eq8 is here

[rob288]

Stardrifter,

Was that a skywatcher or celestron catalogue?

Regards

Robert

[ribuck]

It could be roughly the same mount, that has been refined and perhaps built using better materials.

It might account for the long delays to the launch of the EQ8, due to also working on a CGE Pro version of the mount, which may be sharing technology with the EQ8.

It would make sense to share some design components to save on costs, since they are both owned by the same company.

Rich.

[Astro_Bot]

There were rumours of the eariier "EQ7" design being shelved and the EQ8 being "rushed" out in its place, re-using much of the CGE Pro (which is also a Synta product). But perhaps they were just rumours ...

[Merlin66]

Hello....
The CGEPro looks nothing like the EQ8
http://www.celestron.com/astronomy/celestron-cge-pro-mount.html

What am I missing - "Yeah, but it sounds like a Golf..."

[Stardrifter_WA]

Celestron catalogue. I know Celestron and Skywatcher are supposedly different companies, however, the company that produces these brands is Synta Optical Technology, who own several other brands as well.

Cheers Peter

[AstroJunk]

Its a pretty easy pier fit due to the flat base. The manual has the fixing dimentions in it if you plan (like me) to get someone to build it for you. It seems reasonable too to create a collar for the existing pier - I'm beginning to like that idea now you've mentioned it :thumbsup:

[AstroJunk]

If the EQ8 was rushed, I'd hate to see how long it would take them to put something together if they took their time :rofl:

[Stardrifter_WA]

Probably just rumours, as I have heard a couple of differing stories. From what I know, the story appears to be a little more complicated, apparently? I think we will never truly know what the story is, as Synta are not overly forthcoming about such matters. It matters not anyway, as the EQ8 is here now.

Price wise, at $4,300 (BTOW's price) it appears to be great value. I expect that the CGE Pro is probably quite expensive in comparison. Mind you, the old CGE Pro price was such that I would never have considered it anyway, as the price of the Paramount was much more attractive, given the differences. But, that will all change now that our dollar is heading south, as some analysts are predicting it will hit 80 cents, or lower, by years end. Great for exporters, but not so great for those wanting astro gear, never mind the extra costs for fuel to get to your favourite dark sky site. Just hope it doesn't dive to its previous low levels of 47 cents. :sadeyes:

I am just glad I bought my US dollars for my upcoming trip to the US in July/August, as I got an actual exchange rate of 101.8. I bought enough to to pay for the trip and to buy some gear whilst there, so I was lucky I bought it when I did, literally the day before it began to take a dive below parity. The highlight of the trip will be my attending the Stellafane Telescope Makers Conference in August; something I have wanted to do for years and thought with the dollar where it was, it was this year or never. :)

Cheers Peter

[Stardrifter_WA]

That's good to know, thanks. I will be making it myself anyway, as I already have the material, scrounged from a scrap yard for next to nothing. I also have the skills, as a machinist, to make it myself, although I do need to gain access a lathe though.

I am using hydraulic cylinder tube, as it has a nice thick wall, although, I did note that the EQ8 pier has a thick wall anyway.

Cheers Peter

[Tandum]

Ok, I haven't been able to get hold of a 9pin female to make an adapter for my Shoestring usb eq6 eq-dir device so I opened the 9pin plug and tack soldered my rj connector and tail to it.

It works. I connected to the mount using the usb eq-dir device without the handset.

I'm guessing the shoestring eq5 eq-dir device is the one to use on an eq8.

Not sure why my 3.3v bluetooth didn't work but this does.



Quote from skywatcher:

[ntk.thava]

Hi ALl, I have tested running my EQ8 with EQMOD and MaxIm DL. It all works. Only issue I am seeing is while autoguiding where there seem random spikes in the RA and DEC while doing long exposure. I am addressing this issue with the supplier now. WIll keep you all posted.

[pmrid]

My EQ8 finally arrived here today. Thanks to Steve M for keeping the thumb on Tasco and their carriers.
1 day to get from Sydney to brisbane and 6 days to get from Brisbane to me - 80 km away. Gotta love it!!

Thanks for the heads-up on the EQMOD thing Robin. I have an EQ5 EQIR dongle here so I'll give it A whirl later today. Too much excitement for one day. I need to lie down.
Peter

[Tandum]

Pete, apparently the hitech astro and shoestring adapters are known to work at 3.3v. At this stage all others are suspect.

[TrevorW]

Always amazes me how people will spend $5000 on a mount then skimp on matching counter weights :question:

[h0ughy]

well i didnt - i bought an extra two

[pmrid]

The adapter I have is the Shoestring RJ45 to USB version (i.e. it sets up a virtual COM port). What troubles me is that being a USB connection at the PC end, it will be feeding 5 volts (or thereabouts) into that connection. I don't know what sort of power there is in an RS232 connection. Is it the same? I don't think and MBs put out a 3 volt line do they?

Another thing - BALANCE. Has anyone else found this - the 2 motors sit well out on the east side of the mount and have a major impact on balance. Follow the balance instructions with the 2 axes horizontal is fine because the motors are balanced on either side of the RA axis. But as soon as you swing the weight bar off the horizontal position, gravity takes over in a big way. Perhaps this is Synta's way of loading the mount to be a bit east-heavy but the mis-distribution of weight is a lot more than just the usual "little bit east'.

Peter

[Tandum]

Quote from skywatcher:


Also you confuse a 5v dc supply with signalling levels, although these devices just happen to communicate at a 5v ttl level.
Skywatcher claim the mount can handle 5v ttl signalling. The 5v dc powers the electronics in the signalling device.

[TrevorW]

Nice :thumbsup:

[2stroke]

Any PE data to share? Thats what i'am more keen on then anything. No point in having a sweet payload capacity if the thing doesn't track for my use, provided there used nice bearings the specs look mighty nice.

[peter_4059]

Sounds like this is the adaptor needed for EQMOD if it needs 3.3V rather than 5V?

http://www.dontronics-shop.com/ftdi-usb-to-serial-ttl-level-33v-converter-cable.html

[pmrid]

The good news it the Shoestring RJ45-USB cable works fine with EQMOD in Maxim. So far so good. Got to that stage and for some reason the filter wheel decided to go into hibernation and won't talk to me. Just as well it's clouded over for the next week. I can see a fair bit of tinkering to come.

But: the mount talks to me and seems to behave appropriately.

EXCEPT for balancing. See post below about that. I'd be interested to hear others' experiences with that.

Peter

[Merlin66]

I'm obviously like many others very interested in the capabilities of the EQ8 mount.
Can we start another thread for "EQmod running with the EQ8"????
There are many other features and capabilities I'd like to see discussed/ reviewed.
Not all of us need/ want EQMod (well at least not all the time!)
It may well be that some users will only use the handcontroller and no computer etc attached. (visual observers....)

[Tandum]

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/attachment_browse.php?a=141575
I see 4.4 peak to peak raw and 2.18 peak to peak corrected on this one.




Yes mine is a little heavier on one side.

[Tandum]

Are you talking about yours Ken?
Anyone with a camera connected is going to use ascom on the mount
Anyone with it in a dome requires ascom on the mount.
I haven't seen an eq6 with a handset connected to it in years.

[rustigsmed]

Yes noticed this too.
Getting another counter weight this w'end.
hanging for the full moon to pass ...

[DavidTrap]

Wouldn't they be "west" for those north of the equator? ;)

DT

[Merlin66]

Robin,
I use both a HEQ5pro (solar imaging) and the NEQ6pro (spectroscopy) without EQmod and without ASCOM....just the handcontroller/ CdC/ PHD/ Al's reticule/ AstroArt5
What more do you need????

[Tandum]

So only the eq6 see's night skies and you wouldn't need an eq8 for spectroscopy.
If you want to know what the handset does, check out your eq6, it's exactly the same.
I'm wondering how many of these aren't going into an obs?

[pmrid]

Apparently they are being offered for sale in the UK as mount only - no tripod.
Peter

[AstroJunk]

Just a small point Robin, ASCOM is perfectly OK without EQMOD if you plan to be at the scope, ie enter the date and time by hand. Nothing particularly wrong with Synscan - ask any Celestron owner!

(Having said that, I'll be using EQMOD to operate the scope remotely!)

[Tandum]

The celestron driver works for me also, but with a motorised dome, you must have a way to sync the two. I use poth, it goes to the mounts ascom driver and to the domes ascom driver.

