PMX ordered, whats different with the software?

[Paul Haese]

This will amuse Ernie no doubt.

I ordered a PMX to go into the roll off roof and handle the duties required in that observatory. The PME will go into the new dome with the RC12.

In regard to the PMX, as part of the deal the SkyX, Tpoint for SkyX and the camera add on are included.

I have avoided doing an upgrade from The Sky6 (you know if it isn't broken don't fix it), but with a new mount coming and free software with it, I might as well transfer the whole system over.

What tips can people recommend to make this a hassle free change over? Is it an easy transfer from one to the other?

I already have The Sky6, MaximDL, Pinpoint, AAG Tpoint mapper (I think this going to be redundant), Tpoint for windows (that will be redundant too) and GSC 1.1 extended.

[frolinmod]

It's not an easy change over for mental reasons mostly. For me it was love/hate for about three months. For what it's worth, I will feel your temporary transition pain with you.

One of the MOST important considerations is that your video card and video card driver have excellent OpenGL support. Download and install the latest video drivers directly from the video card manufacturer. If you have an Intel video card, you may be in for trouble as Intel video cards can be problematic when it comes to OpenGL support.

Don't bother with the software on the CD. Register all your serial numbers (all software serial numbers plus the mount serial number) then download the software from Bisque. You want to download and install the following in the following order:

TheSkyX Professional Edition for Windows Full Installer.
TheSkyX Professional Edition for Windows Latest Update.
TheSkyX Professional Edition for Windows Daily Build.
AllSky Image Link Database. (It's a large download.) No hurry on this one.

Then pop on over to ascom-standards.org and download and install:

ASCOM Platform 6 SP2.
TheSky Controlled Telescope 5.2.12 for TheSkyX.

That way if you prefer, you can not only have TheSkyX use Maxim DL as your camera, but also have Maxim DL control the mount in return too.

Right click on the icon or start menu item and set TheSkyX to "Run as Administrator." Do the same thing for anything that needs to communicate with it.

If you don't already have UCAC4, let me know and I can give you a download link. (It's another large download.) Or get a copy of the UCAC4 DVD from someone down under.

The Camera Add On and Tpoint Add On are contained within the base software and enabled by entering serial numbers. Nice thing about that is that they have no subscription fees associated with them and that they're automatically updated/fixed with TheSkyX updates/fixes.

You can have both TheSky6 and TheSkyX installed at the same time, so don't bother deinstalling TheSky6 or Tpoint for Windows.

If you have CCDSoft and still use it, be sure to go into CCDSoft->File->Preferences and tell it to use TheSkyX instead of TheSky6. You can also have TheSkyX use CCDSoft as your camera if you need to for some reason.

QSI have an X2 driver for their cameras available for download from their website.

You will not need AAG Tpoint Mapper.

You will not want to use GSC with TheSkyX. UCAC4 is far superior. Image Link within TheSkyX works extremely well with UCAC4. The only stellar databases you need enable in TheSkyX are Hipparcos-Tycho (bright stars) and UCAC4 (everything else).

You can bring over your custom horizon file by editing it with a text editor to match the format used by TheSkyX.

You can bring over your Tpoint model by exporting the samples from TheSky6 and importing them in TheSkyX. Then click on supermodel for a better model than you ever had before, particularly if you have a large number of samples.

The #1 distraction people run into is having their orientation changed on them and the need to select Orientation->Celestial Sphere from time to time when that happens. Put a button on your toolbar for that.

Click on Display->Field of View Indicators->Equipment->Update Equipment Database from Web to get the equipment database up-to-date.

Once you have field of view indicators, don't forget to click on the checkbox that ties them to the rotator (if you use one). When you do an image link you can have Tools->Image Link create your field of view indicator to the exact size of your actual field of view rather than the theoretical size.

Click Display menu item and add/remove sidebar tabs to suit. Enable the Chart Settings tab, click on that tab and you have a zillion things to drill down through enable/disable to suit your tastes.

Check out the optional databases in Input->Database Manager. Stuff like Celestrial Equator and Poles, Declination Zero, G2V stars from SIMBAD, etc.

Tools->Preferences->Toolbars->Customize lets you totally customize your toolbars including adding new ones to add buttons for often used actions. You can even run Java scripts from toolbar button clicks.

Click on Telescope->Telescope Setup and you'll see there are actually 12 setups to go through Imaging System (Mount, Focuser, Camera, Dome, Filter Wheel, Rotator, Video Device) and Autoguider (Focuser, Camera, Filter Wheel, Rotator, Video Device).

Don't miss going into Tools->Preferences->Advanced and turning stuff on/off/down/up as desired. So you really want 30fps updates to the screen? Increase the bad pointing sample criterion. Yes, you do want the advanced camera user interface. Etc.

