Orion Shorttube 80 or Orion mini Giants 9x63?

[Draco]

Hi all

I have yet again got myself at a fork. I went to Bintel today to have a look at the Orion binoculars esp the mini giant 9x63 which is selling at $299. While there I also checked out the Orion 15x70 Astro selling at $149 and the Orion 20x80 Astro at $219. The sales guy was really nice and very knowledgable. He said that the cheaper binoculars were not as good as the 9x63 mini giant. He also recommended the Orion shorttube 80 selling for $279. He said the shorttube will be much better than the binoculars for jupiters loons, saturns moons and some deep sky objects. I know I will need to get tripod for it and if I get a binocular then will need a tripod for that as well

At this stage I am just starting off and plan to get a meade 12" dob in 6 months so need something portable and not too expensive

I want to look at the moons of jupiter, moons of saturn and deep sky objects (those that can be seen with binoculars).

Which of these will be better for ne? Is the shorttube a good choice over the others?

Thank you in advance

[OzEclipse]

I have a differently badged version of the Orion short tube 80. What he told you is true. The Short 80 will be better than the binoculars for looking at the moons of Jupiter.

He didn't tell you that the moons of Jupiter are just four little dots of light in a scope that size. Not much to see? Jupiter itself is more interesting as is Saturn and the shadow transits of the moons of Jupiter. However neither the shorty 80 nor the binoculars are really suitable for this.

An 80mm aperture is really only satisfactory on the handful of brightest DSO's. The 12" will eat it for breakfast.

The tube weighs about 1kg and it is really portable. I have a very good ED80 but I still grab the shorty from time to time. Used it a few weeks ago on Panstaars. It's quite good as a low power wide field scope and mine is quite well colour corrected for such a short achromat. However, rack up the power and you'll soon see that this scope isn't a high power optic.

You can mount the 80mm on your dob and use it as a super finder. Binos are useful for a range of reasons. Before you spend money, think about how you'll use what ever you buy in the long term.

Joe

[Draco]

Hi Joe

Thank you for your reply.

I primarily want a scope or binoculars that I can easily carry around, or don't have to spend much time on setting up (meaning taking out of the box, putting it up etc). I just want to be able to pick it up and be able to use it straight away.

I guess what I am looking for is a binoculars with enough resolution to be able to see jupiter, its moons, saturn and its moons and some DSOs (which can be seen at such aperture/mag). However, if I get a better performance out of a small portable telescope like Orion Shorttube 80, which is as portable, I am guessing it would be better to get that since there is not much difference in price between the 9x63 binoculars and the shorttube (the shorttube comes out $20 cheaper).

My main issue is that I haven't bought my first scope (apart from a dodgy Digitor 10x50 ruby coated binoculars from DickSmiths, which is the worst purchase I could have made!) and am trying to do all my research before shelling out the money (which is quite scarce at the moment).

I totally agree that the moons will show up as spots of light and jupiter and saturn on their own will be more pronounced than the moons. Actually that is what I am looking for (so basically a binoculars performance). I am trying to learn the night sky using Sky Safari and need a binoculars/small telescope to see much closer .. and once I have saved enough for my Meade, yay.. I will be rocking !

[LewisM]

A word on the short tube Orion 80mm refractor - don't expect QUALITY assemble here. Most people use these as cheap guidescopes for photography, where they seem reasonable (though I LOATHED it!).

I had to rectify the cosmetics on mine (paint runs, sags and pooled splotches in several places, as well as black over spray), and some of the components are brittle plastic (the objective lens holder being one),

I would prefer one to binos ANY day, but just don't expect too much out of it. Should perform well enough on a simple alt-azimuth mount, like the Skywatcher AZ2 or similar.

[OzEclipse]

If you want portable, it's certainly portable. You can throw it on any light-middle weight tripod (very solid on a 1.5kg Manfrotto 190) unlike my ED80 which needs a very big solid tripod or EQ mount. It's great at very low power up to around 50 x but it's definitely not a scope for viewing planetary detail.

It is like an oversized monocular. I like using a 16mm 65 degree eyepiece in it which gives me 25 x with a 2.5 degree field and yields a nice crisp clear sharp image. However my model was purchased in 2000 so I'm not sure if the optical quality or performance of current models will be the same. Could be better, could be worse. The only cosmetic problems on mine are of my own making.

Put short FL eyepieces in it and push the magnification higher and you will see colour fringing esp purple on the moon but it's not out of control.

Keep looking for comments from owners of newer versions.

Joe

[Draco]

Hi LewisM

Thank you for that . Yea, when I looked at the Shorttube at Bintel, I did tell myself, nothing comes for free or cheap esp in Astronomy .. you get what you pay for. So yea I have mentally set myself to not expect telescope standards from the shorttube :sadeyes:

Being majorly short on cash (and space since live in a studio though would be moving in couple of moths) I just thought of getting a decent pair of binoculars. However when I went to Bintel, I saw the shorttube and thought to get that instead of binoculars.