Without that ascom driver to the mount I'm screwed. Doing ascom via the handset means entering times/dates etc before you can do anything. You should be able to bypass that crap so the pc has control from turn on.

[AstroJunk]

Me too, I'm using the standard celestron drivers for the scope on POTH to sync it with the dome. Agreed about the entry of data - I was just pointing out that EQMOD isn't actually needed.

[Tandum]

One thing for ya Johnathan, pempro will put a pe correction curve right into eqmod. So will pecprep I assume. The celestron driver doesn't do any of that, also I've had to up guide pulses in eqmod from the eq6 settings to get guiding under control. It's not what works, it's what works best ...

[acropolite]

Bummer, I just bought the 5v usb I/F based on what I read on the eqmod site regarding the Az-EQ6, they claim the 3.3 volt one won't work. Looks like the circuitry in both the Eq8 and AZ-EQ6 are similar.


I read from this that the mount is tolerant of 5v TTL as long as the TTL I/F device can accurately detect the lower 3.3v signal from the mount.

[Tandum]

That's right. It seems some people already knew this from dealing with the alt/az eq6. And skywatcher have to protect the mount from 5v ttl synscan controllers.
I still don't know why my 3.3v bluetooth didn't work. I'll revisit that sometime.

[OneCosmos]

I tried using my EQDIR cable that worked with the HEQ5 but the mount wouldn't connect. I don't currently have a serial to USB connector, but I have one on order from Jaycar but can anyone confirm that I may need the one Pete sent the link for?

Chris

PS the 152mm APO arrives from the UK early next week - currently in mid-air :)

[Merlin66]

I'd be interested to hear comment on the polar alignment, 1, 2 and three star alignment and the accuracy of the GOTO, using the Synscan.

[pmrid]

Chris, that link (the one Peter gave us) seems to be for a cable with USB at one end and a flat connector of some sort at the other. The one you need has an RJ45 connector at the mount end. Have a look at Shoestring Astronomy's site for their USB2EQ5 cable:
http://www.store.shoestringastronomy.com/products_eq.htm

Mine worked when I connected it yesterday in Win 7 (32 Bit). Can't vouch for other OSs.

Peter

[chrisshillito]

Don't worry, the 5V usb will work fine - it is what the shoestring USB cable uses.

It was only yesterday that I received that technical response from synta regarding the true nature of the mount interface changes made for the AZ-EQ6GT and EQ8. As soon as I knew I posted to the EQMOD group and SGL, Robin copied that info here. I have yet to update the EQMOD website but as it stands the advice still provides a good default stance as the 5V ftdi device will work with all mounts whilst the 3.3V device will only work with the AZ-EQ6GT and EQ8 (and its yet to be tried in practice).

Chris.

[chrisshillito]

You would need to cut off the flat end and splice the black orange and yellow wires to a cable with RJ45 connector. The full connection details are identical to those given for the 5V cable on the EQMOD Project website. Do that and you've made your own USB2EQ5.

Chris.

[pmrid]

Does anyone know the worm period in seconds for the EQ8?
Peter

[OneCosmos]

But the Shoestring one would work with the EQ8? I don't quite understand then why my specially made up one for the HEQ5 Pro doesn't work with the EQ8 - I would have thought it must be the same as the Shoestring one - as they both work with that mount.

[Shiraz]

24 hrs/435 is 198.62sec (I hope)

edit: see next 2 posts

[Lee]

Should you use the length of a sidereal day (23h 56min 4.1s) for that calc?? Wouldn't make much difference to the period I suppose.....

[Shiraz]

but it would make it correct :(. guess that makes it ~198.1 s

[Tandum]

The eq5 and eq6 communicate with a 5v ttl serial line. The alt/az eq6 and the eq8 communicate with a 3.3v ttl serial line. All the adapters out there communicate with a 5v ttl serial line but some of them can hear the 3.3v ttl serial coming from the eq8 and some can't.

[OneCosmos]

Thanks Robin, that makes sense. So some people will be lucky with their existing cables and some not. I wasn't :(

I can't remember now who I bought mine from but I'm sure it won't be long before someone starts making them available commercially. I'm looking :help:

[Grimmeister]

Hi Everyone,

I posted this earlier in this thread, the cable you are looking for (untested but I would be very surprised if this did not work) is an FTDI cable (TTL-232R-3V3).

These are very cheap to purchase and simply need the plug snipped off and an RJ45 plug connected up with the pin arrangement in the correct position. You can easily find details on what pin goes where between the EQ8 manual and the EQMod web site.

The Datasheet for the FTDI cable can be found here and has all the details you need to understand how these work. http://www.ftdichip.com/Support/Documents/DataSheets/Cables/DS_TTL-232R_CABLES.pdf

I use the 5Volt version for my EQ6 mount with a home made DB9 plug from JayCar.

Regards

Anthony

[acropolite]

The TTL-232R-5V is what I ordered from Dontronics based on the EQmod site info, I guess I'll find out soon enough whether it will work.

[h0ughy]

on a slightly different tack, i was looking to put the tripod in a case from bunnings but it might be the impossible squeeze? the leg part will fit no problems but the central pier part wont in the current position. thought about lowering completely but then it might not work. yeah yeah measure once and cut twice ;) oh well the case wont go to waste :)

also shows the head of the eq8 case with the bunnings one

also thought to put velcro top and bottom on the pier to stop it from going to the extremes when loosened instead of drilling into the pier, also would make somewhere to attach things?

[Tandum]

I drilled and taped a couple of 8mm allen bolts into the pier as bump stops and put it in a canvas bag. Now it's got handles :)

[peter_4059]

Yes Peter - you will need to cut off the flat connector and attach an RJ45 connector as per the wiring on the EQMOD site. The link I posted is the 3.3V version of the FTDI USB-Serial TTL 5V cable most of us have been using with the EQ6. If you can attach the right connector you can make it for a little over $18. Dontronics is in Melbourne and very good to deal with in my experience.

[Merlin66]

Based on the limited experience so far...
Is the EQ8 really a transportable mount - or one which is targeted for the observatory/ permanent slab?????

[Grimmeister]

Hi Phil,

The 5 volt one should be fine as the system is 5volt tolerant.

Cheers

Anthony

[h0ughy]

of course its portable:D

[Tandum]

Warning ...

If the scope is pointing west, be careful how far you engage the dec clutch lever. If you lower it too far and then go east it will foul on the motor/worm box.

Really horrible noises come out of it.

This is another design fault.

[h0ughy]

Is everything ok robin? :question:

[Tandum]

It's still slewing but home is miles away from where it should be and you can't just move the scope to the approx point cos of the encoders.

Tomorrow is another day, I'll plug the handset in and see if it homes.

Damn cold out there tonight :)

[pmrid]

The Synscan has an auto-home sensing routine for the EQ8 that might be worth a try. Not sure how it works but it slews in both axes on both sides of the CWD position to establish the right position.

Peter

[AstroJunk]

I'd agree with you there. I had to go and have a play though as it has been slewing without a hitch for me. I can't clamp mine down that far - maybe yours needs adjusting (Not an excuse - it should never be possible to hit). And dont forget that they only need to be lightly clamped, its better to let them slip in the event of tube strike or cable snag and with encoders you don't loose the alignment.

I had rather hoped that they programmed it like the Servocat on my dob which stops if the motors are turning but the encoders are not changing. I guess I'll have to tell them about that one...

[AstroJunk]

I am a plonker. I had my lat settings 20 mins out!

Ok, i fixed that, did a one star align and headed for saturn. Now we're talking. Good to less than 5 arc mins and despite that fact that i have not aligned the plate on the OTA yet.

Best bit is, that it slews to the same position every time after that.

So can it point? I say yup!

[Gruffalo]

16 pages and only one test shot. :P

Pull the lead out!

[h0ughy]

crud weather mate - so you will just have to wait - like the rest of us

[AstroJunk]

And from the non-astrophotographer :rofl:

Anyway, for those in suspense, four is the number of weights needed for a 14" OTA with guide scope. My extra two arrived today!

[h0ughy]

thats what i figured when i ordered mine , not that i have run it yet:sadeyes:

[Merlin66]

Hmmm
Hanging a 14" SCT from the EQ8 is certainly very impressive!!

Tandum - did you get the chance to do more testing?