TheSkyX has a zillion features. Even after you think you've explored it all, you'll find more you missed before. Telescope->Tools->Bisque TCS is where all your Paramount specific setup is located, such as setting Southern Hemisphere, checking synchronization history (oops, I didn't realize I accidentally synced but there's the log showing I did and when I did it), setting mount parameters, programming PEC, etc.

If you have and use a LodeStar camera, direct support has just recently been added for it by Richard Wright.

I know the time differences can be problematic, but get your butt on over to the Software Bisque support forum and post questions whenever you have them. Lots and lots of questions are okay! Don't forget to include your TheSkyX version number and build number.

Download "daily builds" religiously. New ones appear frequently and intermittently. They can be backed out when needed if they cause a problem.

[PRejto]

Hi Paul,

I cannot comment too much re a transition to TSX from TS6. When I got my MX everything was new to me and the learning curve was (and still is) pretty steep. T-Point works great as does the polar alignment function. Finally some bugs peculiar to the Southern Hemisphere have been resolved, notably PE measurement and correction, and a reversal of knob issue in adjusting azimuth. The manual is very Northern H. centric thus far.

Perhaps Greg Bradley will respond to this thread. I'm pretty sure he made the transition to TSX from TS6. If I remember correctly it wasn't without some protesting, but I think he is a convert now.

Congrats on the purchase. Hope it all works out smoothly.

Peter

[DavidNg]

Wow, that IS comprehensive, I wish knowing this when first played with my set up. I will save it for future references. Thanks

[Paul Haese]

Thanks Ernie. That is a well detailed and thought out response. Hmmm love hate sounds familiar.

I will have to take a long look at this PMX by the sounds. I had read about the screw issues. I will take that under advisement.

Yep will take a wander around SB forums, always good for a bit of light reading.

I'll let you know if I get stuck. I guess I will do the shake down once it arrives.

[marc4darkskies]

Nothing to add in terms of tips but, by way of a confidence builder, I found the changover to TSX quite easy. It's definitely a feature rich application and it's now also a stable and mature product. The lack of major issues in the support forum is testament to this. I use TSX for everything now, having transitioned to using the camera add-on (no more CCDSoft), the X2 Robofocus driver and @Focus2 (no more FocusMax). Having a one stop shop for mount, dome, camera, guiding, focus, plate solve etc is a boon! CCDAP works beautifully with it too. I guess that makes me a TSX fanboy! :D

Cheers, Marcus

[jase]

Great info. I need more convincing why I should port all functions such as plate solving, camera control, focusing etc over to TSX. I doubt I'd still be able to run in an autonomous manner.

[Peter.M]

HAHAAHHAA, I still have nightmares about holding the torch while Paul had his face buried in the mount checking every little machined out recess!

[PeterM]

Paul, I will have ucac 4 already optimized for skyx and the all sky data image link data at the AAIC conference if you want just bring your USB stick, anyone else can also get it if they want.
SkyX pro is VERY different to SKY6 in many many ways. I think you will love it. As noted you can still run Sky6 on the same PC until you are comfortable, they are independent to each other.
The SkyX also allows you to have the now nearly 600,000 minor planets download whereas (I think) the Sky6 won't load over 500,000.
Almost forgot one nifty feature is you can have whatever skyx features you will use often as icons anywhere and any size on the screen. A 27 inch monitor makes the SkyX even more fun. A fanboy too I guess.

[marc4darkskies]

Wouldn't even try to convince you Jase! :lol: Your recipe is obviously working very well for you anyway. Suffice it to say, I'm doing automated runs now using CCDAP without issue, plate-solving is fast and accurate (I use UCAC4) focussing and guiding is faultless (I'll let my latest 2 images speak for themselves), and camera control is, well, camera control! Bottom line for me is I'm free of the tyranny of dealing with multiple applications to accomplish the one task - astrophotography.

[frolinmod]

That's very kind of you.

In regards to the all-sky image link datafile, please note that SB totally changed the format of that file (for the better) with the last daily build. They eliminated building the datafile yourself for different image scales in favor of having one single pre-built file for all image scales. This datafile is downloaded from SB rather than being built by the user on site. With that last change it appears to work better than ever. Almost as good as the regular image link. :-)

[Paul Haese]

Thanks guys for the input and offers.

Pete, now that was interesting night. Lots of cursing and it all turned out to be a dicky wire.

Marcus, just tell me that the camera add on is capable of adding more than four filters now? I walked away from CCDsoft because of the filter selection limitations. I do have a copy I bought but rarely use. Only for PE.

[frolinmod]

Paul, is 20 filters enough?

[Paul Haese]

Yep Ernie that is more than enough. Crackerjack.

[PeterM]

Yep its the latest 1.7 gig download that I have.
Peter

[Paul Haese]

Wow huge download Peter. Might take you up on that. I'll bring my drive anyway or I will buy one.

