iPhone Geiger counter

[David Niven]

I am going for a holiday in Japan but is worried about radiation exposure.
It seem, according to the US media, the Japanese authority there is grossly under reporting the Fukushima nuclear disaster.
So I am thinking of buying one of these device, to take along.
Has anyone bought and use one of these iPhone add on that turn it into a Geiger counter?

http://www.radiation-watch.org/p/english.html

Would like to hear from any user out there, as to it's effectiveness.

[Wavytone]

Relax.

Unless you intend to spend considerable time (i.e. live there) in the immediate vicinity of the reactor I suggest you are worrying about nothing. The reactor isn't exactly a tourist hotspot.

There's a lot of FUD spread about this. As with cities nearby Chernobyl, which suffered a far worse leakage of radioactivity.

Plenty of people have chest X-rays and CT scans with no ill effects, and your exposure will be far lower than that.

[rat156]

Yes, unless you're planning on suiting up and scrubbing reactor walls, you'll probably get more radiation exposure from the plane trip over there.

I have an iPhone geiger counter, it just clicks randomly until you tilt it.

The best (and perhaps only) defence against radiation exposure is distance, rad levels drop off at the square of the distance.

Cheers
Stuart

[David Niven]

Well, I have no plan to travel near the Fukushima disaster but there are a lot of reports on the massive cover up and the fact that, millions of gallon of radioactive water were discharged and continue to be discharged into the ocean without any regard whatsoever.
My main concern is the sea food. Anyway, I have put in a purchase.
As they say, better to know and avoid then to be sorry.

[David Niven]

My concern has heighten, since reading this article,
http://kyotoradiation.blogspot.com.au/p/is-it-safe-to-visit-kyoto.html

I mean, how can you avoid eating radioactive contaminated foods there unless you bring along your own supply of Mars and Uncle Toby yogurt bars?

[noeyedeer]

Chernobyl isn't pumping hundreds of tonnes of radioactive waste per day into the pacific ocean either ...

maybe their jellyfish blooms will love it and clog their fishing nets even more than before

matt

motherboard.vice.com/blog/expect-fukushimas-radioactive-ocean-plume-to-hit-the-us-next-year

we are kinda lucky that ocean currents are not north to south. I'm sure the roll on effect will happen within the wild animals that eat fish .. including seals and polar bears. as for humans that i don't care much about

[KenGee]

when you're there try to get bitten by a spider and watch out for Godzilla !

[noeyedeer]

honestly just buy a Geiger counter. I wouldn't trust an app on a phone to measure radiation accurately .. when apparently the phone produces radiation.

matt

[tlgerdes]

I have spent a couple of weeks in Tokyo in the last 2 years. Now that my ears glow at night, my wife says I've never looked better, and I save on power bills by not having to run night lights to go to the bathroom.

Plus, when out on the observing field I'm easier to find.

[Barrykgerdes]

Some things that no one tells you about exposure to neuclear radiation, exposure to RF radiation.and even asbestos dust

All these forms of exposure can damage body cells in rather large doses. This can lead to these cell being distorted which often leads to cancer.

However the bodies natural repair mechanism (better than any doctors) identifies the rogue cells and replaces them with good cells.

If your bodies repair mechanism is under performing due to all sorts of abuse you may develop cancer with small cell damage but if you are fit you are more likely to be killed by other means than radiation.

Barry

[Marios]

Your fears are well placed the disaster in Japan was bigger than chenobol made so by the fact that spent plutonium and Uranium rods were stored in the outer layer compartments in pools of cooling liquid. When the outer containment's blew there tops they sent 100's of kilograms of highly deadly elements into the atmosphere and sea. Why Plutonium these reactors we designed to burn weapons grade material after American and Soviets agreed on a nuclear arms reduction program.

Reports of radioactive elements such a radioactive cesium in the food supply are common.
I would suggest not to go at all. if you must there are supplements such potasuim iodide you cant take to protect the most vulnerable part of the body the thyroid gland.