Can't find an on-line manual but:
The EQ8 mount is equipped with auxiliary encoders on both the R.A. axis and Dec. axis. Therefore, the mount can keep tracking its current position even when a user unlocks the clutches and rotates the mount in R.A. axis and Dec. axis manually. With this feature, a user can manually operate the mount anytime without worrying about losing the mount’s alignment status. When the user wants to operate the mount with the SynScan hand control again, no alignment is required and all that is needed to be done is to re-lock the clutches.
This feature can be enabled or disabled on the SynScan hand controller.

[pmrid]

Happy to say I fired mine up last night for the first time.
I'm using a Shoestring Astronomy USB2EQ5 cable to run from the PC via EQMOD and MaximDL. I have managed to fit a FLI focuser, Tak .73 reducer, Precise Parts adapter to get the right backfocus (72.2mm for that), a TrueTech FW and Apogee Alta U8300 within the available backfocus of my BabyQ - but ONLY just. Guiding by a piggyback modified finder scope with a QHY5.

I had a helluva time getting the rig balanced. It still is not balanced but it's a good as I can get it. The balance problem is caused by both RA and Dec motors, worms etc hanging off to the east side of the mount so unless you counter that weight somehow, it can never stay put in any location. Those east-side weights will always pull it out of whack. But I have gone down that counterbalance road by hanging my HitecAstro Mount Hub Pro on a short plate out to the right side. Not fixed but better.

The connection PC to mount is seamless. No issues in making a connection. Although for some reason, Maxim seemed to send a signal to EQMOD telling it to stop tracking after I stopped the guide scope to change targets. Odd but not fatal.

It calibrated fine and tracked fine too. After a few pulses to settle down, the graph was bouncing along at about .25 pixel above and below the line with 5 second subs. It held that well.

I didn't do the Synscan polar alignment routine. Instead I just did a drift alignment and the guiding results seem to say that this worked pretty well. Goto moves are good but not perfect. They all fell within 5-10 arcminutes of dead centre - all well within a plate-solving with Maxim and a quick re-center to get it bang in the crosshairs.

Too much moon last night for the LRGB filters I have on that FW so any serious imaging will have to wait a few nights but all indications so far are that the mount will be a good investment.

Peter

[AstroJunk]

Chris has the polar scope. I guess that it perfects the balance, waiting on his report!

[h0ughy]

OK the polar scope weights about 0.9kg and given its dimensions one could deduce that it may be the weight offset?:help::question:

also the polar scope does not have a illuminated reticle

[Tandum]

Here's those pics of the polar scope you wanted Dave. It came with the mount and indeed weighs 900 grams. The slight imbalance doesn't seem to worry guiding on the mount for me. I've added a pic of maxim guiding through an OAG at about 1.2 meters. I'm still chasing power and frosting issues here.

I just realised, there are no dust caps for this polar scope :rolleyes:

[h0ughy]

thanks Robin, wow no eyecaps!!? that's nasty! thanks for the happy snaps

hope you get your power problems sorted out:thumbsup:

[acropolite]

Hmm, I seem to remember someone posting about 3D printers, perhaps they could print a couple.:confuse3:

[Tandum]

I don't need a 3d printer, I found the perfect dust caps for it. Fits like a glove :P

[h0ughy]

:rofl: well there are pluses and minuses for that argument

[Tandum]

Gezzz mate, you may as well hang barbed wire off the thing :)
Would have the same effect in my tiny dome in the dark :)

On another front, I relayed the dec lock lever issue to my supplier who flicked it to tasco who replied, adjust the knob.

I also asked if there was a document/procedure/rumour on how to adjust the worm drives. Total silence.
Nothing like solid support from the local reps.


But I did get the Beemer running again tonight. :thumbsup:
Note the hand polished exhaust, it used to be brown all over :D
Damn thing is stainless steel. It'll outlast me :(
Even the chrome heat shield is older than my son :rofl:
They don't make em like that any more.

[h0ughy]

Almost reminiscent of Kingswood Country, "cant take the BMW as I have just polished the exhaust"….i can EQeight to that:rofl:

[Poita]

I'd love to know as well.

[AstroJunk]

It's an observatory class instrument that is also perfectly suitable for field use by anyone capable of lifting a 30kg object without hurting themselves.

This mount isn't for wimps...

[h0ughy]

OK i have sourced a hard case for the mount. just ordered

http://www.gtcases.com.au/p/explorer-10840-case-with-foam/10840

delivery was free.

They have another 6 in stock with 10 more coming in a couple of weeks.

[pmrid]

Those who suggested the optional polar scope was the missing weight needed to balance out the east-heavy motors etc were on the money.
I didn't get a polar scope with mine so I rigged up a 250mm length of flat bar that I bolted on to the mount using the attachment points for the polar scope and I then attached my HitecAstro Mount Hub Pro to the flat bar. I now can achieve good balance in all 3 positions. Since this rig sits on a pier inside a roomy obs and I am in a warm room next door, the protruding bar won't bother me in the least. Though I can appreciate that is an obs like Tandum's, where all available room is taken up by a "12"Orion and an EQ8, it would be a total PITA.
If anyone wants a photo of this balance arrangement, let me know.
Peter

[h0ughy]

might as well post it Peter, someone may find it handy (cant believe this thread has has over 15000 hits)

[rustigsmed]

great to know, i thought i was going crazy :thumbsup:

[OneCosmos]

I do have the polar scope, which came as a freebie because I didn't order one :). I don't think Skywatcher had designs on it being required for counter-balancing because they say explicitly that once polar aligned you should remove the polar scope. I presume that is because it would be very easy to knock.

Chris

[Poita]

That case costs more than my entire 10" scope and mount :rofl:

[pmrid]

Fair enough. Here 'tis.

It balances just fine every which way with this thing in place. And I couldn't come close to balance without it - or something roughly similar.

Peter

[h0ughy]

yeah not cheap but it means i can move it in the trailer:help::question:

[Merlin66]

I'm sure it won't be long before ADM come out with a "SW mini-rail" balancing system for the EQ8!

[h0ughy]

well it does provide a stable platform for cable management;)

[h0ughy]

wow so who else just bought one of these? - they had 6 in stock now they have none:lol::question:

i just went back to check sizing

[jcm]

I would just like to give a big thanks for all the info that has been posted about the EQ8 mount by "iceinspace" members. This info has been very helpful to UK amateur astronomers as we will not get our EQ8 mounts till October. I have already found some steel plate in my junk box to counteract the out of balance problem. :thumbsup:

John

[h0ughy]

well mate i think it will produce the goods, i have a titan and i wont get rid of that. it is primarily an alternative to going to one of those mounts - and at at least a minimum half the price i think that is the telling factor here.

[AstroJunk]

And we are still waiting for the detailed comparison. I can't unfortunately as I have no experience with these higher end GEM mounts, but I can say that this mount handles my near 80kg of load (including weights) with absolute ease. In fact, the bearings are so smooth that a slight offset in lateral balance caused by not having a polar scope cause the scope to list to one side - co-incidentally with the time honoured tradition of 'laying back' against the worm to ensure maximum tracking accuracy.

I'm pretty amazed to be honest how much better this mount is than the original LX200 fork from which the OTA came. I look forward to those with experience of more exotic scopes to give them a good side-by-side test.

[h0ughy]

and with the current weather pattern it will be that way for a while - we are forecast for the same conditions for the next week. I am over this ruddy weather, that's unless someone up north or south or west of me can do something:P

[rustigsmed]

Hi John,

You might get to use yours before us ... The weather has been terrible over most of the country!!

[AstroJunk]

Whilst were all waiting, don't forget to upgrade the firmware. The new version seems to help with setting the Home Point Offset that improves pointing accuracy after a one star align.

[h0ughy]

good point, its 3.35 isn't it?

[Steffen]

Unless you need the almost fully functional polar alignment routine, version 3.27 is still the best.

In 3.35 they still have that odd backlash compensation bug introduced in 3.32. The mount tries to approach an object always from the same side in RA and Dec with GOTO slews. That's laudable but sometimes it moves in on the target, then moves away in Dec, moves in on it again and so on several times only to eventually stop *away* from the target. This can be worked around by manually slewing a fair bit past the target in Dec and then doing the GOTO again, but it's still annoying.

Version 3.27 didn't have this bug.

Cheers
Steffen.

[acropolite]

Did anyone manage to find a source for the power plug??