Your comment about picking the shorttube over binoculars helps in my decision to get the shorttube over binoculars ;)

For anything more I will go to my Meade 12" Dobsonian (collapsible) which will join me in 6 - 8 months .. just depends on how fast I can save $1200 :(

I am planning on getting the velborn videomate 638 ($199) from bintel to mount the shorttube. That is currently what it is displayed on and looks sturdy enough and is quite a tall tripod.. I think around 160cm.

[Draco]

Hi Joe

That is exactly I was hoping for when I did my post ;) to get some reviews from owners of the shorttube hehe.

Hopefully an owner of a recent purchase will be able to provide me with his/her feedback (I guess they all must be at IISAC2013 :( .. sad coz i couldn't go)

[Allan_L]

I have the Orion Mini Giants 9x63 that I bought from Bintel.
As far as night binos go, these are the best I have looked through.
But I would not say that it would be a good choice for looking for any planetary detail on any planet.
It is great for scrolling the milky way, for clusters, and very few nebulae, but not enough magnification for planetary detail (it is only 9xmag).

You are welcome to come and have a look under dark sky if you are in the area. Perhaps you can come to Mangrove Mountain (Pony Club) tomorrow night?

There will be a few different scopes to look through there too.

[Draco]

Hi Allan

Thank you for the info and the invite. I have a busy weekend planned so might not be able to make it to Mangrove Mountain :(

[dannat]

The mini-giants are Overpriced & can be bought cheaper OSeas. The 15x70 are reasonable value to get you started with binoculars-which are not planetary instruments, though can be used for tracking jov moons

Do you want to handhold or use a tripod?
For handholding a 10x50 will be fine as in the burbs the 7mm exit pupil will be wasted in the mini giants.

The st80 is also not a planetary instrument IMO, if you want planet views ozscopes has a 6" dob on eBay for $279-priced similarly to what you are looking at

[Draco]

Hi Daniel.

I want something portable which I can carry around with myself. Also, since I have jittery hands, tripod would be better for higher mags. I am just soo confused :(

I was calculating today ... ~ $300 for scope (binoculars or shorttube), ~$200 for tripod .. I could actually get a 8" GSO Dob for that from Andrews! Andrews has the 8" for $399 and the 10" for $599

Decisions decisions :(

[dannat]

If you want something portable which can be carried around maybe a 90-125mm maksutov would be the go, no wide views but decent planet/Luna performance in a small pkg.
I took a 90mm Meade mak with me on a US trip, let me some some astro views as well as a grizzly feeding on a bison across the paddock-it was very light & fit on a small cheap tripod

FOr jittery hands I use canon IS binos, but they are more expensive than what you are looking at

[MattT]

I'm not mad on the f5 refractors way too much every aberration you can name. I ditched my 102 f5 for a 70mm f7 achro with a 20mm 70 degree eyepiece. I get around 2.5 degree of sky which frames lots of clusters etc very nicely and the 20mm eyepiece gives a nice dark background. I could use a 30mm plossl for a wider view but then the view gets washed out in the city. Naturally there is CA but not much field curvature. Dirt cheap too.
Matt

[Irish stargazer]

The ST80 is not a bad little scope. I have one on an EQ1 mount and it is quite adequate. Cant push it much above 40-50x though. Much prefer the 15x70s on a camera tripod.

[carlstronomy]

I also have the ST80, it is not a bad little scope. Like you said yourself you get what you pay for, I use it mainly as a guide scope and have used it for some nice visuals of the night sky as my main scope is an f10 it gives me more to look at some times.
I even placed my Canon 450d on it to give it a shot (dont laugh) the image wasn't half bad although the stars lost shape once out of the inner 50% of the image...
I did not, like many others have quality issues the scope it is solid and of fair quality but there is a lot of plastic, it seems with this product you take pot luck on what you get from scope to scope.

Carl

[Draco]

thank you for all your comments guys. much appreciated. Hope you guys enjoyed the clear skies over the weekend (if you were in sydney). I loved it ;)

[rogerco]

I have the ST80 and similar spec binos, I don't recall being able to see the planets as anything more than globes slightly bigger than the stars through the binos, moons of Jupiter yes but not Saturn's moons.

With the St80, the focuser is a simple rack and pinion one, Bintel mainly sell it as a guidescope for the Orion guide camera, so I think don't include eye pieces, so you might have to include a $100 for a basic eye piece. Other than that its a nice little scope.

[Draco]

Hi Rogerco.

Thank you for the hands-on review. Yea I spent the weekend reviewing what to get (there are so many choices when you are starting off and dont know much :( ) and doing the math I figured that I was spending as much on the ShortTube + tripod combo as I would on a decent dob so I have decided to get a GSO 10" Dob from Andrews Communications. I know I would need a binoculars for "grab and go" situations but for now, I would like to dive deep ;)