Dr. Helen Caldicott: The Medical Implications of Fukushima, Nuclear Power and Nuclear Proliferation http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hTuqy6RpFQ



http://emergency.cdc.gov/radiation/ki.asp

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/22/world/asia/wary-japanese-take-food-safety-into-their-own-hands.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

[David Niven]

The iphone geiger counter is develop by a couple of Japanese Uni and some private companies and calibrated by a dutch meteorology institute. See my first link at the start.
The Japanese civilian no longer trust their own government information and so started their own radiation watch monitoring.
I am not so worried about air borne radiation, more about the food there!
Pot iodide salt is a good idea, thks

[TheoP]

I suggest that you watch the documentary "Pandora's Promise". It's available on Itunes:

https://itunes.apple.com/au/movie/pandoras-promise/id675188533

There is so much disinformation being spread about nuclear power that you have to do a bit of independent reading to see what is going on. Sure, Fukoshima was a very serious accident based on a very old nuclear reactor design that was built on a fault line and then the tsunami took out the cooling system.

Monitoring the radioactivity levels from a Geiger counter means nothing unless you know what it means and what the normal safe levels are. Radioactivity is everywhere, some places have natural radioactivity that is much higher than what you will find close to Fukoshima.

Please use your good judgement before you believe everything you hear from doubtful sources.....

[Amaranthus]

You will get far more radiation exposure on the flight over to Japan (due to slightly increased exposure to cosmic rays) than you'll get once you are there, even if you chose to camp IN the abandoned Fukushima prefecture! As Theo said, the level of misinformation on this issue that has been spread to the public by professional anti-nuclear fear mongers is breathtaking.

As for Helen Caldicott's credibility, have a read of this -- quite astounding:
http://www.monbiot.com/2011/04/04/evidence-meltdown/
http://www.monbiot.com/2011/04/04/correspondence-with-helen-caldicott/
http://www.monbiot.com/2011/04/04/interrogation-of-helen-caldicotts-responses/

[Barrykgerdes]

You will live longer if you put the iphone in your pocket and only use it as a phone when there is no danger from lack of attention to your surroundings.

I think you will find that there are more people killed by inattention to their surroundings due to playing with iphones, ipads, itunes etc. forgetting to take care, than people in Japan being harmed by radiation levels.

Barry

[David Niven]

If their own citizens are concerned enough to start their own radiation watch, common sense will imply that there is some concern indeed!
Anyway I have decidef to buy the iphone gadget, as the info available about it is good.
It seem spots mesasures as high as 1.4 micro siervets vs the average background reading of .11 or 14x higher!

[killswitch]

While Fukushima is not over yet and still struggling to this day. I would just carry a basic geiger counter. Its good to be vigilant especially to something you cant see. Just don't get caught up in a mass hysteria. Id be more worried about earthquakes, tsunamis and gojira.

That said, you need a very sensitive geiger counter to pick up trace amounts found on food and water. Most on the market wont even pick up the radioactive K in bananas. Also the japanese radiation standards for food is much stricter now.

If your interested in a basic and compact geiger count, have a look at the MightyOhm geiger counter. I built one for fun to test lenses and old crap in the garage.

[Marios]

"Just don't get caught up in a mass hysteria"

Facebook is full of Japanese people complaing of radiation sickeness and beign ignored by there government. More like mass denial by the politicians.!

[TheoP]

rem: USA unit for radiation dose absorbed by the body
Sievert (Sv): Metric system unit of radiation dose absorbed by the body


1 Sievert = 100 Rem
1 mSv = 100 millirem


1 x chest xray = 0.04 mSv = 4 millirem
1 x mammogram = 0.3 mSv = 30 millirem
Annual cosmic radiation from living at sea level = 0.24 MSv = 24 millirem
Annual living in Denver, USA = 0.5 mSv = 50 millirem
Level of radiation dosage that could cause some symptoms of radiation poisoning = 500 mSv = 50 rem
50% of people who received a 4,500 mSv dose (450 rem) at Hiroshima died of radiation poisoning.
Average annual natural background radiation in USA is 2.6 mSv (260 millirem).

Source:
MITnews www.web.mit.edu/newsoffice/1994/safe-0105.html
MITnews www.web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2011/explained-radioactivity-0328.html

Spot reading of 1.4 micro Sievert = 0.0014 mSv = 0.00014 rem. This radiation level is NOT something that one should worry about.

The fact that a Geiger counter can measure a certain level does not mean that it is dangerous. Its like measuring your car's speed in mm/hour to make sure you do not exceed the speed limit. If you are driving at 1000 mm/h and increase your speed a thousand times you are still only going at 1 km/h.