If it's the same one as the Az-EQ6 its a smaller diameter than usual.:confuse3:

[AstroJunk]

Sounds annoying! Thankfully not an EQ8 bug though, those encoders certainly play a big part in pointing.

[Merlin66]

Hmmmm
So the 12V power supply plug isn't the "std" 2.1 x 5.5mm size?

[Tandum]

Yes, These ones from jaycar fit. I'm using one in the dome.
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=PS2014



I solved my power issues. I'm using those gold plated/coloured chassis mounted RCA sockets for 12v out of the computer and in/out of my dc distribution box. The -ve tag is under a nut and that wasn't good enough. I ran a bead of solder down the thread, across the nut and onto the tag and it's all fixed.

I still have a couple of bad usb extension cables. The qhy5L II refuses to work in all but one of the 6 extension cables. Time for all new cables I think :)

[OneCosmos]

My Shoestring USB2EQ5 cable arrived this morning and it works like a charm as an EQMOD cable with the EQ8 :D.

Just for good measure I also finally have my GPS dongle working with the hitechAstro Mount Hub Pro - not using the drivers hitech told me to use:P

Finally, customs have decided that I don't after all have to pay GST on my 152mm APO:) I was hoping to get it this week, but it looks like customs will drag it out until next week now.

[Maurice]

I've attached a zip file containing a 300s raw (except for the compression) uncalibrated & unprocessed single frame taken at full moon with my Vixen VC200L @ f/9 + Ha filter + QHY9 + QHY5 guider (on 270mmfl guide scope) to give an idea of the guided performance of the EQ8.

My mount shows an average raw PE of 5.1" PTP which is extremely smooth.

I am seeing some differential flex at different declinations with this set-up & will probably go to an off axis guider eventually.

Very happy with the EQ8 so far.

Cheers
Maurice

PS - sorry about the compression artifacts, but I thought others might like to see a full frame

[Astroman]

Is this the same cable as what Bintel sell? http://www.bintel.com.au/Mounts---Tripods/Mount-Accessories/Shoestring-USB2--br-EQ5-Interface/774/productview.aspx

[OneCosmos]

The very same.

[Astroman]

Thought it was, just wanted to be sure... Cool, at least I know now if I ever get a chance to try out one of these baby's, I have the right cable for it... Terrific news... Anyone in Adelaide have an EQ8 yet? Would love to come and have a look at it, if it's at all possible..

[h0ughy]

well my case turned up for the tripod - too big to fit in an old corolla sedan. Will have to pick up from Alan's tomorrow with the Subaru. its big. waiting on the polar scope i ordered from Steve Massey, will also fit in the case. thanks Zane i also got the lens

[h0ughy]

Hi Maurice,

have you a shot of the setup? Glad you are getting to use it:thumbsup:

[OneCosmos]

So what case did you get in the end?

[h0ughy]

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/showpost.php?p=991448&postcount=329

this one

[OneCosmos]

Blimey - is it a triplet? :lol:

[h0ughy]

wouldn't it be nice to have a toa150 to put on it;)

[Maurice]

Hi David

I've attached a couple of pics...

I have used it, but I'm a little desperate for some good seeing though.
Tonight its about 3.7" :( ....not good....

[h0ughy]

thanks Maurice - awesome setup, is that your preferred park position because of the roof? so having fired the angry shot off how do you like the mount?:question:

also for the record its raining tonight

[Maurice]

I usually have the counterweight bar set horizontally in the park position - yes, its because of the roof, but it also gives easy access to all the bits on the mount. My pier is quite high & I wouldn't be able to reach everything in the CWD position.

So far I love the mount. I have had the good fortune to play with a few mounts in the past & the EQ8's PE is as smooth as I've seen in anything..
(EQ6, G11, Titan, EM200)

For now, the only criticism I have is that the locks on the axes aren't as positive as I would like. When I move anything (guider or camera orientation) I get some slipping in RA &/or DEC; even with the locks tight. This isn't an issue if everything is as I want it, but a PITA when I need to change something.

Its early days yet, but overall its a 'thumbs up' from me. :D

[h0ughy]

the only mount not on my list is the EM200.:thumbsup::D

[Maurice]

Attached is an uncorrected PE trace of data acquired on the 23rd June.

Maurice

[Merlin66]

Maurice, very interesting!
Which program/ software did you use?

[Maurice]

Hi Ken

I used the trial version of PemPro to collect the data. Saved the raw data & PEC curve, but couldn't reload the raw data again; only the PEC curve....?

I do have the original data in a text file though.. happy to send it in a PM if you want to have a look.

Cheers
Maurice

[h0ughy]

I will have to give pempro a go and see how my mount fairs. might have to phone an expert at Duckadang this year?

to get me there, i got the case for the mount tripod and extras such as the polar scope.

as you can see its a little larger than the bunnings craftright cases

[Tandum]

I got 4.4 on this one about 10 pages ago so they look to be reasonably consistent.
Although I'd prefer to see more than one worm period in a sample.
And your example says zero RA samples?

http://www.iceinspace.com.au/forum/showpost.php?p=987364&postcount=191

[Maurice]

Hi Robin

The curve that I posted was loaded back into PemPro, hence no 'RA samples'. I tried to load back all of the original data (4+ cycles) as well, but it wouldn't load. Happy to send it via PM if you like...

Regards
Maurice

[Tandum]

No thanks, but I do believe you want a lot more that 15 minutes of data to create a true pec correction file.

[Steffen]

Her Royal Highness's matched luggage! :eyepop::rofl:

Cheers
Steffen.

[h0ughy]

yessir :thumbsup::rofl:

[RB]

Doorstops Galore !

:P :poke:

[h0ughy]

yep making the staircase to heaven......

note to self - must get desiccant packs for cases:question:

[jcm]

Hi All,

I would be very interested to know if anybody has done any auto guiding using the guide port. I have seen a comment on another web site about "spikes" on the guiding graph.

John

[AstroJunk]

I did, with an orion star-shoot, but isn't soplisticated enough to show spikes. All it did was keep the star exactly where it was supposed to be without wavering...

I have noticed, that so far, in every case where I have had issues, its been my fault :thumbsup:

[jcm]

Thanks for the info.
Just about to order an EQ8 and so far most comments about this mount have been positive.

John

[OneCosmos]

I'm sure can't be the only person to have noticed that even with the RA clutch lever fully locked the slightest nudge will move the telescope on that axis and exactly the same for the DEC axis for that matter too.

This strikes me as potential real problem - has anyone done anything to mitigate it?

Chris

[h0ughy]

I haven't had a chance to set mine up properly yet Chris but that sounds exactly like my titan:question:

[jcm]

Oops-perhaps I spoke too soon. I seem to remember a video from an Austrian astro supplier who tried to move the mount but it was fairly resistant. Will have to look at the video again.

John

PS Had another look at the video - looks like accurate balance is going to be essential.

This was the video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMJIb5PSSFY

[OneCosmos]

..and has it proved a problem with the titan when imaging?

[pmrid]

I finally managed to get the EQ8 with the CCD/FW combo going on my BabyQ that I liked. So it is now ready for some serious imaging. So last night I had it in place but with a piggyback guidescope and using a Lodestar as a guidecam.
I found (again) that I have to recalibrate my guiding every time I start Maxim - which surprised me since in the past and on my other mounts, Maxim would remember the calibration settings from the previous session. Not a big pain, but a pain all the same.

Once guiding settled down - and it takes longer on this mount that any other I've had - it does not have any spikes - in fact it's pretty darned smooth - but I'm only guiding at about 300 mm FL so you wouldn't expect too many wild swings but all in all, I think it guides pretty well.

All the auguries are pretty good from my perspective.
Peter

[jcm]

Thanks for the confirmation, Peter

John

[AstroJunk]

I took this video a while back - its not a sophisticated test, but shows how solid my clutches are! I suggest that some simple adjustments are needed for others: http://youtu.be/ArbNmPd_lvI

[Poita]

I feel better anout my G11 now :)

[h0ughy]

that calm voice - such acting abilities - legendary !!

