the length of the blade. The edgepro stones are true wet stones (as opposed to oiled) and have 4x the surface area, meaning you can do a knife in 1/4 of the time (in theory anyway).
Most importantly though, when you take a knife to a specific grit size on both of these sharpeners, the knife done by the edgepro is noticeably finer and can be taken a deal further (to light sabre territory) if you are prepared to go through the polishing tape stages. There is a level of sharpness you can attain with the edgepro that you simply cannot approach with the Lansky irrespective of the amount of time you spend.
if you are a knife nutter then the edgepro is something worth considering.

[clive milne]

Andrew... you wont be disappointed.
Just one user caution though, the inner core is an alloy designed for cutting performance as opposed to corrosion resistance. The cutting edge will develop a patina in a matter of weeks (which looks cool) but obviously it is not advisable to leave a knife like this on the cutting block coated in tomato juice or whatever. It is good practice to simply wipe dry and put in a place too high for the cherubs to reach after every use.

[clive milne]

Yep, I just don't understand the logic behind Globals.... the alloy balance is just plain stupid. 18% chrome guarantees you excellent corrosion resistance but no toughness and mediocre hardness. They're a triumph of marketing over science. Probably one of the worst mass marketed Japanese knives ever produced pretending to be a quality product... The Bose of knives.

[omegacrux]

How sharp ?
It was so sharp even the shadow cut !

I'll have a look into those Clive you are correct about the lansky

David

[clive milne]

Attached is a couple of pics that some of you might find interesting...
You can see where the bevel angle changes on the Mundial blade (in the background) it is about 1mm away from the cutting edge.

The Watanabe (in front) shows two transitions across the width of the blade. The first one (4mm in from the edge, where it goes from gloss to matte) delineates the point where the high carbon steel is exposed from underneath the softer stainless protective outer layers. The second one (at the tip of my thumb) shows how far up the blade the primary bevel angle extends up the blade... probably 15mm, as opposed to 1mm for the Mundial. That should give you a clue how fine an edge is put on a Watanabe blade and implicitly, the mastery of metallurgy required to achieve it.
It's a case of scalpel versus block splitter.

http://i371.photobucket.com/albums/oo158/clivemilne/Photoon2014-05-08at1701.jpg

The second image shows the patina that develops on the high carbon steel core on the older (lower knife) over a couple of months, it turns a dark bluish grey. The upper knife has never been used and still has a mirror finish. The lower knife (though discoloured) is almost equally sharp after several months use.

http://i371.photobucket.com/albums/oo158/clivemilne/Photoon2014-05-08at1657.jpg

I have been as succinct as I know how but still feel that my written words fall quite short of what is required.
All I can suggest is either read this last post through twice or try one.

best
c