A longer M16 - opinions...?

[strongmanmike]

Hi guys

I need your opinions please :help3:

I reprocessed my M16 from Sat night, this time using 80ED data from last year for the RGB colour. I would really appreciate your opinions on which you prefer and why please.

New colour version with 80ED data for RGB (50K)

http://www.pbase.com/strongmanmike2002/image/60953534/large

Original colour version from yesterday (50K)

http://www.pbase.com/strongmanmike2002/image/60864863/large

If you press F11 on your keyboard you can centre the image on your screen and then use the "previous / next" tab in the top right above the image and toggle back and forth (blink) between the images in full screen mode. This should make comparing them easy.

:computer:

These 50K versions have a lot of jpeg compression, so please click on "Original" under each image for a 500K large view if you like.

I will await your verdicts :thanks:

Cheers
Mike

[Octane]

Mike,

Definately the image with the 80ED RGB data.

Why? It seems so much more lively.

What an amazing photograph.

Well done.

Regards,
Humayun

[xelasnave]

:eyepop: How can you choose? Its like a blind date..the blonde or..but that was years ago:D . There is so much detail:thumbsup: .
I guess it is not cool to tweek it too much but I did :whistle: to illustrate my point even at poor resolution you can notice heaps (black and white so as not to intrude on your colour interpretation as well) Inspirational to see such work.
I will be interested to hear how a favorite is chosen.:shrug: Congratulations:thumbsup: :)
alex

[strongmanmike]

Ah LOL noooo, it's easy to chose Alex!...the one with the biggest ti...?... CCD's!

Thanks for the tweeking too. There is already a mono version at my web site though, next to the two colour versions, did you see it?

Mike

[Doug]

G'day Mike, hmmm yes well you did ask...............:whistle:
Maybe I need to preface my comments with a disclaimer; The comments expressed here represent my opinion and might differ markedly from those of others less opinionated;)

Really a difficult comparison because the 2 images are totally different in their data content. What feature are you intending to present in these images?
Some emision nebulae are predominantly just that, while others also feature prominent foreground stars and or asterisms; M16 is one of them.

The earlier verion seems to have a slight blue cast, and the star colours are fairly weak. Its strength lies in that the asterism above the nebulosity seems to compliment the nebula rather than compete.

The newer image on the otherhand appears to have a slight magenta cast. It is showing much more pleasing star colouring, maybe because of the contrast with the nebulosity, or maybe more colour saturation. However, the asterism is now in competition with the nebulosity, mostly because of the increased depth bringing the nebulosity into the area of the asterism. Because of this competition, the quality of the star images (IMHO) needs to be such that they harmonise with the nebula instead of being in conflict to it.

Both images seem to suffer from unsharp masking effects on the stars, giving them halos that really detract from the overall effect. This is all the more noticable in the ED80 enhanced image.

On my monitor, both images are improved by adjusting the blue channel black point a tad.

So, having pulled them apart on you..............I think I would give the second image the :thumbsup:, surprisingly, not because of the increased data, rather because it is so pleasing to the eye to see yellow stars, in there mixing it with the blue/whites, but maybe that is just personal bias.

Personally, I never use unsharp masking, instead I tend to favour hi pass layer mask techniques. If you are unfamiliar with this I am about to post some material on the use of it, or maybe Iceman will put it up as an article. I have the images prepared, including a comparison between unsharp masking and hi pass layer mask sharpening; all I have to do is oil up my typing finger and write out the description of how to.

Mike I have tried to be objective and realistic in my assesment of your images,(been a bit picky too:D ) however,I hope I have been of some help.

best,
Doug

[EzyStyles]

Gee's mike, they both seem really rich in colours and fantastic work but i prefer the one with 80ed data. i guess it shows more nebula.

[iceman]

Doug, it's already up!
http://www.iceinspace.com.au/index.php?id=63,294,0,0,1,0


Mike, the non-ED80 version appears to be more 3D to my eyes, which is why I give it the :thumbsup:

[Itchy]

Umm, sorry Mike. Doug is talking about a different technique altogether. This article is on HDR processing. Doug is talking about High Pass filter layering. :D

cheers

[Itchy]

Hi Mike (the other one)

Firstly, they are both really great images.

Personnally I prefer the extra colour data provied in the ED80 version. As the contrast is higher it appears to enhance the detail, giving a brigter, more "lively" effect. I agree with Doug about the star colours too.

Cheers

[iceman]

ah my bad Itchy, thanks.

Doug, feel free to write another article and I'll be glad to put it on the site!

[Striker]

I like the ED80 but gee I would be stoked with both.



haha so true Mike....lol

[Lester]

I like the first one Mike,

Richer colour.

[josh]

I kind of like the original. I like the bright detail in the new one but its alittle warm for me. The original still shows lots of detail while still looking like cool space... if that makes any sense.

[xelasnave]

Hi Mike:hi: , Yes I saw your b/w or luminecence capture? earlier, thats what made me think about looking in the other images, I often download an image to see what else is there just using brightness/contrast and a look in negative:) ....some get the magic colour enhancement:lol: well there has been no blind dates for a while and I only have 3 dogs to pat:sadeyes: , but its the cabin madness and curiosity I live with.:D :screwy: :)
But I thought if someone hadnt been to your site they would get a bit of an idea of what I was going on about.
Not being able to see colours with the same enthusiasm as others I seek detail over colour so by others standards it will be seen as bright and the colour is off:shrug:
And what magic to capture a Neb made famous by Hubble, it was everywhere first out and here you are producing an image that the general public would think again came from Hubble.:thumbsup:
alex

[xelasnave]

The biggest Ti ??? go the biggest Iq alex

[rogerg]

Mike,

I like the new one. Very nice image. It's been a long time since I imaged a nebula, this is making me want to go back to them again..

I assume you autoguide your exposures - what with? I don't think the SXV-H9 has a guider chip does it? Interested to hear more about how you find the Starlight Xpress camera, I almost bought one (not the SXV-H9) when I was looking for my ST7.

Roger.

[sheeny]

I can't decide! I like 'em both. I like the extra detail in the brighter one but I like the subtle "moodiness" of the other...:)

Al.

[strongmanmike]

What wonderful feedback guys!

Seems most like the 80ED data version?

The spread of opinions however just ran parallel with my own conflicts between the two :(. I was tending toward the latest version too but couldn't help but be atracted to the more mystical look of the original.:confuse3:

Doug, your detailed analyisis was rather refreshing indeed, thankyou! The slight dark donuts you refer to, around the smallest stars in the 80ED data version, were not a result of unsharp mask though, instead they are from not matching star sizes perfectly between the 80ED image and the AP image.... not through the want of trying though but the result wasn't quite ferfect :(. Luckily this effect is only noticable (to me) in the fainter stars of the 80ED version and as a result I deemed it "acceptable?" :shrug: .

Thanks again guys.... :love: ya's

he he he (ah, :lol: gotta love these smiles!)

Mike :innocent: (my favourite - me to a tee......NOT!)

[Doug]

G'day Mike, yeah quite acceptable really, I was only 'nit picking', but not with malicious intent. Actually I wondered about the fit of the two data sets,I wondered if it might have been from an LR deconvolve on one of the data sets that might have caused an uncontrolable shrink, that why I said "seems"; I was :fishing:
Cheers,
Doug