I was extremely impressed with that test:thumbsup:, bomb factory and a hammer for you:lol:

didn't that dampen out quickly - as far as I am concerned that is better than the titan in the doghouse

[h0ughy]

only if you walk into it;)

[rob288]

Just wanted to say thanks to all you guys that posted about your mounts, following these posts made it so much easier to get setup when ours arrived, just need to get onto a permanent pier. The 12 inch Newtonian sets on the mount fine, very stable.
http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/attachments/5952556-IMG_0193up.jpg

[h0ughy]

that's an awesome view - to think a few years ago this was a pipe dream

[AstroJunk]

Ah yes, a whole new career becons! I really did give it a damn good shake - I was online doing a google hangout demonstrating it and had to record the video.

Looks like a clear weekend coming up - I might finally get some quality time with the scope to finish the set-up. Not that there has been much to do really.

I do get the prize of being the first person in the world to break a bit though. I'll take a photo and post it up whilst everyone gets to speculate which bit. No-one will guess in a bazillion years :rofl:

[h0ughy]

the plastic holder - or the clutch latch, maybe the geared knob:question:

[AstroJunk]

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too likely :lol:

[OneCosmos]

Don't tell me you've snapped the pier in half :rofl:

[AstroJunk]

Warmer....

[h0ughy]

one of the connection arm points for the peir support?

[rustigsmed]

i'd go with the azimuth adjustment knobs or overtoasting the pier clamp nuts?

[OneCosmos]

I put the question to Rob McIntyre at Tasco and thought this forum might be interested in his response:

"The clutch levers may be at the end of there travel. You can adjust the position of the lever, buy undoing the retaining screw on the lever shaft.
As they have the same star position setup as the NEQ6."

I will give it a try later today if I can.

[AstroJunk]

Incandescent! The lock nut siezed and the liberal application of brute force, I sheered the bolt in half. No damage to the tripod itself thankfully.

[h0ughy]

well that confirms a theory i had - they sending you a new bolt? when i bolted mine together for the first time I thought to myself how much tension would these take if you over compensated to "hold up" the mount and gear on top?

[rustigsmed]

yep i reckon i nearly did the same thing, with the lower one. but i haven't revisited the mount since i unpacked it on Day 1 ... i'll be extra careful when i get back to it as i want to lower the pier a bit..

[rustigsmed]

if this works it would make life so much easier!

[OneCosmos]

I have just tried but nothing I do seems to make any difference, but then again I'm not sure what method is supposed to work.

I tried putting the lever in the unlocked position and loosening the screw, then moving it back to locked before re-tightening and several other combinations.

Does anyone know what the actual procedure might be?

Chris

[Shiraz]

if its like the eq6, do the clutch up tight and then undo the screw and take the lever right off - reposition the lever in a more convenient alignment on the shaft - it has an interior a bit like a ring spanner and will lock on the square shaft at more or less any orientation you want.

[AstroJunk]

I haven't told them yet, But I'm sure one will be sent in the fullness of time! I would expect the mount flanges to break well before the bolt if you seriously over tighened it, and that would be a problem...

[Tandum]

Cripes, do you have arms like popeye or what? Maybe you need a tension wrech.

[AstroJunk]

Nah, it was only M12 Stainless. I chew bigger for my iron suplements :eyepop:

[OneCosmos]

yep my levers can now be tightened to hold everything rock solid. just in case anyone else is wondering I had to start with the levers in locked position then unscrew them completely taking them off, tighten the hex nut more then put the levers back on with plenty of room to tighten further if required. Now the scope won't move and the levers still have space to move further.

Chris

[Tandum]

Watch that dec one. I closed mine when the scope was west and it caught on the motor box when the scope went east.

Apart from the horrible noises, now it's wobbly. Tasco have washed their hands of this issue and I got the same email you did.

[OneCosmos]

Last night I had my first night out with the scope - visual only and I ran in to the problem I think you were highlighting. Just in case people don't quite understand what the issue is I have posted a couple of pictures. You'll see that the problem occurs if you push the locking lever fully flat. You MUST therefore ensure that fully locked is at a good angle - see photos.

For good measure I have also included a photo of my system with the new telegizmos cover which arrived yesterday and made last night possible.

Chris

[rustigsmed]

Thanks for the heads up on that guys.

[jcm]

Would making the locking lever slightly shorter solve this problem?

John

[Tandum]

If it was short enough to bypass this, it would no longer be a lever. It would be a knob.
Just typical SW poor quality control. I am in no way surprised.

I watched RickS setup his AP mount at 10 chain hill this arvo.
The counterweigths had bass inserts instead of plastic bushings !!!
You get what you pay for ....

[pmrid]

Also at TenChain, I switched guiding over from relays and a guide cable to Pulse Guiding under EQMOD. Works well - managed a good hour before cloud closed us down and the guiding was darned good. I won't be going back to relays.
Peter

[Tandum]

Good to see it's working pete. Now there are lots more adjustment options for guiding.

I've found you just need a gentle push to get it back on track.

[rob288]

The issue with the lever having to be adjusted is not a new problem, in several instances both the Celestron CGE and CGE pro needed the levers moved as well out of the box.

[OneCosmos]

Once you set the lever at an angle it isn't a problem at all.

I have now had a couple of nights with the EQ8 I thought it might be useful to write up how it went.

Because I can't connect the cameras up properly yet with the OAG and Lodestar I decided just to connect the Canon 50D directly to the focuser for a 1200mm fl and just see if I could get any kind of image without guiding.

Setup:

The ground has a significant slope and I made no effort to level it - in fact the pier looked like the leaning tower of pisa :P. I Performed a very rough polar alignment using a compass and inclinometer - but really didn't take much time over it.

Mounted the telescope, and using the SW hand controller performed a 2 star alignment. The first star, Arcturus was surprisingly close and the second was Antares - a bit off, but I centred. Pointing at this point was Ok.

I thought I'd try the SW polar alignment routine using a high powered illuminated cross hair eyepiece (I don't think the version of the firmware I used with the HEQ5 Pro had this). It works on the same lines as Alignmaster but actually it is better because unlike the latter it doesn't really how far off polar alignment you are to start with - just up to you to move the RA and Dec as far as it needs to be. Alignmaster simply fails if it thinks the margin of error is too high.

The SW polar alignment routine takes you a star (massive choice) and you centre it and then it goes to one more star and you centre that and it is then moved to where it should be and you move first the DEC axis and then the RA. You can of course do this iteratively - I didn't.

Pointing was much better now too.

I found M20, stuck the Canon 50D (modified), focused using a combination of Liveview and a magnified angle finder and did a series of exposures to see, at this focal length what the EQ8 could manage. Anything above 30 seconds showed trail, but given the rather rough polar alignment (everything took about 10 minutes) I was pleased.

I took 99 30 second exposures, no darks, no flats, no bias frames, stacked in DSS and only a minimal histogram stretch in PI. the result is attached. Also worth noting this is from Ascot, 7kms from the CBD!

Chris

[rustigsmed]

Its only taken 4 and half weeks since collecting my EQ8 but it looks like the clouds and moon have finally cleared allowing me to actually use it. i hope i remember how to put it together :question:

unfortunately, i've got a heap of things to sort out with my system so doubting i'll be able to provide too much in terms of performance. :P

[rustigsmed]

And there goes my bottom bolt untightening as well ...:confused2:

[OneCosmos]

A pattern is emerging....Skywatcher/Tasco take note!

[TrevorW]

Some serious lack of quality control and end user testing by the sounds of it, I doubt I'd pay $4500 for a Chinese made mount, considering the EQ6 was only $1500, is this mount 3 times better

[Lee]

From the PE readings being reported, and its large payload, it just might be 3x as good.....

[h0ughy]

quite simply - yes. it takes more weight which expands your scope choices. so in the end it is your choice no one is forcing you to go down this path.

[DJT]

In my view the plucky pathfinders who are finding their way through what is basically a brand new product have cochones of steel given their investment and this thread will end up being one of the best and most referenced threads for new EQ8 adopters for quiet a while I suspect.

On ya boys! Looking forward to seeing the results over time.

:thumbsup:

[Bullockbob]

In addition, I don't see the fact it is Chinese having much to do with it. There are also examples of mounts lacking a little QC that originate from other parts.

The eq8 is up against the likes of the G11 in terms of price. So far (and admittedly its early days) I'm glad I postponed my G11 purchase. The only annoyance I see with the Synta range of mounts are their very limited connectivity options. Something that Losmandy is leading the way with.


Cheers

[TrevorW]

I wouldn't expect this mount to have cost 3 times more to make either, time will tell whether people have made the right choice. As to it being 3 times better than an EQ6 I have my doubts.