[PRejto]

Hi Peter,

I'll be at the AAIC. Might I take you up on your kind offer?

Thanks,

Peter R

[PeterM]

I will be there Saturday and Sunday so no problemo. Note UCAC 4 is about 12 gig and All Sky Image link data about 2 gig. I will have a couple of USB 3 / 2 sticks with them both on and you are welcome to copy from there during the conference. I will have simple instructions for the UCAC 4 installation and for the All Sky Image data just follow SB instructions on the downloads page.
Peter

[Paul Haese]

Hi Ernie,

well major glitch with software download. I got Software Bisque to register my serial numbers prior to delivery via Bintel so I could take a look over the software. I cannot see my numbers on my subscription page (only the ones that are out of date for other software) so when I try to register I get this serial number has already been registered and I cannot download because I get access denied. Urgh what a pain.

I made a post on SB forum about this, until then I am stuck in the water. I wanted to use the installer today but that will no doubt based on previous experience with SB and its forum take many days to sort out.

[Paul Haese]

Good tip, done just that. Michael from Bintel is doing likewise. With any luck it will get sorted soon.

Only one account at SB though. We gave them all the right info about which account it was and what my user name was. Time will tell.

[gregbradley]

I'd think twice about installing the latest daily build. From what I have seen they sometimes go backwards. I'd only install the latest stable version of the software.

Its a big enough learning curve already without aggravation from latest daily build unintended side effects mudding up the learning.

PMX is not that different to PME.

The MAIN thing I would keep an eye on with PMX is never install or take off a scope that is badly unbalanced (ie. before or after you take the heavy camera setup off it) unless the 3 way switch is locked.

If not the axes gears can slip and it makes a horrible grinding sound and that whole adjusting cam thing can need to be done.

Otherwise its much the same as a PME.

Sky X is good in many ways. I prefer the graphics of the Sky 6 personally and find the Sky X graphics messy and hard to setup in comparison. Also the EWSN buttons on top are hard to read in low light on Sky X. But Sky X can control the camera if you wanted without the limitation of only 4 filters like CCDsoft and it has a refined T-Point which is easier to use. If you use CCDSoft you need to change preferences in CCDsoft to Sky X from Sky 6 or back again should you change.
But I believe you use Maxim.
The lots of open boxes on Sky X takes a bit of getting used to. They seem to have followed the Adobe Lightroom approach to graphical interface there. Its fine once you get used to it and know where they have tucked away PEC and bits and pieces (its in the TCS window).

Greg.

[gregbradley]

Perhaps. I have read on more than one occassion though where the latest daily build crashed this or that. I am more interested in system reliability these days and don't really enjoy the constant little bug fixes that inevitably crop up in a complex system. Also often Southern Hemisphere aspects get overlooked as it tends to be northern hemisphere centric software.
It all gets fixed eventually. I wouldn't want to run a software business it seems endless the little bug fixes and changes.

Greg.

[RickS]

That's true, but the margin on software is good (no COGS) and you can charge people a subscription and get recurring revenue from the endless bug fixes and changes :lol:

[Paul Haese]

Or you can sell them a subscription and assign the registration numbers to another person and not do anything about sorting the problem for days on end. Looks like my little issue is being fixed by Daniel Bisque today after sending a small warning about how a review might not look so good on the subject of subscription assignment. I think I made the complaint on Thursday last week and I got asked for the serial numbers today. Not bad going I suppose.:P

[Paul Haese]

Ahh surprise. Nothing done yet regarding my serial numbers. Totally peed off with those idiots. They make great mounts but have no idea about customer service. I am pretty annoyed. It has been over a week since we gave them the serial numbers and I have done that twice and yet no action. MORONS!!!!!

[Logieberra]

Big things happening in house it seems... context perhaps?

http://www.bisque.com/sc/blogs/daniel_bisques_blog/archive/2013/08/16/out-with-the-old-in-with-the-new.aspx

[Paul Haese]

I wake up this morning and still nothing done. I just don't know what to do. It is now 8 days since we asked about this issue. Great service.

[Logieberra]

Hmmmm... odd. Can you post your SB thread/link here? A few of us SB forum members can chime in on your behalf and help to raise awareness.

Otherwise, email Sarah at SB directly. She'll sort you out.

[Paul Haese]

Logan, it has just been all sorted. Michael from Bintel gave them a call again and now I have my numbers registered. Bintel once again provided the service that SB should have. Now on to the process of downloading.

[Logieberra]

Yay :)

[Paul Haese]

Downloaded the full installer last night with the update and the daily build. Followed Ernie's treatise. There is so many great things about SkyX that I cannot begin to list them all. Looking forward to using it, but I think I will still wait a while to translate all the way across. Once the new obs is up and running I will make a full transition. For now I will do plenty of reading and learning.