[killswitch]

....thats exactly what mass hysteria is.

[David Niven]

14 micro siervst x 24x 7=2352 micro siervat or 2.35 milli siervat per week
Or roughly 1 Xray per week.
Scarly, if you are domicile there, 50 Xrays per year!

As I am there for 2 weeks, 2 Xrays equivalent is ok, I suppose

[Astro_Bot]

Just to correct the maths and an assumption ...

The 1.4 (not 14) microSieverts/hr spot reading would add up to 1.4 x 24 x 7 = 235.2 microSieverts/week, i.e you're out by a factor of 10.

But readings were "as high as" 1.4 microsieverts/hr and would have been lower on average. Even if that were the average, your total additional exposure over a fortnight would be ~470 microSieverts, so not so much.

BTW, even if you stood still at the hot spot, and the radiation stayed at that level all the time, and you stayed there for a year, you'd only receive an additional ~12 milliSieverts, which is approximately twice the USA background exposure rate (6.24 mSv/yr).

[MickS]

David,

There would be no reason to worry about the radiation; the smog blowing over from China is probably a bigger health risk than the miniscule increase in radiation. Enjoy your trip to Japan :)

[David Niven]

Just came across this article from a US Radio talk show...and it is scary!
http://www.turnerradionetwork.com/news/146-mjt

It gives you no peace of mind.

[Amaranthus]

David, do you want to listen to scare merchants, or scientists on this matter? You can always find someone willing to try and scare you out of your wits. Or you can apply the scientific method -- which is, after all, what all astronomy/optics is also based upon!

Take a look at this latest paper on radiation-risk levels in Japan, just out in PNAS:
http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2014/02/19/1315684111

[David Niven]

I will trust the information coming from the USA instead of those from Japan.
There is a lot of comments that the radiation levels has been very much under quoted, especially by the Japanese government.

[Intergage]

Nothing to worry about AT ALL. However, I have built one of these: https://sites.google.com/site/diygeigercounter/

It was heaps of fun to build and do things too.. Just wish it worked haha. I have no experience with this type of stuff when I attempted it.. :P

[tonybarry]

I'm interested in the subject, and work with ionizing radiation as part of my job. I wear a "film badge" (really a thermoluminescent detector (TLD)) at work, it's required by law.

I obtained a real (calibrated) geiger counter and took it on a plane trip, Sydney to Melbourne.

On the tarmac at Sydney, 0.08 microSieverts per hour.
At 16000 ft over Kosciusko, 6.5 microSieverts per hour, spiking to 9 occasionally.

Is this a problem ? Well, you need about 0.5 Sieverts in a short time (say a day) to get close to acute radiation sickness. That's 100,000 times more than on the flight to Melbourne. Some people can tolerate more than 0.5 Sv before getting sick.

Your chance of cancer is assumed to increase in a linear manner (from presumed zero) at a rate of 5.5% per Sievert (not milliSievert or microSievert). The average deaths from cancer (pooled) is about 20%, so if you cop a Sievert, you will likely suffer acute but mild radiation sickness and be 5% more likely to die from cancer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiation-induced_cancer

If you are interested in finding out your dose during the trip to Japan, don't get an iPhone device which has not been calibrated. You don't want to scare yourself. You do want to be better informed.

Regards,
Tony Barry

PS Had a look at the iPhone module. Uses a reverse biased diode as a detector, and is good for low levels of radiation. Requires a copper shield of a certain thickness to get the detector to approximate a Sv response (which is basically catering for for biological impact). The engineers have done a nice job on the device, but the detector appears to be quite small and easily saturated. This is not a problem for people taking normal level readings. Putting red dots on maps to indicate high radiation levels might be a bit much though. High in terms of device sensitivity is not the same as biological impact.
TB

[rat156]

PNAS is a very well respected journal, it does not publish biased papers. The paper in question was also reviewed at UCB.
"Edited by Kirk R. Smith, University of California, Berkeley, CA, and approved January 22, 2014 (received for review August 21, 2013)"

The supporting documentation is also available if you cared to look at it.

But by all means buy your iPhone gadget and scare yourself when it goes off.

Cheers
Stuart