Personally I would have expected it to cost less than a G11 to purchase. just my opinion. I'll say no more

[AstroJunk]

I'm confused guys - why would you comare the EQ8 to a puny little G11? It's a head to head competitor to the Paramount MX in function, and in fact beats it in every respect except build quality:rofl:

[GrahamL]

Harsh Jonathan :)

You guys have to get this puppy up and working , the improved version will be released soon;)

[AstroJunk]

My theory was that they can't afford for the first batch to be shonky, so they would be indvidually tested to perfection. As far as the drives and bearings are concerned that seems to be holding good.

The lemons are coming in the second batch :lol:

[pmrid]

Let me add my two bob's worth to this discussion. I have both a Titan and an EQ8 on piers in my obs.
They have much the same weight-carrying capacity.
The Titan has no homing mechanism or encoders for maintaining position information.
The Tian relies upon a control system (Gemini) that continues to be problematic whereas the Synta hand control is virtually indestructible.
Both are capable of direct PC control but (I think) only the EQ8 can do EQMOD.
Where the EQ8 is not better is that the Titan (like the G11) can be stripped down for easy cleaning, repair and transportation.

To my mind, the EQ8 is equal to if not better than the Titan and half the price.

The other mount mentioned here is the PMX which I have also owned but sold. It occupied the same pier as the EQ8 now sits on.
I think the PMX had better design features and better build. But it was just not for me. I didn't mesh with it whereas the EQ8 is refreshingly simple and so far at least reliable and at much less than half the price.

Of the two, I much prefer my EQ8. In addition, I resented the way the PMX locked me into a software relationship that cost me ongoing annual licence fees. The EQ8 does not.

Peter

[frolinmod]

It certainly does lock you into a software relationship. You don't have to pay the yearly subscription fees if you don't want to. They're not for the license to run the software. They're for access to the updates (which I think are absolutely essential). The software will not stop running if you don't pay the fee, but lack of access to updates would likely be problematic.

[h0ughy]

exactly spot on Peter!!! I feel that a lot of the armchair astronomers out there have no idea, which makes their arguments rather moot and really just stirring the pot to get their jolly's. :P

It is for that simplicity that i bought mine - it will allow me to use a wide variety of scopes anywhere. I have a G11, I have a Titan, I had a EQ6 and still own a heqpro5. I bought the sky6 from an IIS member and loaded it in the hope to use AUTOMADOME. No support, but they wanted me to pay for the licence yearly. and it never worked for me

[Logieberra]

Interesting comparison. Have you owned or used both mounts? It's more like Hyundai vs. Toyota. Yes. Both are cars, have engines and roll! Differences? You'd hope so for the price. Owners of older-style AP, SB and HGM mounts are still rolling years later. Can the same be predicted for the 8? Time will tell. They sure got something right with the EQ6 :)

[Paul Haese]

This is not true. You don't have to pay for a license fee each year. As Ernie said it is an update fee. You don't really need to pay it in my opinion if everything works for you.

As to the EQ8 being on par with the PMX, I think that is a fairy land exaggeration. While I am more than happy to use a variety of products the EQ8 would not have the pointing capacity of a PMX. Nor would you be able to use the EQ8 for robotic operation collecting data night after night at a remote site or event setup to act remotely at home. It is just not the same level of sophistication. The PMX does require software to run and that is not that bad even if you want to travel with the mount. It is designed for use at star parties as well as being permanent.

The EQ6 was is a fine mount and I am sure that the EQ8 is now, but certainly not on par with the PMX.

[ZeroID]

EQ8 was advertised over here in NZ by a local supplier, $6499, :eyepop:.
Don't think I'll be buying one soon. Equates to nearly my entire astronomy budget to date. :shrug:

[Bullockbob]

Hi Paul

Can you elaborate on your claim that the EQ8 would not have the pointing capacity of a PMX please?

I agree about robotic operation. It badly needs a tcp interface and built in web server. Then again it appears ppl use the direct pc connection method without too much trouble.

Cheers
Rob

[Shiraz]

my question as well.

I thought that all mounts are basically just a couple of motor drives + bearings, clutches, encoders etc. They all count pulses (stepper or encoder) to keep track of where they are and the EQ8 drive has about 0.1 arcsec pulse resolution - so the ultimate pointing limit will be determined by the PE and flexing in the mount structure and bearings. The EQ8 has low PE and no-one would say that it looks flimsy - it might not be pretty, but it sure looks strong and it seems reasonable to assume that it will point well.

Surely the sophistication of high end mounts resides in the associated software? As far as I can tell, the EQ8 should happily run with TPOINT, TheSkyX, anything ASCOM or whatever else you care to use, so it should be just as sophisticated as the high end mounts if you want to go down the automation route. If I have got this wrong, would appreciate feedback since I had been planning to place an order for an EQ8.

regards ray

[Paul Haese]

Guys if you can run the EQ8 under Tpoint it might compete. However, I don't see that happening yet at all. With Tpoint my mount can point at 12 arc seconds. If the EQ8 can point at 12 arc seconds at present it would present a coupe, but I don't see that happening.

The more high end mounts have integration ports which allow for automation. All I see on the EQ8 is a guide port and an hand controller port. I might be wrong here but I don't think it will be useful for automation at present. It really needs a USB port (USB2) for automation. In time it might have the necessary ports but for now I cannot see it happening.

The PE graphs I have seen so far look incredibly flat and this makes me wonder if the PE is being taken correctly (not saying anyone is stupid here but it can be taken incorrectly). The PME has a sine wave graph and even the AP mounts do. Nearly flat graphs indicate that the camera is not orientated correctly. Happy to be wrong but at this stage I am cautious about any claims being made.

Don't get me wrong I am happy to see more competition and maybe provide a different price point, but assertions of this mount being equal to an AP or a PMX is really over reaching. Ray come down to my place sometime and see a PME and then you will see what I am talking about.;)

[Bullockbob]

Thanks Paul

Just so I understand (completely), and assuming the EQ8 doesn't have a pointing accuracy of 12, why is that so critical to you? Just for robotic operation?

In terms of automation, surely a tcp interface (ala Losmandy) is far better than USB?

Comparisons of mounts, like most things, should surely be based on price first. Therefore as I mentioned in a previous post the eq8 is right at the G11 price point. However, it may well be the case that its punching higher than that, closer to (but not the same as) the PMX in terms of load carrying and PE. If that is the case then it will surely prove to be excellent value.

Cheers

[Shiraz]

exactly what I wanted to find out thanks. TheSkyX can run any of the Skywatcher mounts and my understanding is that TPOINT runs in that environment, so it should be possible to run TPOINT/EQ8. All the Skywatcher mounts can run USB with an adapter.

All of the EQ8 PE curves I have seen suggest about 6-8 arc sec pp and smooth, which seems reasonable for a system with 8 inch gears and direct drive to the worms. I used phd for getting pe data from my EQ6 and that automatically corrects for camera orientation - pecprep takes care of scale and Dec. don't know about other software, but it isn't too hard to get reliable PE data and I would assume that most published data is OK.

Prefer not to see a PME in action :lol: who knows, I might want one. My philosophy is to wring the last ounce of performance out of the gear that I have and I haven't quite got there yet with my EQ6. But thanks very much for the kind invite.
Regards Ray

[marc4darkskies]

C'mon mate, no support?! That's not fair. I remember that thread - it was you who gave up, not SB and now you're bagging them? You had 2 Bisque brothers respond - starting the day after you posted (ie pretty much instantly). At no point in that thread (that I was following - because I wanted to help too) do I recall them saying "pay up". You probably need to move on ... or buy TheSkyX :P:lol:



That's a good question Ray. The sophistication of high end mounts resides in their mechanical accuracy. Software, no matter how sophisticated, doesn't count for anything unless the mechanics can keep up. I don't own an EQ8 or a PMX but I can speak to the mechanical accuracy of a PME. My RMS pointing with a TPoint Supermodel is 9 arcseconds RMS with a peak error of 20. When the mount is asked to move 5 arcseconds, it moves 5 arcseconds. I use CCD Autopilot for automation. When it goes off to a focus star and comes back, my target is between 0.5 and 1.5 arcseconds away from the requested coordinates - every time and with only one iteration plate solve and correction. My raw PE is 1.6 arcseconds peak to peak. That's what sophistication means :D.

If an EQ8 can match that or even get close I'd say Software Bisque is in trouble. But I wouldn't lay bets on it. ;)

[h0ughy]

Marcus,
i had sent of several requests for help, yes they replied in the first instance but after that they didn't, especially after i had followed what they had said to do to the letter, if you remember i rebuilt the software on that PC 3 times. I then got a reminder email stating that i had to pay the upkeep for the Automadome - at which point i was very very frustrated and angry as the level of support and the quality of the software seemed on very different levels. There were no more replies, you can only kick a dead horse so many times. Someone else had the exact same question as me on their website, to which i replied - still no response. I did thank you at the time for your help, your advice seemed a lot better than theirs. I think getting theskyX and the maintenance would be another mistake, especially after a $900 investment in software that is non functional. yes i am bitter and twisted on this one:P and yes i will bag them, I have that right, especially after they didn't fix the problem or respond further and for the record i gave up after 12 months of trying to get the thing to work and no further support apart from the first responses - i was just wiped. if it all had worked as it was supposed to then you would probably find a different answer.


but the eq8 is for the field, only need it to point and track and find the objects

[marc4darkskies]

Wow, $900?!!!! that would buy you practically the whole s/w suite these days!! Did you buy it all second hand? For me at least, that kind of money would have been a strong incentive to persist in getting it working! Which you would eventually have done I think. After all, the software was indeed functional for the vast majority of users and as I recall it was only the scripting (vbs) for dome slaving that wasn't working for you - even after I gave you my version - very strange. I was using the same s/w and h/w combo as you for years out of the box through 2 different lappies. Same with TSX - no fiddling, it just works. Oh well. :shrug:

But, this is all off topic - sorry. :rolleyes:

[AstroJunk]

I've owned BMW's and Mercedes. I always prefered my VWs. They are cheaper to buy, cheaper to run and do exactly the same job (and no one ever keyed my Golf, but that's a different analogy...)

Both the EQ8 and PMX have set out to properly accommodate the largest consumer SCT's ie the 14" Celestron or Meade. That requires a payload capacity of 40+ kg. Other mounts that weigh in are the AP1100, Losmandy Titan and the latest GGE Pro mount from Celestron. My post was mainly to stop the silly notion that a G11 was even comparable - I have used one of those and it has litrerally half the capacity.

And there is no doubt that those top end mounts are beautiful in a way that the EQ8 can never be with machined and anodised parts. But Skywatcher have done exactly whay they set out to do - use mass production techniques to create a mount just as capable at a fraction of the price.

As I have said before, I cannot compare directly, but I have yet to see a test it hasn't passed. It has low PE, it can point too and with EQMOD, integrates perfectly into my remote observatory and is already sucessfully gathering scientific data more acurately than my previous fork mount. The best bit for me is simply to be able to open up the clutches and swing the scope to the best position to be able to change cameras, collimate etc, then slew back to target without loosing alignment. It comes in very handy.

[Paul Haese]

Pretty much my experience too. Incredible to watch it point and then just one minor adjustment to put me back in the same spot.

Bob, pointing for imaging big runs (10-100 hours of data) requires that you put the scope back in the same spot and pointing accuracy needs to be tip top to get repeatable results. If the mount cannot point quite accurately it takes several iterations to get the scope back in the same position. That can add up to lots of time you are not imaging and collecting data. That's why good pointing is so necessary.

[PeterM]

Well Paul, a picture is worth a thousand words.
Your image of The Wolf - SL17 Dark Nebula is simply superb (see image of the week folks).
If I win lotto it will be a MX for me but reality says this time next year its an EQ8 but then I'm only after 30 sec images. And this will be more than adequate for the LX200.
Great thread, great responses and discussion & all FIRST here on IIS, the others can but follow.

[Tandum]

Paul, I guess you are talking about this result. I suppose you have never used this version of pempro else you would know that what you are seeing is the correction curve not the error curve. Please note the eqmod tab, you won't see that visible on yours as your mount is not ascom compliant. I guess if you had a technical background instead of a legal background, this wouldn't need to be pointed out.

I have 35 plus years experience dealing with electronics and complex technical entities and hold a degree in software engineering. I'm pretty sure sure I can capture data from a guide camera :rolleyes:

And, it does work with TPoint. Although I don't need or use it. As with the eq6, I just use maxim to slew to target, pinpoint, sync and correct and it's there. I have slewed from the SE to the NW and it pinpoints in seconds. That is where the eq6 used to get lost, this one doesn't. I drive it remotely except I still need to fit the robofocus to the scope.

I'll add that a lot of people use automation software to drive skywatcher mounts, ap mounts, etc etc as robotic mounts.
Apart from the advertising, what makes a Bisque mount the robotic mount ?
As ray said, they are all just gears and motors + software.

[Logieberra]

Pempro's camera orientation and calibration setup for PEC is a beautiful thing isn't it! It's fool proof with, 'what shape is the L?'

Users of TheSkyX (and now retired CCDSoft) don't have it so easy (well, not as of the latest daily build anyway) and we often read about mis-orientated cameras. I've been there myself. The PE graphs produced on those nights appear pancake flat; as you'd expect when a camera is off by 90deg and thereby lowering the RA's peak to peak error :)

[Bassnut]

Simple, power up homeing. THE difference for remote operation.

[AstroJunk]

http://youtu.be/-ocCnvuwAHk

I've been at it again - forgive the pom narrating....

Make with it as you will. The separation wasn't far, only half a degree or so, but the aquisition of the target is just as reliable over a much greater distance.

I still haven't sorted my cone errors out or done any pointing runs to give a better pointing precision, this test is simply to see if the scope is consistant between slews from one object to another based on Pauls need to slew off to a star for refocussing and back. Spoiler alert. It is.

I forgot to slip the clutches and then have it go exactly to the same point again. Great party trick :)

[Tandum]

These things have encoders and home as well, but not via eqmod yet.
I just slew to star from park and it instantly does a pinpoint, same thing ?

[RobF]

Heck, if you're going to be setting up an automated remote observatory, an extra $5-$10k for the mount is likely to the be the least of your financial worries. The EQ8 is very much looking like the first industrial strength chinese mount with great carrying capacity, ease of use and price <$5k. For a long time the standard advice for people that know they're getting serious about astrophotograpy has been "don't buy anything less than an EQ6". If you have space for it, the EQ8 is looking like the new entry benchmark for top end performance.

I'm inclined to agree with Peter - when/if I can afford a Bisque mount I'll happily use and look after it. Until then, I just might be able to find a few thousand extra to upgrade to an EQ8.

I think a lot of people would be grateful to see more PE curves getting posted as people get their mounts, so we get a better idea of population spread. Certainly looking very encouraging to date. :thumbsup:

[Paul Haese]

No need to get narky Robin. Don't simply assume someone who has a background in law is an idiot mate. Setup this rig for imaging night after night and show me the subs I want to see if you can get subs that are 2 pixels different from one night to the next. I will be very happy for you to get reliable pointing data. Like I have said I am an adopter of lots of different gear, but night after night operation is another matter. Until I see it happen I will assume it is vapour ware. Like I said happy to be wrong.

Jonathan, slew to the zenith do a focus run and then slew back to the target again and then do that night after night every hour. 3 star alignment will not give reliable results night after night.

Anyway you guys are happy with what you are working with, when you get it robotic please let me know. :)

[Merlin66]

Paul,
I understand your discussion, but I'm having difficulty, even with a remote automated set-up as you why you really need pixel to pixel registration for your observering runs....

That's equivalent to positioning a known target star on a 12 micron slit, using a camera with 6.4 micron pixels, everytime, night after night...I haven't seen many observatories with that spectroscopic capability.

[Paul Haese]

Hi Ken, its all about maximising data collected in each panel. The better the overlap the faster noise disappears.

[Bassnut]

OK, yes, it does have home sensors, thats very good.

Slewing from park and plate solving is fine..... until one day you loose power when its not parked.I think that means a trip to the remote site?. Although I suppose you could do a very intensive plate solve to see where it is. I used a fancy plate solve service with a pic on the web once, and it worked a treat.

Anyway, it has home sensors, thats the main thing. Im sure the software you have will be sorted eventually and itll all be good.

[AstroJunk]

Fred, not only does it have home sensors, it has encoders too. You can switch the EQ8 on from dead and it knows where it is. Never thought we'd end up with EQ8 deniers out there:rofl:

Its only a mount!

[h0ughy]

because of the weather and being crook i have placed myself in a position of not putting this up yet and testing. probably still wont get a chance until astrofest, but there is one thing that is bothering me and that it how it will work with tandum saddle bars? with the eq6 you could spin it around and it didnt matter, but noiw with the encoders and the home position i am not so sure? I am looking to setting up a c11 and solar scope side by side?

[AstroJunk]

It's possible to sync the encoder positions off a catalogue star - it has really sharpened up my pointing. That will ovecome the first issue. A one star alignment alows you to update the home position offset, which should sort the second.

Its worth knowing about those two settings and they make a big diffrence to pointing when settting up the scope in any configuration, and as is typical, are hardly mentioned in the manual.

[h0ughy]

looks like astrofest will be a steep and hopefully productive learing curve.

i will be taking the c11 and hyperstar so if i do manage to get things humming - wow how many targets can i bag in a night?:thumbsup:

[DavidTrap]

So why do people dither their sub frames?

DT

[Maurice]

I have attached a couple of pics showing plots of successive raw PE records on a different data set to that which I posted previously; before smoothing or PEC curve creation, together with a frequency spectrum view of the same.

Regards
Maurice

[Shiraz]

textbook high-end-mount result Maurice - smoothly varying worm error and nothing else.
Consistent pattern emerging from posted results - looks like the EQ8 is up there with the best. Regards ray

[Maurice]

Does look good Ray. I hope the sky clears here so I can get more data.
Keen to see how repeatable it all is...

Cheers
Maurice

[Bassnut]

So that when stacking (and aligning), and tHe stars line up, chip artifacts move around and are deleted.

[DavidTrap]

Exactly Fred, which is why I'm confused about Paul wanting to put his object in exactly the same position on his CCD night after night.

DT

[allan gould]

David, I think Paul actually said "putting it to the same spot" and to within a couple of pixels the next night. This is as good as dithering as far as I can see anyway.
But you do need that sort of accuracy night to night and I'm afraid to say that with a well tuned eq6 or Losmandy G11, Sequence Generator can do that to within a few pixels. With the plate solving in SG this can be done with a photo taken last year or someone else's image you want to get for yourself and you don't need a PMX to do it with.
Demos at Astrofest if you are interested.
Allan

[Paul Haese]

Yes I did not mean exactly the same spot I meant within 9 pixels or less and that is only the dithering that is causing that movement.

[DavidTrap]

Thanks Gents,

I have no problems with my AP doing that, with the aid of plate solving, and have done so either in the observatory at Leyburn or out in the backyard on a tripod.

Paul's comment of the noise reducing faster with precisely repeated pointing didn't make sense.

DT

[DavidTrap]

BTW,

Very impressed with Jonathan's video. Will look forward to the development of these mounts and eqmod in the months and years ahead. Might end up with one as a workhorse mount for a scientific program I have in mind, and keep the AP for pretty pictures!

DT

[tpiastro.com]

Hey Guys- So new EQ8 owner and I am curious how does one use a side by side with this mount- I do not see an OTA orientation option on the hand controller..
Anyone used a side by side with the EQ8 yet??...
Thanks Much..

[h0ughy]

not sure yet - probably have a play with things at Astrofest

[h0ughy]

loaded the drivers for my keyspan rs232 to usb on my windows 8 lappy - then loaded the synscan updater and connected up the hand controller. a lot less painless than my first attempt to do this many years ago with 3.27. was easy to then upload the new firmware 3.35.

[Tandum]

Dave, if you got an eqmod device, don't forget to get drivers installed for it too.

[h0ughy]

I have one but it is for the eq6 and eq5pro - bought as a set from OS but never used it. so what do I have to download for eqmod?

[Tandum]

In Windows 7, connect to the Internet and just plug it in, it will auto install the drivers.

[acropolite]

i'm glad you mentioned that...:ashamed:

[bloodhound31]

Just waded through 24 pages of this thread as I am looking at purchasing the EQ8 in the future.

I can't see if this has already been asked, but how do you polar align this mount?

[rob288]

You can purchase an optional polar scope, mounts on the side of the mount, or of course even better drift align, especially if its going into an observatory.

[bloodhound31]

Thanks mate.

David, did you get the polar alignment scope with it? Anyone got a pic of the setup with the polar alignment scope?

Baz.

[AstroJunk]

Chris has one and may share a photo, but they realy aren't necessary. The Synscan has a built in polar alignment routine which I am told works very well, just set it to roughly south and roughly your lattitude and run the program which uses

I haven't tried it, as I use PemPro, but it is meant to work pretty well and basically uses a couple of reference stars to help you get the mount just right.

[Poita]

SGP gets me within 2 pixels on my G11 and my current (on loan) camera. I am getting more and more impressed with the program. I'm interested to see how the EQ8 goes, I've been thinking about adding encoders to the G11 and using the SiTech controller with it.

[bloodhound31]

Cheers for that.

So, do you set it up in the general direction and elevation, then the scope slews to a couple of stars one at a time then you manually adjust the mount to bring the star into the centre FOV? Is that how it works?

Baz.

[AstroJunk]

That's pretty much it - in the style of alignmaster I am told. Chris (OneCosmos) has done it, I'm sure he will chip in when he catches up with the thread...

[OneCosmos]

Hi, finally caught up. Yeah, I did try the alignment routine using the handset on a night when alignment wasn't my main priority. As Jonathan said it worked pretty much the same as alignmaster but actually better in two important respects, particularly given the limited amount of sky I see from my garden:


There are vastly more stars to choose from - most of which I didn't know but have since made a concerted effort to learn; and
Unlike alignmaster it doesn't seem to mind how far off alignment you are at the start of the routine.
With Alignmaster I found that I might go all the way through only to find it says error too large move the mount and try again.

Both require an iterative process for accurate alignment to be achieved, but essentially it takes you to a star, you centre slew it, then to another, centre it. Once done it moves in RA to where it thinks alignment should be and you move the mount physically in RA to centre, then the same for dec.

I may use the hand controller at AF for an initial alignment and then see if Alignmaster agrees or refines it (or just changes it completely).

I don't see why it should be less accurate than Alignmaster though. We will see.

One other thing - not really related, but worth mentioning is that when you go to the home position using the hand controller it does a kind of dance whilst it finds the position which doesn't happen when you home with EQMOD. I assume the hand controller is more accurate for this...?

Chris

[BPO]

And then there are the gearless -- and PE-less -- direct drive mounts...

;):P

But the EQ8 is looking to be a real game-changer. Definitely at the top of my list right now.

[BPO]

My usual supplier here in NZ tells me he can sell me the EQ8 for NZ$6,450 (AU$5,630) so I guess we do pay a bit of premium being on the far end of the supply train.

[rustigsmed]

Sounds like it, although in Europe i believe they are going for 4,300 euro (A$6,100) - with the tripod.

[h0ughy]

Well its taken me a while but i now have the case packed and ready for the tripod, the feet, the polar scope, scope covers, power supplies and a few odds and ends (not shown in shot) - all fits:D. Quite happy about it as I reused some of the packaging from the original carton:thumbsup:. :question:In hindsight you could buy the case without foam and just add what you need and reuse the original foam. I did have to cut down a piece slightly but not much. this has turned out to meet my needs exactly.:D:)

[Mighty_oz]

Great pics of what u did, but looks like the car is too small for the package :) hehe. Must weight a ton to lift tho :( ?

[RobF]

That's why Houghy will be arriving a few days early by Chinook this year ;) :D

[acropolite]

One should never make statements in jest of a man who has single handedly kept the Australian economy afloat....:P

[h0ughy]

oh wouldn't that be great - no driving, no pressure and quick and easy:rofl:

[h0ughy]

not true:question::help: :P honest;)

[AstroJunk]

My new 'Pegasus Pier' is ready for the powder coaters - Hurrah!

It stands 1.3m high and has three m6 holes tapped front and back where I'm planning to fix narrow utility boards to screw random stuff on :lol:

Fingers crossed for a speedy return.

[h0ughy]

so what colour did you go for? puce pink?:lol:

it will look a treat when completed - and an eq8 on top:thumbsup:

[AstroJunk]

I could handle that, I'm in touch with my feminine side :P

Boring go deeper black - gets coated quicker!

[RB]

Dave you should lend Jonathan your Bintel chair to colour match it.

:P